Civilian Auto Hobby Shop

[hilld]

Mercnry,

if you can make it work, that would be fantastic. While this is an old thread, it is still very pertinent. When I was in the military, I did get to use the on base rental shops, but not all bases had them, they had one on Ft. Bragg, but didn't have one on Ft. Riley.

The lack of such an option made me put in my own lift, I can pay rental fees to myself or my wife.

Derek

 

[ADaughen]

We are going to be opening one soon here in Charlottesville, VA
Putting together the last of the operating capital. It will work with the correct plan and that is what we have been working on for longer than I care to admit.

Best of luck to you.

That was my plans for the extra space in my dream shop. One of those, if I won the lotto and started my own company.

All/most of the concerns have already been voiced.

Liability - people are idiots and LOVE to sue. I would have to keep it limited to a few local clubs at first and hope for the best. Make sure you get a competent lawyer to help draw up the waivers.

Small, local clubs are all fine and good, but you need a bigger base to help pay for the consumables, recoup start-up costs, etc.

Start-up Tools/Theft/Loss/Breakage - If I won the lotto, it wouldn't be difficult to outfit 5-7 bays full of tools... WPAFB Hobby Shop shares a big tool chest between two bays and specialty/power tools are in a locked cage you have to sign for. IIRC, there were ~12 bays.

After hours security would be required around here. On base it is pretty easy.

Labor - with the above sign out plan, you will need someone there during working hours. It would help if he were a retired mechanic. Someone who couldn't crawl around under cars, but knew everything about them.



There was an old dealership in my hometown I always wanted to buy. The whole back end was five double drive through bays; two being big "semi sized" doors. It would have been cool, but I don't think there were enough kids modifying their cars in the area to sustain the building.

More reasonably, I almost pulled the trigger on an old two bay in the next town over. It was an oil change place, prior to that a gas station. EPA fees made it cost prohibitive to try to get a loan for the $45,000 building (10 years ago).

 

[rsanter]

4 friends and I did that a while back where we pooled our recources and tallents to make a nice shop for us.
it only lasted a while before 2 of them were out and then the remaining 3 of us got along well in that deal for several years.
learning point, even between friends there was some lack of respect and some things getting 'aquired' so between people that are not friends can you imagine what it will be

there is another model to this...its called adult education or evening classes at the local college or high school
a friend took a body and paint class in the evening and used it to do the work on his streetrod project

bob

bob

 

[ecotec]

civilian = disrespectful.

total BS!

the hobby shops are known for missing tools. soldiers are no better.

 

[Varkwso]

It is a tough business model.

The "Auto Barn" option with a few bays for contracted storage customers is more likely I would think.

I have used a lot of military auto hobby shops - they are mostly good, not always cheap, and tool control is rarely a problem.

 

[Grumpy365]

The problem no one addressed is this quickly becomes a full blown money making garage for some of its patrons.. So. You have the guy trying to build his hotrod or work on his daily driver and all the lifts are filled with some dude doing oil changes for $20.00 bucks a pop.

 

[red baron]

The problem no one addressed is this quickly becomes a full blown money making garage for some of its patrons.. So. You have the guy trying to build his hotrod or work on his daily driver and all the lifts are filled with some dude doing oil changes for $20.00 bucks a pop.

This would be really hard to regulate. Very good point!

 

[krivasgarage]

Anyone ever thought of starting a civilian Auto Hobby Shop?

I think something similar would be an excellent church ministry - a shop owner donates the space, other church members do the work and the screening of the truly needy.

 

[babzog]

The problem no one addressed is this quickly becomes a full blown money making garage for some of its patrons.. So. You have the guy trying to build his hotrod or work on his daily driver and all the lifts are filled with some dude doing oil changes for $20.00 bucks a pop.

Set a limit of one customer per bay. If buddy wants to rent the bay all day doing oil changes (though I can't imagine him making much if he's only charging $20 ea), then let him. You're still making your money.

