just a bunch of random questions that need answered please

[tekkerAMCer]

well for starters i am 21 yr old guy who loves cars. i am deciding to venture out away from the shelter of my mothers house as my passion for cars and my collection of parts, tools, supply's, and projects has out grown our small drive way and my shed.

is it easier to go on your own with buying property or is hiring a reality broker a wise investment? i have tracked down the private owner but have not asked him directly about the property. but i am 100% sure its for sale. just doesn't have a sign out front.

is it easier to get financing if i use a reality broker?

i have read on here people restoring old fire stations and historic buildings and making them a place to live in. has anyone converted a smaller sized factory into a usable/ livable space?

picture #6 #7 from bottom Wayne school #2 and gym. 2 different pics are of the same building. 1 is the south side and the othere is of the west side.

http://www.oldohioschools.com/ashtabula_county.htm

i want this place because it is my dream home. basically a HUGE place to work on my cars with somewhere to eat sleep and use the bathroom

how would i heat a massive building in the winter? radiant floor heat, hot water wall mounted heat exchanger, a few well placed furnaces?

the roof needs repaired most of the windows need replaced and im sure it will need a new well and some sort of septic. so i plan to wait until spring before i get serious about this place to avoid working in the cold ohio winters on this place just to get it in a livable condition. this gives me time to save up a nice sized down payment.

i will post pictures of the inside and outside as soon as i send them from my phone to my email.

if any more info is needed to answer my ? then just ask.

p.s. this forum has been my bible since i graduated wyotech last yr. and i cant list all the ideas and such i have gotten from here.

 

[jklingel]

there's nothing magic about a realtor, or what they do, though a good one has experience. if you've found a place, see the owner about the price, and do your own homework on what its value is by looking into comparable places. i'd suggest getting someone with more experience than you to look at the place and run down what needs to be done to bring it up to code, etc. you may find that the land is the only value and you can build new cheaper and easier than repairing old. i would suggest that you buy land and build PART of your dream shop, having designed it to accommodate growth, not just funky, tacky add-ons later. keep your debt minimal. i know this is your dream, but you are young and dreams change. if you are stuck w/ debt that is way beyond your means, you are setting yourself up for a disastrous start, esp if you decide in 2 yrs to go to college in california because the chicks wear bikinis to class, or move to alaska because there is a moose behind every bush (there ain't; trust me). start low and slow; you have plenty of time. john

 

[ZRX61]

p.s. this forum has been my bible since i graduated wyotech last yr. and i cant list all the ideas and such i have gotten from here.

This place is worse than heroin...

 

[cowboyjosh]

Buy something within your means, dreams change as mentioned above; gradually gravitate towards your dream home and the dream of restoring a old building. Trust me my dream home when I was 21 versus when I was even 25 were way different.

I know there are lots of TV shows about folks restoring old buildings into something grand as all get out, what they DON'T often tell you is that most of those folks paid cash for the buildings since most banks won't loan on a building that is all broke *** and not habitable at possession; nor will they likely loan (especially in this economy) for improvements to said broke *** building. Hell some banks won't even loan money to folks who want to pick up a foreclosure to fix up and move into. I suggest find something you can afford, take pride in, and that needs some "sweat equity", not something from the start that needs a complete rehab.


If you don't work with a Realtor; your going to need a Lawyer to do a title search, facilitate a home inspection, not to mention writing a contract, you might need a soils test, and a perk test if there is a septic tank to the property you are purchasing; not to mention your going to need a appraisal for the loan as well. A SELLER typically pays for the Realtor, so if you hire a Realtor, he will likely get 2.8% of the sale, the sellers Realtor then gets the remainder of the 5, 6, or 7% of the commission; so a Realtor might not be a bad idea.

 

[Concrete B]

Realtors in Ohio get paid from the SELLER. So it does not matter at all if you use one. It is proper to only use one, so find one you like, and have them look for what you want. If you find a for sale by owner it may be worth doing all the work on your end. If you rent I'd look on your own, buy with a realtor, or at least make sure you use a good honest banker. A good realtor will do all the hard work like making appointments and making sure the permits and legal are in order.

