Between 265 & 485 SQ/FT 1950s Craftsman Garage retro remodel

[Bob Heine]

Red Leader,
As the instigator of all this EXL excitement, a couple of people have added to it. This was posted over on Jack Olsen's 12-Gauge Garage but the question was asked here as well (Post #1788). Hope this helps ....

Thanks to the discussion here, I learned about the 3M EXL/Scotchbrite deburring wheel and got myself one recently. It really is the cat's pajamas! There's a sale at ENCO, just got a 6" dia x 0.5" wide for $35.59, down from $48.99.

I also got free shipping, but that was a special promotion because I'm on the ENCO email list.

Yes, it removes light rust and polishes things all shiny, lickety split! Thanks, Red Leader! Thanks, Jack!

Now I'd like to thank Squankum.

ENCO sells the adapters (which don't come with the 3M EXL wheel). This "telescoping" one fits the 1" diameter hole in the wheel and using one, two or all three bushes the hole to fit 3/4", 5/8" and 1/2" shafts.

http://www.use-enco.com/CGI/INSRIT?PARTPG=INLMKD&PMPXNO=8003402&PMAKA=391-1400

 

[ckadams00]

Are they really that much better than a wire wheel? I was going to pick one up but the lowest prices I could find were about $60. My wire wheel works pretty good . . . .still, very tempted because of all the accolades!

 

[Zengineer]

Are they really that much better than a wire wheel? I was going to pick one up but the lowest prices I could find were about $60. My wire wheel works pretty good . . . .still, very tempted because of all the accolades!

Not even comparable in what they do... buy one and be amazed.

 

[Jack Olsen]

It's like wire-brushing, and then steel-wooling, and then buffing -- all at once. It's pretty great.

I wish I'd known about Squankum's deal. I paid ten bucks too much.

 

[Bob Heine]

It's like wire-brushing, and then steel-wooling, and then buffing -- all at once. It's pretty great.

I wish I'd known about Squankum's deal. I paid ten bucks too much.

Jack,
That's exactly what it is. I used the EXL wheel on the bottom section of this saw blade. The center section is just a wire brush, which I used on the cutting edges of the first two sections. The top section is EXL, followed by green buffing compound for stainless steel. The wire brush removes loose rust and dried wood sap but it leaves the steel alone. The EXL wheel removes a very small amount of steel (you can see the original manufacturing marks) to achieve a bright, fresh finish.

Forgot to mention that Squankum is referring to a 1/2" thick wheel. The 1" is about $65 from ENCO when it's not on sale.

 

[ckadams00]

OK I'm sold. Red Leader, if you don't own 3M stock you should probably move fast - you're startin' somthin.

For those of you who have these wheels, 1/2" hold up ok or do you recommend the 1"?

 

[Red Leader]

OK I'm sold. Red Leader, if you don't own 3M stock you should probably move fast - you're startin' somthin.

For those of you who have these wheels, 1/2" hold up ok or do you recommend the 1"?

1/2" would be better for tight spots and crevices/odd shapes. 1" would be good if you want to cover more territory and do it faster.

 

[Dan in Pasadena]

How long do these last?

 

[Red Leader]

How long do these last?

Mine has several hours on it now. The edges just have a slight rounding, but other than that it is fine

 

[Red Leader]

Well, here are a few updates!

Got a little bit more done on the work bench. This is tough because it is slow going (.75 inch at a time, lots of glue, nails and screws) and the biggest issues - the boards are not quite dimensioned properly. If I was to make sure the smooth edges all lined up perfectly straight, the table would curve either inward or outward. So the pieces are all not perfectly square, if you can understand what I'm trying to get across. What this means is that I'm having to stagger the pieces ever so slightly on the top to make sure it doesn't bow, but because of tolerance stacking, it gets worse by the board. I need to take it as it is now (about or little over a foot made so far) and sand the edge of the last board I put on so I can start again with a true 90 degree angle to attach to. I'm thinking if I can find a shop around here that has an industrial planer, it might not be a bad idea to pay a little bit and get it planed. If I was to work in sections, finding a planer would be really easy. I suppose there is always that option - of having the table be 2x 14" pieces or so, then find a local OWWMer who has a planer and borrow it.

