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Snap On F80 clone???

bassbone52

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Just received a SO F80 ratchet from an eBay seller. The back of the ratchet is stamped Snap On and there is F80 stamped into the handle, but no where do I see U.S.A. What gives?? Is this made out of the country?? :headscrat
 
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Tarheelgarage

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Nothing good will come out of this post.

I'm still waiting for the proverbial post stating "Duralast ratchets are made in the same Chinese plant as Snap On dual 80s":lol_hitti
 
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bassbone52

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OK, thanks. I don't have a problem with that, just a little surprised that's all. The way this country is headed, China is looking better all the time.
 

BigAl62

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Hey, where's the obligatory Snap On praising/bashing I've come to expect? I want a good clean fight and at the sound of the bell come out swinging!!! DING!!!!!
 
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t100

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Fedwrench

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Here's the deal, the current president of Snap on in order to attract more foriegn customers, has removed USA from many of their tools. Your F80 is US made. Pull it up on the Snap on website and under country of origin, is USA.
I view the removal of USA as conditioning the buyer not to care where a tool is made but, that it bears the Snap on name. Mac started doing this many years ago as it transitioned from US made tools to Taiwan produced tools.
There are many people here that would buy a turd as long as it was branded Snap on. Yes, these endless threads about country of origin get tiresome but, the quest for tool answers goes on. Perhaps, there should be a sticky about Country of origin.:bounce:
 

slipjointed

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It's funny, any other tool brand does that, it's shunned and sent to the tool island of lepers, but the golden child snap-on can do no wrong. It's a perfectly reasonable business decision when snap-on does it, but anyone else, it's anti-patriotic. I'll stick to companies that are proud to stamp USA on their tools. Any company that sees stamping their tools "USA" as a detriment to their business, won't be getting my business.
 

Skin

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I view the removal of USA as conditioning the buyer not to care where a tool is made but, that it bears the Snap on name. Mac started doing this many years ago as it transitioned from US made tools to Taiwan produced tools.

The kicker about this logic is both companies tout American made as being a great selling point of their product still. Even MAC, in the 2011 catalog there are multiple sections and shots about how they proudly make X product in their plants in Texas. It doesnt make sense. In MACs case we know whats going on. Imported tools = no COO because its not a selling point and was obviously done to rake in even more profit. However what they still make here they do at least still mark it USA. SOs logic is counterintuitive and i just dont get it because supposedly they are not outsourcing so there is nothing to hide but hide they do. At least until the first boat from Taiwan with SO branded tools really does show up, then the pieces will click together.

Its also worth mentioning its not every SO tool, just the ones of most recent manufacture. If you go buy something they've been making for awhile, e.g. a combo wrench set or socket set, they should still be safe.
 
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slipjointed

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The kicker about this logic is both companies tout American made as being a great selling point of their product still. Even MAC, in the 2011 catalog there are multiple sections and shots about how they make X product in their plants in Texas. It doesnt make sense. In MACs case we know whats going on. Imported tools = no COO because its not a selling point and was obviously done to rake in even more profit. However what they still make here they do at least still mark it USA. SOs logic is counterintuitive and i just dont get it. At least until the first boat from Taiwan with SO branded tools really does show up, then the pieces will click together.

Its also worth mentioning its not every SO tool, just the ones of most recent manufacture.


It's counterintuitive because it's a giant load of ****. The USA marking on tools (and other products for that matter) stands for quality, worldwide. Other countries pay TOP dollar for American products, in fact many consider American products to be prestigious luxury goods.

Just like many Americans have a love affair with German, Italian, French, and Spanish made tools, many countries have a love affair with Snap-on simply because it's an American company that represents quality American made tools.

If I had to guess, many international buyers probably would like to see made in USA on their tools as well... in fact I read a long post by a Saudi tool buyer voicing his disappointment in Snap-on's decision to remove the marking, and therefore the implied quality.
 

Pro-Painter

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I believe the whole reason behind the missing USA stamp is a simple one.