Edit: if I were single I'd grab up a small house (or trailer) with a big garage and be done with it. Not that it would suit everyone, but it would sure suit me. I hope my next house is a 40s-50s period home. I think I can sell my wife on it!

 

[Concrete B]

Also, restoring a building can be tough. Most buildings like that have flat roofs and can be pricey to fix (and heat). I would block off part of the building and heat only what I needed to. You'll have to remember that window, roof, exterior repairs, and landscaping are all pricey. You're 21, you don't want to blow your credit over something that becomes too much. I had a buddy that lived in his winnebago outside of a garage, but that's what he could afford and still have "fun" money

 

[bazzateer]

You'll need to look into whether the zoning will allow you to convert into residential as well.

 

[sgtmonte]

Definately work with a Realtor because I would think that zoning will be a major issue if you plan on living there.

 

[fomocoforrester]

I would say you are far too early on the learning / experience curve to take the big decisions involved in buying property. Especially considering the current uncertain state of the market and the fact that this is going to be your first venture on your own. As others have said, your views on what is right for you are almost certainly going to change over the next few years.

I'm not sure how things work in Ohio, but when I lived in Florida I rented a four car unit with a small office in a gated retail storage facility which worked out really well for a couple of years.

As far as energy consumption is concerned, in Florida I only had AC in the office to give a bit of relief from the heat. Where I am now in a colder climate, I have made big savings by partitioning off a small area as a machine shop / clean assembly area and normally only heating this smaller space.

As in Florida, I have found that having a space maintained at optimum temperature, where I can occasionally take refuge from the extremes of temperature in the main shop area, greatly increases my tolerance level of less than ideal conditions.

Whatever you decide, I wish you the best of luck with your venture.....

 

[Charles (in GA)]

You are talking tens of thousands of dollars for every project you mention, the well, septic, roof, windows............ utilities would be far beyond your means unless you are turning a $100k+ a year.

Why do you need all this space? You have to maintain all of it, paint all of it, etc.

I could not afford that even if someone gave it to me.

You are also looking at environmental aspects such as asbestos in the building that the building inspectors would be forcing you to do something about...........

And as already mentioned, the zoning would be an issue.

Charles

 

[tdkkart]

keep your debt minimal. i know this is your dream, but you are young and dreams change. if you are stuck w/ debt that is way beyond your means, you are setting yourself up for a disastrous start, esp if you decide in 2 yrs to go to college in california because the chicks wear bikinis to class, or move to alaska because there is a moose behind every bush (there ain't; trust me). start low and slow; you have plenty of time. john

Good advice.
I knew a couple guys at work that had dreams of being farmers, both of them with next to zero experience and living in houses in town.

Guy #1, has a modest house in town he's was paying on, should have had it payed off years ago but spent too much money screwing around with mud trucks, beer drinking etc rather than moving towards is dream. He finally saved a small down payment and bought a "farm", consisting of about 60acres of sand, a dilapidated house and buildings. He set it up on a short payment schedule that pretty much took all of his monthly income.
So now he's got a money pit of a farm and no money to either fix the buildings or buy equipment to work the land. Oh BTW, first thing he does is throws out the guy that's paying him $6000/yr to rent the land, because of course he's gonna farm it himself.
Over the course of a couple years he ends up buying a few pieces of farm equipment, all of it junk and needing fairly major work. He's constantly bitching that every time he goes to do something his equipment falls apart.
He swears people are sugaring his gas tanks and poking holes in his radiators.
In the mean time he's still living in town, trying to commute 20 miles to the farm to tinker, after he sleeps till 11am every morning. Every time he leaves tools etc at the farm they get stolen.
This goes on for 10 years or so. He's never gotten a crop of any sort off the land, none of the buildings are fixed, he's got piles of junk, and his health has gone to hell. He ends up dumping the whole works for a huge loss.