What do you guys think? If I did that, I'd probably have to attach the tables together underneath with metal strapping. One possible solution.

I also thought it was time to start work on the saw/jointer combo.

Yes, it looked ridiculous, but I took Jeff's suggestion and just picked up my grinder with the EXL wheel on it and went to town:

I'm not planning a full restore on this tool, just don't have the time. I will recondition the cast iron surfaces, replace the blade, recondition and lube the moving parts, redo the electrical then get it sent out. Should be a fine little worker when done.

 

[Zengineer]

Well, here are a few updates!

Got a little bit more done on the work bench. This is tough because it is slow going (.75 inch at a time, lots of glue, nails and screws) and the biggest issues - the boards are not quite dimensioned properly. If I was to make sure the smooth edges all lined up perfectly straight, the table would curve either inward or outward. So the pieces are all not perfectly square, if you can understand what I'm trying to get across. What this means is that I'm having to stagger the pieces ever so slightly on the top to make sure it doesn't bow, but because of tolerance stacking, it gets worse by the board. I need to take it as it is now (about or little over a foot made so far) and sand the edge of the last board I put on so I can start again with a true 90 degree angle to attach to. I'm thinking if I can find a shop around here that has an industrial planer, it might not be a bad idea to pay a little bit and get it planed. If I was to work in sections, finding a planer would be really easy. I suppose there is always that option - of having the table be 2x 14" pieces or so, then find a local OWWMer who has a planer and borrow it.

Find yourself a decent old hand plane and flatten it that way... Cheap, effective, and in line with your tools and garage collection.

 

[SpeedinLemon]

It's good to see progress on the bench! I think that top is going to turn out nice. Do you happen to have a pic/details of your EXL setup you're using on that table top? I also took the EXL plunge based on yours and others recommendation....It is great. I bought an 8" with adapter for my bench grinder. I've just cleaned up a few tools that were surface rusted from the fire. I need to do the top of my table saw and will need to do some parts on my 150 DP that will be difficult to do on the bench grinder wheel. I've got a couple of 4" grinders....do you use a 6" wheel on a big hand held grinder or what? Please continue to educate me! I feel like I need to send you tuition for all the great things I learn in this thread! Keep up the great work RL.

 

[tinbender 66]

That bench looks really cool but man what a lot of work!!

I haven't thought about just picking my grinder up. Can you get the EXL somewhat flat on the surface?

 

[Wingnut65]

+1 on the portable planer. And I'd follow up with a belt sander to even it out.

Be very careful with that Craftsman portable hand-held bench grinder. There is a lot of torque on that thing that can cause serious damage or injury if it gets away from you. Also, I haven't found a brake on mine yet. That wheel will spin for a while.

That said, the combo is starting to take shape.

 

[Bob Heine]

Red Leader,

I'm not frightened by many things but a bench grinder used as a portable device has just been added to my short list. When I read your post last night I thought there might be a better solution. I don't want to slow you down but I ordered five 2" diameter 3M EXL disks for a Roloc holder. The little disks are about $4 each when purchased in small quantities.

http://www.rshughes.com/products/048011_17183.html

I purchased these from RS Hughes. As soon as they arrive I'll try them out on my Swag Off-Road table -- it has a little surface rust.

 

[ckadams00]

Red Leader - I am not sure if I am reading you're post right - difficult to tell if you are using a hand-held grinder on the table top, or using your bench grinder *by hand*. If it is the later, then stop! Holy cow I am in awe of the creativity and detail you bring to your projects, but there is a safety line not to be crossed.

I understand the 3M wheels are the cat's meow and all, but a portable grinder - even a 4 1/2 inch - will do a decent job of cleaning with a sanding pad or lapped 3M disk on it. Geez you can get a cheap import one at HF for about $20.

