Drainage issue in alley

[gayler]

My garage was built 23 years ago. It is a 30x40 post frame, slab on grade with a four inch floor. It sits parallel with the alley. When built the garage and approach was above the grade of the alley the rest of the driveway was crushed concrete and sloped to the alley. At that time there was no drainage issues. Over the years the city added material, sand and gravel to the alley instead of blading it when potholes would happen. Now the driveway is lower than the alley and the garage is about the same level as the alley. Any time it rains my driveway is under water and won’t drain. I have spoken to the city numerous times and they claim the problem is my garage has no gutters I explained I have a large overhang and gutters wouldn’t change anything. They then claimed my slab had “settled “! Any advice on how to get this corrected? The alley needs to be cut down to the level it was in the beginning but the city won’t do it. Sorry for the long rant.

 

[wssix99]

Use the historic imagery feature of Google Earth to prove to the City that their work over the past decades has changed things. If that fails, they may listen more if you get a lawyer.

I had the same issue but built my property after the alley had been built up. I raised my garage but had the puddles since Day 1. Fortunately, my City understood that the alley was built without proper drainage (according to their own specs) and we were headed to legal discussions so they re-constructed the alley. (That took a couple of years of promises before the project was carved out of the budget.)

If there are no storm sewers or grates in the alley, it should be cupped so the middle of the alley trenches the water and carries it out to a street where there are storm drains.

 

[DGersic]

The alley needs to be cut down to the level it was in the beginning but the city won’t do it.

Start becoming a pain in the *** for whatever city department is responsible for alley maintenance. Show up to every public meeting, call. write letters. Figure out who is in charge and badger them, or find the guy with the grader and flip him a $100 to come remove some material.

I have a similar situation, but I’m now about 9” below the street grade. They’ve tried to give me the same ******** answer about “settling” though I can show that the street has been raised. Now they’re falling back to the “oh, you should elevate your house” answer. It’s easy to spend someone else’s money.

 

[cannuck]

I have same problem. the apron behind my shop is sloped a few inches over 20' and the bottom WAS a few more inches above the back alley. Years of town "improving" the surface by adding gravel and clay fill and in spring melt the apron and fence (structural as it support tensioned fabric roof) floods by about 2". I have to get out my pump and send the water about 60' either way over very gentle rises. I am tempted to ***** at the town, but my fully covered back arpon is kind of pushing the limits on what is allowed, so need to let that sleeping dog lie. I guess my message is: councils and especially town/city bureaucrats can be vindictive arseholes. Know exactly where you stand (read the related bylaws), what you are getting into and who is who before taking a run at them.

 

[carcruse]

Since you have an alley, you are most likely in a very old subdivision. Newer subdivisions require an overall drainage plan as part of the development. It will not hurt to check if there is one for your subdivision showing your property and the alley proposed grades. Also check for any past grading plans for just the alley.

 

[BillK]

Do you have any pictures from when your garage was built that might show the alley at that time ? How about a survey from when you bought your house ? That might also show grade levels. i would start out by trying to find solid evidence of how the alley used to be.

 

[gayler]

Do you have any pictures from when your garage was built that might show the alley at that time ? How about a survey from when you bought your house ? That might also show grade levels. i would start out by trying to find solid evidence of how the alley used to be.

No survey of the property or pictures. I’m trying to get information from Cleary building but have not heard back yet. I’ve included pictures of my driveways and alley. I own the properties on both sides of the alley. One we inherited when my father in law passed away.

 

[PoorUB]

No survey of the property or pictures. I’m trying to get information from Cleary building but have not heard back yet. I’ve included pictures of my driveways and alley. I own the properties on both sides of the alley. One we inherited when my father in law passed away.

Are you the last house on the alley? In the one picture it looks like it.

I am the second house from the end of the block and during hard rain the neighbor behind me and I had water standing for days. No alley. We didn't try fight the city, we just dug in 4" drain tile and ran it out to the curb across the adjacent neighbor's yard, with his permission of course.. We saw cut the curb where the drain went through and patched it in. Zero issues since.

In your case I would either dig in a drain, or it looks like you could dig in a shallow ditch out to the curb along the alley. Easier and less stress than trying to fight with the city.

 

[dcg9381]

No survey of the property or pictures. I’m trying to get information from Cleary building but have not heard back yet.

City will have records of the maintenance. Good luck getting them. Maybe hit them with a FOIA?

