The VISES of Garage Journal

[Mr. Wonderful]

Found my first American Scale Co. this morning! Very nice under the paint. Stored in a humidity controlled shop for a few decades! Pipe jaws intact. Does anyone know the years of manufacture on these? Seemed a fitting find on Americas birthday

 

[Beerhippie]

Here's my curious little vise o' the day find:







The jaws are 1 15/16" wide; opening is 2 1/4"; OAL is 6"; width 4"; height 2". The hex-socket screw is reversed--left-hand thread. The right-hand way has adjustable brass grub screws. The screws that hold it together are shoulder screws. The jaws are welded on and the bearings for the screw are brazed in.

I'm thinking this is a shop-built tool, but it was a fairly good shop with a good operator.

 

[Outlawmws]

Cool little shop made Timm!

Do I understand correctly that the slide is beveled onto the gibbs?

 

[Outlawmws]

Found my first American Scale Co. this morning!

Specs and model No.?

I have a couple of AS vises, they are very well made!

 

[Mr. Wonderful]

Specs and model No.?

I have a couple of AS vises, they are very well made!

I didn’t realize I forgot the specs!! It’s a 23A 4.5” at about 87lbs.

 

[Beerhippie]

Cool little shop made Timm!

Do I understand correctly that the slide is beveled onto the gibbs?

Yep. I lost my terminology for a bit there. With the brass (bronze?) gibb screws, it's tighter than a bull's *** in fly time. Not perfectly flat on the back, but I can fix that.

 

[jawstight]

Certainly not an antique but I picked a new Wilton 4" up today.

The cheap little Bessey I've been using does not lend itself to using Parallels because the bed does not extend all the way out to the static jaw. I fixed that last night by making a spacer out of a left over piece of brass bar stock to go between the static jaw face and the body. But it has a very shallow 1" throat depth.



This Wilton will work better for most things, and even with its 1-1/2" throat depth it's not nearly as tall as my Palmgren tilting vise.

 

[Tom Graham]

If you were guessing, what material would you say that this nut was cast from?

I’ve just dissembled a Charles Parker 974 and was more than a little surprised by this color I saw as I spun the fixed jaw around to remove the retainer pin and nut.

This is only Parker #5 for me. Maybe you’ve seen this before?

(edit: nut not screw)

 

[micahd1997]

If you were guessing, what material would you say that this main screw was cast from?

I’ve just dissembled a Charles Parker 974 and was more than a little surprised by this color I saw as I spun the fixed jaw around to remove the retainer pin and main screw.

This is only Parker #5 for me. Maybe you’ve seen this before?

I love the look of bronze and steel! I can’t spake to how common a brass nut is in Parker vises, but I’ve owned several Prentiss’s with bronze nuts. I haven’t identified any rhyme or reason to the occurrences of bronze slides in vises, but I do always enjoy seeing them.

 

[Beerhippie]

I'd say bronze, possibly brass. Bronze would be the right thing to use, but that nut isn't going to be as strong as steel.

My Parker 954 1/2 has a bronze collar:



I believe the vise is ca. 1940.

 

[Outlawmws]

I’ve just dissembled a Charles Parker 974

Markings on the 974? I'm wondering about the era it was made.

 

[Tom Graham]

The static jaw is the late generation 974 with the simple, angled brace (rather than scroll brace) at the rear. No other indications to an A or B suffix that I can see to indicate post-Union. (although I do wonder…)
I can see a “PM” on the dynamic jaw and a “974 P” on the swivel base brake shoe. (I just bought this on Tuesday in Wichita KS. This is not the same 974 with the extremely rusty swivel base and broken dynamic jaw that I posted a few days earlier (June 26 and Tuesday, July 1 .)

 

[RTM]

I’ve just dissembled a Charles Parker 974 and was more than a little surprised by this color I saw as I spun the fixed jaw around to remove the retainer pin and nut.

When I see bronze or brass where a normal tool or part would normally be steel, or cast iron, I think recast or reproduction. If you can find an iron version, see if yours is smaller by the shrink rate difference.

Easier to recast in bronze than in steel, probably easier to machine too.

 

[neophyte]

I'd say bronze, possibly brass. Bronze would be the right thing to use, but that nut isn't going to be as strong as steel.

My Parker 954 1/2 has a bronze collar:



I believe the vise is ca. 1940.

Steel would potentially be stronger than Brass/Bronze, but only if the right type of steel alloy were used.
Presumably, foundries casting vises would cast the nuts out of a material appropriate for casting, and iron and Bronze/Brass, are usually the metal alloys way more commonly cast.
Iron might be used because it was cheap, and and foundries casting vises would most likely already be pouring iron.
Brass or Bronze might be used, because even older brass and bronze alloys were way stronger than cast iron was, until modern iron alloys and heat treating techniques.
Brass and bronze alloys also tend to have a lower coefficient of friction when combined with a steel or iron screw, and would make tightening a vise easier, especially if the vise screw didn’t get lubricated frequently.

 

[Tom Graham]

The yellow main nut on my late-generation Charles Parker 974, which I disassembled last night, is definitely cast brass, not iron or bronze. I tested it with a strong magnet today, and it’s not magnetic. The bright yellow color suggests brass, but I also performed a positive sound test for a more distinct ring and observed a chemical reaction for zinc (using vinegar, hydrogen peroxide, and salt).

I’ve set the newer brass nut side-by-side to the typical cast iron nut from my older 974 for you to compare.

The threads on each nut match the main screw from either 974 easily. The brass nut is much heavier than the cast iron.

 

[OneMoreVice13]

Just purchased this guy earlier on offer-up! Any info about it? I found model 43S but nothing 43SN. It's in really good condition.

