Giving my DeLorean VD

[Dickey]

For those unaware, DeLoreans do not have vented discs for their brakes. The rotors they get from the factory are reminiscent of vinyl 45s and will pretty much warp after about 10 miles of mildly spirited driving. So far as I have observed, the hardest DeLorean owners typically pedal their cars can best be described as "aggressive commuting" so this isn't an issue most of us. As a bonus the pads are tiny too and even with premo fluid brake fade occurs after about three miles at a place like Deal's Gap. Thankfully, all of the oem parts are retarded expensive.


So I spent $300 and a few weekends working on this:

My expectation is that what I have subsituted is dramatic overkill compared to what was previously in place. I have to add a lip to the lower control arm, make the upper control arm extend out about another inch and the do the requisite cleaning and painting...but I expect the passenger side will go a bit quicker since I already have the measurements I need and my free time is not being taxed with divorce shenanigans.

That said; I'm sharing what I have done so far in case I'm committing an egregious faux paux in fabrication. I have welded spring perches and frame mounting points before so I'm not entirely green at performing this kind of work though once I have the LCA completed, I intend to see if two tons of force at the outer edge will deform the arm or demonstrate any flaws in the welds. I'm also going to see about twisting it a bit for the same reasons. I don't imagine the car will come across anything quite like that in daily use but I want to put that out there in case I'm mistaken.

The new addition is a quarter inch plate up top and 1/8th inch around the sides. It is welded inside and out to the LCA and the lip that I do will also extend underneath the factory stamped lip. As best I can measure, the lower ball joint is easily within 1/16th of an inch of center where the original was though the upper needs to move out about 1/2" to accomodate the new spindle. I opted not to make the caster adjustable but the updates to the upper control arm will allow for camber adjustments. Toe is the only thing adjustable from the factory.

Anyway, feel free to rip me a new one if you see a legimate problem with my approach but please do me the kindness of telling me the what and why about it too. If I just wanted to get picked on and insulted I'd have stayed married, hehe.

 

[TeckniX]

Sweetness is all I got for you. Keep us posted on progress, although I'm surprised you couldn't get some factory stuff from other cars to adapt more easily to it.
I don't know anything about LCA strength, angles and all that, but I'll keep up on the reading of this.

looking around found this bit, it may help:
http://www.deloreaneurotec.co.uk/forum/viewtopic.php?f=32&t=1370&start=30

 

[Dickey]

Sweetness is all I got for you. Keep us posted on progress, although I'm surprised you couldn't get some factory stuff from other cars to adapt more easily to it.
I don't know anything about LCA strength, angles and all that, but I'll keep up on the reading of this.

Such parts are available, but not from cars that are readily available in the States. With what I've got, I'm able to buy easy to find Miata parts that will clear a 14" wheel while maintaining the 4x100 bolt pattern and lug threading. When Mazda developed their 1st gen Miata they put a lot of their budget into the suspension and brake design.

 

[TeckniX]

I was going to say Miata or Nissan 240sx - Seems that parts are cheap and heaps of upgrades available

 

[FastKat]

I just put these vented rotors together to replace the solid rotors on my XJ6. I ordered everything separate. I have less than $400 in this pair of rotors delivered to my door and I didn't do any of the real work - only put the bolts on. The only real work I had to do was the caliper spacers.

http://www.buyrcars.com/jag.htm#ventedrotors

Wow... I just found some pictures of Delorean calipers and they look a lot like my Jaguar calipers.

 

[Dickey]

I'm pretty sure the rear calipers on the DMC are mid 80's XJ6. A lot of the components for the car were off the shelf. Just off of European shelves which still puts me in a spot wanting easy to source robust components.

The stock front calipers are from something called a Mercury Capri. I've read about this car but I have never seen one in person. Parts for them at Autozone and the like are even less common than DMC fare.

Also, I had to fit all of this under a 14" wheel in order to retain the stock rims. As I recall the Jaguar setup required a 15" rim though admittedly I went through a world of stuff, and may be misremembering, when I was making a decision on which parts to use.

 

[FastKat]

Wow. The Mercury Capri was a very small car - probably had small brakes too!

BTW, when I read the title, "vented discs" was not the first thing that came to mind!

