I just need to rant!!!

[johnson1975]

Well - I hire a distant friend to build my shop - the reason I hired him is becuase he had a good vision and was willing to build a custom pole barn for us - most other contractors just wanted to slap up the standard pole barn kit and move on.

Well - we agreed on price and he told me the shop would take about 3 weeks to build. Well - we started job the 1st week of July and the freaking thing still is not done.

It is a 30x40x12 with 6/12 pitch, overhang, fully insulated, cupula and smartside exterior.

I have paid him in installments along the way - and the last installment I paid him was realistically to much (looking back now)

I get so tired of coming home everyday to notice nothing has been done and I will call him to ask why and it is one excuse after another. If the SOB would put in a 40 hour week, the job would be done - thing is, it is hard to get anything done when you only work 10-12 hours a week and there is only 2 guys.

I am holding my tounge becuase I am at the point of - if he leaves, it will cost me more to finish it vs the money I left due to him (3k)

He gives me excuses as to why he did not show up - I know his excuses are BS....but I feel he has me by the ********* (finacially speaking).

When the job is done - I am going to be sure and let him know what a piece of **** he is and how lazy he is and how I would NEVER recomend him to anyone. The work he is doing is good work - it is just taking forever.

anyone else got any stories to share - maye it will make me feel better

 

[GarageEnvy]

Are you asking if anyone else has had experience with a contractor taking longer than he originally stated? That would be just about everyone. Is is frustrating? Yeah. Is it common? Yeah. In my opinion building that structure with 2 guys in 3 weeks is completely unrealistic. It makes me think he's either totally inexperienced, had some other jobs pop up and he's dividing his time, or we're not getting the whole story. At any rate it looks like mistakes were made on both sides of the deal and if nothing else it is a learning experience.

 

[rickycobra]

Call him up and tell him you want the money back if he doesn't start showing up. However he might be working on two jobs. Good Luck with it all.

 

[haugy]

Is any of this "deal" in writing?

You do have options, but they won't be pretty. That's why I don't do business with friends.

 

[ket-tek]

he told me the shop would take about 3 weeks to build. Well - we started job the 1st week of July and the freaking thing still is not done.

It is a 30x40x12 with 6/12 pitch, overhang, fully insulated, cupula and smartside exterior.

Sorry to hear it, I would see if you could push him for a little longer to at least get the moneys worth complete that you've shelled out to him already. And then fire him and move on.

3 weeks for that amount of barn? from the ground work, to a cupula and all? and with only 2 guys? that would have been impressive to complete for sure, would have been the key suspicion to me at the start.

Is he working from a professional set of plans you had done, some he drew up, or is he just building on the fly?

Got a pic of the current stage of progress to share?

 

[gorilla]

When he finishes the work delay paying him as long as he delayed you. I'm sure that you could come up with BS excuses if needed.

 

[johnson1975]

I thought 3 weeks sounded fast - the thing that ticks me off is the fact that he will not show up some days and usually only puts in about 12 hours a week. example....he has not worked since last Friday becuase he is waiting for the garage door guy to put up a piece of weather striping on the door - he acts like he cant do anything until this gets done.....BS - there are plenty of other items that need to be done. He just looks for any excuse not to work.

Heck - if there is a rian cloud in the sky and it is 200 miles away - he will pack up and leave - and forget him working if there is mud on the ground:

when he was installing metal roof - one day he left becuase it was to hot to handle the metal - I thought they had invented something called gloves..

I will see what I can do to get some pictures up for you guys - the shop will look great when it finally gets done

 

[scooterseats]

Well, I agree, it sounds like the guy is a flake. I am sorry that you have had this trouble. I chose to have one of the standard package pole buildings put up and the company that I chose was just unbelievable. It is 30X40 with 10' walls. It is insulated, foil/encapsulated bubble/white interior, with one 10' roll up, 1 7' overhead and 1 36" passage door.
They put this shop up in three working days. Of course, these were not consecutive ( weather) but they were within 2 weeks.
The first day 5 men arrived with the materials (I had already ordered the dirt and it was onsite). They leveled the dirt and put up the wood framework and were gone by 4 PM. A couple of days later three men arrived with the cement finishing equipment. They put the vapor barrier down and poured the cement (fiber filled) and were finished by 7 PM. The final day the same 5 men arrived that were there the first day with all the final materials and put the insulation up, trimmed it and put all the metal up. Finally they installed the doors and helped me push my 1939 Ford Coupe in and were gone by 3 PM.
This was three years ago and there hasn't been the first leak or any other problem with this building, I couldn't be any more pleased.

 

[ovilla]

Help him get organized so he sees the BIG picture!

