Company won't let him get his toolbox..

[TheGrooveking]

I was called by a guy I worked with who was laid off last week(along with a few other guys) who asked me my advice on his situation. It seems they were called into the office and then told they were laid off, and directed to go out the front door. The company had hired security people to assist if necessary, they asked to get their things but were told they'll be contacted.

I told them to call the police and explain to them that they are your tools & boxes and that they must give them to you. Any of you guys run into this?
I always take pictures of my tool boxes and their contents before I bring them into a place and again once they are in the place with a copy of that day's newpaper in the photo in case their is ever a dispute of any type.

TheGrooveking

 

[Catamount]

I would absolutely call the police. I hope he has an inventory of all of this tools.

 

[toolnut]

Man that's some BS situation to be in. Let us know how he makes out.

 

[ptschram]

In many states, it is a felony to refuse to allow a tradesman access to his tools.

Similarly, in some states, a tradesman's tools can't be seized in divorce and in some, not even bankruptcy unless money is owed on those tools.

When I was a landlord, I could not prevent an evicted tenant from accessing his tools for the purpose of removing them from the premises. IE, I could not hold them for security against monies owed me.

The courts WILL side with the tradesman. Have him call the Sheriff and ask for a "civil stand-by". I can guarandamntee you he will get his tools.

 

[scott37300]

I would be wild. I would call the police and go down there. How can a company that requires you bring your own tools when you are hired hold your tools hostage. They let him go, I'm assuming for lack of work and not some kind of disciplinary action. Don't see how they can hold his tools. He can't even look for another job because he doesn't have any tools to work with. Pretty low in my opinion of the company.

Can you watch over his box for him to at least make sure it's not messed with? Can you ask management what the deal is for him? Maybe ask if it's company policy to hold boxes after one is laid off?

 

[ajchien]

I would get together with all the laid off techs and call the local TV station.

 

[jjjrmx5]

Call whoever is in charge of human resources and discuss your situation. If no conversation, then document it and leave a message.

Document in a very detailed fashion via a list what you have in the box.

If no response from mgmt or human resources, contact a lawyer and ask proper procedure for your state to reclaim personal property. You WILL get your tools back, it's just a matter of following proper corporate and legal procedures.

Been there done that.

 

[Underdog]

If he was fired,then escorted out the door without his tools, why in the heck he didn't call the police that minute. I wouldn't leave without my tools. Tell security go ahead and call police for me.?

 

[HandyManny]

First I'd call the police, get them to assist you. Then I call up the company and tell them (not ask them) you are coming down there to retrieve your tools. If they refuse I'd tell them I'm coming with the cops because the company has commited thievery. Though it would be interesting to hear the other side of the story. Were they layed off or fired? What were the circumstances? Were they good employees?

 

[Eagle Point]

It's pretty common at dealerships to have a shop foreman or manager inspect the contents of the box before it leaves for any shop tools, equipment, shop rags, chemical products etc that might have "fallen" in the box over time. Other than for that reason they should be happy to get the box out of the shop and not take up space.

 

[mrshaun]

those security people must have had guns. if you keep a man from taking his personal property it could get ugly..... civil matter that will need a judge to get that one fixed, or an off duty cop that is a friend and has his gun and badge when he goes with you...

 

[route246]

It is very important to try to document a complete inventory of what was there. Corporate people will usually be very cooperative because they don't want any trouble, they just want closure.

Call whoever is in charge of human resources and discuss your situation. If no conversation, then document it and leave a message.

Document in a very detailed fashion via a list what you have in the box.

If no response from mgmt or human resources, contact a lawyer and ask proper procedure for your state to reclaim personal property. You WILL get your tools back, it's just a matter of following proper corporate and legal procedures.

Been there done that.

 

[gsport]

i wonder if that's the whole story???

 

[MartyO]

Police are unlikely to assist. This is a civil dispute, not a criminal one.

Why were they laid off? Were the allegations of stealing?

If the company had security on hand, I suspect that this runs deeper than is revealed in the OP.

 

[TheGrooveking]

There were a few techs laid off. I worked with this guy about 10 years ago. None of the techs were allowed to take their tools/boxes. I think it is some jerkoff HR person who thinks they can do what they want. One guy gets dropped off by his wife in the morning and picked up by his neighbor for the trip home, the knew this and arranged for a cab to be waiting for him outside.

I think in total there were about 40+ employees let go that day. I called him a few minutes ago and he and the other techs were all heading over there with a few pickup trucks and a trailer. He says they are not leaving without their stuff, I'll let you know what goes down.