Guy #2 lives in his now mostly paid for house in town. It's nearly paid for because he's lived conservatively for the last 10-15 years, paying as he went and saving money for a downpayment on a farm. Buys a mostly functional 80 acre farm via an estate auction. Liveable house and buildings, good quality farm ground with a renter that pays him a fair price to farm the ground. Sells his in town house and moves the wife and kids to the country.
Spends the next 5 years or so fixing the house and buildings, as well as collecting a batch of reasonably functional farm equipment. He works his *** off, but it's paid for as he goes.
Finally the day comes where he can embark on farming his own land, and he does it successfully. A few years later he buys another small acreage and another 100 acres of ground a couple miles away. He has now built a new house, shop and large pole building on the 2nd acreage. Sold the first acreage for a decent profit and is now farming nearly 200 acres himself.
Everything is paid for and is decent stuff. In a couple years he'll be able to retire from his factory job and just tinker around with the farming.

It can be done, you just gotta be careful and smart.

 

[Graymills - Craig]

well for starters i am 21 yr old guy who loves cars. i am deciding to venture out away from the shelter of my mothers house as my passion for cars and my collection of parts, tools, supply's, and projects has out grown our small drive way and my shed.

Good on ya!

is it easier to go on your own with buying property or is hiring a reality broker a wise investment? i have tracked down the private owner but have not asked him directly about the property. but i am 100% sure its for sale. just doesn't have a sign out front.

The realtor will simplify things for you, but if you go on your own, you can typically negotiate for part to all of what would have gone to your realtor (typically 2.5-3%). If you do it yourself, make sure you read up on what to do and what risks there are, from earnest money to inspections to closing costs.

is it easier to get financing if i use a reality broker?

No. They'll steer you to their contacts, but that only helps with the introduction. And, to take a cynical view, are you sure they're not steering you to mortgage brokers who will give them a kickback?

i have read on here people restoring old fire stations and historic buildings and making them a place to live in. has anyone converted a smaller sized factory into a usable/ livable space?

It's VERY expensive (but cool). Keep in mind that old buildings typically have problems from remediation (especially old garages, etc.), zoning, structure, etc. You'll need a GOOD inspector and an understanding of any zoning variances.

picture #6 #7 from bottom Wayne school #2 and gym. 2 different pics are of the same building. 1 is the south side and the othere is of the west side.

http://www.oldohioschools.com/ashtabula_county.htm

i want this place because it is my dream home. basically a HUGE place to work on my cars with somewhere to eat sleep and use the bathroom

Big is cool, but big means big tax, repair, and utility bills, too. Can you float those? And keep in mind that what the current owner pays in taxes likely has little bearing on what you will pay, since change of ownership usually means a resetting of taxes.

how would i heat a massive building in the winter? radiant floor heat, hot water wall mounted heat exchanger, a few well placed furnaces?

Huge.

the roof needs repaired most of the windows need replaced and im sure it will need a new well and some sort of septic. so i plan to wait until spring before i get serious about this place to avoid working in the cold ohio winters on this place just to get it in a livable condition. this gives me time to save up a nice sized down payment.

You'll need to save much more than this. You might not even get an occupancy permit until all those problems are fixed (assuming zoning goes through).

i will post pictures of the inside and outside as soon as i send them from my phone to my email.

if any more info is needed to answer my ? then just ask.

p.s. this forum has been my bible since i graduated wyotech last yr. and i cant list all the ideas and such i have gotten from here.

We're glad to help, but be careful with this purchase.

 

[Graymills - Craig]

Realtors in Ohio get paid from the SELLER. So it does not matter at all if you use one.

That's the same everywhere, but if you don't have a realtor, you can typically negotiate for a good chunk of the payment that would have gone to yours.

 

[Falcon67]

Not to be harsh, but based on experience buying many houses, land etc and the quality/quantity of your questions - do not try to buy anything on your own. Educate yourself on the process - yes. Get an experienced Realtor to work with you. Get recommendations from friends, family, etc. to hep you pick. Work your financing yourself with recommendations from the Realtor or broker, possibly others. You will need to be pre-approved anyway, and that will tell you what you can spend. Shop around, money costs vary.

