Waekon patent infringement on Loadpro

[MrMark]

bad grounds cause crazy stuff to happen.

The Sullivan device tests both sides of the circuit B+ and B- on the initial test that you see where he plugs into the connector putting the 25 ohm replacement load where the real load was. You need to do some further testing to see whether the B+ path or the B- path has the bad connection or wire (added unaccounted for resistance).

You could do the same thing by putting your test light (the replacement load) where the volt pro leads are connected and then putting your multimeter across the test light to see if any system voltage was dropped other than across the load where it is supposed to be. So, if the system v is 12.6 if you see less than 12.6 across that light the missing voltage was dropped somewhere else in the circuit that it shouldn't have been. If you add 50 ohms, for example, it would drop the voltage across the load down to around 4 volts.

Sullivan's invention, if it holds up, is the clever way he incorporated a load test with voltmeter.

 

[Dan_Sullivan]

I empathize with Dan Sullivan's situation and wish him good fortune. I bought his book and his Loadpro leads so that's about all I can do. Honestly I haven't found them all that useful, but I can see how they could be very useful in many situations. If his patent has been infringed then I hope justice eventually prevails.

I'm a pin-headed engineer myself, but I've never been disrespectful to a technician, much less called them names like "jackass" or "idiot." Where I work that would get me fired. Furthermore I don't know any engineers who behave like that - generally we listen to and learn from technicians and get valuable help from them. You can't be a successful engineer by habitually treating technicians or customers like they're inferior. Only doctors can get away with that.

On the other hand, pin-headed engineers sometimes treat salesmen and businessmen like they're misguided or self-serving. For example, a salesman might say a product is a "piece of ****" without a clear explanation of why, or that test lights are useless 1950s technology, or that 80% of all circuit faults are in the wiring without any real evidence of that. From experience we learn to be very skeptical of these sorts of statements and occasionally question them rudely, which annoys the people making them. Still, I wouldn't call such a person an idiot, or a, um, pin head.

There are days when I'm as much a pin-head as anyone else might be, and I find it annoying to have to admit. I agree that such an overt generalization isn't fair, and to those engineers who have a clue about the value of a tech's abilities and skills, I apologize. I would argue however that this tool and method are guaranteed to work because of Kirchoff's and Ohm's Law, and the uncountable number of engineers who've told me that the tool doesn't work, means that there's something going on here that is wholly illogical.

When I asked for about 200 of the original tools back from the engineers I'd sent them to for evaluation, asking also for a technical explanation of the denial, no one sent me a technical report detailing the tool's failure, and no one returned them. That taught me something.

As an engineer, I'd ask you your honest opinion of a tool that can rewrite a 47 step, 7 page diagnostic procedure for ONE 1P2T relay, as 1 page and 6 steps - as it relates to the current methodology and the number of engineers required to write the revised procedure. It never was technical - it was always personal...

 

[Toolhorder]

There are days when I'm as much a pin-head as anyone else might be, and I find it annoying to have to admit. I agree that such an overt generalization isn't fair, and to those engineers who have a clue about the value of a tech's abilities and skills, I apologize. I would argue however that this tool and method are guaranteed to work because of Kirchoff's and Ohm's Law, and the uncountable number of engineers who've told me that the tool doesn't work, means that there's something going on here that is wholly illogical.

When I asked for about 200 of the original tools back from the engineers I'd sent them to for evaluation, asking also for a technical explanation of the denial, no one sent me a technical report detailing the tool's failure, and no one returned them. That taught me something.

As an engineer, I'd ask you your honest opinion of a tool that can rewrite a 47 step, 7 page diagnostic procedure for ONE 1P2T relay, as 1 page and 6 steps - as it relates to the current methodology and the number of engineers required to write the revised procedure. It never was technical - it was always personal...

I'm plenty happy with my PP3 but I have your probe and book on my amazon wish list. I'm willing to give it a try. I noticed on IATN a lot of guys didn't like it but I'll keep an open mind.

 

[Dan_Sullivan]

I'm plenty happy with my PP3 but I have your probe and book on my amazon wish list. I'm willing to give it a try. I noticed on IATN a lot of guys didn't like it but I'll keep an open mind.

