Hydraulic Cylinder Tilt Aluma Trailer

[bugnut]

All I have a new to me Aluma trailer. My understanding is that the hydraulics on the trailer allow for locking in the upright/tilted position. This being so car can be loaded without tilting before all of the tires are on the trailer bed. Currently my trailer tilts freely up and down no matter where the ball valve is positioned. So I called Aluma and they have no information on this cylinder arrangement and no manual for how it works, which *****.

That said, I'd like to check the system and refill it so I can see whats really going on. I watched a couple videos and understand I have to have the trailer bed full down, beyond the stops-so the main cylinder is fully extended.
My questions:
How to fill the system and test?
What fluid should I use?
Can I use my tractor or the hydraulic unit from my Quick Jacks, hydraulics to test the system-I note there are quick connects on the system?

Any help greatly appreciated!

 

[Hohn]

It might be that Aluma didn't make the trailer that way, but a previous owner did.

 

[denis4x4]

I have a B&H(?) aluminum tilt trailer and the hydraulic cylinder is fully visible as is the pump and reservoir. In looking at the photo, I can't figure out how that even works!

 

[txvwnut]

We have some Big Tex tilt decks with a hydraulic cylinder and it's more like a dampener than a hold cylinder but they also do not have the additional plumbing that appears to be on yours. Take a few more pics of that setup so we can get a better idea of how it might work.

 

[customh]

You've got 3 functions/positions in the system: (I'm not sure from the pic if the horizontal cylinder's purpose is to lock the deck in the down position or not)
1. Tilt cylinder retracted, Locking? cylinder extended
2. Tilt cylinder extended, locking? cylinder retracted
3. Moving between positions: This one is fuzzy to me as it seems when the tilt cylinder is being powered to retract the locking? cylinder is also forced to extend

The Ball valve appears to select whether you're extending the locking cylinder or not, and in turn locking that cylinder into position when you close the valve.

If this is meant to be a closed system charged with hydraulic fluid it would in theory be timed such that the tilt cylinder drives the locking cylinder to retract when tilting then the ball valve would "lock" the deck in the tilted position? Looking at it again this doesn't make sense either because unless there is hydraulic power applied to the quick connects both movements of the tilt cylinder apply retract pressure to the horizontal cylinder.

I think @txvwnut is close to the truth with the damper idea so the deck doesn't slam down when weight rolls on to the deck. Need more pictures or insight as to the function of the horizontal cylinder.

 

[Fav Onefour]

I am surprised they were not able to help. I have contacted them in the past with trailer questions and had good luck. In fact, I'd say they went above my expectations. The first person I talked to was in the customer service area. She was not able to help with some details and connected me to other personnel. I had an engineer call back a few days later about one specific item.

Might be worth trying to call again. Find your build plate with the exact model number and build info before you call. It looks like one of their systems but there were different versions.

What about the seller? It sure looks like they used the trailer tilt.

 

[jack stand]

Is the horizontal cylinder acting as a reservoir?
With the tilting cylinder extended there's more fluid (you can use any hydraulic or light weight engine oil) required than this closed system can hold to fully retract the tilt cylinder. That's why I'm wondering the purpose of the horizontal cylinder.
I'd bet this was something that was added and not a factor set up.

 

[customh]

Looks like a factory option. I think @jack stand is on to something with the horizontal cylinder acting as a reservoir. It would also act as descent damper with the valve partially open.

 

[ericm]

Maybe a previous owner added the quick connects to make it into a powered tilt when connected to a tractor or other source.

Either tractor fluid or hydraulic fluid would work. Tractor fluid has additives for wet brakes and clutches on tractors but it's ok for hydraulics.

