Breaker box height

[Dave Maxwell]

I have a copy of the 2011 nec and its hard to maneuver through to say the least. What height does my breaker box need to be from floor? Also with the power coming up through the floor. Do I bring the power in through the bottom and bring the wires around to the top or bring the conduit up and around to the top? 200 amp. 200 plus foot run. Thanks

 

[EOC_Jason]

There's a certain height "tolerance" I forget what it is off the top of my head.

You can bring the power in from any side of the box (except the front of course) and run them around to the top. If you can work the conduit somehow to make it come in from the top you will be saving room in the box and also the pain on having to make a U bend in heavy gauge wires...

 

[matt151617]

Maximum of 6' 7" from the floor to the main breaker. That's from the 2008 codes.

I would bring conduit into the large cutout on the bottom. There's plenty of room to run the wires to the top in a 200 amp panel.

 

[Alchymist]

Bring it in from the bottom. If you run conduit up and around, 2 things happen -
1) you wind up fighting the heavy wire through the bends, worse than bending it in the box,
2) the conduit gets in the way of the individual runs on one side of the box.

JMHO, also looks neater.

 

[Gooch]

Bottom feed the panel with the MB/ML on the bottom? Unless you purchased one of the very few with a MB that operates vertical instead of horizontal.

I usually try to stick with the top of the panel(i.e. the box, not breaker) at 6' 6" AFF. but last i recall code allowed the highest breaker to be at 6'7" or 6'6", can't remember which.

 

[Speedy Petey]

Maximum of 6' 7" from the floor to the main breaker. That's from the 2008 codes.

It's 6'7" to the highest breaker handle.
There is NO minimum height.


Definitely mount the panel "breaker down". NO REASON at all to have the breaker at the top when bottom feeding. Hasn't been for quite a few years as Gooch alluded to. I haven't seen a standard residential main breaker panel with an up/down breaker in a long time.

 

[Falcon67]

I mounted mine with top of the box just about eye level. That was a confortable work height and high enough not to be bothered by much.

 

[Dave Maxwell]

Do they make a box with main on bottom

 

[trainer]

My box was installed upside -down with the main on the bottom. It's not like the electrons are going to spill out...
I've also seen them mounted on thiier sides.

 

[Norcal]

My box was installed upside -down with the main on the bottom. It's not like the electrons are going to spill out...
I've also seen them mounted on thiier sides.

It's not "upside down" when the main is on the bottom if the loadcenter is made to reverse the interior, In Canada it's permitted to mount panels sideways, it's forbidden by the NEC in the states. See 240.81, when a circuit breaker is mounted vertical, as they would be in a sideways mounted panel, "ON" must be the "UP" position, that is the reason why where the NEC is in effect, it cannot be done.

 

[Charles (in GA)]

Definitely mount the panel "breaker down". NO REASON at all to have the breaker at the top when bottom feeding. Hasn't been for quite a few years as Gooch alluded to. I haven't seen a standard residential main breaker panel with an up/down breaker in a long time.

Most GE panelboards use vertical operating main breakers. They are actually four individual breakers ganged together and riveted together to make one main, with a big long handle tie.

Charles

 

[Charles (in GA)]

That 6 ft 7 inch number (two meters) is actually part of that "dedicated space" and "working space" that the code requires, 30 inches wide, and from the floor to two meters in height, nothing else is supposed to be mounted in that area (such as phone junction boxes, cable TV connections, etc.

Charles

 

[jvitez]

For interest sake, the Canadian Electrical Code states that a panel should be mounted "as high as possible" but with no breaker higher than 1.7m which is 67", not 6 ft. 7 inches, from the finished floor. If the main breaker is at the bottom, then the top branch-circuit breaker space is just under 67".

 

[Dave Maxwell]

Thanks everyone. I just assumed they didn't want the words upside down. Wasn't sure how picky they were

 

[Charles (in GA)]

Thanks everyone. I just assumed they didn't want the words upside down. Wasn't sure how picky they were

In virtually every case where its OK to install a panel either way, the wording is either positioned so that no matter which way is up, its sideways, or the words stamped into the metal, such as MAIN are stamped both ways.

Make doubly sure that however you install the panel, that all breakers either work sideways, left to right or right to left, or if vertical operation, that UP is ON and Down is OFF.

Charles

 

[Jefe]

Most GE panelboards use vertical operating main breakers. They are actually four individual breakers ganged together and riveted together to make one main, with a big long handle tie.

Charles

Maybe you meant to say they have horizontal operating main breakers? As in you push them side to side to operate and the box can be installed with the breaker on top or bottom.

 

[Speedy Petey]

Do they make a box with main on bottom

Like I said, there is NO top or bottom on most new panels.