I heard. But, the CAT, VOlvo and UPS part numbers trump a bunch of guys who enjoy dumping on things at times. I'll be the first to admit my leads have limits; I just don't understand the "logic" of NOT wanting to be able to instantly load a circuit without having to think about it. My downfall was assuming everyone would simply jump on board when they saw it, and it would sell itself. Boy was I wrong. It's been a weird 13 years and I don't think it's going to settle down any time soon.

BTW - did you watch the video I did showing the PP3 failure modes?

 

[GeneralDisorder]

BTW - did you watch the video I did showing the PP3 failure modes?

Link?

A big part of the problem is that a LOT of technicians go through the motions of following a diagnostic procedural outline written by some engineer without understanding the circuit they are troubleshooting. This leads to the obvious result of them not understanding the use of the LoadPro test leads.

I was a generator technician (52D) in the Army and then subsequently an industrial machinery technician and now own my own auto shop. I'm extremely blessed to have had education on how to READ SCHEMATICS and figure out what the circuit does and how. I don't ever use troubleshooting procedures - which means the LoadPro gets used and it's value is apparent.

Until you can get the engineers to adopt the tool (or a generic voltage drop test using a substitute load) as part of their procedures you will simply not access a huge number of tech's. They will never understand unless you can reach them on a level beyond the procedures or write the tool into the procedures.

GD

 

[signcrafter]

I heard. But, the CAT, VOlvo and UPS part numbers trump a bunch of guys who enjoy dumping on things at times. I'll be the first to admit my leads have limits; I just don't understand the "logic" of NOT wanting to be able to instantly load a circuit without having to think about it. My downfall was assuming everyone would simply jump on board when they saw it, and it would sell itself. Boy was I wrong. It's been a weird 13 years and I don't think it's going to settle down any time soon.

BTW - did you watch the video I did showing the PP3 failure modes?

Dan, it seems like you are trying to compare your loadpro to a powerprobe and pick which one is better. My opinion having both of them is they are two totally different tools and I use them both, just in different situations. But it seems like you want people to pick one or the other? When actually both have a place in the toolbox. The PPIII is great for certain things and the loadpro is great for what it does. Your right that your loadpro tests in ways the PP doesn't.

Link?

GD

 

[MrMark]

The thing about the loadpro that concerns me is the danger of it on computer driver circuits and 5V reference signals. Most people using it have no idea about the circuit design or the draw of the circuit. The loadpro is going to draw about .5 amp minimum on a 12V circuit. Thus, it is NOT computer safe. It draws MORE than a test light (test light is about .3 amps), which is not allowed by manf on computer circuits. It certainly should not be used on 5V circuits. It's fine on a horn or a light but what else? The load resistor is LOW - why so low? Why not 200 ohms? Why not have a switchable load to make the device more useful/safe in the right hands?

In fact a test light across the connector as the load with the multimeter connected across the test light is far safer than this tool.

 

[MrMark]

Link?

A big part of the problem is that a LOT of technicians go through the motions of following a diagnostic procedural outline written by some engineer without understanding the circuit they are troubleshooting. This leads to the obvious result of them not understanding the use of the LoadPro test leads.

I was a generator technician (52D) in the Army and then subsequently an industrial machinery technician and now own my own auto shop. I'm extremely blessed to have had education on how to READ SCHEMATICS and figure out what the circuit does and how. I don't ever use troubleshooting procedures - which means the LoadPro gets used and it's value is apparent.

Until you can get the engineers to adopt the tool (or a generic voltage drop test using a substitute load) as part of their procedures you will simply not access a huge number of tech's. They will never understand unless you can reach them on a level beyond the procedures or write the tool into the procedures.

GD

I think he's arguing that the PPIII will give a positive on power or ground with very high resistance in the circuit, which is true. But, that doesn't mean it is isn't a useful tool. It just means that you have to realize its limits and if you have a suspect circuit you have to do further checking on the quality of the connections and integrity of the wire.

 

[GeneralDisorder]

The LoadPro comes with a warning to the effect that it should not be used on circuits powered or grounded through a solid state (computerized) control unit. The load is too great (resistance too small) and can damage such circuits.

