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Harbor freight markets to posers

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Shoreline_

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Nothing to do with the customer's ability. But HF marketing reminds me of 90s GM commercials when they would compare themselves to BMW and MB. It was like "oh you wanna look like you have an expensive car?"

HF - "Oh you wanna look like you own snap on but don't wanna spend the money?"

They should just come up with their own stuff. Every guy I know that loves icon loves the fact their stuff looks like Snapon.
 
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Jtels85

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Imitation is the sincerest form of flattery.

We have a shop full of heavy equipment technicians and road techs, and guess what? A number of them use ICON on the daily and haven’t had any issues that I’m aware of. Our crane tech told me the only thing he’ll buy from SnapOn are their ratchets, everything else he uses is from Harbor Freight, GearWrench and Husky.

Be angry about it. I think it’s hilarious.
 

The Metric System

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I have seen a whole lot of home wrenches who have Snap-On gear that gets used exclusively for pedestrian stuff like oil changes, spark plug replacements, and (maybe) brake jobs.

I have also seen plenty of professionals doing complex and important technical work with Icon/Pittsburgh/Doyle etc, because that was the tool that was available to them.

I will leave it to the reader to determine which of these use cases is more consistent with the term "poser".
 
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d.mcfarland

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Imitation is the sincerest form of flattery.


A number of them use ICON on the daily and haven’t had any issues

In regards to what shoreline is saying, if HF just copied Snap On, they shouldn't (like you said) have any issues. Snap On did the R+D to make a quality design.

To play devil's advocate, there are so many good quality tools available these days that you would have to purposefully go out of the way to find junk stuff. Intellectual property "sharing" (stealing) is probably just as responsible as is manufacturing advancements.
 

gizardlizard

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Agree with Jtels85. I bet the guys the poster is talking about also loves the fact that Icon is far cheaper. Let the Snap On fan boys cry about it all they like. I am NOT brand loyal. I have Icon, snap on, Mac, craftsman, you name it. Have lots of Icon at work and abuse them daily. Have yet to warranty any of it.
 

zendriver

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Why wouldn’t somebody who cannot afford an expensive car want to buy a reasonably priced car that looks like an expensive car? :rolleyes2

Snap on tools are expensive but good quality and they look nice

Icon look and function like snap on tools, but they cost less

It’s marketing is literally a “no-brainer”


Of course, nobody that ever buys snap on tools are “posers” :lol: I know from my own personal experience
 
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Hakeem

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I use a ton of icon stuff as a newer HD mechanic and have been very satisfied with it all. The only tool truck stuff I have is a couple of ratchets and some specialty items. I live close to a HF and their service is always great. Meanwhile the tool truck reps I’ve dealt have been friendly but unreliable, and getting service/warranty can be a hassle.

If I was younger I’d be more likely to load up on debt and try to keep up with the jones but I’m old enough to know what matters: getting the job done and saving money where I can. At this point, I’d be embarrassed to wear SnapOn swag lest somebody think I spent a bunch of money with them.

THAT SAID - I do think the imitation snapon branding is embarrassing. I wish they would have tried to carve their own lane, but oh well.
 

Hakeem

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They should just come up with their own stuff. Every guy I know that loves icon loves the fact their stuff looks like Snapon.
Oddly enough, I thought everyone hated the “GreatValue” Snapon vibe like you and me. But when i made a poll on the Harbor Freight Reddit (admittedly not the most scientific polling method), the results were like 80:20 in favor of the fact that it looked like Snap-on. Go figure.
 

Chipm

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I turn wrenches for a living. My opinion is to use good tools that get the job done. I view a "poser" as the guy who uses the fact that they own Snap-on as evidence that they must be a good mechanic, when really that is irrelevant and the quality if his work is what matters.
 

cgrutt

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I prefer Snap on over pretty much every other brand for a number of reasons but cant afford them last ten years or so and, regrettably, sold off alot of my Snap on and replaced them with other brands. I have some ICON and like them because they're somewhat affordable and generally work fine. I have broken some and sold off others that I didn't care for. Was noticing just the other day that the chrome wrenches seem to scratch much more easily than my Snap-on tools ever did. Have a few ICON tools that look beat up but are only a few years old. Granted this could be all in my head or maybe part of the reason they cost so much less. They work and I have no problem using them. Still wish they were Snap on and will likely replace them if and when I land on my feet again.
 

M.Jay

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HF - "Oh you wanna look like you own snap on but don't wanna spend the money?"
Who cares about which brand copies whom? Just buy the stuff that fits your needs and carry on. If you don't like how HF does business, don't buy there. Anything beyond that is childish behavior I'll leave to influencers and their animosities.
 

ChefRex

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90% of my tools are SO, they were the best, reliable drivers when I started.
Not long age I had a Matco ratcheting wrench fail me, no driver for years, not wanting to pay 4,5 times the price for a set of SO I gave Icon a try.

