Small engine fuel line vs. "new" gas

[EdT]

Does anyone have a specific recommendation for fuel lines for two cycle engines. I have a chain saw and a blower which have both dissolved their fuel lines again. Changing them is a PITA and I thought maybe someone had a good suggestion for avoiding this problem again.
Thanks,
EdT

 

[Gary S]

My guess is that you likely are using gas with ethanol in it. Pure gas shouldn't cause this kind of problem.

 

[byoungblood]

My guess is that you likely are using gas with ethanol in it. Pure gas shouldn't cause this kind of problem.

Good luck trying to find pure gas in most parts of the country without either having to drive to the boonies or buy 91+ octane fuel.

If I were to ever become the benevolent dictator of this country, one of the first things I would do would be to ban the use of ethanol in motor fuel and dissolve the EPA.

 

[EvilWelder]

Been there done that, switched over to viton tubing from McMaster-Carr
http://www.mcmaster.com/#standard-plastic-and-rubber-tubing/=i3eids

 

[gReves]

http://www.stihlusa.com/lubricants/premixed-fuels.html

Problem solved. Cost about the same as a gallon of mixed gas and no ethanol.

 

[Skin]

Good luck trying to find pure gas in most parts of the country without either having to drive to the boonies or buy 91+ octane fuel.

Octane rating has nothing to do with ethanol content.

To the OP, buy better line. I'd wager you got something not meant for 2-cycle oil as thats generally what i see destroy fuel line that isnt meant for it (swells/turns gummy).

Problem solved. Cost about the same as a gallon of mixed gas and no ethanol.

Wow what 2-cycle oil do you buy? Those canned fuels are $8-$10 a quart.

 

[TDLMOMOWERS]

I use Tygon hose and haven't had a problem with New Gas. I also run Seafoam mixed with my gas. Stabil is supposed to counteract the effects of ethanol. Ethanol is very hard on carb. parts in small engines. Seafoam is available at most NAPA stores and it claims to counteract ethanol also. I know at the NAPA store where I work, we sell a ton of Seafoam to guys with antique cars.

 

[byoungblood]

Octane rating has nothing to do with ethanol content.

No, but in some states, laws have been passed to keep high octane fuels ethanol free for marine and aviation use (in both cases, ethanol is a big no-no) because it is produced in comparatively small quantities. Likewise, stations that choose to sell a single grade of ethanol free fuel voluentarily sell high octane because that's usually what is easier to obtain from the local blender.

When you get outside large cities that don't require special fuel blends, lower octane ethanol free gas is usually easier to find because it isn't as much of a headache for the blender to sell a few trucks of pure gas here and there.

But I have had fuel lines on both two and four stroke small engines become brittle and just break at the slightest touch after ethanol came around after running fine for years on regular gas.

 

[picshooter]

I have switched to recreational fuel for my lawn equipment, which gets a real workout here in Florida.
Here's a State by State list of stations that carry it:

http://pure-gas.org/index.jsp?stateprov=FL

 

[plinker]

No, but in some states, laws have been passed to keep high octane fuels ethanol free for marine and aviation use (in both cases, ethanol is a big no-no) because it is produced in comparatively small quantities. Likewise, stations that choose to sell a single grade of ethanol free fuel voluentarily sell high octane because that's usually what is easier to obtain from the local blender.

When you get outside large cities that don't require special fuel blends, lower octane ethanol free gas is usually easier to find because it isn't as much of a headache for the blender to sell a few trucks of pure gas here and there.

But I have had fuel lines on both two and four stroke small engines become brittle and just break at the slightest touch after ethanol came around after running fine for years on regular gas.

Up here, Most (95%) of the 91 octane gas does not contain ethanol. Mostly due to tourism and outdoor activites (boating, sno-mo's & such).

 

[theoldwizard1]

Does anyone have a specific recommendation for fuel lines for two cycle engines. I have a chain saw and a blower which have both dissolved their fuel lines again.

Odd. Usually it is the opposite. Fuel lines on small 2 strokes usually get brittle and crack.

 

[John Timmins]

I restore vintage Mercury outboard motors for a hobby. This picture shows some fitting I found that work and I bought them at a hydraulics place or Ace hardware - push on fittings with a barb. I posted the wrong picture on the left, so study the right picture.

The hose is fuel injector hose at NAPA outo parts, and they say it is ready for ethanol gas.

The prices I paid and part numbers for the fittings are also on this . I posted this picture on one of my Old Mercs postings.

I use no ethanol gas which costs about .50 more/gallon. I usually get 89 octane because that all they have. A big day on the water for me is 3 gallons so this is not expensive. Many times where I get it, there are yard service guys there getting 6-8 5 gallon jugs filled for all their mowers and leaf blowers etc. They said it is not worth the down time for repairs to use cheaper ethanol rated gas.

About my outboards....