If the friendship is worth saving (or even if it's not) put together a punch list and put each task into MS Project so you can develop a plan. Then list each person that will be working on each task, along with the start and end dates for everything.

Once complete, share it with him and get his buy-in to being able to complete his weekly "goals". Then go to Kinkos and get your project plan blown up and hang it by the main entrance so he sees it coming and going. Then when he finishes a task, mark it off the list.

That should hopefully give him a little pressure to stay on track. You might also want to break up your last payment so you can pay out smaller sums after the completion of certain tasks (another motivator).

Best of luck!

 

[Heavy Metal Doctor]

anyone else got any stories to share - maybe it will make me feel better

The contractor did the same thing when we built our familly shop / barn at my brothers. The place was then owned by my dad, and I remember him stewing over a lot the same issues with that guy. The dude even tried to stick Dad with the rental of the forklift he needed to lift the roof trusses. That was after the extra grading / drainage stuff the had to do (extra cost - but understandable) because they found water in a hole when the did the post holes. My dad told him that he bid the job knowing what the work was and that he (contractor) should have planned for it. That was when the work slowed down, constant excuses for working a half day here and there....it finally got done when we started putting up siding ourselves and told the guy to go **** in his hat....a short time later my sisters screen porch this guy did just prior to the barn had problems with the roof and it nearly went to her highing a lawyer.....we never saw him again and dad never paid him the last installment on the barn.

 

[NUTTSGT]

You should never hire freinds or family. Getting them to help on a project is one thing but actually hiring them is another.

 

[BPJOOP93]

One quick question. where are you located?
maybe he's just tired.


he probably just needs a nap

 

[T1320T]

Sorry about your crappy experience man. It ***** dealing w shadey builders/contractors. I just went through a bad deal w my block layer... man, dealing w/ empty heads torques me off. Does he have a formal business or is he just a "carpenter for cash"? If he has an actual business name you may want to ask him how it's going to look when you call the BBB to discuss his company, that may motivate him.

 

[chief ben]

What we call a good worker or contractor or builder in Arkansas is one that just shows up every day, As for as your so called "" Friend Ship "" it was over as soon as you gave him the first Dollar, when I have a big problem like that I turn it over to the wife, because I get to Mad and want to Kill them, all the little woman has to do is talk to them two times, first time is to find out when it is going to be done, if it is not to her liking, the word to them is your fired, and tells them our lawer will be talking to them about the money we want back, I had to go to texas a few years ago to get back one of our welding truck one of our employees stold, and wile I was gone the other 3
A-Holes took a few days off, when she spoted one of our other trucks at a Bar She went in got the keys from the one guy and Fired all 3 of them, I got home she told me what happend, I shut the shop down sold the work trucks and went back on the Retired List, and now have a Beautiful Hobby Shop to Play in, Good Luck On Your Problem Mr. Johnson

 

[haugy]

3 weeks is actually long in my opinion.

Walt's Buildings had my shop up in a total of 4 days. 30x40x14, with no cranes for the trusses, and that includes garage doors. I was beyond amazed.

And it was 2 guys only! And the building is perfect.

EDIT: I just realized, this information is probably not making you feel better, sorry.

 

[willymakeit]

Make sure to get material and labor lein releases.

 

[Grumpy365]

You don't know problems , until this happens with a construction loan in place and you are up against the drop dead date for completion.

If he is doing good work everything will be ok , but it is frustrating as he'll.

Good luck. Hang in there.

 

[strelnik]

anyone else got any stories to share - maye it will make me feel better

I live in a state with 14% unemployment (Michigan) and 30% unemployment in Detroit.

I can't hire anyone to help with the smallest of things. No one wants to work.

I can't even hire college students, they don't want to work more than 4 hours on a weekend.

My block work ois being done by a friend, a retired mason who does a little every month. Fortunately, this doesn't stop me.

I work two jobs and may be nforced to retire from one due to age, so I am getting all the extra work and travel completed that I can before I go. Then I'll be down to one job and working in the man-cave/enclave, which I hope to have finished by next spring.

The building is up and tight with electricity. I
have to:

- build a toilet trailer and water supply,
- help Les finish the block work,
- insulate the ceiling,
- paint the blockwork,
- seal 1/2 the floor in the shop area,
- install the burglar-proof screens and
- install the heating system

Then I have to
- build two steel theft doors,
- add one 36" x 96" human/fire door
- install 18 x 8foot fluorescent lights
- install a burglar alarm
- move 12 cars in there
- move my tools
- take a nap

- start working


by myself

 

[strelnik]

I live in a state with 14% unemployment (Michigan) and 30% unemployment in Detroit.

I can't hire anyone to help with the smallest of things. No one wants to work.

I can't even hire college students, they don't want to work more than 4 hours on a weekend.

