Buying Land Specifically for a Private shop

[GSEninja]

Are there any enthusiasts/ realtors on here that can answer a hypothetical for me?

I’ll be retiring from 20+ years in the Corps next year, wife is dead set on moving back to Southern California and I’ve always dreamed of having a large shop garage (most I’ve ever had is a 2-car).

I know the cost of living out there is astronomical, we have been planning for all this and have saved accordingly.

Plan is to buy a small townhome, somewhere in Escondido or Poway, and buy a blank plot of land relatively close to build the shop on.

So, the question is.. if we buy a small plot of land with the sole intention of building a private shop on said land, what kind of zoning do we need to look at? What is the least restrictive? What will be the most beneficial in the future (ie build on industrial, that way a future owner has more flexibility)

Thanks in advance! And of course, highly interested in any recommendations y’all have!

 

[BillK]

GE,
I dont know what the area is like where you are going but how about buying a warehouse unit instead. Example is the building I have my business in. There are 18 units that are each about 1800 sq ft. I bought 2 of them for my business. The good thing about this setup is we pay a condo fee and it takes care of all of the building maintenance, parking lot, dumpster etc. If I ever do decide to retire I can either sell the units or rent them out for income. Its a lot more secure than having a shop on a piece of property somewhere with nobody to watch it when you arent there.

If you are dead set on doing a standalone building I am pretty sure the only one who can advise you as far as zoning goes etc will be the local authorities.

If you do build your own consider making it twice as big as you need and leasing out half. I have a friend who did exactly that when he built a building for his business and he is always "bragging" at how his tenant basically payed the mortgage.

Just a thought,

 

[GSEninja]

Great advice BillK, I’ll definitely look into that.

Im not dead-set on a standalone, I just need some space and I’ve 100% outgrown the 2-car lifestyle.

You really do sell the warehouse unit, the added security sounds ideal!

 

[tarmy]

You better get a Land Use person to look into this. I was an entitlement guy for 32 years in NorCal and can tell you there are all kinds of rules for “commercial” types of land uses. A freestanding shop would likely be classified as commercial…not always…but they have noise, vibration, trucking and outside uses rules for these types of buildings. The idea is to manage nuisances from noise sources, odors (paint shops), hours of operation, outdoor lighting…you name it and they will regulate it.

Chemicals can also be an issue and drainage from runoff of oils, etc.

not a straight forward answer OP…but welcome to what land use regulation looks like in one of the most regulation happy places on earth…CA.

 

[PoorUB]

Many areas require living quarters, plus the limit the ratio between living and garage.

You really need to check zoning in the area you are thinking about buying.

A smaller city in South Dakota. I know a guy that owned some land. He had some money and wanted a place to store some of his classic cars. He built a 2500 square foot home on the proerty just so he could build a 2500 square foot shop. The house is not lived in, sits more or less empty, He stores some small items in the house, and keeps it heated. He keeps 6 or 7 cars there. He said when he dies his estate can sell it off and someone can live in it!

 

[ericm]

Building a 2500 sq ft house just to have a shop on the land would be prohibitively expensive in the populated parts of SoCal.

I'd make sure I was not near a state or county recognized earthquake fault or landslide zone. We're in both and the building requirements are serious. It's easily going to add 50% to the cost of the shop I'm trying to build.

Some CA counties really do not want people to build and will throw up road blocks and make the process long and expensive. It's been nearly two years and four different engineers and I'm still in the "trying to get a permit" stage. Part of that is the earthquake/landslide zone issue and part is my county building dept which was slow and hostile before Covid and has got worse since.

It would probably be cheaper to find a house that already has a shop.

 

[FMB4]

It would probably be cheaper to find a house that already has a shop.

I agree 100%.

 

[quickfarms]

A lot of cities regulate the accessory buildings to the point that they can not be larger than a percentage of the house.

If you can find a place that is technically zoned as agriculture then the regulations are less restrictive

to build a shop on a property without a house the property would need to be zoned commercial or possibly agricultural

commercial has a whole host of other issues

why Escondido or Poway?

you need to look a little further out to, like valley center or romona but check with planning and zoning unless you find a property with a building already on it

also look for horse property with an existing barn

 

[CraigStu]

I have no expertise at all but will pose a thought. It might be easier to build a home w/ a large garage. What size shop are you thinking of? Could a home w/ a 3-4 car garage and a basement for some equipment work? Maybe a split level so there is only 8-10 steps between garage/shop floors? Just trying to think of ways for you to end up w/ the room you want by building something w/ enough Sq footage but that doesn't appear to be a shop. We once got close to building a house where the garage was on the basement level. Builder said no problem; fire rated drywall on walls and ceiling, a steel door to get into the house, and the portion where the cars would be kept needed the concrete floor one step down from the rest of the basement. So, for zoning, building permits, etc purposes, the official garage was an oversized 2 car and then the rest was a basement. For my purposes, the builder would make one of the dividing walls easily removable which then gave me a shop that was the size of the house. I think it was 28x40.

