How-to: Index breaker bar/6pt socket in 30° increments.

[bentt]

Although some here will know this, I don't believe it is common knowledge as every newly posted 6pt vs 12pt thread will site an advantage of 12pt sockets w/ breaker bar as having a smaller, achievable, angle between sequential positions (60° vs 30° degree angle of rotation).

To start from the beginning, examples of 6pt (left) and 12pt (right) sockets. On a hexagonal bolt/nut, a 6pt socket can be placed in one of six unique positions (60°, 120°, 180°, 240°, 300°, 360°) and a 12pt socket can be placed in one of twelve unique positions (30°, 60°, 90°, 120°, 150°, 180°, 210°, ...and so on). In the case of a socket/breaker bar, or any other fixed head config, this translates into six or twelve possible handle positions respectively.


Here a clock face is used to represent the points of a 12pt socket.


...and here the even numbers are marked to represent the points of a 6pt socket.


Now, to access the points represented by the odd numbers with the same 6pt socket, simply remove and rotate the socket 1/4 turn (in either direction, CW or CCW, relative to the breaker bar or handle). As can be seen, the even numbers are now where the odd numbers were and vice versa.


To obtain a handle position between two sequential handle positions... (Note the position of the 6 points.)


...simply remove and rotate the socket 1/4 turn in either direction and reattach. (Can you see the twelve points represented within the last two pics?)

 

[nw2571]

Great post! I hadn't really ever thought of this, but it makes perfect sense! Seems so simple, but if you get in a tight spot and don't know this, you may end up pulling your hair out.

 

[Bull]

This post rocks. Not something many people would have the patience to set up and photograph for everyone. Thanks a lot

 

[rockchucker]

100% I try to only use 6-Point Sockets and when it is on a Breaker Bar with a Fixed Head you don't have too many other options!

Great explanation though. Not everyone knows this.

 

[nmanitou]

Great Post - thanks for the tip. "Don't try to bend the spoon, rather, simply acknowledge that the spoon does not exist"!

 

[alex71]

Doesn't work with many impact sockets because they are designed for a pin detent, and have a hole for the pin on one side, and no indents for a ball detent on the other sides. YMMV.

 

[garfunkle24]

Very clear explanation and nicely done post.

We become so familiar with things we sometimes forget that common knowledge to us isn't known by all. And of course; Common sense isn't common at all.

Thanks

 

[MattT]

Doesn't work with many impact sockets because they are designed for a pin detent, and have a hole for the pin on one side, and no indents for a ball detent on the other sides. YMMV.

It still works with drilled retainer sockets. You just loose some, but not all, of the retention.

 

[gatewaysysop]

Great post, definitely something cool that most people don't think about. Really great to see the pics and have everything so well photographed and explained. Definitely a keeper!

Thanks for putting this together!

 

[JEEPLESS]

This post rocks. Not something many people would have the patience to set up and photograph for everyone. Thanks a lot

+1

Thank you!

 

[otis66]

Although some here will know this, I don't believe it is common knowledge as every newly posted 6pt vs 12pt thread will site an advantage of 12pt sockets w/ breaker bar as having a smaller, achievable, angle between sequential positions (60° vs 30° degree angle of rotation).

To start from the beginning, examples of 6pt (left) and 12pt (right) sockets. On a hexagonal bolt/nut, a 6pt socket can be placed in one of six unique positions (60°, 120°, 180°, 240°, 300°, 360°) and a 12pt socket can be placed in one of twelve unique positions (30°, 60°, 90°, 120°, 150°, 180°, 210°, ...and so on). In the case of a socket/breaker bar, or any other fixed head config, this translates into six or twelve possible handle positions respectively.


Here a clock face is used to represent the points of a 12pt socket.


...and here the even numbers are marked to represent the points of a 6pt socket.


Now, to access the points represented by the odd numbers with the same 6pt socket, simply remove and rotate the socket 1/4 turn (in either direction, CW or CCW, relative to the breaker bar or handle). As can be seen, the even numbers are now where the odd numbers were and vice versa.


To obtain a handle position between two sequential handle positions... (Note the position of the 6 points.)


...simply remove and rotate the socket 1/4 turn in either direction and reattach. (Can you see the twelve points represented within the last two pics?)

Or you can just flip the socket over.

 

[bentt]

Or you can just flip the socket over.

Flip?? If by this you mean moving the flex head of a breaker bar to the opposite side, then the net result is an offset of 180°. By doing this, nothing is achieved as the pattern on the socket, relative to the breaker bar, has not changed . Think of the clock face being rotated 180°; the even numbers are still even & the odd numbers still odd.

 

[oldtools]

This is cool. I use 6pt 90% of the time. This would help out nicely. Great job!!

 

[PT Doc]

Great writeup with good visual aids. You saved yourself lots of replies with questions by providing the photos. Very good information to be aware of.

 

[Wakefield]

There are some breaker bars made with the drive piece coupler rotated slightly (45*?) from the way that the normal ones are made.

 

[flyingvette]

It's very true that you can get 30 degree increments out of a 6 point socket. Doesn't make it convenient though. You still have to extract the tool and reposition the socket, potentially for every turn of the handle. I've done it when I've had to - but holy %^%! is it a pia.

Good write up.

