Power over Ethernet (POE) powered driveway gate

[Stuart in MN]

I saw this guy's video yesterday, he's pretty clever. He was able to operate a driveway gate 1000' from his house using Power over Ethernet, and threw in several security cameras at the same time.

 

[racecougar]

I'm impressed. That's thinking outside the box.

 

[njk4o5]

wow i might try that

 

[Codyboy]

I watched that a week or so ago. And just re-watched it.
I wish he would give more detail on the setup.
He says its poe but then has 12awg wire and fiber from the shop.
Is the 12awg wire AC or DC?
And then there is what I guess is two wifi antennas on the control box.
Having a hard time understanding all of it.

But being that my gate is 1200ft from the house and I want cameras down there I'll probably have to figure out a setup like this.

 

[racecougar]

I skimmed it, but the gist that I picked up is that the Ethernet cable provides 24V to charge the battery that actually operates the motor.

 

[dcg9381]

Is the 12awg wire AC or DC?
And then there is what I guess is two wifi antennas on the control box.
But being that my gate is 1200ft from the house and I want cameras down there I'll probably have to figure out a setup like this.

I skimmed it. He mentioned it's low-voltage DC, probably POE level DC. He mentions running fiber and power in the same conduit.

I did one of these, it was way easier for me to throw up a 100 watt solar panel, 2 batteries, on a solar charge controller with low-voltage cut off and then power cameras via a DC to DC POE converter. But my gate was closer so I could still get wifi to the cameras with a directional antenna.

 

[Codyboy]

I skimmed it. He mentioned it's low-voltage DC, probably POE level DC. He mentions running fiber and power in the same conduit.

I did one of these, it was way easier for me to throw up a 100 watt solar panel, 2 batteries, on a solar charge controller with low-voltage cut off and then power cameras via a DC to DC POE converter. But my gate was closer so I could still get wifi to the cameras with a directional antenna.

Yeah I'm not really looking forward to trenching 1200ft.
My issue is so many trees . If I did solar power I'd have to set it up farther away where there is somewhat of a clearer spot. Not 1200 ft but at least 75 to 100 ft.
Then there is the cameras. I did see a video on a wifi antenna that had pretty good range. I don't remember who did the video but it was one of those homestead / hobby ranch / farm guys.

 

[dcg9381]

Then there is the cameras. I did see a video on a wifi antenna that had pretty good range. I don't remember who did the video but it was one of those homestead / hobby ranch / farm guys.

Directional antennas have exceptional range, but they require line-of-site, so if you're heavily treed and can't can't relay in between, you may be building this the same way this guy did...

 

[theoldwizard1]

I watched that a week or so ago. And just re-watched it.
I wish he would give more detail on the setup.
He says its poe but then has 12awg wire and fiber from the shop.

POE does not spec the cable ! Using 12AWG and fiber is very smart as you can not run CAT 5 or CAT6 that long !

Using separate power wires is part of the standard From Wikipedia "Alternative/mode B, which separates the data and the power conductors for 10BASE-T/100BASE-TX, making troubleshooting easier"

Is the 12awg wire AC or DC?

DC. 12v is very common, but I would have "injected" 24V. I can not find the exact model of PoE "splitter" he is using with the voltage and current displays.

Having a hard time understanding all of it.

That is because he keeps "mixing" installation for short runs (<330') and longer runs. Longer runs definitely need heavier wire and fiber.

And then there is what I guess is two wifi antennas on the control box.

That is what the WiFi control wants. Don't get hung up on it as it is "optional" !


Personally, I would have gone one step further (in for a penny, in for a pound). I would have added a larger LiFePO4 battery, solar charge controller and 120VAC inverter (or a combo). Then you would have 120VAC at the gate for things like a drill or saw !

 

[dcg9381]

I would have added a larger LiFePO4 battery, solar charge controller and 120VAC inverter (or a combo). Then you would have 120VAC at the gate for things like a drill or saw !

It looks pretty shaded there, limited solar.
I like the inverter idea, but they do have idle draw. Guess you could get one on a switch. Or get one that does the DC to DC step to charge..
And LiFeP04 can't be charged below freezing, so you'd need to heat it or buy a battery/charge controller that is "smart" enough not to charge below freezing.. Looks like a part of the US where they have an actual winter.

 

[theoldwizard1]

It looks pretty shaded there, limited solar.