 

[03protege]

I'm pretty sure the rear calipers on the DMC are mid 80's XJ6. A lot of the components for the car were off the shelf. Just off of European shelves which still puts me in a spot wanting easy to source robust components.

The stock front calipers are from something called a Mercury Capri. I've read about this car but I have never seen one in person. Parts for them at Autozone and the like are even less common than DMC fare.

Also, I had to fit all of this under a 14" wheel in order to retain the stock rims. As I recall the Jaguar setup required a 15" rim though admittedly I went through a world of stuff, and may be misremembering, when I was making a decision on which parts to use.

The second gen Capri is the same as a Ford fox body mustang.

The third gen Capri is the same chassis as the 90-94 Mazda protege or 323 hatchback. Even had a Mazda motor.

If it uses parts of the first gen Capri I cannot help you.

 

[Dickey]

Yeah, the first gen one that was made in Germany. They quit importing them here a few years before DMC rolled out its first car but were readily available at the time in Ireland.

If I remember to, I'll snap a picture of the factory setup that I removed. It does not inspire confidence.

 

[racingtadpole]

Looks solid but I would have gone down a different road. I think I would have been inclined to have some top hats made and fitted the car out with aftermarket rotors and calipers. Im guessing not as cheap but it would be reversible if you decided to sell the car.

 

[JamieK]

There are companies that sell 4 pot calipers and drilled rotors for Deloreans. Or, you could had a custom vented rotor made that would work in place of the original. Would have been easier, and less risky, then modifing the control arms.

 

[Dickey]

I'm not convinced it would have been easier though I am aware of the current dmc vendors and their offerings. None of those options addressed the availability and simplicity details that I prioritized.

My primary concern here was explicitly related to the fabrication steps I employed to arrive at my solution. I may not have made that clear in my original post and I apologize.

 

[FastKat]

My primary concern here was explicitly related to the fabrication steps I employed to arrive at my solution. I may not have made that clear in my original post and I apologize.

No need to apologize - it's pretty common around here to add your $.02 and get advice you might not have anticipated.

From what I can tell, it looks way overbuilt, but as long as you didn't add an absurd amount of weight, it should work great. Generally it's much better to over-build than under-build. I think I might have upgraded the brakes in a different way, but what you did seems solid and if it works you should be proud of it!

 

[Ksullivan]

This is an awesome upgrade to a really cool iconic car! Prop's on jumping right in and going for it! Can't wait to see some updated pics!

 

[SlappyWhite]

Seems a bit heavy handed to me. With a little more effort you could adapt a spindle that bolts up and a caliper mount the bolts up to use an old school cheap *** GM/Ford disk that is vented and made for 14" rims and machined to your bolt pattern.

Just need a machinist willing to put some effort into making some money off of the DMC guys. Yours is the first, everyone after that is cash in the bank. This exact thing has been done for all kinds of cars but they are usually trying to put monster brakes on old stuff. I can see why a small number production car with small brakes is not getting attention, you just have to define the market.

 

[e-tek]

GREAT title, car and project!! The writings pretty good too!

I believe the Mercury Capri's were available in Canada. Sounds very familiar.

On a side note, I find it a bit sad you had to put this rider in your OP: "but please do me the kindness of telling me the what and why about it too. If I just wanted to get picked on and insulted I'd have stayed married, hehe", but it does seem to have kept the UEWNRA's at bay!!!

 

[Dickey]

No need to apologize - it's pretty common around here to add your $.02 and get advice you might not have anticipated.

From what I can tell, it looks way overbuilt, but as long as you didn't add an absurd amount of weight, it should work great. Generally it's much better to over-build than under-build. I think I might have upgraded the brakes in a different way, but what you did seems solid and if it works you should be proud of it!

As best I can tell, the unsprung weight is reduced by about a pound. I'll be weighing everything after it is all said and done to be certain.

Seems a bit heavy handed to me. With a little more effort you could adapt a spindle that bolts up and a caliper mount the bolts up to use an old school cheap *** GM/Ford disk that is vented and made for 14" rims and machined to your bolt pattern.

Just need a machinist willing to put some effort into making some money off of the DMC guys. Yours is the first, everyone after that is cash in the bank. This exact thing has been done for all kinds of cars but they are usually trying to put monster brakes on old stuff. I can see why a small number production car with small brakes is not getting attention, you just have to define the market.