They were originally designed to use a premix of 25:1 which is double the oil modern outboards use. Today's oils TWC-3 can be run in older outboards at 50:1 I've read, but I continue to run the old Super Hurricanes at 25:1. Some people run 40:1 in the race outboards.

The 100 octane LL Av Gas can to used with 50:1 in the older outboards although some people back off on the timing a little. I only tried it once and my plugs were WHITE and the pistons were perfectly clean. I am a little scared to use it, but many will only use 100LL in ANY 2 stroke.

Finally, I have checked out the Pure Gas web site. The Bunnell Fl gas station only had 112 LEADED Sunoco for no - eth gas. they have a big mud bog place out there with unlimited HP class !

 

[theoldwizard1]

Ethanol is very hard on carb. parts in small engines.

Okay, I have no documented proof to call BS, but neither due any of the nay sayers !

• It is getting harder and harder to find ethanol free fuel these days. Checking web sites, I can not find 1 in all of SE MI. E10 is here and it is not going away (and the government is trying to ram E15 down our throats) !
• All "rubber" parts used in fuel lines and carburetors for the past 30+ years are are safe for use with E10.
• The real problem with E10 is its tendency to "clean" your tank ! Any spec of varnish or anything else will get loosened up and travel into the carb where is will plugs things up for sure. My hobby is fixing old outdoor power equipment, much of it over 40 years old. If the carb is gummed up, it is because the tank is gummed up. On small engines, my rule is clean the tank, when you rebuild the carb. I know this is difficult on old cars and boats without removing the tank, but drain the fuel, and get the tank steam cleaned in place if you have to !

My hobby is fixing old outdoor power equipment, much of it over 40 years old. Anything over 20 years old should have the fuel line replaced because it is deteriorating from age !

If the carb is gummed up, it is because the tank is gummed up. On small engines, my rule is clean the tank, when you rebuild the carb. I know this is difficult on old cars and boats without removing the tank, but drain the fuel, and get the tank steam cleaned in place if you have to !

Don't get me wrong. I don't like E10, but for other reasons (government farm subsidies, using a food stock for fuel, cheaper for the fuel blender but not passed ob, marginally worse economy).

Now if you want to go fast and money is no object (funny how those 2 frequently come together) design, build and calibrate your engine to only run E85 ! The fuel economy will be terrible, but it will go fast.

 

[Knuckle Buster]

Good luck trying to find pure gas in most parts of the country without either having to drive to the boonies or buy 91+ octane fuel.

If I were to ever become the benevolent dictator of this country, one of the first things I would do would be to ban the use of ethanol in motor fuel and dissolve the EPA.

Amen. My Husqvarna says not to use 87 octane anyways. It says 91 or higher should be used to avoid engine damage, and must not contain more than 10% ethanol.

Also, I hear that ethanol fuel is not allowed in anything that flies in the air. Even if it will run on 87, it must be ethanol free no matter. That tells me ethanol shouldn't be used in anything I have.

We live in the sticks and do luckily have one station that offer you a choice. 87 octane that contains 10% ethanol is 3.19 per gallon, and the ethanol free 87 octane is 3.35. I pay 3.35 for my trucks, and a bit more for my Stihl & Husqvarna chainsaws.

 

[Ryf]

on my 2 cycle I buy the cans like were posted of premixed ethanol free gas, they carry it at my local parts store and walmart, so shouldn't be hard to get. best part is since I don't use much it and doesn't go bad as fast so it ends up saving me money, weedeater now starts on the third pull 99% of the time (assume the rest is me lol)

using this for fuel I would just use the clear fuel line they sell at an auto parts store. I think you need to buy up a grade or two, running whatever we have here I've never had those problems running mid grade or better.

 

[Knuckle Buster]

Interesting video from a boat mechanic.

And other small engines.

 

[ishiboo]

Amen. My Husqvarna says not to use 87 octane anyways. It says 91 or higher should be used to avoid engine damage, and must not contain more than 10% ethanol.

Also, I hear that ethanol fuel is not allowed in anything that flies in the air. Even if it will run on 87, it must be ethanol free no matter. That tells me ethanol shouldn't be used in anything I have.

We live in the sticks and do luckily have one station that offer you a choice. 87 octane that contains 10% ethanol is 3.19 per gallon, and the ethanol free 87 octane is 3.35. I pay 3.35 for my trucks, and a bit more for my Stihl & Husqvarna chainsaws.

We are insanely lucky I guess to be in the middle of millions of acres of corn, and have two local gas stations which sell ethanol-free 87 for the same price as all the surrounding stations sell E10!

 

[gReves]

Okay, I have no documented proof to call BS, but neither due any of the nay sayers !