That's not what its intended for and in any case those circuits are not as commonly subject to corrosion as they are generally better protected and often are using shielded or twisted pair wiring and high levels of environmental protection. For such circuits a real ohm test of the wiring end-to-end has to be performed. But those types of situation represent a small (but growing) percentage of circuit troubleshooting.

GD

 

[MrMark]

ohm test on such wires doesn't always work and/or is not dependable. That relies on the small multimeter current to power the circuit. You need to do a traditional load test with the circuit powered and the multimeter across the wire.

 

[GeneralDisorder]

Yes in many cases that would be required. This doesn't often crop up though because if the wire can handle the DMM current without dropping anything chances are that its going to handle the real load also. But yes there is a range of load sizes where the DMM is too small and the LoadPro is too large. It would be nice to have an adjustable load for such situations. But it wouldn't be a mindlessly usable tool.

GD

 

[Dan_Sullivan]

The thing about the loadpro that concerns me is the danger of it on computer driver circuits and 5V reference signals. Most people using it have no idea about the circuit design or the draw of the circuit. The loadpro is going to draw about .5 amp minimum on a 12V circuit. Thus, it is NOT computer safe. It draws MORE than a test light (test light is about .3 amps), which is not allowed by manf on computer circuits. It certainly should not be used on 5V circuits. It's fine on a horn or a light but what else? The load resistor is LOW - why so low? Why not 200 ohms? Why not have a switchable load to make the device more useful/safe in the right hands?

In fact a test light across the connector as the load with the multimeter connected across the test light is far safer than this tool.

No - it's not more dangerous. The load is 40mA per volt, so we're fine on all computer sensor drivers. Do the math on 5V and 8V. We've tested it on innumerable ECMs; we actually found a manufacturing problem on a GM ECM that they didn't know about on a 5V driver. Some techs have also figured out how to use the tool as a substitute sender on such systems as rheostats/thermistors and also fuel level senders.

One tech in Illinois has used the tool successfully on all of his bus systems, including PLCs. The tool cannot harm sensor drivers, so there is NO concern there. In addition, because we're using the fully passive voltmeter, and we have a load in the tool, the MAXIMUM load will be 40mA/V. Corrosion is a series resistance. Ohm's Law can't fail, so the only thing one needs to apply is the age-old concept of holding your mouth right and grunting as you fine tune your thresholds for failure on your equipment in your environment. In Syracuse NY their's is about 0.6-0.8 V.

The question I must ask is this: If you're given the opportunity to immediately load a circuit using a completely safe tool, using existing OEM diagnostic instructions, and identify all three faults with improved meter reading - AND - do it without having to think about it, why wouldn't you?

What people are having the hardest time appreciating - for some reason - is that this tool closes the circle on meter reading and simply makes a voltage reading make sense. If the World had been introduced to this tool 25 years ago as a "normal" function when digital meters first surfaced, we wouldn't be having this argument.

Say what you will about the tool, and criticize me all you want - BUT - if one argues against voltage drop testing made insanely simple and instantaneous and affordable, then that person is obviously completely unfamiliar with the problem.

 

[MrMark]

Your biggest problem is that you are overselling this tool of yours. It's an interesting tool with some limited purpose; it is not the be all of testing. It's really not. People have been doing voltage drop and load testing with multimeters since the beginning of time. That is as old as dirt. You came up with a neat way to nest a load test in a voltmeter lead and I appreciate that.

I understand how you can get emotionally attached to something but that is your problem as I see it. When I can make your tool in about 30 minutes from scraps or simply use a test light or any bulb to replace your lead and put my meter across that when I need it you are not going to have a world beater on your hands. And, despite what you may claim (although apparently your directions regarding computer safety state otherwise) it's not computer safe at those current levels. They are more than test lights (substantially more) that are not allowed. Perhaps anecdotally you haven't blown anything up yet that you know about but who really wants to take that chance when the manf say no?

 

[Danglerb]

I suspect after 13 years of daily use and feedback from other users that Dan can do stuff with the loadpro so fast, and so well, it would make your head spin, so it IS a magic wand in his hands. Most of the techs I know hate electrical work, hate trouble shooting, so are never going to get that excited about the subject or any tool related to it.