 

[CRSINMICH]

OneMore: From a 1964 catalog. Nice find.
​

EDIT: I should have noted that this was from a 1964 RIDGE Tool Company catalog. That's probably the reason for the number changes

​

 

[CRSINMICH]

This is the back cover of the 1964 Ridge Tool Company Catalog #86 of 1964

​

 

[CRSINMICH]

OneMore: I just discovered that by 1967 the Ridge Tool Company changed the name of their vises from Simplex to Ridgid. That narrows the possible age of your vise to 59 - 61 years.

 

[Beerhippie]

Cool little shop made Timm!

Do I understand correctly that the slide is beveled onto the gibbs?

Yeah, and the reversed-thread screw is kinda' driving me nuts. It's just wrong--like a right-hand drive vehicle on American roads.

 

[OneMoreVice13]

OneMore: From a 1964 catalog. Nice find.
​

EDIT: I should have noted that this was from a 1964 RIDGE Tool Company catalog. That's probably the reason for the number changes

​

Awesome thanks for all the details! That's really cool. I was thinking about painting it but I'm gonna keep it as is.

 

[OneMoreVice13]

OneMore: I just discovered that by 1967 the Ridge Tool Company changed the name of their vises from Simplex to Ridgid. That narrows the possible age of your vise to 59 - 61 years.

It's definitely in pretty good shape for it's age. I think I might clean this one up and keep it. Replacing the jaws might be a fun time once I learn how to go about it.

 

[CRSINMICH]

OneMore: Here's some information from the #86 catalog that might help; especially the part about jaws.​

 

[Tom Graham]

What original paint colors were used on Charles Parker vises? I thought that I had seen reference to initially black and then green. My only personal example that I believe to be good, original paint is this pictured late example of a Union-Parker 954.

i ask because I would like to select a color for a couple of older (pre-Union) Parkers that I have begun to restore. I initially thought that they looked best ”au naturel” but have since decided that I would like to paint at least one (starting with a 973 1/2)

I am leaning to the use of a flat or matte finish, think either of matte black, matte charcoal (or even indigo?!) and I’ve seen one flat green that looked nice.

If you have tried to re-create a Charles Parker original paint color with spray paint, what did you use?

 

[Outlawmws]

For your earlier 973-1/2 flat or satin black is probably closest.

The green ones were specifically to one model series that were less expensive and did not have the patented bars in the slides.

 

[ranger08]

If you were guessing, what material would you say that this nut was cast from?

I’ve just dissembled a Charles Parker 974 and was more than a little surprised by this color I saw as I spun the fixed jaw around to remove the retainer pin and nut.

This is only Parker #5 for me. Maybe you’ve seen this before?

(edit: nut not screw)

looks brass to me, brass nuts were used to impart less wear on the spindle, they are easily replaceable vs the main spindle, theoretically just as strong as steel as forces are in direct compression and not in shear, IMO

 

[ranger08]

I'd say bronze, possibly brass. Bronze would be the right thing to use, but that nut isn't going to be as strong as steel.

My Parker 954 1/2 has a bronze collar:



I believe the vise is ca. 1940.

pretty sure its brass, imo

 

[Private Lugnutz]

I plucked this teeny tiny critter out of a box of old C-clamps this morning at the flea.



I can see why it was mixed up with them. The static jaw and the dynamic jaw look like a vise, but the spindle looks like a clamp, and it has the overall shape and appearance of a C-clamp, with a base and provision for fastening to a bench. If anyone knows anything about it, please pipe up.



Not marked except for a "LANG" on the static jaw, which seems to be user-stamped...



...and a forged-in model number tab, "S4" or possibly "54".

 

[Private Lugnutz]

A few more shots for size context.

 

[Beerhippie]

^Well, ain't that just the cutest lil' thang!

 

[cody1325]

I recently traded a pair of beater axes and a couple pocketknives for a Lakeside to replace my Harbor Freight special. Should be getting it in a couple of days.

Curious--who made the Lakeside vises for Montgomery Wards?

 

[cody1325]

A few more shots for size context.

Neat!

I am wondering if, perhaps, I could possibly mod a C-clamp into a similar mini vise? Guess I need to pick up a couple different ones next Harbor Freight run--as I am NOT messing with any of my clamps--which, on average, are probably 70 years old.

 

[TheRealZeus]

At first glance at the profiled angle pic, I thought it was a nut cracker. Not with those jaws, tho. Neat.

 

[wildman63]

This one has me stumped. Morgan? Trojan? Same castings but not legible. I'll buy a pop to whomever can ID it!

 

[wildman63]

Close up

 

[TheRealZeus]

Based on the shape and remnants of lettering. It may be a Craftsman. Like a 5160. Got a better picture of that side? And the other?

 

[TheRealZeus]

Post #2, third ad. Courteous of Outlaw.
Post in thread 'Craftsman/Sears, Vise ID by Catalog'
https://www.garagejournal.com/forum/threads/craftsman-sears-vise-id-by-catalog.149519/post-2308591

Get you on the right track and if need be, someone can dial them closer.

 

[CRSINMICH]

Lugnutz: This is not the tiny vise you posted but it does have features in common with yours.

​

 

[Mr. Wonderful]

I grabbed this 6” Eron 150 thinking it was one of the British made units. I guess it’s Japanese. Oh well for $45 it doesn’t seem too bad. Not a ton of info on here about these

 

[Private Lugnutz]

Saw - and left behind - this massive Columbian (I didn't measure and guy didn't know, but looked at least like 8" jaws) this morning. I couldn't read the model number. Posterity pics.