Thoughts on re-siding the barn

[MushCreek]

I built my barn about 14 years ago, and was on a very tight budget. It's a 28X48 gambrel, framed with 2X6's and sheathed with T1-11. That was the first mistake. The second one was painting it with very cheap red paint. Now, the T1-11 is starting to deteriorate, although it is still solid. I can't afford to replace the barn, so I need to consider my options. My plan is to cover the siding with something more durable. My options are: cheapest would be white vinyl. I can get it for about $1200, and it's easy to put up. White is about the only option, as other colors are not available cheap. I could go with black trim, like the barn in 'Yellowstone'. The next option would be LP Smartside clapboards. It would cost about $1600 for the materials, and it's still pretty easy to work with. I'd have to add the cost and added labor of painting it, though. Lastly would be Hardie, at about $2000, not including paint. Hardie is the most work. I've done Hardie before; that's what's on our house. I pre-painted every clapboard, which is a lot of work, but when you're done hanging it, you're done.

All of those material prices are based on stuff on FB Marketplace. No choices on color; you take what you can find. Retail prices are way, way higher. I'll be 72 this summer; I'm just looking for a material that will outlast me. I'm running out of years where I'll have the energy to tackle a job like this. It might be next fall/winter when I do it. The other question is whether I should put Tyvek over the T1-11 prior to putting the siding on. I will be running heat and A/C, but not regularly; it's a workshop. Not the same conditions as a residence would have.

The Hardie is definitely a premium product, but money is always an issue, as is my declining strength and energy. I'm currently insulating and finishing the interior, and it's kickin' my ****!

 

[CraigStu]

Is the T1-11 deteriorating at the bottom only like a lot of them do? If so, how about cutting out the bottom 3ft or so and replace it w/ something that runs horizontal w/ a Z flashing between?

 

[The Cobbler]

I would cut the t1-11 at a height of 36" or so, slip a Z flashing under it and install some horizontal siding below that.
edit I see previous poster had the same suggestion already

 

[MushCreek]

Mostly. That would look kind of hack, though, depending on what I used. I guess a faux (or real) stone would look good. The upper gable ends are T1-11, and they are holding up fine, other than needing paint. I'd like to get into something with less maintenance, though. Our house is Hardie, and the paint is perfect after 12 years. I feel like T1-11 doesn't hold paint nearly as well.

 

[dcg9381]

Hardie on my home also. Pretty much once and done. They have it in a "stucco" look if you board and batten the seams.

How about using R-panel? You can get it in a lot of colors, won't have to paint it in your lifetime... Lighter than Hardie. There are some "trim" differences, but I'm sure you can figure it out.

 

[captaindiode]

I have Hardiboard on my house. It is still holding the original Valspar paint from 2000. Hardi is heavy, and hard to handle, but lasts forever.

 

[Snapped-off]

I've got T1-11 on my shop from '89. It's still solid. I'll be cleaning and painting it, hopefully later this year.

I'd look into replacing just the bottom portion like mentioned, and giving it a fresh coat of paint.

 

[Dagny]

Many new shops and garages around here have the 3 foot bottom in a different color. looks sharp.

 

[NUTTSGT]

Is the T1-11 deteriorating at the bottom only like a lot of them do? If so, how about cutting out the bottom 3ft or so and replace it w/ something that runs horizontal w/ a Z flashing between?

Or metal siding underneath as wainscoting and in the future, add a different color in the upper area. Could even progress that one side wall at a time.

 

[MushCreek]

If I cut a couple feet off of the T1-11, won't that edge then tend to deteriorate over time? Or is it just the proximity to the ground that does it? Mine is about 2' off of the ground, and it is still starting to look bad (beyond what paint will fix). I'm soaking the inside bottom with copper napthenate, which should stop any potential rot. I'll do the same on the outside. If I just put siding on the bottom 3', it would be a lot less work if I could just put something over the existing T1-11, and then flash it out, rather than trying to remove the existing sheathing. It's put on with ring shank nails, so removing it would be a fight.