So far I am not disappointed as hard as it is to admit.
 

zendriver

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I blame OPEC and their 1973 oil embargo, doubling gas prices (to $.50 ) triggering a global recession, that lasted almost a decade

Formerly affluentAmerica’s lost their economic minds, gladly start saying **** yes to cheap fuel efficient vehicles from the far east, snapping them up as quickly as they were unloaded from ships. Then follow TVs stereos, microwaves, and most everything else.

The rest is history
 

zimman

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Nothing to do with the customer's ability. But HF marketing reminds me of 90s GM commercials when they would compare themselves to BMW and MB. It was like "oh you wanna look like you have an expensive car?"

HF - "Oh you wanna look like you own snap on but don't wanna spend the money?"

They should just come up with their own stuff. Every guy I know that loves icon loves the fact their stuff looks like Snapon.


I'm not sure why but I don't have time to be marketed. I don't watch, listen to or see any advertisements for anything. If I need something I go to the store and get it. I'm no longer in the shops so tool trucks are non existent and don't need them. I've got plenty. Lastly why would a poser be a bad thing? When I pull my top drawer, I'm proud of everything in it regardless of brand or price. It's mine and I'm proud.
Zim
 
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tak1313

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To echo what some have stated using a different industry. As a former chef (Executive), it's not the tool that makes a fabulous dish, it's the chef.

I have seen chefs and cooks use the best, most expensive equipment (ala Le Creuset, All-Clad, expensive (REALLY expensive) knives, etc.) create dishes that is no better than a kid with a bad cookbook. I have seen chefs and cooks use beater pans and knives from SYSCO create things that would be Michelin Star rated.

A "poser" is someone that uses his/her tools in an attempt to make OTHERS think they are great. A great chef/cook is simply that - great - regardless of the tools he or she uses.
 

shoggoth80

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I turn wrenches for a living. My opinion is to use good tools that get the job done. I view a "poser" as the guy who uses the fact that they own Snap-on as evidence that they must be a good mechanic, when really that is irrelevant and the quality if his work is what matters.
This. All day, every day.

A poser is someone who wants to appear a certain way. Everyone who seems to like Icon like it for the intersection of price and quality (where I work anyway). High value. Probably one of the more convenient brick and mortar options out there. None care about what other brand it looks like, unless it relates to function, or ergos. Others may have different experiences, but this has been mine.
 

gahrajmahal

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I love those ads and TV commercials that show a supposedly “tradesman” doing skilled work then have this hammer in the shot. Picked up last minute by the prop master for the shot.

IMG_1584.jpeg

Another one that always got me was a tv commercial shown during episodes of This Old House, that had a young couple (with a ) buff husband completing a deck project while holding a ball peen hammer.

Back when I was turning wrenches I had a hard time buying lunch out, much less affording purchases from the tool trucks. My best deal was when I “traded” services with the tool truck owner. I pimped out his tool truck van in trade for a set of oxy-acetylene torches.
 
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neophyte

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Plenty of tool companies “copy” the successful designs from other manufacturers.
Sometimes this is just to offer their customers tools that are as functional as possible.
Other times, it’s because the customers associate “the look and aesthetics” of the tool, as part of the functionality, and the copying manufacturer wants to sell the tools they make.
Record , (and I think Eclipse), tried redesigning their tools in the 1960s? using “modern design” aesthetics, possibly as a selling ploy, or because they thought a “modern design” might be better.
It might have actually been a top UK industrial designer who did the designs, although that’s a bit of guesswork.
The planes routinely get crapped on as bad tool design, and I think Record went back to the older designs for the items they kept in production.
I believe many if the Eclipse designs remained in production.
Veritas/Lee Valley, has tried similar “modernization” with various woodworking tools such as planes, usually with less complaints, but still with some, even in major woodworking magazines.

As far as the items Harbor Freight has “copied”, many were basic tool forms that existed for decades, or even a century, that lots of people associate with Snap-On, simply because they’re the “big name” in professional automotive tools.
The Harbor Freight Icon screwdrivers do appear very similar to the Snap-On screwdrivers, but even without the branding differences, the screwdrivers aren’t identical, and the Snap-On screwdriver handle had a design patent, which ran out, so anyone is legally free to copy the design now except for the Snap-On trademarked branding.
The long nose three pivot point “talon grip” pliers were literally just a revamp of an older style of pliers, that Sears, and other manufacturers had variously offered, combined with an offset three point slip joint design, which Snap-On tried Patenting.
Snap-On used that three point offset design on a non-spectacular, fairly standard slip joint plier design, which HF/Icon copied first, and Snap-On seems to have never challenged HF for Patent infringement, either considering a court challenge not worth the cost, or maybe they sent a challenge letter, and HF pointed out why they thought the Patent was bullsh!t, so Snap-On shrugged and let things be.
Whatever the case, the Snap-On patent is likely basically unenforceable nowadays.
As far as other Snap-On pliers, many of the designs far predate Snap-On offering pliers, or even Snap-On existing.
The red cushy plier handles are hardly unique to Snap-On.