But you can use Google Earth Historical Imaging - works pretty well to show changes over time. I can't give you a direct link, but I managed to click around and find it for my address. It might show when they added material to the road.

Pretty clear to me that the "road" is higher than your lot. One of the qualifiers around here for any construction is "cannot change existing drainage".

 

[Jacko264]

City will have records of the maintenance. Good luck getting them. Maybe hit them with a FOIA?

But you can use Google Earth Historical Imaging - works pretty well to show changes over time. I can't give you a direct link, but I managed to click around and find it for my address. It might show when they added material to the road.

Pretty clear to me that the "road" is higher than your lot. One of the qualifiers around here for any construction is "cannot change existing drainage".

If you look at both ends of the alley it looks like the roads are higher then your alley is that why it’s flooding ?

 

[dcg9381]

If you look at both ends of the alley it looks like the roads are higher then your alley is that why it’s flooding ?

I dunno in the OPs case, but road grading can substantially alter drainage... If the road is higher, it may create a "berm" that flows water to the lowest drive.. Hard to tell without being there, but if this is a "fairly recent" problem with recent road changes......

Amount of water volume matters too. Sometimes problems don't show up until you get a lot of rain in a very short time.

 

[gayler]

Are you the last house on the alley? In the one picture it looks like it.

I am the second house from the end of the block and during hard rain the neighbor behind me and I had water standing for days. No alley. We didn't try fight the city, we just dug in 4" drain tile and ran it out to the curb across the adjacent neighbor's yard, with his permission of course.. We saw cut the curb where the drain went through and patched it in. Zero issues since.

In your case I would either dig in a drain, or it looks like you could dig in a shallow ditch out to the curb along the alley. Easier and less stress than trying to fight with the city.

I thought about digging a shallow ditch along the edge of the alley. I just don’t think I should have to, but I might.

 

[gayler]

City will have records of the maintenance. Good luck getting them. Maybe hit them with a FOIA?

But you can use Google Earth Historical Imaging - works pretty well to show changes over time. I can't give you a direct link, but I managed to click around and find it for my address. It might show when they added material to the road.

Pretty clear to me that the "road" is higher than your lot. One of the qualifiers around here for any construction is "cannot change existing drainage".

Our small town won’t have records of anything. The center of the street is pretty high due to chip sealing the streets so many times over the years, but the gutters is much lower.

 

[gayler]

If you look at both ends of the alley it looks like the roads are higher then your alley is that why it’s flooding ?

Gutter is lower. The center of the street is very high due to chip sealing the streets so many times over the years.

 

[gayler]

One big problem is that I’m on the city council. Our town has lots of issues I was elected because people knew that I would work to make changes. Trouble is , everyone from the city administrator on down are buddies including mayor and most of the other council members. As you can imagine I’m not very popular with any of them.

 

[dcg9381]

Our small town won’t have records of anything. The center of the street is pretty high due to chip sealing the streets so many times over the years, but the gutters is much lower.

Not doubting you...

But how do the "road crews" get dispatched? How do they know what to prioritize? There's heavy machinery, someone is paying for road base....

Sounds like a great place to get a job and take a nap since they don't track anything. Which is probably a thing.

 

[gayler]

lol

Not doubting you...

But how do the "road crews" get dispatched? How do they know what to prioritize? There's heavy machinery, someone is paying for road base....

Sounds like a great place to get a job and take a nap since they don't track anything. Which is probably a thing.

it is a great place to take a nap. Supervisors have no idea where the employees are at. It took the Facebook warriors to get a paved street fixed that had foot deep ruts in it! A street that all city vehicles travel daily to get to their fuel pumps! One of the city trash trucks lost a steering drag link at the landfill! Imagine if that happened on the hi way! The city doesn’t use a time lock. It’s on your honor to write in your time. The town is 1.3 square miles and all but two employees drive city vehicles home every day. Many other issues. Sorry for the rant.

 

[Jacko264]

Hi would it be possible to build a hump on your property just of the road( alley ) like a sleeping police man or woman to stop water coming of the road onto your land.
I know you would have to drive over it but if it stops the water all well and good.
also if you had gutters and the water went into a pond or tank it must / should help with the problem
Graham

 

[PoorUB]

I thought about digging a shallow ditch along the edge of the alley. I just don’t think I should have to, but I might.

That is what I would do and stop messing with the city. Your blood pressure will will be better!