 

[quickfarms]

I have no expertise at all but will pose a thought. It might be easier to build a home w/ a large garage. What size shop are you thinking of? Could a home w/ a 3-4 car garage and a basement for some equipment work? Maybe a split level so there is only 8-10 steps between garage/shop floors? Just trying to think of ways for you to end up w/ the room you want by building something w/ enough Sq footage but that doesn't appear to be a shop. We once got close to building a house where the garage was on the basement level. Builder said no problem; fire rated drywall on walls and ceiling, a steel door to get into the house, and the portion where the cars would be kept needed the concrete floor one step down from the rest of the basement. So, for zoning, building permits, etc purposes, the official garage was an oversized 2 car and then the rest was a basement. For my purposes, the builder would make one of the dividing walls easily removable which then gave me a shop that was the size of the house. I think it was 28x40.

Basements are not common in Southern California and are very expensive due to the seismic activity

 

[u2slow]

Here, you'd have to do something like haul in a used or mobile home on residential property, and then build your sweet garage. Commercial property is untouchable for average folks.

 

[FredWanaker]

the zoning needs to match your use. There are different type commercial zoning, and multi use manufacturing. There is also AG land which has its own uses. Now the hard part - can you predict what the zoning will be when you get ready to build if you aren't ready relatively soon? Poway and Escondido were built out 40 years ago so maybe you might want to look in Fallbrook or Vista. Keep in mind that SWRCB, ARB and their parent, CalEPA, have strict regulations on lots of things so make sure you can do what you want to in the shop before you commit to SoCal. There are many chemicals and processes that were legal here 5 - 10 years ago that are banned now. Also - there can be historical regulations on some land, and if the land has not been studied for environmental and Native American sites, one can get zonked right out of the gate. Same is true if the land was say used for someone like the RR, military, or a farm house, and problems come up with things like oil tanks from the old farm house, unexploded ordinance (which there are a lot of area in San Diego County that is found), and underground gasoline tanks etc..

https://www.sandiegocounty.gov/content/sdc/pds/zoning.html

Planning & Zoning | Poway, CA - Official Website

The Planning Division administers and implements the city's land use and zoning functions, processes discretionary land use applications and assures compliance with conditions of approval through various reviews and inspections.

poway.org

Planning - City of Escondido

www.escondido.org

 

[BillK]

You really do sell the warehouse unit, the added security sounds ideal!

A very good friend of mine did the same thing. His first Wife passed away and he remarried a few years later. Moved from his house near me with a big detached garage to a townhouse that his new Wife had about 60 miles away. He rented a warehouse unit for his Hot Rods and shop work and stayed with that till he also died.

Like I said it depends on what is available in the area. I would certainly buy rather than rent if at all possible.

 

[Bucko]

A few things that come to mind for me is:

All of your tools and cars, etc sitting miles away in a stand alone building may be a target for theft.

The farther away the less likely you will go use it.

Would still need water and sewer so added money to build.

As for moving to California after retirement....why.....most people leave when they retire. Check the true cost of living like food, fuel, property tax etc. , wife may change her mind when you find your retirement checks will all go to living expenses and not enjoying the time you have earned. I spent 30 years in SoCal and nothing would bring me back there. My entire family has left accept for one neice and she is seriously looking at leaving. Heck just ask the lifetime senator (correction...Congresswoman)Pelosi why she bought a house in Florida, speaks volumes to me (correction again...apparently a rumor, my bad... I don't follow her actions that closely or watch much tv)

 

[mogandave]

I would not move back to SoCal on a bet, but the OP did say "...wife is dead set on moving back to Southern California..."

How close is relatively close? An hour each way? What's the old lady do while you're at the shop, entertain the pool guy?

Were it me, as others have suggested I would rent/buy something for the shop that is already developed.

I worked on a project almost twenty years ago to expand an existing manufacturing facility in Riverside county. The original plans approved by the county had included the future expansion, we had already done an environmental impact study and a traffic study, but it still took 18 months to get approval to start the construction.

We had actually been approved to be part of a "Fast Track" program. There was picture of the "Fast Track Task Force" in the paper with an article explaining how many new union jobs we would be bringing to Riverside county and that the "Fast Track Task Force" would be expediting the approval process to make it happen.

Approval to be "Fast Tracked" an the article in the paper only took a few days, approval to start construction took eighteen months.

The worst part of the whole thing was the indifference of the people involved in the process. They actually seemed to think it was hilarious how long it took, how many mistakes they made or what the delays costed.

 

[TTMotorsports]

I looked into something similar in San Diego county and basically a shop building is classified as a commercial building OR an accessory building. Basically you would need a living structure in most places to build a shop on the land easily. Now that could be a mobile home that you rent out, OR a mobile home that you live in with a shop on same land. Basically you would have to find a lot that would be zone commercial OR get approval to rezone it commercial for that to you. I decided that living in Ramona/ East San Diego County would be nice BUT i went up the hill into the High Desert and was able to buy a mobile home WITH a shop on the property for cheaper than just a shop would cost to put on a piece of land that I still would have to buy and get permits, utilities etc on. Also like stated above a home on the property would make it look like someone was there "protecting" the stuff in the shop, a shop stand alone is asking for trouble with theft and such.