TheGrooveking

 

[ptschram]

Police are unlikely to assist. This is a civil dispute, not a criminal one.

Why were they laid off? Were the allegations of stealing?

If the company had security on hand, I suspect that this runs deeper than is revealed in the OP.

I disagree. They have committed the criminal act of conversion, if not outright theft-and I'll put money the value of those tools is more than the minimum to constitute Grand Larceny, therefor, a felony in most states.

They would be best served to allow access before the Sheriff shows up.

It is a BAD thing to keep a tradesman from his tools. Might go so far as to rise to restraint of trade, especially if the techs were considered independent contractors as some dealers have defined their techs.

 

[gtivr4]

I mean I could see not wanting them to just have at it and take stuff they didn't own, but why the heck couldn't they just be escorted to their tools, let them take those with them and then leave.

 

[BajaBound]

**** give me the number out there I will call the damn cops for him!!!

 

[muddyjoe15]

It's pretty common at dealerships to have a shop foreman or manager inspect the contents of the box before it leaves for any shop tools, equipment, shop rags, chemical products etc that might have "fallen" in the box over time. Other than for that reason they should be happy to get the box out of the shop and not take up space.

When I was let go from one of my jobs, they checked my box right away. Then my box and I were showed the door. I don't think they can go through your box with out you being present though?? Somethings fishy with this situation, I would defiantly get some kind of legal help involved!

 

[willy3486]

Welcome to the new America where companies are considered people and have more power than the average person. I am inclined with the others. I don't see how they could stop them. I don't necessary believe in suing people but I think this company needs to be made example of. If workers don't stand up for their rights I think we will loose even more. I think the company should be prosecuted for a felony theft if the tools of them all total enough for a felony.

 

[mrshaun]

we are going to see on cnn that techs opened fire on corporate execs over tools... justified....

 

[bmfenn]

I disagree. They have committed the criminal act of conversion, if not outright theft-and I'll put money the value of those tools is more than the minimum to constitute Grand Larceny, therefor, a felony in most states.

They would be best served to allow access before the Sheriff shows up.

It is a BAD thing to keep a tradesman from his tools. Might go so far as to rise to restraint of trade, especially if the techs were considered independent contractors as some dealers have defined their techs.

PT,
In the people's republic of NJ, this would be considered a civil matter. Per the OP, When they asked about taking their tools, the employer didn't say they couldn't have them, just not at that moment. The employer didn't say were taking their tools, but that they would be contacted. Per that statement, one would reasonably assume that they would be allowed to retrieve their tools at a later date. It's definitely a ****** situation, but probably the company doesn't want the laid off techs all retrieving their stuff at one time and causing a scene in the shop. Do I agree with what the employer is doing, absolutely not. But don't expect the police to start threatening the employer with theft. Hopefully if he calls the police, you'll get an officer willing to go out of their scope of influence, and try and mediate.

Now, if you were to head in there with your man purse, that'd be a different story.

 

[tatra]

why were these guys let go?.................and what kind of industry is this?.........

 

[Stuart in MN]

It's standard procedure for office jobs these days, if a company lays a person off they're walked to the door without a chance to clean out their desks. They will get all their things back, but only after a couple days. There are at least a couple reasons; one is to make sure they don't walk off with any company property, and another is to give them a cooling off period before they're let back in the building.

 

[Intel]

It's standard procedure for office jobs these days, if a company lays a person off they're walked to the door without a chance to clean out their desks. They will get all their things back, but only after a couple days. There are at least a couple reasons; one is to make sure they don't walk off with any company property, and another is to give them a cooling off period before they're let back in the building.

Yeah this is how they handled the layoffs at our office. Not quite the same with tools etc but I doubt the company is trying to steal the tools or anything. Given they had security my guess is you will get a call within a day or two and then go in and pick up the box on off hours. Not saying it is conveinant I just hope that is the case in this situation.

 

[southern iron]

i had a mac and cornwell box full of name brand tools ...i got to lock it as i was escorted out , but when i came back a week later both boxes were broke into and had tools taken ,

 

[cashishift]

edited.

 

[K5blazer83]

If that was me, I would have been on my cell phone with the sheriffs department while I was still in the shop or being asked to leave.
I do believe its wrong to keep a tradesman from their tools...it's their livelihood.

 

[ptschram]

It's standard procedure for office jobs these days, if a company lays a person off they're walked to the door without a chance to clean out their desks. They will get all their things back, but only after a couple days. There are at least a couple reasons; one is to make sure they don't walk off with any company property, and another is to give them a cooling off period before they're let back in the building.

The problem and the reason for the law is that these people cannot earn a living without them.