 

[oldjacks]

For a relatively small investment you could also get a ratchet adapter for your Breaker Bar and then not have to deal with such time consuming problems. Although I have to admit to doing this very technique when I was too lazy to get up and walk over to the tool box.

 

[W650Mike]

I've rotated sockets on breaker bars before, but never really thought about it – just trial and error until it worked.

Great writeup!

 

[bentt]

There are some breaker bars made with the drive piece coupler rotated slightly (45*?) from the way that the normal ones are made.

This will not influence the outcome. The same rules apply.

 

[mrholeshot]

That was great of you to make this post.

 

[xroad]

Flip?? If by this you mean moving the flex head of a breaker bar to the opposite side, then the net result is an offset of 180°. By doing this, nothing is achieved as the pattern on the socket, relative to the breaker bar, has not changed . Think of the clock face being rotated 180°; the even numbers are still even & the odd numbers still odd.

I had made the calculation about two years ago. Now I have forgotten ..... If you heat up the head of the breaker bar, right at the base of the head .. and bend it by 15 degrees (or 30 degrees, I forgot)..... Then each time you flip the head, the socket will give you that small 30 degree available arc swing. That way, you don't have to remove the socket for each arc swing.

 

[xroad]

For a relatively small investment you could also get a ratchet adapter for your Breaker Bar and then not have to deal with such time consuming problems. Although I have to admit to doing this very technique when I was too lazy to get up and walk over to the tool box.

Or, just replace the breaker bar with a ratchet in that tool kit !

Well, I have a motorcycyle carry tool kit and I've decided to carry the breaker bar instead of a ratchet. The reason is that (1) the breaker bar have a lower profile than the ratchet. (2) It is also stronger than the ratchet in case I have to break loose a really tight fastener. The socket set I carry is 1/4" drive.

I really wanted a sliding T-handle but the height profile is taller than the ratchet and the breaker.

 

[stopdroplol]

I've never really thought about it but I guess I've done this before when I've rotated the socket around a bolt until I could attach a breaker bar.

 

[trainwreck]

For a relatively small investment you could also get a ratchet adapter for your Breaker Bar and then not have to deal with such time consuming problems.

Why would you put a ratcheting adapter on a breaker bar instead of just using a ratchet? I thought the whole point of a breaker bar was to eliminate moving parts for the sake of added strength. Wouldn't adding a ratcheting attachment negate any benefits of the breaker bar?

I had made the calculation about two years ago. Now I have forgotten ..... If you heat up the head of the breaker bar, right at the base of the head .. and bend it by 15 degrees (or 30 degrees, I forgot)..... Then each time you flip the head, the socket will give you that small 30 degree available arc swing. That way, you don't have to remove the socket for each arc swing.

Too bad it wasn't 20 years ago, and not 2. You could have hit up Nepros up for some royalty rights....

http://www.garagejournal.com/forum/showpost.php?p=1102383&postcount=148
http://www.garagejournal.com/forum/showpost.php?p=553192&postcount=16

 

[Displaced Hokie]

So simple it's stupid. Thanks!

 

[xroad]

Too bad it wasn't 20 years ago, and not 2. You could have hit up Nepros up for some royalty rights....

http://www.garagejournal.com/forum/showpost.php?p=1102383&postcount=148
http://www.garagejournal.com/forum/showpost.php?p=553192&postcount=16

I've always thought I am a legend in my own mind

BTW, I did end up buying 3 pieces of the flat 6-pt Nepro double box wrenches with the tilt heads. Beautiful wrenches.

 

[farmmech86]

It's very true that you can get 30 degree increments out of a 6 point socket. Doesn't make it convenient though. You still have to extract the tool and reposition the socket, potentially for every turn of the handle. I've done it when I've had to - but holy %^%! is it a pia.

Good write up.

Especially when it is freezing cold, your hands are greasy, and you are upside down bent over a piece of equipment. Still a great post, though.

 

[Gtamazing]

Bentt for the Win!

 

[ajchien]

Re reading this thread a year later has me freaked out a little. I distinctly remember just flipping the breaker bar head around, and the 6 point socket then fit. But then I didn't understand why based on this thread.

Until now.

I just went to my box and looked at all 26 adaptors/extensions in it. Turns out that 13 of the 26 do not have the drive square matched up with the head square. So if it's offset by some degrees, using an adaptor or extension with this type of offset would allow you to 'flip' the breaker bar head and give yourself access.

Yeah, i know. Tool geek.

 

[trboxman]

I had made the calculation about two years ago. Now I have forgotten ..... If you heat up the head of the breaker bar, right at the base of the head .. and bend it by 15 degrees (or 30 degrees, I forgot)..... Then each time you flip the head, the socket will give you that small 30 degree available arc swing. That way, you don't have to remove the socket for each arc swing.

Wouldn't that compromise the temper of the breaker bar and make it more prone to failure?

Or are you suggesting a full heat treat and annealing at home?

 

[sk farmer]

well done post. while this has been dicussed in the past it is worthy of bringing up. someoene made a breaker at one time that had the head offset at forty five degrees. i don't recall if it gave more positions or not but in conjuction with another bar at the normal 90 it added a little different twist. this was the reason that 12 pt. was really invented, to add more postions, not for 12pt fasteners.