I don't believe it was a marketing decision as many say it is. Because a tool with a "USA" stamp is going to sell better in the USA. And if they do it for global reasons, then how hard is it to change out the die/stamp to one without the USA logo? And what does the other non USA snap-on factory's make if the USA factory's import out ratchets around the world?

And I don't buy the other party's belief that the ratchets are no longer being USA made. I'm sure snap on still makes their ratchets in the USA.

I believe it's all got to do with the soft handles. I believe they are imported, and that is why the USA logo was removed. They could not keep the USA logo on the non soft handle ratchets because that would have everyone worried that the more expensive soft handle ratchets would not USA made. So they simply removed the USA stamp altogether.

I believe this because a replacement ratchet (FH936-12) soft handle is only $6.55. (very cheap for snap-on) But the SDD5R-1R hard handle screwdriver handle that has USA on it is $18.75 each (normal snap-on like pricing). The soft handles are much more complex then a hard handle, yet they are 1/3 the price?

I strongly believe snap-on imports the soft ratchet handles. And that is the whole mystery behind the missing USA stamp.
 
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Fedwrench

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I believe it's all got to do with the soft handles. I believe they are imported, and that is why the USA logo was removed. They could not keep the USA logo on the non soft handle ratchets because that would have everyone worried that the more expensive soft handle ratchets would not USA made. I strongly believe snap-on imports the soft ratchet handles. And that is the whole mystery behind the missing USA stamp.

Wrong Brand. That's Matco. All of the current Matco ratchets with comfort grips don't have USA stamped on the ratchet. However, the all metal versions of the 88 have USA stamped on the handle.:bounce:
 

Pro-Painter

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Wrong Brand. That's Matco. All of the current Matco ratchets with comfort grips don't have USA stamped on the ratchet. However, the all metal versions of the 88 have USA stamped on the handle.:bounce:

I'm not at all filmier with matco. But that further supports my theory that snap on has done the same thing, except they removed the USA logo from both ratchets. I believe they decided to remove it from both ratchets because it would be harder to sell the soft handle ratchets for more money when they don't have the USA stamp their full chrome brother has.

Of course this is just my theory. Its far from fact.
 
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slipjointed

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I believe the whole reason behind the missing USA stamp is a simple one.

I don't believe it was a marketing decision as many say it is. Because a tool with a "USA" stamp is going to sell better in the USA. And if they do it for global reasons, then how hard is it to change out the die/stamp to one without the USA logo? And what does the other non USA snap-on factory's make if the USA factory's import out ratchets around the world?

And I don't buy the other party's belief that the ratchets are no longer being USA made. I'm sure snap on still makes their ratchets in the USA.

I believe it's all got to do with the soft handles. I believe they are imported, and that is why the USA logo was removed. They could not keep the USA logo on the non soft handle ratchets because that would have everyone worried that the more expensive soft handle ratchets would not USA made. So they simply removed the USA stamp altogether.

I believe this because a replacement ratchet (FH936-12) soft handle is only $6.55. (very cheap for snap-on) But the SDD5R-1R hard handle screwdriver handle that has USA on it is $18.75 each (normal snap-on like pricing). The soft handles are much more complex then a hard handle, yet they are 1/3 the price?

I strongly believe snap-on imports the soft ratchet handles. And that is the whole mystery behind the missing USA stamp.


I must say, that theory definitely makes more sense than the official story. I really have to wonder though, how much more would it cost for a USA made soft handle? $1? $2? I'd like to think that folks would pay that extra to see a USA stamp on their ratchet.


One thing it doesn't explain though, is why tools such as the pliers are now missing the stamp as well. I suppose perhaps the foam cushion grips are import as well?
 

oldtools

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I must say, that theory definitely makes more sense than the official story. I really have to wonder though, how much more would it cost for a USA made soft handle? $1? $2? I'd like to think that folks would pay that extra to see a USA stamp on their ratchet.


One thing it doesn't explain though, is why tools such as the pliers are now missing the stamp as well. I suppose perhaps the foam cushion grips are import as well?

Both of my SO Z-shape screwdriver and L-shape hex drive have no USA marking. Both are all pure metal.
 

