Suggestions for... Load Center surface mount with enclosed wire raceway to ceiling

[WI/MI Border]

Looking for simple design idea to enclose the branch wires from a load center to the ceiling.

I am surface mounting the panel. I want full insulation in the wall behind the panel. I'm running PVC conduit to a side or bottom mount for feed wires into the load center. I'm looking for simple ideas to enclose the branch wires that will exit to one side (about five circuits) and to the ceiling (about eight circuits). I'm ok with exiting and running branch wires inside the exterior wall. I just don't want to flush mount the panel.

Hopefully suggestions will follow the KISS methods as much as possible. A plywood raceway, from the top of the stem wall to the ceiling is among my first thoughts. And I'll be mounting the panel "upside down". Main breaker on the bottom. Might surprise some folks but it is acceptable here.

Thanks, Tim

FYI... 3/4" PVC is for ethernet and comm cables. The extra 1-1/4" PVC is for future solar install to home.

 

[Norcal]

Main breakers or lugs at the bottom are not "upside down" when the feed is at the bottom, when panels are installed with the main breaker or lugs at the top with bottom feeds show how ignorant the installers are.

 

[kngelv]

What are you using for your wall covering? I did this a few months ago in my newly built second garage. I ran all my romex in the studs but surface mounted the panel as shown. I used a 1 1/4" cable clamp on the back of the panel and pulled all my romex through it. The screws for the clamp are in the panel and the locknut is behind it. You can see it if you look close on the upper right inside the panel. You must dry fit everyuthing to get the hole lined up. Once installed I sealed the opening with silicone. Passed inspection and code compliant. Pics below.

James

 

[mike93lx]

Just build out a section of wall above it. Simple 2x4 framing then cover with whatever is going on the walls.

The conduit should have been completed before pulling any wire, fyi

 

[PCustoms]

Just build out a section of wall above it. Simple 2x4 framing then cover with whatever is going on the walls.

The conduit should have been completed before pulling any wire, fyi

X2 to both points here

 

[WI/MI Border]

Just build out a section of wall above it. Simple 2x4 framing then cover with whatever is going on the walls.

The conduit should have been completed before pulling any wire, fyi

Thanks. All of my branch circuits enter from above the stem wall and entering the panel on the left side, so I'll do that but build the wall below and to the left.

This is a sub-panel. Can you explain the issue with finishing the last three feet of conduit into the enclosure? I'm not seeing it being a problem but I'm a rookie.

 

[WI/MI Border]

What are you using for your wall covering? ...

7/16" OSB

 

[PCustoms]

Thanks. All of my branch circuits enter from above the stem wall and entering the panel on the left side, so I'll do that but build the wall below and to the left.

Are you surface mounting the branch circuits, or do they enter the wall cavity at some point?

Can you explain the issue with finishing the last three feet of conduit into the enclosure? I'm not seeing it being a problem but I'm a rookie.

Per code, the conduit is supposed to be completed end to end before wire is pulled. With PVC there is potential that the glue damages the wire insulation.

 

[WI/MI Border]

Are you surface mounting the branch circuits, or do they enter the wall cavity at some point?

They are in the wall and originally were going to exit the wall cavity left and below the panel location. That can be changed. I still have empty stud walls. I've temporarily mounted the panel to make sure I'm cutting branch circuits long + enough.

I was planning on entering the panel on the left but now that it's been suggested I may build a wire raceway under the panel and enter the bottom.

Per code, the conduit is supposed to be completed end to end before wire is pulled. With PVC there is potential that the glue damages the wire insulation.

Understood... I'll be extremely careful with glueing. As I mentioned in other posts earlier this year there are no inspections here. None. But I am still doing everything I can to code.

 

[WI/MI Border]

Main breakers or lugs at the bottom are not "upside down" when the feed is at the bottom...

Thus the quotation marks...

 

[PCustoms]

They are in the wall and originally were going to exit the wall cavity left and below the panel location. That can be changed. I still have empty stud walls. I've temporarily mounted the panel to make sure I'm cutting branch circuits long + enough.

I was planning on entering the panel on the left but now that it's been suggested I may build a wire raceway under the panel and enter the bottom.

So your in the wall cavity, will come out into your raceway, and into the panel?

Why not run the branch circuits directly into the panel, through the back?

For that matter, you could flush mount it and leave an access panel (cutout section of OSB) in case you want to run future circuits into the panel.

 

[sparky 1971]

Build a wall on top of the exterior wall from floor to ceiling. The panel can go in there and it will hide what is going to look like an abomination going in the bottom of the panel.

I almost always leave the last piece of conduit off, it makes for much easier pulling and or feeding.

 

[Codyboy]

Looking for simple design idea to enclose the branch wires from a load center to the ceiling.

I am surface mounting the panel. I want full insulation in the wall behind the panel. I'm running PVC conduit to a side or bottom mount for feed wires into the load center. I'm looking for simple ideas to enclose the branch wires that will exit to one side (about five circuits) and to the ceiling (about eight circuits). I'm ok with exiting and running branch wires inside the exterior wall. I just don't want to flush mount the panel.

Hopefully suggestions will follow the KISS methods as much as possible. A plywood raceway, from the top of the stem wall to the ceiling is among my first thoughts. And I'll be mounting the panel "upside down". Main breaker on the bottom. Might surprise some folks but it is acceptable here.

Thanks, Tim

FYI... 3/4" PVC is for ethernet and comm cables. The extra 1-1/4" PVC is for future solar install to home.