• It is getting harder and harder to find ethanol free fuel these days. Checking web sites, I can not find 1 in all of SE MI. E10 is here and it is not going away (and the government is trying to ram E15 down our throats) !
• All "rubber" parts used in fuel lines and carburetors for the past 30+ years are are safe for use with E10.
• The real problem with E10 is its tendency to "clean" your tank ! Any spec of varnish or anything else will get loosened up and travel into the carb where is will plugs things up for sure. My hobby is fixing old outdoor power equipment, much of it over 40 years old. If the carb is gummed up, it is because the tank is gummed up. On small engines, my rule is clean the tank, when you rebuild the carb. I know this is difficult on old cars and boats without removing the tank, but drain the fuel, and get the tank steam cleaned in place if you have to !

My hobby is fixing old outdoor power equipment, much of it over 40 years old. Anything over 20 years old should have the fuel line replaced because it is deteriorating from age !

If the carb is gummed up, it is because the tank is gummed up. On small engines, my rule is clean the tank, when you rebuild the carb. I know this is difficult on old cars and boats without removing the tank, but drain the fuel, and get the tank steam cleaned in place if you have to !

Don't get me wrong. I don't like E10, but for other reasons (government farm subsidies, using a food stock for fuel, cheaper for the fuel blender but not passed ob, marginally worse economy).

Now if you want to go fast and money is no object (funny how those 2 frequently come together) design, build and calibrate your engine to only run E85 ! The fuel economy will be terrible, but it will go fast.

I dont have any pics to show you, but ethanol does corrode aluminum, especially cast aluminum and gums up rubber lines.
I'm a sthil tech and recently spent two days at the silver level training classes. Most of the discussion was customers using ethanol fuel in small engine power equipment and warranty claims on said carbs.
I have replaced many carbs and fuel lines on chain saws and weedeaters due to corrosion and gummed up jets. The gummy jets are from the small red rubber o-ring dissolving as well as fuel lines over time due to ethanol in the fuel.
Also working on getting a truck back going from sitting up for 4+ years. Pulled the fuel pump out today and the rubber line from pump to the metal line is fully dissolved. It looks like grease around the pump it has dissolved so much over the years from sitting in a half tank of e15 fuel.

People can think its all hype and talk, but I have seen the results of ethanol fuel first hand over and over

 

[TreePointer]

I also use Tygon tubing. My local small engine dealer/shop will sell me a length of it if I want to do install it myself. I've also purchased small lengths (instead of giant spools) from eBay.

 

[TreePointer]

http://www.stihlusa.com/lubricants/premixed-fuels.html

Problem solved. Cost about the same as a gallon of mixed gas and no ethanol.

Just to clarify, you mean that that ONE QUART can of Stihl premixed fuel costs as much as ONE GALLON of mixed gas. I see this as a great solution for someone who infrequently uses a 2-cycle engines. It certainly stores longer than ethanol-gasoline. I just recommended it to my brother who uses his chainsaw couple times a year in his backyard.

As for me, I sometimes can use well over a gallon a week, and paying 4X for the premixed fuel doesn't make good money sense.

 

[TheGrease]

Tygon is a good fuel line to use give it a try

 

[camarotoolman]

Just dump the remaining fuel when you are done weeding, cutting and run till its dry.

 

[EdT]

Thanks for all the feedback guys. I spoke with a friend of mine who is the manager of a big hardware where they deal with lots of small engines. He said to use ethanol free gas, add STABIL or something like that and the problem will be reduced. Problem with that is that I live in "greater Atlanta" and I'm pretty sure all the gas has ethanol in it (maybe not the premium). I will try Tygon in one engine and Viton in the other and see what works best. The viton is pretty pricey, but it doesn't take much. It would sure seem to be in the best interest of the manufacturers to use something that lasts longer than a season, or maybe not since to have the line fixed in a shop probably costs as much as a new weed whacker and that's what the manufacturers make.

 

[TreePointer]

I say forget about Sta-Bil and just use quality 2-cycle engine oil from a OPE manufacturer (Stihl, Husqvarna, Echo, etc.). That 2-cycle oil will say on the bottle that it already contains fuel stabilizer.

 

[byoungblood]

Also, I hear that ethanol fuel is not allowed in anything that flies in the air. Even if it will run on 87, it must be ethanol free no matter. That tells me ethanol shouldn't be used in anything I have.

That is correct. It won't cause any immediate damage, however the STCs for motor fuel do not allow for ethanol because it attacks rubber and its propensity to absorb moisture can cause cause corrosion in the tanks and lines.

We live in the sticks and do luckily have one station that offer you a choice. 87 octane that contains 10% ethanol is 3.19 per gallon, and the ethanol free 87 octane is 3.35. I pay 3.35 for my trucks, and a bit more for my Stihl & Husqvarna chainsaws.

There is a station a few miles away from here that has ethanol free 87 available, but it is just out of the way for anything but filling up the gas cans for my small engines. I wish it were on the way to work as I'd gladly pay the extra amount for pure fuel.