 

[e-tek]

So many nay-sayers! There's a couple around here, one runs out of a body shop (nights & wknds) and does quite well. The other belongs to the main car-club here (Draggins) and anyone can rent it out.

 

[nate379]

I have helped a couple people out at the Hobby Shop on the base here, there are 2 of them (Ft Rich one and Elmendorf). In the end I usually have them haul there stuff here since I would end up having to haul 1/2 my tools over there.
The Ft Rich one will give you a small tray of tools and anything else you need to do it 1 tool at a time. Need a hammer? Well better turn in that 9/16" socket.
An hr job ends up taking all day!

And then you get the "mechanics" hovering over you. Sorry dude but I don't care that you have 150k in Snap On tools and took a few classes... I just may have an idea what I'm doing... and I certainly didn't ask for your help!

The Elmendorf one got pissed when I went in one day and did an oil change and tire rotation in 25 mins. They charge by the .5/hr so it cost me like $3.
I guess most of the people that go there spend all day on it or something. I was in and out faster than the guy was able to put the stall ticket in their computer system.

One of the places wouldn't allow food either. Sorry but what fun is an engine or trans swap with a couple of your friends if you can't have at least soda and pizza?
Bring a beer in there and you may as well get caught clubbing baby seals instead!

And then depending on who is running the counter the cost of stuff and availability changes. The Ft Rich one has a parts washer (steam cleaning kind) and sometimes can't use it, or it's x amount per 5 min, or other times it's free for use.

All of that hassle made it make more sense to buy the tools and work in my own garage.

 

[Grumpy365]

Set a limit of one customer per bay. If buddy wants to rent the bay all day doing oil changes (though I can't imagine him making much if he's only charging $20 ea), then let him. You're still making your money.

It violates the principle of Hobby.

It then becomes an auto shop based on a Beauty Shop model of operation (where you rent a chair)

Which is fine, if that is what you want, but it ain't a hobby shop.

 

[6768rogues]

Click and Clack, the car column guys, started out with one. It was a disaster.

 

[burnitwithfire]

There's one in my area. They work on a coin system to rent tools, there's a parts guy, a few welders, oxy torches, 2 and 4 post lifts and midrise lifts, spring compressors and a paint booth. If you rent the paint booth at the end of the day you can leave your car to dry in there all night and pick it up the next morning.

It looks pretty clean in the pics and their hourly rates are good, 12$/hour for floor space and 17$/hour for a lift and 70$/4 hours for the paintbooth.

http://www.autonome3060.com/Item.aspx?type=Installation

http://www.autonome3060.com/Item.aspx?type=Outil

 

[babzog]

It violates the principle of Hobby.

It then becomes an auto shop based on a Beauty Shop model of operation (where you rent a chair)

Which is fine, if that is what you want, but it ain't a hobby shop.

Well, if you don't want that going on (ie: if there are customers lined up to use the bays), it's easy enough to give buddy the boot. Like you said, depends on your goals and how you want to run your shop.

 

[Even 11]

I know there is one locally here in Colorado Springs, but I don't know anything about it. I heard about a guy who was going to start one a while back like one he used in germany somewhere but I lost touch with the guy and don't know if he ever got it off the gound or not. Seems like a good idea but with all businesses, there's potential for a lot of problems.

-Dane

 

[StanBo]

Have any of you guys done this without trying to turn a profit? A couple of my friends have been thinking of doing a community garage.

I bought my house thinking the guys in my club could come over and work on their cars and they have. Heck I started doing my work in friend's garages.

One of the stumbling blocks that we have is the owner of the garage needs to be home to open the garage. So sharing one has come to mind.

With smart phones with videocam apps.

User owned minor tools and shared large tools it seems it should work.

Any advice from working shared shops?

 

[Varkwso]

Have any of you guys done this without trying to turn a profit? A couple of my friends have been thinking of doing a community garage.