 

[dcg9381]

Many new shops and garages around here have the 3 foot bottom in a different color. looks sharp.

One of them 'fancy garages.. wainscot - they call it "brick ledge" here when done in masonry. Masonry is "relatively cheap" here though.

 

[Dagny]

No you want the channel behind the top stuff. snap a line then screw a saw guide to the wall nice and straight allowing for blade height and use a skillsaw pull the wood off then cut the nails off.

 

[Codyboy]

Many new shops and garages around here have the 3 foot bottom in a different color. looks sharp.

Wainscot. (Sp)?

As mentioned earlier and the Op did to.

R or U panel would look nice in my opinion and not very expensive really.
Stone would probably look good too.
With either of those choices I would use a 2x4 cedar as a divider. Can't think of what you call it. Ug, ***** being old.

Curious if this is actually T1-11 ?

Or is it that pressboard junk?

 

[Codyboy]

If I cut a couple feet off of the T1-11, won't that edge then tend to deteriorate over time? Or is it just the proximity to the ground that does it? Mine is about 2' off of the ground, and it is still starting to look bad (beyond what paint will fix). I'm soaking the inside bottom with copper napthenate, which should stop any potential rot. I'll do the same on the outside. If I just put siding on the bottom 3', it would be a lot less work if I could just put something over the existing T1-11, and then flash it out, rather than trying to remove the existing sheathing. It's put on with ring shank nails, so removing it would be a fight.

If its rotting or delaminating remove it. You don't want to hide it behind something new. It will just cause more issues.

 

[Fav Onefour]

If its rotting or delaminating remove it. You don't want to hide it behind something new. It will just cause more issues.

I strongly agree that the bad portion should absolutely be removed. Short cut fixes usually mean long term repairs. Sounds sorta like the problem of saving money on the build and redoing it at 14 years.

I'm curious why the siding is failing badly at 14 years. I've seen OSB with nothing done last that long. Is the building in long duration wet conditions or some other factor?

 

[MushCreek]

The worst part of the siding is literally in the woods, so constant moisture and little drying. As for the trim piece between the siding and lower wainscoting is called a water table. Properly made, it has a slope which helps shed water, and prevents water running off of it from running back under it. I have it on my house, and it works well. Flashing is installed under the upper siding and over the top of the water table. I'll have to examine my siding more closely to see if it's just weathered, or if it is starting to rot or delaminate.

 

[Uncle murph]

If I cut a couple feet off of the T1-11, won't that edge then tend to deteriorate over time? Or is it just the proximity to the ground that does it? Mine is about 2' off of the ground, and it is still starting to look bad (beyond what paint will fix). I'm soaking the inside bottom with copper napthenate, which should stop any potential rot. I'll do the same on the outside. If I just put siding on the bottom 3', it would be a lot less work if I could just put something over the existing T1-11, and then flash it out, rather than trying to remove the existing sheathing. It's put on with ring shank nails, so removing it would be a fight.

If you go that route just make sure you seal /paint the new bottom edge after cutting.No matter which route you take,please use extreme caution with the tyvek,I definitely would not install it where wood or wood based material is usd as the final.

 

[WisJim]

My preference would be pole barn style steel siding. But I built a garage back in the early 1990s with T1-11 on the back side of it, where it gets the most water from the slope behind it, and it is still good--but I used a good penetrating stain to finish it before installing it, so the bottom and back were finished also. I had thought about restaining it, but but that would have been for purely cosmetic reasons.
For the OP's situation, I like the idea of removing the bottom 2 or 3 feet and using a different material there, after properly flashing etc.

