Anyone notice the similarities?

[83diesel]

Is it just me or does Danahers' companies, Matco, Craftsman, KD, and Armstrong tools are getting similar in quality. Our main tool truck is Matco, but we have a independent tool truck stop by also. The KD tools he is selling appears to be just as good quality wise but half the price of Matco. Craftsman is now selling the pinless impact sockets Matco has sold for years. Armstrong large tool boxes, hammers and ratchets have been looking closer to Matco's than their own in the past few years. Why buy Matco if you can buy the same quality half the price and get the same service. Matco tools get more disapointing each year. Almost all their tools are made by someone else (air tools, specialty tools, etc.)

Anyone also notice that Sears is promoting SK more often in their catalog and internet sales and how some of the newer SK tools look like Matco or Armstrong?

 

[Merkava_4]

Armstrong has always seemed to be in a class by themselves; for example: their swivel sockets had solid pressed pins while Craftsman were still using roll pins; and their ratchets have always been completely different and not even comparable to Craftsman.

 

[Fedwrench]

The Danaher stuff has only had minor cosmetic differences between the lines for years now. I haven't noticed SK tools looking like any of the Danaher stuff though except for that teardrop shaped ratchet. Sk is independently owned and not part of the Danaher empire. Sears does list more SK items on line and in their paper catalog. They sell it at full retail list and don't have to warranty the tools. That's a win-win situation for them. I can't believe anyone would buy SK from Sears when there are so many other options that are considerably cheaper.
I do like Matco but along with other tool trucks, more of their products are being made in plants in Taiwan. It's one thing if they market a separate line like their Silver Eagle products or if they sell Grey Pneumatic impact sockets. I just don't like it when the main hard line items that are engraved Matco are made overseas. With the expansion of the Gearwrench line into regular hand tools, I only see the similiarities growing as the lines continue to blur.

 

[Zeroek]

Uggh. And I have a majority of Matco tools.

 

[mrsleeve]

I havent had them side by side but the SK supper Krome line wrenches look identical to my Cman pro line wrenches??????????? but I dont know for sure as I said I have not lined em up side by side.

 

[eschoendorff]

The only advantage to going with Matco is ease of service and warranty. If the Matco dude stops by your shop and takes care of you, then maybe buy from him.

Over here, the Snap On guy rocks. i will continue to buy from him... because I am pretty sure taht he's gonna be around for a while. Even if Snap On starts making things overseas (let's face it - if Snap on goes overseas, it's only because MAC and Matco have already done it), I will probably still buy from him. Snap On standards are high enough to satisfy me (regardless of country of origin)...


Now, price might be an issue. But even at Home depot, Chinese hand tools are selling for nearly the same price as their Channellock/Craftsman counterparts!

 

[chad s]

The only advantage to going with Matco is ease of service and warranty. If the Matco dude stops by your shop and takes care of you, then maybe buy from him.

Over here, the Snap On guy rocks. i will continue to buy from him... because I am pretty sure taht he's gonna be around for a while. Even if Snap On starts making things overseas (let's face it - if Snap on goes overseas, it's only because MAC and Matco have already done it), I will probably still buy from him. Snap On standards are high enough to satisfy me (regardless of country of origin)...


Now, price might be an issue. But even at Home depot, Chinese hand tools are selling for nearly the same price as their Channellock/Craftsman counterparts!

My snap on guy just celebrated his 14th year of his franchise. His truck is well stocked, and the few times I have needed warranties, he does it with a smile. Je rebuilt a 1947 3/8 F-70N last week for me, under warranty!

Matco's replacement practices are probably the same, but snap on level prices, for mostly craftsman pro level tools is a waste to me.

 

[eschoendorff]

Matco's replacement practices are probably the same, but snap on level prices, for mostly craftsman pro level tools is a waste to me.

Yup.

 

[83diesel]

I agree with the Snapon supporters, but the only problem is our Snapon dealer isn't worth a damn. He will show up once every 6 months and expect you to buy 10,000 dollars worth plus buy a toolbox, and if you call him he will say I'll be there tomorrow and then show up two weeks later when you aren't at the shop.

The price for Matco tools is getting pricier than Snapon for lesser quality tools. I have cut back on buying Matco tools. I have had better luck with some of the independent tool truck brands with the same service for half the money than the overpriced Craftsman (Matco) tools. Compare a flexhead Matco 3/8 to a Snapon flexhead 3/8 price, the Matco is around 30 dollars more. All Matco's bit sockets are made by Vim, recognize the brand? They make all the cheap independent bits and specialt items that look like they would be sold at Wal-Mart.

SK does not have that many similarities, but the small similarities make you wonder if Danaher owns numerous shares of SK stock.

 

[bigdav160]

SK does not have that many similarities, but the small similarities make you wonder if Danaher owns numerous shares of SK stock.

Grab a SK swivel impact socket and then compare it to a Snap-On

There's no doubt in my mind they are built in the same factory. They are identical except the stamped lettering.