My block work ois being done by a friend, a retired mason who does a little every month. Fortunately, this doesn't stop me.

I work two jobs and may be nforced to retire from one due to age, so I am getting all the extra work and travel completed that I can before I go. Then I'll be down to one job and working in the man-cave/enclave, which I hope to have finished by next spring.

The building is up and tight with electricity. I
have to:

- build a toilet trailer and water supply,
- help Les finish the block work,
- insulate the ceiling,
- paint the blockwork,
- seal 1/2 the floor in the shop area,
- install the burglar-proof screens and
- install the heating system

Then I have to
- build two steel theft doors,
- add one 36" x 96" human/fire door
- install 18 x 8foot fluorescent lights
- install a burglar alarm
- move 12 cars in there
- move my tools
- take a nap

- start working


by myself

I just read what I wrote. How in God's name am I ever going to get this all done?

 

[iagsxr]

the reason I hired him is becuase he had a good vision and was willing to build a custom pole barn for us - most other contractors just wanted to slap up the standard pole barn kit and move on.

My experience is that it's hard to have it both ways. The guys that hump it out are the ones building kits. The guys doing "custom" work typically take too long.

I have a best friend who's a carpenter that sounds alot like your guy. His work is perfect. He's a total PITA to work with. AND he's the only person that works on my home.

Have another good buddy that humps stuff out. My biggest problem with him is keeping him in material and that he's always at least a day ahead of my thought proccess. BUT there's always some little niggly thing that I can pick at when he's done. He works at my rentals.

Decide what's more important

 

[Daniel Dudley]

I just read what I wrote. How in God's name am I ever going to get this all done?

You want to eat an elephant, you have to do it one bite at a time.

 

[Licensed to kill]

Good, fast, cheap, pick any two!.

 

[johnson1975]

The thing I am irritated about is the fact that he makes up BS excuses not to show up - I am perfectly ok with slow work - it is the fact that many days go by with no one here and it is one excuse after another.

I don't understand why someone does not want to work - when I worked construction - we found ways to get work done, not find ways to not work.

I am still going to get up sopme pics - i need to research on here how to post pics..

 

[Boiler]

I had to tear out a wet wall, jack up the ceiling and repair the wall, and make a crick in the roof at the chimney to fight water problems a few years ago.

The guy that did it quoted 1-2 weeks. So off we move to the mother in laws house. 7 weeks later we're "done" with little trim issues left but no way was I waiting to move in until they were done. The guy was never there. My father in law would drive by at 9 am and not see anyone, and I could come at lunch and see they were already gone.

One time he blew off a meeting with me because he had to "go back into town because KFC didn't give him his sides" WTF!

You guys are right, very few out there want to work. They are searching for easy big jobs that they can overprice. Seriously in 7 weeks he probably worked 50 hours. 3/4 of it I could have done myself in 7 weeks, but I hired someone because I wanted to be out of the house as little as possible.

EDIT: I agree slow work is fine. Especially if they're slow because they are doing a great job. But not showing up is BS.

 

[e-tek]

While I feel for you and hate to see people drag their asses when they hire themselves out to someone, I will forever RECOMMEND getting a garage pacgae by a harware store that has done them for years. I had mine done by Home Hardware, but I know there are 3 or 4 outfits that do the same. They organized everything, from the slab to the materials to the builders. Two guys had it COMPLETELTY finsihed, right down to the door knob, windows, soffit, facia, vents, IN 3 DAYS!!! They also make any changes you want to the basic plan. How many and where you want your windows, OH and man doors and vents. I couldn't have imagine a better experience and I've been enjoying it ever since.

On the topic of hiring oneself out to someone, what is wrong with some people? I have taken in 3 restoration jobs now over 3 years that where stalled by bodyshops and backyarders for years each. I take them on, take detailed notes and photo's and charge by the hour worked. No more, no less. They get done in months - not years.

 

[Bear]

Don't know - hired the SIL +2 to erect 40x48x16 pole barn kit - they did their part in two weeks and two years later I am still trying to finish my part. Guess it just depends.

 

[johnson1975]

Well - my frustration continues....I basically got tired of being jerked around and told contractor that if he does not show up this week, I am hiring others to finish job and that I will see him in court...for past two months - there has been maybe 10 hours of work done - nothing in past month.....I hear excuse after excuse etc...

anyway - I posted a couple of crappy cell phone pics....I will get more up soon.