He is not using solar power, just a solar charge controller to charge the batteries !

I like the inverter idea, but they do have idle draw.

Minimal. You are sending power down the wire 100% of the time.

And LiFeP04 can't be charged below freezing, ...

Good point, I missed that !

Good reason for old fashion lead acid. Two 6V golf cart batteries would be best.

 

[dcg9381]

He is not using solar power, just a solar charge controller to charge the batteries !

I was referring to your comment that you'd use a solar charge controller. In retrospect, I think you meant using the solar charge controller as the battery charger with the POE input as "solar".. I get it now. I like this also, especially as many solar controller have "low battery" disconnects.

Minimal. You are sending power down the wire 100% of the time.

Understood, the idle draw on my Victron stuff (3000 watts) is 10-20 watts. Scale that back to "power a saw" - say 2000 watts, it's not completely unsubstantial for this amount of charge, I think the high end of POE is like 60W. Bigger deal would be that you're going to need some fat cables to get a 12V battery to power 1000-2000 watts for a saw. I don't remember POE voltages off the top of my head, but maybe 2 batteries in series if you're going up to "inverter" power.

Good reason for old fashion lead acid. Two 6V golf cart batteries would be best.

I like your suggestion of going up to 24 volts especially if an inverter was added.

 

[theoldwizard1]

Understood, the idle draw on my Victron stuff (3000 watts) is 10-20 watts. Scale that back to "power a saw" - say 2000 watts, it's not completely unsubstantial for this amount of charge, ...

The PoE does not directly power the load ! The battery does by acting as a large buffer/reservoir of power.

Of course now a days, everyone has battery power tools and a portable AC power station (Jackery, etc) might be a better solution.

I think the high end of POE is like 60W. Bigger deal would be that you're going to need some fat cables to get a 12V battery to power 1000-2000 watts for a saw. I don't remember POE voltages off the top of my head, but maybe 2 batteries in series if you're going up to "inverter" power.

I think the limit is 48V ?

Still need the batteries to power the gate motor.

 

[theoldwizard1]

I think the limit is 48V ?

Segue - The latest spec on USB Power Deliver (PD) says with the correct cables you can do 240W (48VDC @ 5A) !

 

[racecougar]

Segue #2 - My alternator was producing 18+ V last night...the battery really didn't like that.

 

[Codyboy]

POE does not spec the cable ! Using 12AWG and fiber is very smart as you can not run CAT 5 or CAT6 that long !

Using separate power wires is part of the standard From Wikipedia "Alternative/mode B, which separates the data and the power conductors for 10BASE-T/100BASE-TX, making troubleshooting easier"


DC. 12v is very common, but I would have "injected" 24V. I can not find the exact model of PoE "splitter" he is using with the voltage and current displays.


That is because he keeps "mixing" installation for short runs (<330') and longer runs. Longer runs definitely need heavier wire and fiber.


That is what the WiFi control wants. Don't get hung up on it as it is "optional" !


Personally, I would have gone one step further (in for a penny, in for a pound). I would have added a larger LiFePO4 battery, solar charge controller and 120VAC inverter (or a combo). Then you would have 120VAC at the gate for things like a drill or saw !

So it is not really PoE because the power is not OVER the ethernet cable.
I didn’t see anything in that wiki link you posted.
Seems misleading to call it PoE to me.
Maybe EoP but not sure how that works either.

It seems its just power on the 12awg wire to power the batteries to keep them topped up and the data for the cameras are on fiber.

I will say I know nothing of this stuff except that my cameras I have are PoE using cat 5e and cat6 which is powered from an nvr and some from a PoE switch.

 

[theoldwizard1]

It seems its just power on the 12awg wire to power the batteries to keep them topped up and the data for the cameras are on fiber.

I won't argue with you. There are some standards for voltage and currents in the PoE standard that should be adhered to, but with separate power wires, it is probably NOT an issue.

 

[theoldwizard1]

Segue #2 - My alternator was producing 18+ V last night...the battery really didn't like that.

Pull the caps and make sure the fluid is topped off !

 

[kj_mustang]

POE can go over regular CAT 5 or 6 copper cable. Can not go over Fiber.

 

[sardonux]

Times perfectly with two of my upcoming projects - (1) covering my property with Wifi and (2) adding a gate to the end of my driveway. My home and workshop are already running a Unifi UDM Pro setup, this will dovetail perfectly with my plans.