I have a Centech "tribute" to the power probe, and those are the guys I would worry about knocking off a copy of the loadpro.

 

[pfarber]

I can only offer two more words of advice:

SHARK TANK

Bring women in bikini's

You're Welcome.

 

[MrMark]

I suspect after 13 years of daily use and feedback from other users that Dan can do stuff with the loadpro so fast, and so well, it would make your head spin, so it IS a magic wand in his hands. Most of the techs I know hate electrical work, hate trouble shooting, so are never going to get that excited about the subject or any tool related to it.

I have a Centech "tribute" to the power probe, and those are the guys I would worry about knocking off a copy of the loadpro.

I'm sure he can do voltage drops fast; but making my head spin? I doubt it. Aren't we talking about the first day of the first class of EE and the sum of the voltages in a circuit equals zero?

The problem I have with Mr. Sullivan are the ridiculous statements and exaggerations. 200 engineers telling him that his device doesn't work? Do you think that really happened? 200 engineers don't know how to sum voltages around a basic circuit? 200 engineers don't know that by placing a load in place of a load that current flow will cause some voltage drop. These are 200 of the most stupid engineers possible. They must be civil.

Might it have been something more like thanks but no thanks we aren't interested? You tell me.

 

[ourkid2000]

Great thread folks! Thanks to Dan for being so passionate about his product and contributing to our little community here!

 

[Dan_Sullivan]

It was 200 engineers, over 13 years, and none of them said it didn't work. That's the point. They knew it worked, but none of them would acknowledge it. They wouldn't adopt it. They didn't have the courage or sense to realize that the tool changed the game by making - the age-old, well-understood, completely common - voltage drop reading instantaneous. At least 20 engineers at GM reviewed the tool, did a full business study that proved the tool could save them warranty expenses, and ended up saying, "we don't tell techs HOW to do a voltage drop, and it would cost too much money to change our manuals". What? I told them I'd write them a 4-page service letter to solve that but they said no.

I've never thought this tool is a panacea. You do me an injustice by ignoring that I've ALWAYS said the tool does one thing, but it does it well. If you add the ghost and zero voltage component of voltmeter reading it makes BASIC electrical diagnosis much simpler. After 52 years of breathing and farting, I know how to be honest and avoid hyperbole.

 

[ourkid2000]

Dan I'm curious about using this tool on AC circuits......

I know you mentioned you're an ex-aircraft mechanic, well I'm an Avionics tech with an airline and have been trying to visualize using this tool in our industry. Well, as you probably remember, most large aircraft these days run on 120V 400 HZ AC. Although many systems run off the 28V DC power, there are still quite a few that operate on the full 120v AC.

Ohm's law is Ohm's law.....but are there any quirks that AC would throw into the mix?

40mA per volt = ~ 4.8A......pretty hefty load. Am I wrong? Even 28V DC pulls a pretty hefty amperage.

 

[Dan_Sullivan]

No - it's strictly a matter of voltage. I went to Air Wisconsin and taught them about the tool, and as long as you stay on the 28VAC/DC systems you're fine. Part of the system is understanding that nearly all circuits only have one load, and all circuits are parallel. Even if you remove an inductive or capacitive load, they still convert to ohms for the math. If you stick a resistor in it becomes a purely resistive circuit, and Kirchoff's Law works.

 

[Danglerb]

I'm sure he can do voltage drops fast; but making my head spin? I doubt it. Aren't we talking about the first day of the first class of EE and the sum of the voltages in a circuit equals zero?

The problem I have with Mr. Sullivan are the ridiculous statements and exaggerations.

Voltage drops are "how it works", what is does is simplify troubleshooting, that is its value. EE 101 is knowledge, years in the field is facility with that knowledge, the rapid application of years of learning.

Its like saying I know geometry so I can build a bridge, but somebody that has built dozens of bridges will be 10x as fast.

It was 200 engineers, over 13 years, and none of them said it didn't work. That's the point. They knew it worked, but none of them would acknowledge it. They wouldn't adopt it.

