Slab thickness? Radiant heat/ 2post lift/ second floor?

[marcello7x]

So im passing papers on my first house next month at some point, and im far more excited for the garage than the house itself. The house needs minor work, and elbow grease, but the garage needs quite a bit more.

First i need a new roof, simple enough. Wood below shingles should be ok, but we'll see when everything is pulled off. I may pull the old roof myself, then have a contractor put on the new stuff.

Secondly i need a new floor. The garage is a 4 car, with a loft[see avatar]. 2 bays at the bottom, 2 above with loft. Currently only one bay of the 4 are usable. The floor of the second floor is wood, and it has a ton of support 4x4's to support one bay, which then blocks off all the use of the bottom bays.

I would like to put a slab to support the second floor since i have more height there for a lift. Its more comfortable, with better access to the loft/mancave, and should heat better in the winter. As well as easier access to the house. Leaving the lower bays, which have no incline to climb[think of new england snowy winter] for the daily drivers.

How thick does the slab need to be. I read a minimum of 5" for the 2 post 10,000 lift. But since its not going directly over a hard surface does it need more? Also i know i need atleast a big "I" beam, but what else?

I also plan on radiant heating. How well will it heat both upper and lower levels. I mostly need the upper, but it would be nice to keep warm lower bays as well.

I will have a contractor come out and do most of the work to put in a new floor. But i will mostlikely remove the old.

 

[ConCretin]

If I read your post correctly, you would like to replace the wood framed upper floor with a concrete floor that would support a lift.

I hate to be the bearer of bad news but that ain't gonna work. Too many reasons to list.

How about removing a section of the upper floor (which seems to have failed anyway) to provide headroom for a lift located on the lower level. The other side could act as a loft area.

Just a thought. By the way, congratulations on your new garage. Oh yea, the house too.

 

[BlueH20Boss]

If I read your post correctly, you would like to replace the wood framed upper floor with a concrete floor that would support a lift.

I hate to be the bearer of bad news but that ain't gonna work. Too many reasons to list.

How about removing a section of the upper floor (which seems to have failed anyway) to provide headroom for a lift located on the lower level. The other side could act as a loft area.

Just a thought. By the way, congratulations on your new garage. Oh yea, the house too.

What is your laundry list of why he cant accomplish his vision? They can build bridges over bodies of water that hundreds of cars and trucks and trains can pass over, why without the correct engineering could they not plan a properly supported concrete floor most likely poured over a metal corrugated steel deck and lots of structural rebar? Just in 30 seconds of thought I came up with the idea that if the wooden second floor supports a car as is that if he decided to plan a lift up there he could transfer the weight down through the second floor with columns that terminate into a poured footer on the first floor floor basically build a two post lift with super long legs adequately supported. ( guarantee you with the proper engineering you could spec a load bearing concrete/ steel floor. The average parking garage floor cones to mind. Not jumping on your reply but you could have thought of something. Better to offer the guy than "aint gonna happen" I guess I just vision building tasks differently than you do.

 

[ConCretin]

It is impractical to construct a suspended concrete slab capable of supporting vehicles and a lift on top of the existing wood framed walls. The slab would probably need to be 12" thick and the dead load alone would likely crush the existing structure. You'd need some serious concrete or steel supports under the slab with associated foundations.

Anything is possible but it would probably cost more than a whole new garage.

 

[marcello7x]

It is impractical to construct a suspended concrete slab capable of supporting vehicles and a lift on top of the existing wood framed walls. The slab would probably need to be 12" thick and the dead load alone would likely crush the existing structure. You'd need some serious concrete or steel supports under the slab with associated foundations.

Anything is possible but it would probably cost more than a whole new garage.

Well the slab won't be suspended by wood framing. The bottom bays are alot like a basment of a house, where the walls are foundations for the second floor of bays. The perimeter of the slab will be solidly placed on stone foundation with an exception of the 2 garage door openings.

My main concern was the center of the floor being held up with an I beam vs solid ground. Does it need to be thicker to support the lift because of this?

My avatar has a side view and a front view.

 

[marcello7x]

Here is a front view with a side view, its hard to tell the elevation change. In the front view you can see the full height of the garage, and side only shows the second floor and loft area.

 

[ScaldedDog]

Looks like a cool place, and one seriously deserving of its own thread as you get into it. Share with us!

Mark

 

[ConCretin]

Marcello7x, If you are serious about pursuing your idea, you'll need to employ a good structural engineer. There are a lot of ways to accomplish what you want to do but they are all expensive. It is going to be a very complicated undertaking to remove a wood framed floor and replace it with a suspended concrete slab. I also think you'll have a hard time finding a qualified contractor.

I'm not trying to be negative. I do a lot of this kind of concrete work and want to give you a sense of what your are getting into.

To answer your question, the whole floor will need to quite thick and heavily reinforced in order for it to span the distances between the supports. My guess would be that this will be adequate to resist the punching shear of the lift but your engineer will have to make this determination.

 

[marcello7x]

Looks like a cool place, and one seriously deserving of its own thread as you get into it. Share with us!

Mark

Ill start a build thread at some point. Its not technically mine yet so no good pics or anything.

 

[socapots]

Here is a front view with a side view, its hard to tell the elevation change. In the front view you can see the full height of the garage, and side only shows the second floor and loft area.

at first i thought you were crazy.. lol.. But now after seeing these pics it makes more sense.

Id say it is possible. But like the others say it will probably cost alot more then building new. I assume that all four sides of the lower section is already concrete? The big questions are can those walls support the weight of what ever you plan on putting on top. And if not what can be done about it. There is the option of pillars and gurters (like in a parkade).

i guess the first thing once you get possession is going to be talk to some engineers to find out what needs to be done, price it all out. and see if its even going to be worth it.

 

[marcello7x]

I really hope it is possible because im dying to get a lift. After swaping the motor in my brothers car with a typical hoist, i realized having a lift and dropping the whole subframe by lifting the car off would have saved me days!