 

[Jackfre]

I’m in the middle of what I call the Previous Owner Blues. The deck is mounted directly onto the t-111 siding with predictable results. I’m installing a proper ledger after having replaced the rotten rim joist sections. I had a shop build some 24 ga flashing. The 24 ga is pretty stout and at deck level it will be tough. I’ve painted it. It has a 1” flange at the top to go up under the 111. In my case I have a 45* bend to cover the 2x10 and then it runs 6” down the face. That bottom is hemmed. I painted the bottom of the 111 and the rain should flow off the bottom without problem. In your case a flashing of this type will work. I undercut the 111 to prevent what wicking I can. I spent $185 for 40’ of this 24 ga flashing material. Find a good shop in your area and price it out. For the bottom I’d do Hardi board and batten or clapboard. I understand the limitation of strength for the sheets of Hardi. “Oh, how the mighty have fallen” but it is good and tough and takes paint really well. You could cut it as it comes off the truck, so making it manageable. You can do this wall by wall as well so maybe the $ work out better. From a design standpoint I’d put at least a 2x under the flashing similar to mine. That makes it a bit of a design element mid-wall. You loose that with a simple z flashing. Then it looks like a repair.

 

[MushCreek]

One of the tricky parts will be getting the flashing up under the existing T1-11 after I cut it. There are bound to be nails in the way. If I do this, I'll set my saw at an angle so that water running down will drip off rather than wicking back. I'll also soak the cut edge with copper napthenate, and then paint it good before putting in the flashing and water table. That didn't get done when the barn was built. Because the sheathing is a structural component, I'll probably replace the section of T1-11 with plywood- maybe 1/2" PT? Then put whatever kind of siding over that. That will also keep out the weather as I work my way along. The water table will disguise any difference in thickness between the top and bottom.

 

[Stuart in MN]

Depending on just how bad it is, and how far off the ground it is, a good coat of paint (with particular attention to the bottom edge of the siding) may be all that's strictly necessary. If you can make it last another ten years, it may be someone else's problem to replace it.

I'm nearing age 70 myself, and I've begun taking that into consideration in my homeowner decisions...if things around here are good enough to last until I go into the old folk's home I'm leaving them alone.

 

[MushCreek]

Yeah, I think about that, too. I hope to leave here feet first, after a long life, but sometimes things don't work out that way. I'll be pissed if I'm 90 years old and the barn is falling apart. I still tend to build things to last 100 years. I just didn't have the money to do that when the barn was being built.

 

[CraigStu]

Maybe look at the fake stone panels. Those things are getting better and better looking all the time.

 

[MushCreek]

I did- way too much money, though. I can re-side the whole barn for the cost of using them on the bottom 3'.

 

[Jackfre]

As to getting the flashing up under the 111 nails it is pretty simple. I put a flat bar under the siding and pop the nail. the alternative is a multi-tool. Make the flange long enough and you can leave an air gap from the 111 to the flashing. It Is unlikely that you will see more than a few nails that need to be popped unless your carpenter had a real OCD thing going on.

 

[MushCreek]

Yeah I figure there's probably somewhat of a pattern, so if I shoot for the middle of the pattern I should be OK. Doesn't really matter if it's 3' or 4' or 2', as long as they're all the same.

 

[danfromsyr]

Wainscot. (Sp)?

As mentioned earlier and the Op did to.

R or U panel would look nice in my opinion and not very expensive really.
Stone would probably look good too.
With either of those choices I would use a 2x4 cedar as a divider. Can't think of what you call it. Ug, ***** being old.

Curious if this is actually T1-11 ?

Or is it that pressboard junk?

I believe that's called a water table
I call it a drip ledge, I made mine out of 2x4 Pressure treated.. needs to have an anti wicking groove under the bottom and a beveled/sloped top.

Siding an old house #1 Water Table Trim

Well, what can I say – it’s been awhile since updating the goings-on at the Misadventures project. Oh, there’s lots of activity – it’s just that it’s not so phot…

misadventuresinremodeling.wordpress.com

 

[MushCreek]

Yeah, I mentioned the name in post #16. On my house, I made them out of 1X PVC, and sloped the whole thing so I didn't need a slot underneath. I don't remember what angle I used- maybe 10 degrees?