Sometimes the change in protocol requires testing that exceeds the value of the change, at least in the minds of those who do the testing and protocol writing. New protocol means more work for the engineer in order to make less work for a tech, not surprising the tech likes it and the engineer doesn't.

Dan I'm curious about using this tool on AC circuits......

120V 400 HZ AC. ~ 4.8A

Ouch, close to 600 watts, but easily solved with a larger value resistor.

A poor connection in a 120v circuit is going to make some heat and/or smoke fairly quickly, maybe thermal imaging would help, or is it enough to follow a strict PM schedule?

 

[richfinn]

The thing about the loadpro that concerns me is the danger of it on computer driver circuits and 5V reference signals. Most people using it have no idea about the circuit design or the draw of the circuit. The loadpro is going to draw about .5 amp minimum on a 12V circuit. Thus, it is NOT computer safe. It draws MORE than a test light (test light is about .3 amps), which is not allowed by manf on computer circuits. It certainly should not be used on 5V circuits. It's fine on a horn or a light but what else? The load resistor is LOW - why so low? Why not 200 ohms? Why not have a switchable load to make the device more useful/safe in the right hands?

In fact a test light across the connector as the load with the multimeter connected across the test light is far safer than this tool.

OK Mark, one test I do with Load-Pro is to test a typical coolant temp circuit.

I disconnect the 2 pin plug and measure 5v across the pins, I know its fine to load the circuit with 25 ohms, so I hit the button and the voltage drops to zero as I would expect due to the internal circuit in the ECM.

I then watch the Coolant temp PID on the scanner and see the temp change from -40c to +143c.

I feel this is a safe and valid test for both the wiring and the ECM

 

[MrMark]

That's a good test there Rich, apparently the coolant temp sensor goes up from 25 ohms to much higher. You've got a voltmeter/voltage divider at the computer internal circuit though with a big fat input impedance limiting the current. You've hit on the key that it's safe as long as the disconnected circuit load is less than 25 ohms. That sensor must have an inverse relationship with temp so 25 ohms is very hot and maybe 1000 ohms is very cold.

Any tool is safe if you know what you are doing, but this tool requires a level of understanding with regard to safety that is beyond the skill level of the typical user. I think that is apparent from some of the training videos or ads I have seen. This may very well be why those 200 engineers rejected it. They don't want the potential to do damage in the wrong hands.

 

[MrMark]

Here's the drawing for that temp sensor of yours

it starts at 47 ohms, which is its lowest value, so you are off its cal chart with your 25.

http://delphi.com/connectors/assets/product_profile/12146897ds.pdf

 

[richfinn]

Here's the drawing for that temp sensor of yours

it starts at 47 ohms, which is its lowest value, so you are off its cal chart with your 25.

http://delphi.com/connectors/assets/product_profile/12146897ds.pdf

Do it all the time on various models of car with 5v ref sensors, plus a load of other stuff that would probably make those engineers wince ,but what do they know were the ones who have to fix em when they go wrong

 

[MrMark]

Do it all the time on various models of car with 5v ref sensors, plus a load of other stuff that would probably make those engineers wince ,but what do they know were the ones who have to fix em when they go wrong

Didn't mean to imply that you were hurting anything, just that you are off the cal chart for the computer data table.

You are only a hair below the LEAST resistance that circuit is designed for, not enough to matter for this particular type of measuring/divider circuit.

I do want to add that i like your test. Very nice. I think everyone should go around with a 25 ohm resistor to test sensors. But, 50 might be a nicer number actually.

 

[richfinn]

Didn't mean to imply that you were hurting anything, just that you are off the cal chart for the computer data table.

You are only a hair below the LEAST resistance that circuit is designed for, not enough to matter for this particular type of measuring/divider circuit.

I do want to add that i like your test. Very nice.

I like to call it Bi-directional testing for cheapskates

 

[Brownsfan]

I own the Volt-Pro and a Power Probe. I just bought the Load Pro off the Snap On truck because of its simplicity and it helps out a guy who is very passionate about what he does. I bought the Volt Pro off the Cornwell truck for 109 and it is very useful. Helped me find a corroded horn wire at the under hood fuse box of a 95 grand prix. I use my meter 95 percent of the time so for 75 bucks why not. I can't wait to try it out.