I bought my house thinking the guys in my club could come over and work on their cars and they have. Heck I started doing my work in friend's garages.

One of the stumbling blocks that we have is the owner of the garage needs to be home to open the garage. So sharing one has come to mind.

With smart phones with videocam apps.

User owned minor tools and shared large tools it seems it should work.

Any advice from working shared shops?

If there is a lift(s) or paint booth work out how long they can be *******. Immovable projects tying up a lift is a real problem.

 

[rad23racer]

You would have to set it up as a fractional ownership where everyone that works there is an owner or guest of an owner. Buy-in required to become an owner which pays for machines and tools. Dues (bay rental) would cover the operating expenses. Might be good to be in the same building as a repair facility so you can share expenses.

 

[DCarr]

There was a shop like this in the San Fernando Valley in the late 80's - early 90's. I went by it often. The way it looked to me was that you could rent a space from them and tools. In order to rent tools you had to leave a deposit of some sort.

It lasted about 2 years I would guess.

 

[unioncreek]

When I went to college at Montana State Univ. they had a shop for all the students. It was well used and if you didn't make an appointment to use it you couldn't get in especially during the winter. They charged you a $1/hour to cover the heating, but you just turned your student ID in when you came in the door and when you needed a tool or tool box full of tolls they just added that to the list and you had to check them back in when you left. It sure beat laying out in the cold working on a rig. Sad thing is I didn't discover it until the last year I was there.

Bobg

 

[The Slurpee King]

http://www.u-wrench.ca/

I bet this is exactly what the original poster was looking for. The manager and part owner is a good friend of mine.

Website says it's still in business. Excellent. I drove past it a few times when I still worked in Cowtown. After having done car repairs in rain in Van and in the cold there, I thought it was a helluvan idea.

If I knew it had still been open last spring, I might have taken my deck down to paint it last spring, instead of doing it in my driveway. At the very least, it might have cured better and lasted longer.

 

[Stuart in MN]

This place is in the Minneapolis area, from what I understand they've been successful. I know a couple people who have used their garage and were happy with the experience. http://www.firstgeargarage.com/

 

[bmwpower]

I don't see how the insurance wouldn't make it unprofitable. All it takes is one guy to sue you.

 

[toymn6366]

I remember changing the rusted body of my 76 cj5 for a fiberglas body in shop on base when was stationed in texas,i had so many guys it was like a nascar pit crew.
Over in Dawsonvile Ga they are building a race track subdivison haven't heard much about it lately may have run out of money.

 

[Varkwso]

I remember changing the rusted body of my 76 cj5 for a fiberglas body in shop on base when was stationed in texas,i had so many guys it was like a nascar pit crew.
Over in Dawsonvile Ga they are building a race track subdivison haven't heard much about it lately may have run out of money.

Atlanta Motorsports Park. Subdivision part is a long ways off. Supposed to be open for racing this fall. Memberships are still available for those with a high tolerance of risk and lots of disposable income. Houses bordering property are available cheap...

 

[E.Marquez]

I’ve seen Bay rentals before, and bay/ lift rentals. But for everything else you were on your own. I really do not remember the cost, and it was years ago.
And No overnight on the lift, but they had storage on site.

On Post Auto Craft shops are Paid for from at least two funds… and in no way do I think a off post one could be run with the save level of service, equipment, attendants and such while turning a profit.

I spent hundreds of hours in the Auto Craft shops when stationed in Alaska, less so elsewhere as I had better facilities at home or my race partners shop.

 

[Bryan83taco]

I used the one at Bragg when I was stationed there. Mainly because I was living in an apartment. It was great. But now I have a garage so I do all of my work there. I may have to use the one on Eglin when I put a new clutch in the Mustang.

 

[Varkwso]

I used the one at Bragg when I was stationed there. Mainly because I was living in an apartment. It was great. But now I have a garage so I do all of my work there. I may have to use the one on Eglin when I put a new clutch in the Mustang.