Why not just build that wall as a double 2x4 wall?
Thats a lot either way just for some insulation in a couple square feet compared to the other10k square feet of wall cavity.

I want to do something similar but not because of insulation. But for access to pull new circuits into the panel from the attic.
I have something like thay in the existing house now where I deleted that portion of the top plate above the panel.
Still difficult to fish a wire down into the panel though.

 

[wyliesdiesels]

The conduit should have been completed before pulling any wire, fyi

this

 

[Stuart in MN]

I've seen a simple sheet metal raceway built from the top of a load center to the ceiling to enclose the wires, painted to match the load center. The front panel of the raceway was held in place with screws so it could be removed in the future for adding circuits.

 

[WI/MI Border]

Build a wall on top of the exterior wall from floor to ceiling. The panel can go in there and it will hide what is going to look like an abomination going in the bottom of the panel.

I almost always leave the last piece of conduit off, it makes for much easier pulling and or feeding.

Thanks. I think that is my plan (floor to ceiling) going forward. I can hide the branch circuits coming into the box from below and make adding additional circuits from above much easier to finish off.

I'm about a month from closing in the walls so I have time to think about future proofing the wiring. I don't weld but I'm thinking adding wiring, coiled up in the ceiling for someone down the road to have an easy upgrade. I have the wire with no current use for it but could also use it for my EV charging (I use a NEMA 14-50 outlet in my other garage now). That's not necessary but might be a nice option.

The reason I pulled the wire before the monolithic slab was poured is because I wanted to be sure I could pull it all the way (45') without problems. Pros probably wouldn't bother since they do this everyday. I, on the other hand, routinely "over think" these projects. It's just what I do. I have more time than money so...

 

[WI/MI Border]

this

Yep, that's been emphasized in this thread. I don't think it will make any finishing difference for me but good to know for the future.

 

[mike93lx]

If you were to do this again, I would have the conduit come up inside of the block wall

 

[WI/MI Border]

deleted

 

[PCustoms]

If you were to do this again, I would have the conduit come up inside of the block wall

With the appropriate use of a bender* he probably still could.



*Don't ever use a torch

 

[WI/MI Border]

If you were to do this again, I would have the conduit come up inside of the block wall

Yep, I thought of that but locating the PVC before the slab was poured and before the masons arrived to do their part boggled my mind : )

It's just a shop/garage. Hopefully it won't be in the way where I located it.

 

[mike93lx]

Yep, I thought of that but locating the PVC before the slab was poured and before the masons arrived to do their part boggled my mind : )

It's just a shop/garage. Hopefully it won't be in the way where I located it.

I hear you. If it's the block joints, I wouldn't worry about it as they can adjust to compensate if it lands in the way.

Either way, it will work out fine

 

[WI/MI Border]

With the appropriate use of a bender* he probably still could.



*Don't ever use a torch

I will have to do a small bend in the PVC but nothing drastic. I've successfully put bends in this size with a heat gun in the past. Actually did that on the main panel in the basement where... shocker... I installed the PVC all the way to the panel before pulling the feeds! : )

 

[WI/MI Border]

Thanks for the advice everyone. Great forum here to get ideas from folks!

Especially Mike, Sparky and PCustoms. I really appreciate the positive suggestions.

 

[sparky 1971]

*Don't ever use a torch

I would never use a torch. On the other hand, My weed burner identifies as a bad *** and refuses to be mentioned in the same breath as a torch.

For something like this I'd get the hot box out and pre make an offset. That's easy for me to say since I already have one.

 

[mike93lx]

I would never use a torch. On the other hand, My weed burner identifies as a bad *** and refuses to be mentioned in the same breath as a torch.

For something like this I'd get the hot box out and pre make an offset. That's easy for me to say since I already have one.

What sandpaper works best to remove the burn marks?

 

[sparky 1971]

What sandpaper works best to remove the burn marks?

Sandpaper?

https://www.acehardware.com/departments/paint-and-supplies/spray-paint/general-purpose/F002800?store=17656&gStoreCode=17656&gQT=1&variationProductCode=1395854

 

[Bert_]

With the appropriate use of a bender* he probably still could.



*Don't ever use a torch

I've bent quite a bit of PVC with a propane bottle torch.

Recently I stuck some PVC over the exhaust on the ditch witch. Actually worked extremely well.

 

[sparky 1971]

I've bent quite a bit of PVC with a propane bottle torch.

Recently I stuck some PVC over the exhaust on the ditch witch. Actually worked extremely well.

One time I took the hot box so I left the weed burner at home. When I got to the job I realized my generator was still sitting in the garage and the little torch was out of propane so I dumped a bottle of glue on the ground and lit it on fire. It worked but took forever. I might have been able to run home and get the generator or weed burner in about the same amount of time.

 

[dave*99]

I saw a swimming pool installer bend perfect 90 degree sweeps into 3/4 PVC conduit with a simple propane torch. He did about a dozen of them. No burns.

 

[PCustoms]

I saw a swimming pool installer bend perfect 90 degree sweeps into 3/4 PVC conduit with a simple propane torch. He did about a dozen of them. No burns.

The skinny stuff is ez..

 

[alfredeneuman]

I ran all my romex in the studs but surface mounted the panel as shown. I used a 1 1/4" cable clamp on the back of the panel and pulled all my romex through it.

Romex connectors are allowed to have a maximum of 2 cables through it.

 

[PCustoms]

@alfredeneuman let me guess, you're going to point out the clamp is not rated for that many NM-b?

 

[mm08822]

I was too (last night, but refrained) along with the box cut-ins. Those would be some serious goof plates.

And it passed inspection.