 

[Donnda]

Almost finished with my pole barn shop. In 3 days last week 3 guys got ground work done set poles and had the shop in the dry including gravel put in on floor compacted and re-bar in the floor getting ready for cement guy. Then he was out of here. Cement guy showed up yesterday at 8 sharp with a helper and poured floor then left at 6 PM ind its finished ? Total time 4 days. So it can be done. Good luck on yours it looks real nice as far as you have gotten.
Donn

 

[Groovy]

It seems it always cost twice as much and double the time when you hire a builder the caveat is it will only be a quarter more and a quarter more time than budgeted if you make absolutely no changes on the fly. In response to the post about unemployment and no one wanting to work it's true around my way as well but I look at like if I'm willing to pay for it then its probably back breaking and I wouldn't want to do it ether but mostly nothing to it but to do it.

I'm dry walling a ceiling with 12 foot sheets of sheet rock. I had to move all the utilities, insulate, reframe as I added a "tray" in the ceiling. I'm mister "oh shiat my computer is broken can you help me fix it guy" I probably fix five PC\Laptops a month untold number of car\boat\motorcycle repairs for my budrows but getting one of them to help with drywall all I heard when I pinged them was crickets. Attached pics on my dead man with laser I had to make to get this stuff up. Point is sometimes you just have to do it yourself and figure it out I guess.

 

[johnson1975]

since I am terrified of heights - I am hiring a roofing contractor to put on ridge cap and finish roof on cupola. I plan to build the split doors ( already have all hardware etc..) and I plan to finish insulation ( need to dry in 1st)

I will hire someone to pour my concrete apron and sidewalk....

My shop has been going for 4 months now. During month 2 - I pointed out obvious cosmetic error in the smartside - for some reason the contractors pride got in way and he could not accept he messed up and tried to convince me it was suppossed to look the way it did - anyway he packed up and left job. He did come back, but that is when the delays really began.

Take a look at the picture and see if you think the siding was installed correctly? The seems in the siding do not match up when he installed siding in the gable.

 

[holland_patrick]

No he did a crappy job...it should line up

 

[johnson1975]

No he did a crappy job...it should line up

he did come back and fix the issue - however still would not admit he made an error...he apparently did not like the fact that I actually paid attention to what he was doing and asked questions and pointed out an error...

everything else has been good except - he just want show up!!

Since it has taken him sooooo long to finish my job - I know he has already spent the money I paid him and has no motive to come back and finish it.

I have learned a lot from this situation.....no more buddy buddy - handshake/cash deals for me in the future.

 

[scott37300]

he did come back and fix the issue - however still would not admit he made an error...he apparently did not like the fact that I actually paid attention to what he was doing and asked questions and pointed out an error...

everything else has been good except - he just want show up!!

Since it has taken him sooooo long to finish my job - I know he has already spent the money I paid him and has no motive to come back and finish it.

I have learned a lot from this situation.....no more buddy buddy - handshake/cash deals for me in the future.

That siding looks like ****! Gaps all over, uneven, and mis-aligned!

 

[Graymills - Craig]

anyone else got any stories to share - maye it will make me feel better

Against my better judgment, I signed on with a PhD guy in an incubator to develop a new product. Being a PhD, he's always off working on whatever shiny new toy comes along. Now it's a year later (on a 3-month project), there's no product, and he's actually asking for a large sum on money upfront for exclusivity (on a product we helped him develop).

 

[dbleskey]

Make sure to get material and labor lein releases.

Absolutly, do this NOW if you have paid him anything. No releases, No more funds.

If he is licensed, the licensing board MAY require he post a bond with them. Call them up, get the bonding companies name and find out if he has additional payment and performance insurance with them. If he does not have workers comp insurance, get rider on your homeowners insurance for the duration of the project. Remember if he is off schedule you can deduct any additional insurance premiums for the extended schedule from his payment. Start protecting yourself right now.

Do not rule out small claims court.

Sorry to hear your pain.

 

[Groovy]

Johnson1975 it ***** that you are working with a PIA but that is one awesome shop you'll have when it’s done really sweet and at least you'll know you made me jealous and dbleskey is right

 

[johnson1975]

yes - small claims court is going to happen for sure.....I am also going to file a 1099 so that the IRS gets wind of this "cash" payment I have made with him - I know he is not turning this stuff in. I have filled a claim with BBB and I am currently in contact with the state contracting board to file a compliant with them as well

Since we did this as a cash deal - I seriously doubt his insurance even knows he took on this job - so I am going to do my best to find out who carries his insurance to let them know he is doing jobs and not reporting them to insurance.

I think 4 months is more than enough time for me - I am tired of being Mr. Nice guy - gloves are now off

I have contacted the various supply houses that supplied materials and have verified all invoices have been paid.

 

[drmoonshine]

Good Job for standing up for yourself I would stand applying pressure like you are doing but slowly eventually he'll hit a breaking point to when you can settle it out cleanly. Besides the looks you'll have yourself a brand new garage and you can spend you time working on cars in peace when this is all done.