 

[bugnut]

Yesterday I got time to look at this in much more detail. Backed it into the shop and proceeded to tilt and take images. As some mentioned it is a closed system with a hand valve that can be used to hold in position. It will not hold position with the ball valve handle in the closed position. So I had previously called Aluma and they do install this unit on the trailer-it is factory original installation. They have no manual, build sheet, instructions or parts diagram for the unit. I then called Aluma again and found out they buy the entire unit from Force America. So I called Force America, after spending about an hour on the phone and being transferred *** times, talking to many folks, I finally got someone who knew enough about the system to provide assistance.

The system description is closed loop using the lower side to side cylinder for oil storage. When the trailer is tilted up the front to rear cylinder is extended and the side to side cylinder should be retracted, when the trailer is flat/closed, the side to side cylinder should be extended. The ball valve should be able to hold any position either with the trailer empty or loaded. This is so the tilt can be locked into position so that all wheels from the vehicle being loaded or unloaded are on/off the trailer surface before tilting.

Asking about the quick attach ports, that is how the system is filled from the factory/installation. Asked if they can be used to refill or test and the answer is yes given a psi on the pump limitation.

It was suggested by 2 of the folks at Force America that the ball valve be checked as that is the most likely problem.
SO in a day or 2 when I can get back at it, I will check cylinder extension/retraction and then the ball vale is next!

Thanks to all for tuning in appreciate the suggestions and help!!!

 

[Firebrick43]

You don't show the valves but assuming that they are functioning properly then the chances are either some oil has leaked out and you have air in the system, or the seal on the piston is torn/blown and is allowing fluid to bypass sides when the valves are closed.

That is a standard tie rod cylinder and seals/glands are readily available. FInd someone with a tractor and some hoses with quick connects to see if there is any air in the system

 

[bugnut]

@Firebrick43, ball valve is standard issue. I have both a tractor with a fel and quick connects or alternative is the power unit from the quickjacks. Will be using one for a source to see if it leaks. I did a quick google and the cylinders are readily available, so we'll get it fixed.

 

[bugnut]

Yesterday got a chance to look at the reservoir cylinder with the unit closed/flat. As the image shows the protrusion was only and inch or so. I'm guessing it should look like the front to back with about 8 inches of extension. So the next effort is to hook up a good hydraulic system and see what happens. Ball valve does appear to be working but if the system lacks fluid ball valve is moot at this time.

 

[txvwnut]

Looks like a lot of wetness on the bottom fittings of the tilt cylinder, plus the hose going to the top side is rubbing on the fitting on the bottom side.

 

[cannuck]

I would start by going back to Aluma and getting a schematic for the system.

There are 3 ways this might be rigged to work:
1. pump used to extend cylinder then you use ball valve to lock. other side of cylinder (ram end) vented to headspace in reservoir just to keep it clean
2. as above, but retract end filled with oil and connected below surface to use oil as damping fluid the ***** and blows into reservoir under oil at all times
3. pump used to power extension of cylinder while retract line flow into reservoir, and another valve position diverts pressure flow from pump to retract side allowing extend side to bleed back to reservoir.

You don't likely have option 3 as you would have a proper hydraulic, 2 circuit valve to work with, instead of some MickeyMouse setup using low pressure ball valves. For 1 and 2 to work, your pump must allow backflow relatively freely, so if no joy from the trailer company (and if they mounted the cylinder as in you pics, I would not have high expectations from them) head to the pump mfgr to see if it will allow backflow. Most of that kind of stuff is bought as a pump with reservoir combo.

Your thread makes me appreciate the 30 years of trouble free service from my mechanical trailer jack titling car trailer. Your hydraulic fittings, hoses and pump almost outweigh my entire steel trailer!

 

[manwithtools]

I would start by going back to Aluma and getting a schematic for the system.

There are 3 ways this might be rigged to work:
1. pump used to extend cylinder then you use ball valve to lock. other side of cylinder (ram end) vented to headspace in reservoir just to keep it clean
2. as above, but retract end filled with oil and connected below surface to use oil as damping fluid the ***** and blows into reservoir under oil at all times
3. pump used to power extension of cylinder while retract line flow into reservoir, and another valve position diverts pressure flow from pump to retract side allowing extend side to bleed back to reservoir.