>>(New Rule in My Shop: "Crappy Chinese Tools Used Correctly are Preferred to American Made Tools Used Unsafely")<<

Be safe man! I don't want to see your wife move all your cool tools to "Classifieds"!

 

[ckadams00]

Hi Red Leader - in one of your recent posts you were grinding down the sides of one of your cabinet saws. I started doing the same on my CMan this past week, lots of old paint and a pretty good amount of surface rust. My handheld grinder and sanding flap is making good progress, but there is quite a bit of pitting and I wanted your thoughts on next steps . . .

1. How do you get the rust out of the little pits? I don't have a way to submerge it in a kiddie pool of Evaporust. I am sure there is a 'duh' approach to cleaning out pitting but I have never had to tackle this before and it's got me puzzled.

2. What's the best filler on something like this to smooth out the pits and imperfections? Auto body filler? What have you tried that worked well?

Thanks for any input - I don't want to rush this part or I am sure the whole saw cabinet will l look like ****.

 

[Bob Heine]

Red Leader - I am not sure if I am reading you're post right - difficult to tell if you are using a hand-held grinder on the table top, or using your bench grinder *by hand*. If it is the later, then stop! Holy cow I am in awe of the creativity and detail you bring to your projects, but there is a safety line not to be crossed.

I understand the 3M wheels are the cat's meow and all, but a portable grinder - even a 4 1/2 inch - will do a decent job of cleaning with a sanding pad or lapped 3M disk on it. Geez you can get a cheap import one at HF for about $20.

>>(New Rule in My Shop: "Crappy Chinese Tools Used Correctly are Preferred to American Made Tools Used Unsafely")<<

Be safe man! I don't want to see your wife move all your cool tools to "Classifieds"!

+1
Harbor Fright has this 4.5" grinder on sale for $14.99:

http://www.harborfreight.com/4-1-2-half-inch-angle-grinder-95578.html

They also have this set of ten flap wheels, grinding wheels and cutoff wheels on sale for $8.99.

http://www.harborfreight.com/10-pie...nding-and-cutting-wheel-assortment-47572.html

Even excellent health insurance makes you pay $75 for an emergency room visit. You can buy a grinder and set of wheels for a third of that -- OR -- buy three packages and give away two of them -- and not have to sit in a waiting room full of really sad people for three hours. Of course if they have to admit you for surgery or observation, I think the emergency room visit is free. Might want to check with shopnut because he has some recent experience with momentary lapses in attention.

 

[Red Leader]

Haha, thanks for your sentiment guys and I am in agreement with you - I won't be trying that again! It worked well, but even the grinder probably weighs more than the little table.

I have been looking for a source (as well as others) for something EXL-ish in the form of an angle grinder, which I do have one of. However, anything more abrasive than the fine EXL wheel will eat away at the cast iron and I'd like to avoid that.



I appreciate the safety check guys. Trust me, I need that. Thanks for having my back everyone!

 

[Red Leader]

It's good to see progress on the bench! I think that top is going to turn out nice. Do you happen to have a pic/details of your EXL setup you're using on that table top?

Here is the workhorse of my shop:

An old Montgomery Ward motor. Seriously

I've heard a lot of people talk about how these motors aren't very good and just die off, but so far so good! I like having the EXL wheel exposed like that because if I stuck it in a normal grinder I wouldn't be able to use it like I do now and be able to clean bigger pieces. The nice thing about it is that it is not as abrasive as a stone wheel and not nearly as grabby as a wire wheel (which can be scary for sure). I've only seen it throw sparks here and there if I'm really digging into something, other than that, it functions much like a heavy duty polishing wheel.

That 8" wheel is going to be great for getting around the bulk of the rest of the grinder it is attached to.

 

[Red Leader]

Find yourself a decent old hand plane and flatten it that way... Cheap, effective, and in line with your tools and garage collection.

Zengineer I really like this suggestion - doin' it the old fashioned way. It will be a good way to cut my teeth on the essentials of hand planing, plus it means I should keep my eye out for another tool I will seriously look into it.

Also it means that I can keep the bench top as one solid unit.