I used auto hobby shops all over the world. They are a great deal especially since you can do nothing on a car in base housing. They are subsidized by NAF. Mostly profit from bx/px and commissary.

 

[Garage Yourself]

We have opened one in Miami Tell me what you think!

GarageYourself.com

 

[Bill Bowman]

Look's like a very nice facility. IMHO, your biggest hurdle is going to be getting guys to spend the bucks to work there. I'm sure there are some who might utilize this concept, but the secret to success is having the volume to generate the revenue to cover the overhead. Good luck, I hope it works out for you. Bill

 

[colt zantop]

That looks like a very nice, clean, facility. How long have you been open and how is traffic so far? You getting a lot of people coming in? I also am curious, is insurance high or not.... Seems like it would be.

Good luck with your business.. Looks like you did it right as far as I can see.

 

[Jagmandave]

This one's in KC, I'm friends with the owner and I did a weeks worth of work on a friend's car there....he's going strong and has expanded three times now, including opening a separate attached shop for body work.

http://diyautorepairkc.com/

He provides tools and equipment at no extra charge - doesn't have a dyno tho......I think his rates are pretty darn reasonable too.

He still has his full time job tho.

 

[Cobra6]

They have one here -
http://www.pitstopdiygarage.com/

looks like members only - one thing - they also have a storage area - it was an old muffler shop and ther was some rented storage buildings behind it. Looks like a good place to store a vehicle after a quick purchase.

the auto craft center here on post is old and run down - the last time I went in there to help a friend rebuild a ****** we left because it was so dirty.

The rates to use the blast cabinet were than what I would have to pay someone to do it for me at a shop.

 

[Falcon67]

I personally would not let amateurs anywhere near a tire machine. Instant maim or death awaits if not handled properly.

Daily rate not bad. +25 for air tools seems much. Dyno rate seems a mite high. 7/15 weekend we had a dyno at the drag strip - 3 pulls for $85.

 

[Always_Thinkin]

I haven't read all the posts so maybe what I am about to say ha been alredy. I thought this would work if it was a part of a parts store. AutoZone and Oreily's already rents out tools why not a bay with air, a lift, workbench etc.

 

[nuklbstr83]

the video story: http://vimeo.com/35403052

the shops website: http://motomethod.com/

 

[mrpizza]

I love the hobby shop on base. They have a few ase certified mechanics in there to ask questions and help with repairs. The rates are awesome, too. 5 an hour for a bay, 7 an hour for a lift. I think max for either is 25 or 30 for the day. Obviously cheaper because mccs subsidizes it.

 

[the gypsy]

Hi Guys I read quite a few posts before my eyes glazed over. But what I can tell you is that here in Montreal there are many. Actually there are 4 on 1 street alone (this is exceptional and not the rule). The way it works here is that you can rent the floor space or you can rent a lift, obviously not at the same rate. As for the tools you bring your own basic tools and rent out the ocassional tool which you do not have or you ask one of the regulars if they can lend or rent to you. There are almost always some unemployed mechanics hanging around willing to help for a fee or even a weekend mechanic, or mechanics which want to make extra money on the side. As for responsability, I cannot confirm the exact details and honestly don't remember if they make a client sign a waiver, although it would be logical.

 

[bugnout]

I really miss not being near a military base to use the AHS. I think on a civilian level, setting this up as a club garage is the only way this could work. I think insurance would be lower if its a club.

- Members buy into the club, essentially a share of sunk costs for building, lifts, common tools, could have a couple of levels of memberships with different levels of privelages. Family membership vs individual. Associate that can use a bay vs full that have access to paint booth.
- Members pay a daily rental fee for a bay/lift/ booth - This costs cover the management of the club essentially pays the salary for the manager and staff.
- Might be a good idea to charge monthly dues to pay for taxes/electric/gas/insurance etc, or this could be covered out of daily rentals.
- Bring your own tools, maybe have a tool cage/room so members can lock up thier boxes and leave them at the facility.