You don't likely have option 3 as you would have a proper hydraulic, 2 circuit valve to work with, instead of some MickeyMouse setup using low pressure ball valves. For 1 and 2 to work, your pump must allow backflow relatively freely, so if no joy from the trailer company (and if they mounted the cylinder as in you pics, I would not have high expectations from them) head to the pump mfgr to see if it will allow backflow. Most of that kind of stuff is bought as a pump with reservoir combo.

Your thread makes me appreciate the 30 years of service from my mechanical trailer jack titling car trailer. Your hydraulic fittings, hoses and pump almost outweigh my entire ****** trailer!

You do realize this is a system designed to be used without a hydraulic pump in the circuit, correct?

 

[cannuck]

You do realize this is a system designed to be used without a hydraulic pump in the circuit, correct?

AAAHHHHH!!!!! NOW it make sense. Thanks for the overdue slap up the side of my fat head.

 

[ericm]

I bet they used the quick connects to fill the system with fluid and purge (most of) the air out. Just run it up and down a bunch of times with the tractor.

After the leak is fixed of course.

 

[bugnut]

All thanks for looking in. I checked and the system, per Force America is good to 2500psi. I looked up via a quick google and see Quick Jack is okay at 2100psi. Plan is shove it into the shop , cardboard on the floor, hook it together and see what happens. On a couple YT videos they show that one needs to insure the tilt is full and hard against the full extension of the cylinder. So hope to hit it over the weekend.

 

[bugnut]

@cannuck First place I started was Aluma, they had absolutely zero. They buy and install from Force America, I found a good contact at Force America who has been trying to coach my hard head through the process.

 

[cannuck]

@cannuck First place I started was Aluma, they had absolutely zero. They buy and install from Force America, I found a good contact at Force America who has been trying to coach my hard head through the process.

Force America would probably have looked at their installation and puked.

The yoke at the base of the cylinder is meant to be in double shear, but they have it mounted on a bolt in bending (similar at top). You will never get a decent bleed because the cylinder connections are at the side instead of at the top.

 

[cannuck]

-pushed reply instead of edit

 

[txvwnut]

Force America would probably have looked at their installation and puked.

The yoke at the base of the cylinder is meant to be in double shear, but they have it mounted on a bolt in bending (similar at top). You will never get a decent bleed because the cylinder connections are at the side instead of at the top.

The tilt cylinder is mounted in double shear, the buffer cylinder can be mounted anyway possible as it carries no load force so a double shear mount is not needed. Also with this setup the tilt cylinder is not doing any work its just being drug along for the ride, its only purpose is to slow the tilt action of the bed.


Also I've worked with Force America and they don't really care how there stuff gets installed as long as they don't have to do any warranty work.

 

[cannuck]

The tilt cylinder is mounted in double shear, the buffer cylinder can be mounted anyway possible as it carries no load force so a double shear mount is not needed. Also with this setup the tilt cylinder is not doing any work its just being drug along for the ride, its only purpose is to slow the tilt action of the bed.

I somehow managed to miss the part where there are two different circuits. I pictured tilt to happen with Bugnut jumpng on back end of the deck.

 

[bugnut]