 

[MrMark]

THat may be it. But it would require some sophistication because on the positive side it is using power from the connector's 12V but on the negative it would have to switch to using power from the tool's connection to the bat.

I checked, it (the Waekon device) can do ground side just as well. It uses the tool's connection to the battery to check/power the ground side. It has sophisticated logic to know which side it is hooked to (it is a logic probe with comparison circuits) and if it knows it is on the ground side by threshold v tests it runs power through the tool load from the bat connection. It can switch its voltmeter leads internally it would seem.

So, on the high B+ side it reads the load voltage across the tool's internal load so you will see the reduction in the load voltage (if any) on the tool's voltmeter readout.

On the B- side it switches its voltmeter to being across the WIRE from the connection point to the Bat B-, and it gives the voltage drop across the wire, which should be 0 or very close.

VERY clever device and very fast to test high and low sides independently. This is the value of this tool (and it is computer safe) in that you can test for v drop in the wires and connections on the high and low side separately. Speeds diagnosis times. Like I said, this is a pretty sophisticated tool engineering wise.

Just remember Waekon is not some big company it's a little company in Cleveland that employs American engineers and has an actual manufacturing facility in the South somewhere. How many US made electronic tools can you find? Well, this is one. The power probe may be made here too, not sure.

 

[Brownsfan]

I checked, it (the Waekon device) can do ground side just as well. It uses the tool's connection to the battery to check/power the ground side. It has sophisticated logic to know which side it is hooked to (it is a logic probe with comparison circuits) and if it knows it is on the ground side by threshold v tests it runs power through the tool load from the bat connection. It can switch its voltmeter leads internally it would seem.

So, on the high B+ side it reads the load voltage across the tool's internal load so you will see the reduction in the load voltage (if any) on the tool's voltmeter readout.

On the B- side it switches its voltmeter to being across the WIRE from the connection point to the Bat B-, and it gives the voltage drop across the wire, which should be 0 or very close.

VERY clever device and very fast to test high and low sides independently. This is the value of this tool (and it is computer safe) in that you can test for v drop in the wires and connections on the high and low side separately. Speeds diagnosis times. Like I said, this is a pretty sophisticated tool engineering wise.

You are right it is very useful and it does speed up diagnostic times. I posted a recommendation on this tool a while ago along with a story on their customer service. These guys went above and beyon to help me out. The email I sent them was on their Facebook page and it still might be there. I am still going to give the load pro a shot because you can never have enough options when it comes to electrical diagnostics

 

[Brownsfan]

Yes they are a small company in Cleveland and I have met 2 of the engineers when they came to my shop to exchange my defective tool and see why it did what it did. I have a few of their products and use them all of the time. These guys have been nothing but a class act to me. If what Dan Said is true about what happened there that would **** because like I said they were classy all the way. The corporate headquarters is 10 min from my house and I have had the pleasure of a tour of where they research and develop these things and have met some of the engineers

 

[Dan_Sullivan]

The one-armed man...

 

[FiendFX]

The thing about the loadpro that concerns me is the danger of it on computer driver circuits and 5V reference signals. Most people using it have no idea about the circuit design or the draw of the circuit. The loadpro is going to draw about .5 amp minimum on a 12V circuit. Thus, it is NOT computer safe. It draws MORE than a test light (test light is about .3 amps), which is not allowed by manf on computer circuits. It certainly should not be used on 5V circuits. It's fine on a horn or a light but what else? The load resistor is LOW - why so low? Why not 200 ohms? Why not have a switchable load to make the device more useful/safe in the right hands?

In fact a test light across the connector as the load with the multimeter connected across the test light is far safer than this tool.

You know this was the reason why I bought the Loadpro... Figuring it was computer safe, but I was wrong. Kinda disappointed. But at least I can test other things that are not computer related such as headlights.

 

[FiendFX]

No - it's not more dangerous. The load is 40mA per volt, so we're fine on all computer sensor drivers. Do the math on 5V and 8V. We've tested it on innumerable ECMs; we actually found a manufacturing problem on a GM ECM that they didn't know about on a 5V driver. Some techs have also figured out how to use the tool as a substitute sender on such systems as rheostats/thermistors and also fuel level senders.