The act of not allowing immediate access but implying they would be available later borders on conversion.

Were it me, I'd be in jail because I'm not leaving my tools under those circumstances. I'd be rolling my toolbox down the sidewalk waiting for a wrecker to come transport them for me.

 

[UncleJoe]

I would simply show up and get my tools. If they say I can't have them I would say OK and keep loading my tools up. I would keep going and tell them to call the police if they do not like what I am doing. I think the worker is in the right on this one.

I doubt any manager worth a damn will want to make a stink in front of all the remaining employees. This whole thing is BS that someone imposed that just does not know what they are doing.

If they keep you from securing your property and the value of the tools is high this might be grand theft.

 

[Az Scooter]

Well, I would think that once the box was secured, that the location owner, or lessee, was liable. You might want to have a lawyer go have a little talk with the arrogant punk that runs that place, and explain to him that he is liable for the protection of your tools, once he escorted you off the property, without allowing you to tak eyour tools with you.
Just my opinion, I am not a lawyer, but play one on the internet.

 

[SMKS]

Police are unlikely to assist. This is a civil dispute, not a criminal one.

This could be considered theft, not a civil matter. The police should help, but if it's in a big city where they have other problems, they might ignore your concern.

 

[jjjrmx5]

It's standard procedure for office jobs these days, if a company lays a person off they're walked to the door without a chance to clean out their desks. They will get all their things back, but only after a couple days. There are at least a couple reasons; one is to make sure they don't walk off with any company property, and another is to give them a cooling off period before they're let back in the building.

Correct.
Three isssues.

You need to get your tools and box back.
The co. needs to ensure that they are returned any tools or property that resides in your box and should do so with mgmt. and security working with you IN PERSON thru the process.
The tool truck driver needs to be made aware of your location should you have a loan, credit or a lien.

That's why i say contact HR. Once that call is made and your list is made, anything missing is the the fault of the employer for failure to secure your personal possesions.
No resolution, then get a lawyer.

I have a toolbox in my basement with weld plates and tamperproof fasteners fixing an "unauthorized access problem" that were not there when I bought the damn thing, and I see it everyday to remind me.

That poor bottom box can never go out in public again.

 

[MartyO]

"considered theft"

Or might not be as well.

I am not sure we are getting all the facts here just yet.

When a company lays off 40 people, thery usually consult an attorney for guidance on how to handle things because there are far reaching implications.

I suspect that the company had counsel prior to doing what they are doing.

I am not saying that it is right, but I am willing to bet that they consilted with their counsel regarding the tool issue as well as the mass lay off.

 

[MartyO]

That poor bottom box can never go out in public again.

I bet it could with proper therapy.

 

[daveblank]

Auto Nation pulled that same stunt when they closed the "green" stores here several years back.

 

[SuperSocket]

PT,
In the people's republic of NJ, this would be considered a civil matter. Per the OP, When they asked about taking their tools, the employer didn't say they couldn't have them, just not at that moment. The employer didn't say were taking their tools, but that they would be contacted. Per that statement, one would reasonably assume that they would be allowed to retrieve their tools at a later date. It's definitely a ****** situation, but probably the company doesn't want the laid off techs all retrieving their stuff at one time and causing a scene in the shop. Do I agree with what the employer is doing, absolutely not. But don't expect the police to start threatening the employer with theft. Hopefully if he calls the police, you'll get an officer willing to go out of their scope of influence, and try and mediate.

Now, if you were to head in there with your man purse, that'd be a different story.

So I am going to "borrow" your tools and your car.... no you can't have them back at this moment, but I will contact you when you can.


You can retrieve your tools and car at a later date should I decide to do so.



Sorry, but that's theft. $10 says tools will be missing.

 

[treasureseeker]

I would have the police meet me(OP) at the job site. When I got laid off from Roush along with thirty others they pretty much pushed us out the door with what they call white shirts (team mangers which all had on dark sunglasses like something out of a movie).They formed a line and like a cattle drive push us out and wouldn’t allow us to even go near our toolboxes. They let us get our boxes as guest escorted by a white shirt at a later date but went through our boxes as if we were spies.

 

[Skin]

Everyone is assuming something nefarious is taking place but i can understand the point of view of the company. The last thing you want is 40 pissed off employees all trying to clean house and get out at the same time. Thats how stuff gets broken and stolen.

 

[MrSnicks]

Everyone is assuming something nefarious is taking place but i can understand the point of view of the company. The last thing you want is 40 pissed off employees all trying to clean house and get out at the same time. Thats how stuff gets broken and stolen.

Then the company should plan their layoffs better.....