Skin

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I must say, that theory definitely makes more sense than the official story. I really have to wonder though, how much more would it cost for a USA made soft handle? $1? $2? I'd like to think that folks would pay that extra to see a USA stamp on their ratchet.


One thing it doesn't explain though, is why tools such as the pliers are now missing the stamp as well. I suppose perhaps the foam cushion grips are import as well?

its not just pliers. Ratcheting wrenches also have no "USA" stamp even though it states plainly they're made in the USA. Its a nice explanation, but doesnt work.

Lets think about this reasoning rationally for a moment. Do you really think SO, one of the larger domestic tool manufacturers, cant afford to make a seperate stamp that says USA for all metal ratchets? And countering the argument that they wouldnt want to "alienate" the more expensive soft handles, why not simply say made in the USA with global components like Proto ratchets are labelled instead of leaving it up to wild conjecture?

Lastly, i bet if you purchased a set of soft handles with a retail package it says USA on the package. If they can do that on the package they can stamp the ratchet.

Nope, that excuse, while handy, doesnt work. Fedwrench had it when he said they just wanted people to accept the SO name to mean quality without the COO and from what i've seen here, people have. I dont believe i have to state what i believe thats in preperation for as i think thats obvious :). The next time they change the script i think you'll see "USA" erased from most everything if they keep this policy.
 
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slipjointed

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Haven't we been through all this before?

Oh yeah, we have, countless times.

I'm not trying to attack you directly, this comment is meant to be tongue in cheek in a friendly manner, but the only dead horse that's been beaten close to as badly as this one, are posts commenting on how much this dead horse has been beaten. They're pretty much a staple in every one of these threads, and seem to have little influence on the constant re-visitation of this topic. :)

I suppose maybe a sticky containing links to the countless threads on this topic might help, but most folks don't bother to read the stickies anyways. :lol_hitti
 

earlthegoat2

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The tool lovers in China and Taiwan must scoff at the cheap American knock off tools that are produced overseas......
 
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bassbone52

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I'm the idiot that started this thread. It wasn't meant to open up a debate but clearly I have a lot to learn regarding this forum. Reading everyone's responses has been enlightening. Looking first at the SO website and entering the part number would have been smart on my part, to check on the COO. Having owned a lot of SO stuff, I was a little surprised to see U.S.A. missing from the tool, but this is the first SO tool I've purchased in quite some time and clearly things have changed. So...I'll do my homework, i.e., search, before posting. Thanks.
 

Buckgnarly

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I'm the idiot that started this thread. It wasn't meant to open up a debate but clearly I have a lot to learn regarding this forum. Reading everyone's responses has been enlightening. Looking first at the SO website and entering the part number would have been smart on my part, to check on the COO. Having owned a lot of SO stuff, I was a little surprised to see U.S.A. missing from the tool, but this is the first SO tool I've purchased in quite some time and clearly things have changed. So...I'll do my homework, i.e., search, before posting. Thanks.

Don't take ALL the nonsense to heart....this is a real sore spot for some here, others (like me) are just kidding around. Stick around long enough and you'll learn the "hot topics" as well as some of the "hot heads"!:thumbup:
 

kams1973

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A few "hot topics" include: PVC for air lines, welding on compressed air tanks, Duralast ratchets and Snap-on ratchet COO
 

scott37300

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I'm the idiot that started this thread. It wasn't meant to open up a debate but clearly I have a lot to learn regarding this forum. Reading everyone's responses has been enlightening. Looking first at the SO website and entering the part number would have been smart on my part, to check on the COO. Having owned a lot of SO stuff, I was a little surprised to see U.S.A. missing from the tool, but this is the first SO tool I've purchased in quite some time and clearly things have changed. So...I'll do my homework, i.e., search, before posting. Thanks.

It's just a topic that has come up a ton of times and each time there are the same "theories" of why it's not on there any more. The only facts are that snap on took the USA stamp off of a lot of their tools and snap on still says COO is USA. I don't like the fact snap on took it off, but them still saying it's USA works for me. Until someone can prove them wrong or snap on changes that COO people are just guessing.
 
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