Land/home/building buying is a mine field and there are lots of things that go wrong, or are wrong when buying property. There will be fees out the azz so you want to have help making sure you know what you are paying for. Some of those fees protect you against unforeseen items. You sign a 4' high lile of paper for a reason, really.

Case in point - we are looking at two houses. Friendly chatting/howdy-do with the neighbor bought up a possible issue with the fence, the property line and city water. We scored a copy of the survey on that house. Bought a $40 metal detector at Harbor Freight and went all gopher (house is not occupied) at the property looking for the survey pins. Guess what - fence is 3' over on neighbors property and lot is missing 4' in the back because of a misplaced water line. Did seller disclose? No, they did not. Stuff like this is more common than you'd think. These are not old properties either - older stuff in old parts of towns can be way worse on documentation and locations.

 

[sberry]

I know a couple guys with old buildings, one with old school that never could get out from under it, these buildings are so old and big that every issue is a huge expense, 25K for roof, thousands for windows, if you got to save for a down payment you cant afford it.

 

[tekkerAMCer]

it is zoned industrial but it is located in the middle of nowhere. i didn't think i wouldn't be allowed to live inside it.

i have family that has skill in everything id need to fix up the house. ( dad is a roofer, uncle is a plumber, grandfather operates heavy equipment ) so fixing everything is not a concern of mine.

around me i have figured its better to buy a place and pay $250 - 350 a month plus utilities instead of rent a tiny 1 bed 1 bath health hazard for $550 - 650 plus utilities.

as far as income is concerned. wyotech made sure i wouldn't have a problem with that. and my father and possible a girlfriend plan to move in and chip in there above average income towards the building.

my only concern is what is the best way to make it mine? and what i should do first when it is mine?

edit: both pictures are of main shop. left picture looks south and should the big kitchen through that window. right picture is looking north garage door is add-on done by previous owner while it was a rubber factory. there is a smaller shop behind there

 

[NUTTSGT]

It looks run down in both of those pictures. What's the green on the floor, some kind of funk, from the roof leaking?


Not trying to sound like a **** but there is a reason those schools are no longer in use, not to mention why do you think schools are constantly asking for new levies.

Put up a pole building for yourself and make some living quarters in one end.

 

[rsanter]

1 generally for the buyer the realtor os a freebeee. the seller pays the fees. get a realtor as they have the inside lone on alot of stuff

2 its ok to dream big but be realistic. having a big space for cars and a small corner to sleep in sounds cool when your young but if you ever want a girlfriend, wife, or family then you have to think about how you will use that property later.
if you can buy a place that you can use for your needs today and then adapt the place later or buy a place that will have good resale value then your ahead

3 you dont heat the whole space, it costs too much
establish a smaller working space and living space and leave the rest alone

bob

 

[Ocho]

Rent or lease some shop space. If you meet a pretty girl, decide to go to school, get a better job offer in a another state, etc. you won't have to unload an albatross property.

 

[e-tek]

I think you had it right in your first post - you need a REALITY broker!

Just kidding of course - couldn't resist (I'm like that...). Dreams are awesome, gumption even better. Some good advice above from guys with expereince. I'm sure you can find some decent houses with good garages/shops that would be a good start. As said earlier, start low and slow and work you way to your ultimate dream home/shop. With the right (lucky) choices, you'll get there and have some money left over!

 

[xcgates]

Hey, as I remember it, an albatross was a good luck charm until some idiot killed it.

 

[cowboyjosh]

You mentioned that the building used to be a RUBBER FACTORY; would be interested to know now about any soil contamination and if the property is a "brown field"? Based on the pictures, I don't know where I'd start with rehab, and this coming from a builder and electrician. If I were in Ohio, I bet I could build you a nice, brand new, tidy house, with a big *** garage for you for way less $ then you'll sink into this property grant it, it won't be a Taj Mahal but it'd be a fine home. I bet if you quoted out a modest house with a local builder, they could do the same.

 

[ddawg16]

Some good advice so far.....

Just remember..."You learn by your mistakes"....that is why some of the guys in here are so ****** smart.....