 

[tool_scrounge]

Buy an existing house with a 3 car garage. It is a lot cheaper and easier to sell later.

 

[ZRX61]

I know the cost of living out there is astronomical, we have been planning for all this and have saved accordingly.

Why on earth does she want to move to SoCal?? Eventually the only people here will be those too poor too leave.. & they won't able to afford to stay here either. I'm one of them.

 

[rayra]

Are there any enthusiasts/ realtors on here that can answer a hypothetical for me?

I’ll be retiring from 20+ years in the Corps next year, wife is dead set on moving back to Southern California and I’ve always dreamed of having a large shop garage (most I’ve ever had is a 2-car).

I know the cost of living out there is astronomical, we have been planning for all this and have saved accordingly.

Plan is to buy a small townhome, somewhere in Escondido or Poway, and buy a blank plot of land relatively close to build the shop on.

So, the question is.. if we buy a small plot of land with the sole intention of building a private shop on said land, what kind of zoning do we need to look at? What is the least restrictive? What will be the most beneficial in the future (ie build on industrial, that way a future owner has more flexibility)

Thanks in advance! And of course, highly interested in any recommendations y’all have!

https://www.sandiegocounty.gov/content/dam/sdc/pds/zoning/2000-wrd-REV-03-21.pdf

But the OP is making what is termed a 'Type 1' error. Planning to move INTO SoCal when you have every opportunity to go anywhere else.
We left CA last year after ~30yrs there and it's a huge relief. Cannot imagine going back in there, even for family reasons. The tax burdens alone are 'saving' us $9k a year and that doesn't even include State income tax. The State and regional political leadership is insane, have insane, ruinous policies and they are getting worse every year, to the tune of 900 new bills out of the State govt every year. New home build regs mandating solar, killed their nuke plants, killing natural gas, already failing to make sufficient electricity without buying it from out of State. Even as they lean harder on killing fossil fuels and mandating EVs. Then there's the social policies. I'm sure this will get erased if I go any further into 'politics'. But one Marine to another - don't do it, man, Go elsewhere.

 

[LOW1]

Zoning regulations vary from area to area. You will need to check each one separately. Consider making any offer contingent upon you getting zoning approval to build what you want

 

[BurtEggley]

This is an old thread where Saloumbufing is trying to build a thread count.

 

[sailor_lou]

Didn't check the dates so deleted the post.

 

[rust in the eye]

Buy agricultural land. Build a machine shed, lease the ground so it is under till.

 

[BigMike782]

Recognizing that it's an old thread but....
Zoning near me states that you cannot build an accessory building on land without a primary building.
It's to stop people from building a hobby shop then when they sell the next guy moves his commercial business.

 

[My Old Tools]

You can do this easily almost anywhere in Texas. Just get outside the city limits. Most counties don't have much zoning.

 

[NUTTSGT]

This is an old thread where Saloumbufing is trying to build a thread count.

There's been a couple of now banned spammers that have posted here.

 

[F1Fan]

well...I ran into zoning and permitting headaches in my area too, so I ended up connecting with a guy who had experience with San Jose property management. He helped me sort out some stuff I didn’t even think about, like setbacks and parking requirements. If you're still figuring out your layout or how much land you really need, reaching out to someone like that could save a ton of time.

 

[u2slow]

well...I bought five acres just outside city limits and it made permits, noise, and building way easier. County rules were way more relaxed than city zoning headaches. Worth any money

That is a lucky thing. One really has to do their homework on the specific location/jurisdiction they are targetting.

I'm moved well outside the city too, but zoning and building permits are still in full force. The main differences I see is folks mind their own business better, and the bigger lot allowed me a bigger shop (that I cannot run any commercial operation out of.)

 

[dcg9381]

You can do this easily almost anywhere in Texas. Just get outside the city limits. Most counties don't have much zoning.

This varies TREMENDOUSLY not only between states, but between localities.

I'd say your BEST bet is getting the hell out of any city's jurisdiction and seek land in the county. 100% agree.

Do NOT depend on Realtors, they're sales people. The have very little liability. I've seen Realtor try to sell parcels that are totally unbuildable.

Even outside of the county, restrictions can run with the land. So you're talking about knowing the restrictions on any individual parcel, so you have to seek those out and/or may depend on a title company to tell you.

Seeing similar structures go up (you're looking for non-Ag, no primary residence) is a good indication. That's where I'd start, but do not DEPEND on this as an indication that you can build.

 

[slowtwitch73]

Keep in mind there can be islands of county within the city boarders.. sometimes whole neighborhoods, sometimes the lot lines for one house.