The factory DMC balljoints are very sad looking creations. Literally, the tapered shafts are not as large as the RX7 tie rod shafts and I have not ever personally seen any vehicle with as uninspiring suspension components as the DeLorean. The S1 Esprit is a close second though. I don't think you will find a spindle off of anything that is commonplace in the states that can situate itself on the factory DMC control arms.

I do agree with you on using domestic parts though and in fact I chose the Mazda spindles explicitly because they use a Ford taper. That's why I have the mustang ii ball joints. They fit the spindle out of the box and bolt onto whatever. No custom machining of hubs/rotors required. $25 gets you a brand new rotor at Autozone. My race/wrench experience with n/a Miatas also contributed to my spindle selection.

I may be mistaken but I'd venture this is not the kind of update that would be sought after by the DMC crowd. Last I was involved with that group they maintained a fairly polarized view on the sancitity of the marquee. It has been some years since but I'd wager they have still not realized the irony of such a stance.

GREAT title, car and project!! The writings pretty good too!

I believe the Mercury Capri's were available in Canada. Sounds very familiar.

On a side note, I find it a bit sad you had to put this rider in your OP: "but please do me the kindness of telling me the what and why about it too. If I just wanted to get picked on and insulted I'd have stayed married, hehe", but it does seem to have kept the UEWNRA's at bay!!!

Thank you. The exclusion at the end was just to help keep things above board. I don't mind being told I'm wrong when I'm told why, even if I don't agree. The fabrication and testing steps I outlined were my concern for posting here.

As it is, most every suggestion so far has explicitly been in regards to my direction and served only to validate my decision based on the requirements I have for the project. As soon as someone uses the word "custom" in an alternative solution I know that I did well for myself. I made a very deliberate effort to use "common" pieces to suit my personal taste. Literally, the spindles, calipers, new rotors, new pads, new ball joints and new tie rod ends cost me around $290. I had to ream the upper spindle mounts a bit to match the lower and retap the tie rod ends to 1/2"-20, but those are the kind of tools I have in the box.

 

[Dickey]

Well, I've had some time to put some miles on the update and I've got to say I'm very happy with the results. Since having the car back on the road, I've run it down I-77 for about 50 miles from Chester to Columbia...which for those who are unfamiliar with the stretch, is rough to say the least. I figured 70mph for the duration was enough to find any problem areas and the like if my bench testing proved unreliable. To date, the only issue I've had is the driver's side caliper seizing from a rusted slide bolt the other day. That blued the rotor and forced me to sand the pads.

I even took more pictures:

 

[SCscoutguy]

You know to be such a rare car I see them a good bit around here. I saw one just this weekend at the Lowes here in Florence. Do you know if there is a club here in SC for them?

 

[Dickey]

I don't know of a specific local club for them. The closest such thing that I'm aware is the South East DeLorean Owners Club but they are mostly around Atlanta. I usually only meet owners in person when they bring me their car to wrench on. It avoids them a trip down to Atlanta or Bonita Springs, FL.

 

[racingtadpole]

Nicely finished. And as added bonus it stops heaps better too Nice work

 

[JMcFly]

Very cool, just dont go posting it on the DML or they will piss and moan how you "ruined" an OEM control arm...

I never thought about getting vented discs for my DMC, but it never actually ran.

 

[Dickey]

Very cool, just dont go posting it on the DML or they will piss and moan how you "ruined" an OEM control arm...

I never thought about getting vented discs for my DMC, but it never actually ran.

No kidding, hehe.

I'll never understand why people take such a car as seriously as the US DMC crowd does. I stop in on a UK forum from time to time; they poke fun at the car and don't have an issue with seeing the cars modded at all.

You would not believe the grief I caught when I converted over to a Rochester 2gc carburetor back in '06. That was just a quick weld up a manifold then bolt it in place affair that I did because it only took me two weekends and $400 to put the car back on the road. The car had noticeably more power and got 27mpg on a trip to Atlanta and back so I sold the OEM **** and posted my findings. I was flatly told that my car was worthless compared to a non-running example that was completely stock. If they saw something like what I've just done with the suspension there might be burnt effigies involved.