 

[Charles (in GA)]

Some good advice so far.....

Just remember..."You learn by your mistakes"....that is why some of the guys in here are so ****** smart.....

I never made a mistake, I got it right the first time, every time.

Charles

 

[Dewaynep]

I'll ask the million dollar question: How much is the building itself going for?

 

[SPDMETL]

After spending serious time looking for the right house/shop combo, we decided to just concentrate on the house and add the shop. We tried for a long time to find an existing setup because it's cheaper, but that has been surprisingly elusive. Of course, you have to be in the right zoning situation to do that. Listen to the people who tell you new is cheaper...maybe you could save the facade of that building and have a new polebarn behind it ?

 

[Cobra4B]

Living in a big-*** shop is cool when you're 21 and into cars. However, most chicks don't want to come back to your creepy abandoned "shop" in the middle of nowhere (that's how most horror movies start). Plus, when it eventually comes time to move/sell you're going to have to try to sell to a non-existant market.

A buddy of mine flys helos in the Navy and was stationed in Corpus Christie.... his plans were to build a big 5-6 car garage with a living space on the 2nd floor. Not sure if he ever followed through with it, but it'd be terribly hard to sell.

It's like modifying a car on credit... you go buck wild with this awesome creation that you think is really cool, but come time to sell it and you can't get anything for it. You see it all the time.... "CUSTOM SHOW CAR, OVER $60,000 INVESTED" and it's a crazy overdone Civic that they owner can't get $10k for.

You say that Wyotech has got you squared away, but are you sure of that? Do you have a current job that's stable with benefits? How much do you owe Wyotech? All your cars paid for? Debt is bad.... and keeping up with the Jones' is what got this country in the mess it's in.

It's all good to learn from your mistakes, but being stupid with money/debt isn't a good one to take this approach with. It's taken my GF 4 years of living like a complete bum to make a dent in the hole she dug from a big car loan on a brand new car and a few maxed out credit cards from back when she used to make $50k/yr cash tending bar 3 nights a week. She quickly learned that the "real world", even with a good job, doesn't pay quite as well when taxes are accounted for.

Good luck... I'd live as cheaply as possible until all my other debt was paid off, then save up for a house.

 

[Red05GT]

There are lots of real estate deals out there these days that will have more
upside potential and fewer headaches than this property. Finding a banker
to loan you money on a property like this would be next to impossible without
other collateral. And as mentioned by others, what you think is cool and all
you want will be different when a wife and kids are added to the mix.

While "free" help from friends and family is great, just the materials to secure
and stop the decline of a building this large is a huge number. Potential
asbestos, becomes your liability if you buy it. Power was probably turned off
and disconnected, so a new updated and inspected electrical system will be
required. Many parts of the state now require a mound septic system, 25K +.
New roofing material 50-100K, windows and doors, just count the number of
units in the building and multiply by $ 300-500 each. Heating was probably
with a boiler, not feasible for zone heating of just the area you want to use.
Taxes and zoning issues that will not be kind.

As tdkkart told of two guys that wanted to farm, imagine getting strapped
into this money pit and spending 10-15 years of your life trying to restore
or improve this building. I'm sure by now you think that everyone is raining
on your parade and being negative, but as many have said, it's that thing
called experience. Just my .02, and you did ask for answers.

 

[tekkerAMCer]

i talked to the guy on the phone yesterday

he bought it for 55000 its appraised at 57500

and he is asking 45000 but im sure i could offer him a little bit lower. it will need septic roof and electrical

the rest is small stuff i wont worry about util i actually own it.

would it be better to work out a land contract with him personally or still get a loan?

 

[dmw56]

You might need to be concerned about hazardous materials in that building i.e asbestos, lead paint, etc. and the costs for abatement.

 

[W-Cummins]

Bottom line do you have the $45k?? If not go and talk to a banker to see if they will loan you the $$$ or ask the owner if he will carry the paper on it. With out the cash or the financing the rest is a moot point. I would say you will be lucky to find a bank that will touch it, but you never know.

William....