One tech in Illinois has used the tool successfully on all of his bus systems, including PLCs. The tool cannot harm sensor drivers, so there is NO concern there. In addition, because we're using the fully passive voltmeter, and we have a load in the tool, the MAXIMUM load will be 40mA/V. Corrosion is a series resistance. Ohm's Law can't fail, so the only thing one needs to apply is the age-old concept of holding your mouth right and grunting as you fine tune your thresholds for failure on your equipment in your environment. In Syracuse NY their's is about 0.6-0.8 V.

The question I must ask is this: If you're given the opportunity to immediately load a circuit using a completely safe tool, using existing OEM diagnostic instructions, and identify all three faults with improved meter reading - AND - do it without having to think about it, why wouldn't you?

What people are having the hardest time appreciating - for some reason - is that this tool closes the circle on meter reading and simply makes a voltage reading make sense. If the World had been introduced to this tool 25 years ago as a "normal" function when digital meters first surfaced, we wouldn't be having this argument.

Say what you will about the tool, and criticize me all you want - BUT - if one argues against voltage drop testing made insanely simple and instantaneous and affordable, then that person is obviously completely unfamiliar with the problem.

If it's computer safe, then why does it safe not to use on ECM inputs?

 

[MrMark]

http://buy1.snapon.com/catalog/item...roup_ID=683628&store=snapon-store&dir=catalog

Says right on the listing not safe on ECM inputs like you noted there FiendFx. Made in China too!!!

That's what rubs me the wrong way on all of this, the propensity to exaggerate, stretch the truth, and bag on other decent products. That VoltPro is a serious piece of engineering that someone put a lot of work into and it cost quite a bit to make with all the circuitry inside. I wish I had one.

 

[signcrafter]

Is the voltpro made in the USA? The loadpro says made in China

 

[toms73novass]

Is the voltpro made in the USA?

China

 

[whizzy]

http://buy1.snapon.com/catalog/item...roup_ID=683628&store=snapon-store&dir=catalog

Says right on the listing not safe on ECM inputs like you noted there FiendFx. Made in China too!!!

Hi guys,

First post so please go easy I am a novice when it comes to auto electrics and was looking to learn how to troubleshoot wiring problems etc.I do know a bit about ohms law and how to use a dvm but i am just a diyer and will be just using the experience to troubleshoot my own car if things do go wrong.

Mechanically i am pretty good at fixing stuff like brakes,timing belts head gaskets etc .So was looking at the loadpro just to save time on checking for faults in wiring ..I believe that this tool is handy for this ? Just not quite clear about the "not safe on ECM inputs" .I know that you can disconnect the wiring from say headlights ,fuel pumps and a whole other bunch of stuff and use the loadpro placed in the disconnected connector and do a load test and check to see if it passes the test.

Can someone explain in laymans terms what i should not test with the load pro ,just so i do not damage anything.I understand how to use the loadpro and what the readings mean ,just not sure about the "ECM Saftey".


Thanks

whizzy.

 

[Brownsfan]

China

No the Volt-Pro is Made in USA

 

[signcrafter]

No the Volt-Pro is Made in USA

That really changes my view of this whole thing. The loadpro is made in china. I have it and it's well made but if I was looking at buying one or the other I think I would go with the weakon for the simple fact being made in the USA would be the tipping factor.

I've asked Dan to give an unbiased as possible review of the features of each tool to try and see what tool does what and the benefits of each. I don't believe he has other than saying the loadpro tests both the pos and negative side at once while the volt pro you have to test each side individually. But that isn't really an advantage of the loadpro because if you test both sides at once and come up with a fault you still have to test each side individually to track down where the fault is, unless I'm missing something?

I was all for the loadpro and supporting Dan and have had the tool and his book for a while now. But if I didn't have a loadpro and was trying to decide between getting a voltpro and loadpro I think the USA vs china would weigh pretty heavy on my decision and I would end up with a voltpro. Unless Dan can explain what features the loadpro does that the voltpro can't. It ***** if weakon did steal his idea.