All, got to spend some time on the hydraulic system. Backed it into the shop jacked it up and set it on cribbing so I could extend/tilt the trailer all the way with air space below the tilt at the highest point. I then cleaned and checked everything running a gloved hand over all the, hose, fittings and connections. Following that I climbed on the trailer and exercised the tilt function 4-5 times. I then repeated my crawl and wipe and found nothing. I then grabbed the hydraulic unit from my quick jack. Checking the tag it is rated for 2400 psi-just below the 2550 that the Force America guy told me. So I proceeded to try and hook up-ugh not so fast, the connection sizes are different. A 90 minute trip to the hydraulic shop and I had fittings that I could swap out and use the pump, I removed the QJ factory fitting and added adapters and the correct fitting. With that complete it was time to pump up the pressure. Slowly worked up to full tilt and slow release. I did have leaks, some from my threaded connections on the hose/adapter assemble and then some on the unit itself. After repeating this and clambering out many times to walk the tilt down I tried the ball valve. It held as it should. I also noted the rate of fall was slower than previous, this is probably the dampening created by the system. So after a lot of ups and downs, the system is currently filled and functioning. Long term the cylinders will need rebuilt or replaced. The front to back was wet on the bottom passenger side and the left to right was wet at the drivers side. Looking online, prices were about $100 each. I need to spend some time on YT and become a cylinder rebuild master or a cylinder replacement master. So at this time tilt works, the system did not leak out overnight and the ball valve works-all wins.

 

[txvwnut]

Those tierod cylinders are cheaper to replace than to rebuild. I’ve seen the barrels swell enough that the pistons will still bypass with new seals.

 

[bugnut]

@txvwnut Thanks I really like the idea of quick and new, lots less effort too.

 

[rus]

All, got to spend some time on the hydraulic system. Backed it into the shop jacked it up and set it on cribbing so I could extend/tilt the trailer all the way with air space below the tilt at the highest point. I then cleaned and checked everything running a gloved hand over all the, hose, fittings and connections. Following that I climbed on the trailer and exercised the tilt function 4-5 times. I then repeated my crawl and wipe and found nothing. I then grabbed the hydraulic unit from my quick jack. Checking the tag it is rated for 2400 psi-just below the 2550 that the Force America guy told me. So I proceeded to try and hook up-ugh not so fast, the connection sizes are different. A 90 minute trip to the hydraulic shop and I had fittings that I could swap out and use the pump, I removed the QJ factory fitting and added adapters and the correct fitting. With that complete it was time to pump up the pressure. Slowly worked up to full tilt and slow release. I did have leaks, some from my threaded connections on the hose/adapter assemble and then some on the unit itself. After repeating this and clambering out many times to walk the tilt down I tried the ball valve. It held as it should. I also noted the rate of fall was slower than previous, this is probably the dampening created by the system. So after a lot of ups and downs, the system is currently filled and functioning. Long term the cylinders will need rebuilt or replaced. The front to back was wet on the bottom passenger side and the left to right was wet at the drivers side. Looking online, prices were about $100 each. I need to spend some time on YT and become a cylinder rebuild master or a cylinder replacement master. So at this time tilt works, the system did not leak out overnight and the ball valve works-all wins.

Hey there, I have an Aluma tilt with this exact same system. One of the fittings loosened and the system needs a bit more fluid added back now. Can provide a bit more detail on what you did to fill the system? I would greatly appreciate it.

 

[bugnut]

@rus to fill the system I utilized the hydraulic pump from my quick jack, shown below, then using a different end fitting, provided by a local shop-mated to the quick jack hose-that matched the fitting on the trailer cylinder. Connecting this hose to the hydraulic cylinder on the trailer I was able to fill the system on my aluma trailer. This was done by using the up and down on the hydraulic pump and also lowering and raising the tilt bed on the trailer. This up and down on both the pump and the tilt bed was done several times until the ball valve could be actuated and hold the tilt bed in position.

If this isn't enough information please ask more direct questions

 

[rus]

@rus to fill the system I utilized the hydraulic pump from my quick jack, shown below, then using a different end fitting, provided by a local shop-mated to the quick jack hose-that matched the fitting on the trailer cylinder. Connecting this hose to the hydraulic cylinder on the trailer I was able to fill the system on my aluma trailer. This was done by using the up and down on the hydraulic pump and also lowering and raising the tilt bed on the trailer. This up and down on both the pump and the tilt bed was done several times until the ball valve could be actuated and hold the tilt bed in position.

If this isn't enough information please ask more direct questions

@bugnut thank you this is what I was thinking, appreciate you confirming your setup and the additional pictures! Very helpful