To everyone how there who has a wooden work bench you are using right now - how accurate do you usually require the surface to be for your projects?

 

[Red Leader]

That bench looks really cool but man what a lot of work!!

I haven't thought about just picking my grinder up. Can you get the EXL somewhat flat on the surface?

Many times I am using the edge of the EXL wheel, and that is mainly to get around the bulk of the motor. This would be a non-issue on a larger EXL wheel.

Oh, and you probably shouldn't follow my bad example

 

[Red Leader]

Hi Red Leader - in one of your recent posts you were grinding down the sides of one of your cabinet saws. I started doing the same on my CMan this past week, lots of old paint and a pretty good amount of surface rust. My handheld grinder and sanding flap is making good progress, but there is quite a bit of pitting and I wanted your thoughts on next steps . . .

1. How do you get the rust out of the little pits? I don't have a way to submerge it in a kiddie pool of Evaporust. I am sure there is a 'duh' approach to cleaning out pitting but I have never had to tackle this before and it's got me puzzled.

2. What's the best filler on something like this to smooth out the pits and imperfections? Auto body filler? What have you tried that worked well?

Thanks for any input - I don't want to rush this part or I am sure the whole saw cabinet will l look like ****.

Electrolysis is great for getting really hard to reach areas, but it can be hard on a wide surface if you don't have an adequate sized preparation area. I hear that rust needs oxygen to spread, so sealing off the pits should work. I have used a product that is a rust neutralizer called Extend (I think it is made by 3M) and it chemically turns the rust to another substance. You could always swipe some of that around the pitted area. On my cabinet saw, there definitely were pits, so I sanded as well as I could and just used a good primer - Duplicolor self-etching. The self-etching part gets a grab on the metal and I would think locks away any minute traces of rust. Any time you are opening up cast iron or sheet metal with a fresh surface, oxidation will happen, even if you don't see it. On that sheet metal cabinet, I had that orange surface rust 'dust' appear on it in only 1 day. Worse than that, I've had naked cast iron parts air dry for 10 minutes and get small traces of orange - surface rust. It is amazing how fast it can happen so as long as the surface has integrity (most of it is the shiny metal, no scale type rust is present) I think you should be good with a good self-etching primer. Or you can use a bit of bondo to even out the pits before you prime.

 

[Shoottx]

Once you have the bench all together, find a cabinet shop or a wood suppler that has a big wide belt sander and have them run it through.

They will usually charge a minimal amount and it can be done quickly. It is way cheaper than the hand plane slope, way safer than the other method.

As far as removing paint, Rockler has a product called Soy Gel, that works really well, and it is environmentally safe. I used it on a Unisaw, it stripped the school paint and the original delta paint in one application. I applied it with a cheap brush, let it work its magic and then scrapped the pain off with a wide putty knife. A couple of photos

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Mike

 

[Red Leader]

First of all, my wife is awesome!!! She said to go have some fun in the garage, so I got a bit done!

First, I started messing around with the Atlas cabinet saw. Then I started rearranging things. Then I started clearing out the side wall of the garage...which inspired me to start the redo process of that stripe on the wall.

If you recall:

If you look closely, the stripe on the left side is off. Which is also why this happened:

Hee hee. Time to fix that

Here it is with paint on. Still have one white stripe to fill in.

Also, I had a chance to clean the garage today, and here is where it currently stands:

I also moved down my unfinished cabinets and have a mock workbench going on right now so that I can kind of visualize the space with a bench in it:

Oh, and here is where I'm at with the Atlas:

That uneveness in the paint at the top of the saw's cabinet isn't actually in the paint, it is in the metal. I suppose some bondo could have fixed it, but I wasn't going too extreme, especially in the middle of winter. I suppose in another 30 yrs either I or someone else can use some bondo there

The work never stops...but at least a little happened today in the 1950s Craftsman Garage

Not great, but a lot better than it was. Also, I was able to identify all the things that are temporary and get a plan for each one.

 

[Wingnut65]

Dave, Great update for the 1950s Craftsman Garage for post number 1953. Very appropriate.