 

[krusty the clown]

i had an interesting talk with the matco guy today. ALL danaher tools are made in the same factory now regardless of branding. ALL of the sockets are stamped and broached in china and sent here for stamping and and finishing regardless of brand............i'm personally done with craftsman and matco. maybe the FTC should investigate the made in usa claims like they did with stanley. i'll be replacing everything with snap on.

 

[83diesel]

i had an interesting talk with the matco guy today. ALL danaher tools are made in the same factory now regardless of branding. ALL of the sockets are stamped and broached in china and sent here for stamping and and finishing regardless of brand............i'm personally done with craftsman and matco. maybe the FTC should investigate the made in usa claims like they did with stanley. i'll be replacing everything with snap on.

AMEN!! I agree 100 percent, why not just have a Craftsman tool truck?

 

[krusty the clown]

they tried that and warranty went through the roof.

 

[eschoendorff]

i had an interesting talk with the matco guy today. ALL danaher tools are made in the same factory now regardless of branding. ALL of the sockets are stamped and broached in china and sent here for stamping and and finishing regardless of brand............i'm personally done with craftsman and matco. maybe the FTC should investigate the made in usa claims like they did with stanley. i'll be replacing everything with snap on.

No sheit???? Craftsman "made in the USA sockets" are actually only "finished in the USA?" Fck that!

 

[chad s]

No sheit???? Craftsman "made in the USA sockets" are actually only "finished in the USA?" Fck that!

If this is true, and Craftsman got in trouble, the governmental fines could be so high, based on the amount of product and sales, that could ruin Craftsman.

If this is true, you guys may no longer wonder why parts that are made by union labor in Kenosha, Wisconsin cost so much!

 

[MajorPayne]

i have had a very different experience with matco vs snapon...

for me, the matco prices are better, while the snap on stuff is through the roof...it could just be the truck that comes by marking them up, but either way the snap on stuff is by far more expensive and not only that but the snapon guy has about as much personality as a brick wall....the matco guy on the other hand is really cool and friendly

liking the truck guy certainly has a part in my choices, but i will have to say that i prefer many of the matco tools to the snapon counterparts in feel and longevity

but i digress....every tool company has strengths and weaknesses in my opinion, and there are certain things that i will only get from certain tool companies (ie allen-head socket drivers i will ONLY buy from snap-on, etc etc)

it is a shame that they are outsourcing so much of the work to overseas...while the quality may be comparable, i like the idea of my constant buying of tools helping out middle-class, hard-working americans like myself

 

[sjotis]

No sheit???? Craftsman "made in the USA sockets" are actually only "finished in the USA?" Fck that!

This is total BS!!! They are forged and finished in the USA

 

[sjotis]

i had an interesting talk with the matco guy today. ALL danaher tools are made in the same factory now regardless of branding. ALL of the sockets are stamped and broached in china and sent here for stamping and and finishing regardless of brand............i'm personally done with craftsman and matco. maybe the FTC should investigate the made in usa claims like they did with stanley. i'll be replacing everything with snap on.

Your information is completely false. Do you work for Snap-on???

 

[MarkH]

Years ago there were Craftsman tool trucks, think 30s to 50s.

Another reason they disappeared was it was easier to have the customer come to your store. ie hard to cover the labor and transportation cost with higher prices. Then Craftsman found there was more money in the home - DIY market.

The farm has some old stuff from the days of Craftsman tool trucks from my grandfathers day. When I started working we also had other truck stuff from the same time. The Craftsman felt nicer and frequently looked better finished and the most frequently used because of this. It was so far above the other upper end DIY tools that it is easy to see how they owned this market for so many years.

There may be other times they tried, but with most of the current tools aimed at the DIY market it would be hard to make a go of it.

 

[krusty the clown]

Your information is completely false. Do you work for Snap-on???

i would like to believe it's false, but it came from a matco distributor. if you have evidence to prove it wrong please post it!

 

[crazeesal]

it would be nice to see craftsman made in USA, but that wont stop me from buying. I found a lawsuit that says parts are made in many different countries but isnt specific on what parts theres not much detail and i cant find much else so if any one has info on this please tell me more I posted a link that states the lawsuit but isnt very detailed hope it works
http://findarticles.com/p/articles/mi_m0EIN/is_2005_April_27/ai_n13658037
this lawsuit is fairly old and only states that "metal parts" were made foreign, but i heard many other brands use foreign parts also. I just bought a craftsman wrench set that says made in USA but they dont have multiple parts

 

[DavidtheDuke]

i would like to believe it's false, but it came from a matco distributor. if you have evidence to prove it wrong please post it!

If their products say USA on them, then I wouldn't be surprised if SO had some lawyer file a lawsuit. I usually don't buy Matco, but a few weeks ago I got a stubby allen drive socket set.. It usually listed for $90, I got it for about 60. It says Matco and what not, and it seems there is a mark that says "/X/" where the country of origin should be. It could be they are made in the US but something happened with the stamping, and that's why that X is there. Or, from what you've just said, they are from China. It's really hard to buy anything anymore with all this dodging and weaving nowadays..