 

[Speedy Petey]

Most GE panelboards use vertical operating main breakers. They are actually four individual breakers ganged together and riveted together to make one main, with a big long handle tie.

Charles

Do they still make/sell that design??
I haven't bought a new GE panel in years.

 

[Speedy Petey]

That 6 ft 7 inch number (two meters) is actually part of that "dedicated space" and "working space" that the code requires, 30 inches wide, and from the floor to two meters in height, nothing else is supposed to be mounted in that area (such as phone junction boxes, cable TV connections, etc.

I was thinking more along these lines:

404.8 Accessibility and Grouping.

(A) Location. All switches and circuit breakers used as switches shall be located so that they may be operated from a readily accessible place. They shall be installed such that the center of the grip of the operating handle of the switch or circuit breaker, when in its highest position, is not more than 2.0 m (6 ft 7 in.) above the floor or working platform.

 

[Charles (in GA)]

Maybe you meant to say they have horizontal operating main breakers? As in you push them side to side to operate and the box can be installed with the breaker on top or bottom.

Nope, never seen a GE panelboard like that before. All the ones I've seen recently in the big box stores work vertically, not like that.

Charles

 

[jjpp]

So just to be crystal clear I can mount my panel with the main at the bottom?? I don't want to do it that way to only find out that the main needs to be at the top and end up without enough wire to reach the main.

 

[Speedy Petey]

So just to be crystal clear I can mount my panel with the main at the bottom?? I don't want to do it that way to only find out that the main needs to be at the top and end up without enough wire to reach the main.

As long as the main (and all) breaker moves side-to-side.

 

[jjpp]

Thanks, I just wanted to be absolutely sure.

 

[IONH]

Thank you Charles. You just answered a question about upgrading my current breaker box (30 amp no main breaker) to a larger one when I run some larger wire. I have just over 3 feet between the 36" door (which opens into the garage toward the corner) and the corner.

 

[Charles (in GA)]

I highly recommend the book I took the shots of. It is "Illustrated Guide to the National Electric Code" by Charles R. Miller. It has code references on each page, and so you buy it and the NEC itself and you can see the pics and explanations and go to the code book for the full text. Makes it all fit together. Last code book I bought was spiral bound version. Thought it would be better than the standard paperback version as it would lay flat. Not really better however, its a pain to flip pages on the spiral bound version.

You can buy this on Amazon, but the two books together are about $120 or more now. I have 2005, 2008 and 2011.

Charles

 

[Charles (in GA)]

Thanks, I just wanted to be absolutely sure.

If this is being inspected, you had better check with the inspector before you mount the panel. Some inspectors think it looks trashy to mount the panel "upside down" and won't allow it, or think its not legal, anyhow, clarify with them that its OK, making sure they understand that all breakers work horizontal and you don't have any vertical breakers to violate the rules.

Charles

 

[IONH]

I highly recommend the book I took the shots of. It is "Illustrated Guide to the National Electric Code" by Charles R. Miller. It has code references on each page, and so you buy it and the NEC itself and you can see the pics and explanations and go to the code book for the full text. Makes it all fit together. Last code book I bought was spiral bound version. Thought it would be better than the standard paperback version as it would lay flat. Not really better however, its a pain to flip pages on the spiral bound version.

You can buy this on Amazon, but the two books together are about $120 or more now. I have 2005, 2008 and 2011.

Okay, the cost to buy the 2011 book is about $63 on Amazon with free shipping, pretty good.

How easy is it to find what you are looking for in the book if you are not an electrician? What type of index or glossary is there for navigation purposes?

One of the Amazon reviews said it was difficult to navigate and that it is meant for either electricians or people studying to be an electrician.

 

[keating]

That's the exact panel installed the the house I just bought, built in 2006.
Mine is installed the other way 'round, with the main breaker at the bottom.
I don't take possession until Sept 21, but I'm planning now for the sub-panel to feed the garage.
This place was the only home we looked at that had a 200 Amp service installed.

Nope, never seen a GE panelboard like that before. All the ones I've seen recently in the big box stores work vertically, not like that.

Charles

 

[Speedy Petey]

If this is being inspected, you had better check with the inspector before you mount the panel. Some inspectors think it looks trashy to mount the panel "upside down" and won't allow it, or think its not legal, anyhow, clarify with them that its OK, making sure they understand that all breakers work horizontal and you don't have any vertical breakers to violate the rules.

Charles

Seriously???
Have you ever had to "clarify" this very basic code section? If an inspector ever tried to enforce something because he thought it "looked trashy" I'd immediately go over his head. It wouldn't even be worth trying to reason with someone like that.