One could also argue that the Dodge Viper was built for “posers”, but that didn’t seem to stop the cars from having decent performance.
 

MovingAlong

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I've been using their Pittsburg tools for 20+ years: wrenches, reg sockets, impact sockets rachets, breaker bars. Since nothing has broken in that time (have ground down quite a few wrenches & sockets over the years), doubt I'll ever get around to trying anything from the Icon line...

They do look nice though. (y)
 

Jeffrey D

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I love those ads and TV commercials that show a supposedly “tradesman” doing skilled work then have this hammer in the shot. Picked up last minute by the prop master for the shot.

IMG_1584.jpeg

Another one that always got me was a tv commercial shown during episodes of This Old House, that had a young couple (with a ) buff husband completing a deck project while holding a ball peen hammer.

Back when I was turning wrenches I had a hard time buying lunch out, much less affording purchases from the tool trucks. My best deal was when I “traded” services with the tool truck owner. I pimped out his tool truck van in trade for a set of oxy-acetylene torches.
JLHav813SSfCMErvA7IUEr9haLXU7phV8ZiBwEc4eGo.jpg
Photos like this 🤨
 

tak1313

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I am dating myself, but in my "hotrod days," the big wheels to get were Centerline wheels - I don't even know if they still exist. At the track, a LOT of "posers" had Centerline wheels and Mickey Thompson slicks on cars that would do 15 seconds+ down the quarter mile.

Then you had the guys that put all their money into the engine, trans, and chassis that would do 10 seconds or less...with steel wheels and worn tires.
 

gatewaysysop

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Nothing to do with the customer's ability. But HF marketing reminds me of 90s GM commercials when they would compare themselves to BMW and MB. It was like "oh you wanna look like you have an expensive car?"

HF - "Oh you wanna look like you own snap on but don't wanna spend the money?"

They should just come up with their own stuff. Every guy I know that loves icon loves the fact their stuff looks like Snapon.

So I have a bit of a different take on this. I don't have issue with people buying/using HF stuff, like Icon, in and of itself. What I do take issue with is when those same people claim that anyone buying the actual Snap-On/Knipex/etc. are doing so just to push an image. I find it ridiculously hypocritical that someone buying a Snap-On or Knipex look-a-like will turn around and grief someone buying the real thing.

After all, if you're buying the shamelessly marketed look-a-like product, that would suggest to some folks that you're trying to look like the very people you're criticizing, just at lower price point. If I'm a brand ***** for buying Knipex, for example, what does that make these folks for buying look-a-like Knipex? Should I infer that they want to look-like brand whores from a distance? :dunno:

Other than than, I say to each his own. ;)
 

impactims

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Nothing to do with the customer's ability. But HF marketing reminds me of 90s GM commercials when they would compare themselves to BMW and MB. It was like "oh you wanna look like you have an expensive car?"

HF - "Oh you wanna look like you own snap on but don't wanna spend the money?"

They should just come up with their own stuff. Every guy I know that loves icon loves the fact their stuff looks like Snapon.
Yup, nothing from HF is allowed to be in my garage for this reason.

Sometimes I feel like I’m the only one that looks at it this way.
 

Ditchdigger

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We have a shop full of heavy equipment technicians and road techs, and guess what? A number of them use ICON on the daily and haven’t had any issues that I’m aware of. Our crane tech told me the only thing he’ll buy from SnapOn are their ratchets,

That is where I am now. I moved my workspace to a different location and the tool trucks don't stop here. I wound up going the HF 6 blocks away any time I needed anything, and after 6 months I went back onto the snappy truck to buy some screwdriver bits I had misplaced. $46 for 3 Phillips bits. I stepped off the truck and decided I wasn't going back on again.
 

Jtels85

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That is where I am now. I moved my workspace to a different location and the tool trucks don't stop here. I wound up going the HF 6 blocks away any time I needed anything, and after 6 months I went back onto the snappy truck to buy some screwdriver bits I had misplaced. $46 for 3 Phillips bits. I stepped off the truck and decided I wasn't going back on again.

SnapOn’s prices aren’t just expensive, they’re borderline criminal.

I love talking shop with these guys. It’s interesting to see the senior techs who have a box full of old SnapOn tools, and the younger guys have a hodgepodge of Harbor Freight and whatever Black Friday deal they scored off Amazon. A couple of the young guys have told me they don’t go on the trucks because they simply can’t afford it. That’s unusual for someone who’s making $35+/hr starting out.

I don’t know what the answer is, but apparently Harbor Freight noticed a void in the market and took advantage. I say good for them!
 
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