 

[sjotis]

i would like to believe it's false, but it came from a matco distributor. if you have evidence to prove it wrong please post it!

If your Matco distributor told you this, he/she is misinformed. Most Danaher sockets are formed and finished in Gastonia, North Carolina. All Danaher sockets with "USA" stamped on them are Made in USA from forge to finish. Don't let anyone tell you otherwise - it's just rubbish.

Different brands within Danaher (Matco, Armstrong, etc.) have different value streams and processes to support their intended quality levels.

 

[MajorPayne]

I just found out something interesting today when i was picking up some Gearwrenches I needed to fill in gaps in my set....you guys may already know this, but I found it odd, interesting, whatever you want to call it

One of the gearwrenches i bought (these are all gearwrench brand, which are sold by the danaher corp) had "manufactured in Taiwan R.O.C. for Danaher Tool Group, Lancaster, PA 17604, Copyright 1998" and the other had "Manufactured in China for Danaher Tool Group, Sparks, MD 21152, Copyright 2005"

So did they change thier corporate location as well as the location of production? Or did they sell the entire company off, and in doing so move the production to China where the new parent company gets stuff made? Maybe one of you guys know, I suppose it doesnt matter much, as the wrenches seem identical, as well as the packaging, etc. And they still have the lifetime warranty.

Oh and the only other thing that was different is that the "old" one (copyright 1998 on the package) has a 6 degree swing per tooth, whereas the "newer" version (copyright 2005 and made in China) has a 5 degree swing per tooth.

Oddly enough, the packaging for the "1998" wrench said "by KD tools" on the top of the label...the newer "2005" wrench didnt...hmmm

 

[Hutch]

Is it just me or does Danahers' companies, Matco, Craftsman, KD, and Armstrong tools are getting similar in quality. Our main tool truck is Matco, .... Craftsman is now selling the pinless impact sockets Matco has sold for years. Armstrong large tool boxes, hammers and ratchets have been looking closer to Matco's than their own in the past few years ...

Anyone also notice that Sears is promoting SK more often in their catalog and internet sales and how some of the newer SK tools look like Matco or Armstrong?

As far as I can find, Craftsman is not owned by Danaher. I would bet the similarities in the Danaher owned companies is real enough though, less overhead for tooling and production.

I bet Sears is pushing more SK to bring in the folks on the edge of the DIY and real professional market, if they can get them "in the door" then they will likely buy more while there, of the higher margin items.

That's all just thoughts though, who knows what all is really going on in these huge corporations.

 

[krusty the clown]

you right danaher does not own craftsman.......sears does, but danaher is the largest supplier of craftsman branded tools. they are sourcing more and more from sk though. it will be interesting to see what direction they go in.

 

[eschoendorff]

If your Matco distributor told you this, he/she is misinformed. Most Danaher sockets are formed and finished in Gastonia, North Carolina. All Danaher sockets with "USA" stamped on them are Made in USA from forge to finish. Don't let anyone tell you otherwise - it's just rubbish.

Different brands within Danaher (Matco, Armstrong, etc.) have different value streams and processes to support their intended quality levels.

That information is true - at least in the past. Current practices may be different.

 

[sjotis]

I just found out something interesting today when i was picking up some Gearwrenches I needed to fill in gaps in my set....you guys may already know this, but I found it odd, interesting, whatever you want to call it

One of the gearwrenches i bought (these are all gearwrench brand, which are sold by the danaher corp) had "manufactured in Taiwan R.O.C. for Danaher Tool Group, Lancaster, PA 17604, Copyright 1998" and the other had "Manufactured in China for Danaher Tool Group, Sparks, MD 21152, Copyright 2005"

So did they change thier corporate location as well as the location of production? Or did they sell the entire company off, and in doing so move the production to China where the new parent company gets stuff made? Maybe one of you guys know, I suppose it doesnt matter much, as the wrenches seem identical, as well as the packaging, etc. And they still have the lifetime warranty.

Oh and the only other thing that was different is that the "old" one (copyright 1998 on the package) has a 6 degree swing per tooth, whereas the "newer" version (copyright 2005 and made in China) has a 5 degree swing per tooth.

Oddly enough, the packaging for the "1998" wrench said "by KD tools" on the top of the label...the newer "2005" wrench didnt...hmmm

Danaher Tool Group just changed their corporate office to Sparks, MD. Nothing was sold off. The change from KD to GearWrench is just a branding decision. GearWrench is still made by Danaher, although there are multiple facilities in Asia where it may be made.

 

[sjotis]

That information is true - at least in the past. Current practices may be different.

Still current practice....

 

[MajorPayne]

Danaher Tool Group just changed their corporate office to Sparks, MD. Nothing was sold off. The change from KD to GearWrench is just a branding decision. GearWrench is still made by Danaher, although there are multiple facilities in Asia where it may be made.

ahh ok...thanks for the info...it just had me wondering a little thats all