 

[Beemer]

Rotting will attract carpenter ants sooner or later so best to address it rather than cover it.

 

[Fav Onefour]

This topic is rather timely for myself.
Buddy called awhile back and wanted me to help with his garage siding. It's T 111 rotting around the bottom edge. He doesn't have coin to do the whole thing and wanted to know if I had ideas.
I had suggested cutting off the bottom and using z flashing above the new section.

Here's the deal. I finally went over and looked a little closer. The current siding is the sheathing. No vapor barrier or felt.
It is rotting where the siding is overlapping the cmu stem wall. I'm not a fan of putting the new material right on the bare studs and stem wall. I'm thinking along the lines of doing tar paper under the new siding. I'd like to tuck it up at least a few inches and get past the new flashing. I'd also like to bring it down over the cmu where siding would contact.

I know he won't be able to do the whole wall height and I feel like this option might get him siding that will last longer.
Am I on track, or missing another component?
I've already told him he's going to be painting a lot of cut edges. Bottom of old siding and all edges on the new material.

 

[nadogail]

If I were siding a barn, I would investigate corrugated galvanized steel.

 

[MushCreek]

No, if I wanted a metal barn, I would have built one from the beginning. We like the old-fashioned look of wood, or fake wood. A board and batten appearance would be OK, but too much money for the products I've seen.

 

[nadogail]

No, if I wanted a metal barn, I would have built one from the beginning. We like the old-fashioned look of wood, or fake wood. A board and batten appearance would be OK, but too much money for the products I've seen.

We all have our priorities, may you find an agreeable solution to your barn siding needs.

 

[MushCreek]

I checked closer, and the south side definitely needs to be cut and replaced. The other three sides aren't bad, but I still want to cover them with something. On the south side, I'll cut 2-3 feet up and replace with PT ply, then put my siding over it.

 

[MushCreek]

I found the problem. When they built the barn in 2011, they sat the T1-11 right on top of the Z flashing- no gap at all. Of course, the edge of the siding wasn't treated or painted, either. I'll probably replace the bottom section with PT plywood. I'll put in Z flash, but be sure to leave a healthy gap, AND put wood preservative and paint on the cut edge of the existing siding. One thought I had was to make wainscoting out of Galvalume roofing tin, which is what I'm doing on the interior. It's cheap, goes up fast, and would match the roof. Have to run it by 'management' to see how she feels.

 

[Fav Onefour]

I found the problem. When they built the barn in 2011, they sat the T1-11 right on top of the Z flashing- no gap at all. Of course, the edge of the siding wasn't treated or painted, either. I'll probably replace the bottom section with PT plywood. I'll put in Z flash, but be sure to leave a healthy gap, AND put wood preservative and paint on the cut edge of the existing siding. One thought I had was to make wainscoting out of Galvalume roofing tin, which is what I'm doing on the interior. It's cheap, goes up fast, and would match the roof. Have to run it by 'management' to see how she feels.

Sometimes it's nice to find a good reason. It ***** that the siding needs to be addressed but you can do it right and relax afterword.

 

[dandan111]

I’ll echo the cut it up 3ft all around. Put something more weather resistant on bottom and get some good paint on it. Would look great!

 

[MushCreek]

Since I'm currently doing Galvalume wainscoting inside the barn, I decided to stick a couple pieces on the outside to see how it looks. These pieces are 4' tall; too tall, IMO. I'll probably go about 32". There will be a flashed PT 2X4 above it to form a water table. My wife is happy with it, too!

 

[Fav Onefour]

You already have a nice seam at the top of those 8' sheets. It would be easy to just swap in new sheets with proper edge sealing.

 

[MushCreek]

That's true. Lot of work to remove them, though. Also about $1800 in materials, not including paint.