Glad you finally got around to the paint line. Scratch that one off the list and continue playing with old tools. I have some pix to show you when I unpack my laptop...

 

[american3.14guy]

Red Leader,
The tools are looking great. Since reading your thread and watching your transformations, it prompted me to rebuild my old workbench with a beetle-kill pine top. Here is a preview. It also prompted me to post some of my rebuilding skills as pics in my profile. In Red Leader fashion, here is a preview. You will have to check out my pics for the rest.

 

[Red Leader]

For post #1956, I thought it fitting to reference one of the main inspirations for the 1950s Craftsman Garage, the 1956 Craftsman Power Tools Catalog:

This is the catalog that first featured the 110.24561 scroll saw, the 306 Belsaw 12 1/4" planer, and a host of other neat and somewhat rare tools. 1956 saw Craftsman nearing the end of its golden years, but still at what I consider was the pinnacle for Craftsman.

We still see the Craftsman/Parks 12" and 20" planer, the Craftsman/Parks 18" bandsaw, the Craftsman/Parks 10" and 12" radial saws, the somewhat rare swing saw and 12" disc sander, the King Seeley cabinet saw + drill presses and all the pedestal type machine bases.

While it did not feature the art deco 1/3 HP grinder from earlier (1948-1953), it did have the very nice 1/2 HP industrial grinder.

While Craftsman's reputation afterwards took a nose dive (along with most other major tool manufacturers) and there are still many people that will only see Craftsman as a sub-par, non-industrial maker of more flimsy tools (somewhat deserved), you could, at one point, fill an entire garage full of heavy duty, long lasting precision 'Craftsman' tools, and the 1956 Craftsman tool catalog could get you there. That is what I like to remember about Craftsman.

Barring some of the great tools from the 1940s (the Darra James 12" table saw, the 9" Atlas cabinet saw, drill presses and machine tool bases, the 1956 Catalog is my favorite catalog. I encourage you to check it out and read through it yourself. It provides a fascinating look at where Craftsman used to be 66 years ago. It can be found via PDF here:

http://vintagemachinery.org/pubs/detail.aspx?id=2122

Enjoy!

 

[Wingnut65]

Nice!

Now for the pix I promised. These are what were hiding in my Mom's garage. My Dad had these for years. I don't know the years on the RAS or toolbox, but I know you probably have all the answers, or someone does. Although not C'man, I know the drill appears to be from 1958.

I always thought the base was part of the saw, but clearly not. These have been mated for as long as I can remember back into the 60's.

This Sunbeam Drillmaster now resides in the Hideout. I will be restoring it sometime.

Before you ask, I don't know if the saw will end up at my place or not. If it does, I will need to get rid of the planer that I have or be very creative on workbench design.

 

[Red Leader]

Jeff, some very nice tools there. The radial saw does indeed point to the 1960s. Somewhere on it should be a tag (check the radial saw base that the column attaches to for a tag and there might be a date on there). Mind was on the left hand side, facing the saw.

It looks like it is in pristine condition and has the very nice cabinet along with it. If you don't take it, make sure it doesn't get dumped off at the scrapper - it would be a shame to lose one in such fine original condition. That chevron with the Craftsman crown logo is killer - don't let bluebolt see that one!!!

That top Craftsman toolbox is very nice as well and I would estimate it dates to the 1950s as the design is reminiscent of what I've seen in the 1950s Craftsman hand tool catalogs.

 

[bluebolt]

That chevron with the Craftsman crown logo is killer - don't let bluebolt see that one!!!

LOL luckily it's a long way away!

 

[Red Leader]

LOL luckily it's a long way away!

However, the underground vintage tool moving network is very enabling!

 

[bluebolt]

However, the underground vintage tool moving network is very enabling!

I know, there is a certain Craftsman metal lathe I am lusting after.

 

[american3.14guy]

Thanks to you and your thread, I am finding that the older stuff is longer lasting and easy to work on, let alone fix if need be!

 

[Red Leader]

Thanks to you and your thread, I am finding that the older stuff is longer lasting and easy to work on, let alone fix if need be!

That is what I find as well. Thanks!

 

[Red Leader]

So the warmer weather got me thinking about all kinds of fun projects that I have left in the 1950s Craftsman Garage. When I open up the garage and feel the warm air, it just makes me want to tackle every project at once!

Trust me, it won't be over for a long, LONG time. In fact, I've just gotten started. When I look out there, it definitely looks cluttered, but this is the basic plan, some of which will be happening soon:

I was thinking about Jacks garage and how he's mentioned a few times that it is basically or nearly done. Hmmm...so what is left on mine?

Grind floor
Epoxy coat floor (with flecks and stripe)
Install outside lights to then finish drywall inside garage
finish stripe on left hand size
install toolboard
put up toolboard fascia and trim
metal pegs for tool boards
make a small 'commonly used tools' board
redo first aid kit box and install
Hanging rack for ladder
pull down storage boxes under cabinet shelves
rope lighting around cabinet shelves
polished aluminum trim around cabinet shelves
print decals, apply to faceboard, then seal with poly
spray cabinet shelf post trim for shiny look
install speaker system in cabinet shelves
finish garage door opener switch and faceplate
patch holes for garage door opener line
install drop ceiling and fabricate ceiling tiles
install dust collection system hidden above drop ceiling going to each tool
install heater and finish gas line
paint garage door opener box cover
build car parts shelf in far left corner of garage and continue storage area
put tools on rolling bases
finish building art deco bases for workbench, including doors, shelves, paint and finish
finish building bench
finish bench (lacquer or tun oil or BLO)
route slot and install 50s diner style trim around bench
build and finish art deco workbench header, including chrome trim, lighting and custom fabrication (this will be a huge and time-consuming undertaking)
install drill press, vise, and grinder to workbench
build second workbench with fold-away tools (miter saw, small lathe, sander, table saw?)
install and finish table on second rolling bench
cut slot and install 50s diner style trim on second rolling bench
find/build/make shop stool
install magnifying light on workbench
install wall box and wire either to mp3 machine or ipod and hook up to speakers
finish cleaning outside and inside of toolbox and sort all sockets and misc tools
Build over the garage door drop down storage (still working on this one)
Find all the rare missing tools I'm looking for
Restore all the tools I have

Those are what I can think of off the top of my head, I'm sure there will be more. I know there have been some times that I've dropped off for a while and some folks have wondered if I was 'done' with the garage.

not even close!

Thanks for taking this crazy ride with me...there will be lots more to come.

 

[shopnut]

Looks almost as long as my darn task lists. Good luck!

 

[Wingnut65]

You win! That To-Do list takes the cake. And those are just the ones off the top of your head!!!? Wow! You may want to put this at the beginning of the trhead to keep track of it

Now you have to put them in order, meaning that some must be done before others can be started (build workbbench before mounting all the stull listed to it...)

Then it feels great to put the 'DONE' stamp next to each one.

Looking forward to watching this crazy ride continue...

BTW, I don't throw tools out, so the RAS will either come home or go to another caretaker.

 

[ckadams00]

That's a GOOD list.
Why sell the planer - do you have another one? Wondering because I have the same planer . . . .
Your CMan saw looks great. Mine is just starting to come back to life: check it out.

I think you have such a cool space . . . .

 

[Red Leader]

Why sell the planer - do you have another one?

By planer, do you mean jointer? If so...

I do

Even if it pains me a little to say it, the Craftsman just isn't going to win against this thing of beauty. When it is restored it will probably be one of if not the most beautiful tool in the garage. To me, it is the pinnacle of what made these old tools so great - solid, heavy duty, cast iron, made to last, and gorgeous styling.

If you meant the K2000 planer, I am planning to keep it, that is until I find the ultra rare Craftsman Belsaw planer from '56-'57. The Craftsman jointer will be heading out of the shop.

Oh, and thanks for your kind words. Your shop is turning out to be quite the vintage Craftsman palace. A man after my own heart