Aluminum air lines
- Thread starter 66L78
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rsanter
Well-known member
we have some at work
they are easy to work with if you have to make changes
they are also expensive, but with the cost of copper it may be more cost effective now
bob
they are easy to work with if you have to make changes
they are also expensive, but with the cost of copper it may be more cost effective now
bob
RbrtAWhyt
Well-known member
Torque1st
MEMBER EMERITUS
The problem with those quick aluminum setups is making modifications, extensions, or fixing leaks a few years from now when the company that made them has gone out of business. Many businesses fail and many more will fail over the next few years. Iron pipe and fittings will be available for our lifetimes.
Industrial Concepts
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I sale & install quit a bit of Prevost ALR pipe. The aluminum pipe is great product, there various mfg. making & marketing aluminum air piping systems. Each brand has their pro & cons. I don't see the big players going out of business. I can't image Ingersol Rand going out of business.
The product is easily modified. You can add a drop easily, most cases no cutting of the pipe. Cuts with a tubing cutter. As far as leaks, most brands are sealed with an O-ring.
Pricing on the average is between Black Iron & Copper K.
I personally don't believe in using black iron for compressed air. I'm in the business to provide clean, dry air. I like copper, but not black iron. Not everybody agrees. Aluminum pipe systems have negatives also, but the positives out weigh the negatives.
IDASHO
Well-known member
O-rings you say??
Yeah, I think Ill pass.
Yeah, I think Ill pass.
nissan_crawler
Well-known member
Yeah, because o-rings don't hold up for thousands of hours of 3,000 p.s.i. pressure in airplanes for 5-10 years without leaking, or anything, all the while in harsh vibrating environments with chemicals and extreme temerature changes.
I'm sure it couldn't handle your wee little 150 p.s.i. compressor though, in a relatively stable temperature with no harsh chemicals around, lord knows.
I'm sure it couldn't handle your wee little 150 p.s.i. compressor though, in a relatively stable temperature with no harsh chemicals around, lord knows.
IDASHO
Well-known member
You dont follow, as usual.
Why would you even think of relying on 0-rings, when a threaded/sweat-soldered connection is so damn bullet-proof?
And you do know that there are MANY grades of O-rings, right?
Why would you even think of relying on 0-rings, when a threaded/sweat-soldered connection is so damn bullet-proof?
And you do know that there are MANY grades of O-rings, right?
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z28toz06
Well-known member
Does the possibility of an occasional bad o ring out weigh the rust issues and tool damage with black pipe? I can't see black pipe being a savings over copper or aluminum when you take all the other issues in to consideration. don't you need a special threader and equipment, fittings true unions? to install black pipe? I would think it would be easier to learn how to sweat fittings than dealing with black pipe. I have never done it so I don't know for sure. Anybody on here know what is involved in installing black pipe? Rust issues? Moisture considerations?
IDASHO
Well-known member
Im not talking about black iron. I was talking more about threaded connections from the copper to items like filters, ball valves, etc.
Sorry for the confusion.
As for running black iron, I have done a good deal of it. Not for air though, all for gas. It is very easy, provided you have access to a nice threading machine.
Sorry for the confusion.
As for running black iron, I have done a good deal of it. Not for air though, all for gas. It is very easy, provided you have access to a nice threading machine.
Torque1st
MEMBER EMERITUS
O-rings are very good seals.
Unfortunately the aluminum and plastic systems would have the same problems as copper systems only worse in a fire. While doing research a few years ago I found that copper is not allowed in some areas due to fire codes. Apparently because it accelerates fires when the fittings or tubing fails. Reading the materials I found convinced me not to use copper.
Most codes call for black iron pipe but you may find galvanized pipe is acceptable. Check with your local codes authorities.
A pipe threader is handy but hardly required to install threaded pipe if you purchase an assortment of fittings and lengths of threaded pipe. You can return unused fittings and lengths of threaded pipe when finished with your project.
Air supply lines were discussed in this recent thread:
http://www.garagejournal.com/forum/showthread.php?t=23318
Unfortunately the aluminum and plastic systems would have the same problems as copper systems only worse in a fire. While doing research a few years ago I found that copper is not allowed in some areas due to fire codes. Apparently because it accelerates fires when the fittings or tubing fails. Reading the materials I found convinced me not to use copper.
Most codes call for black iron pipe but you may find galvanized pipe is acceptable. Check with your local codes authorities.
A pipe threader is handy but hardly required to install threaded pipe if you purchase an assortment of fittings and lengths of threaded pipe. You can return unused fittings and lengths of threaded pipe when finished with your project.
Air supply lines were discussed in this recent thread:
http://www.garagejournal.com/forum/showthread.php?t=23318
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RbrtAWhyt
Well-known member
I think if there is a fire in my garage hot enough to melt the air lines and fittings, a few hundred dollars worth of aluminum and plastic is the least of my worries...
Torque1st
MEMBER EMERITUS
It could make the difference in the fire department getting there in time to save your lives, the house, and part of your tools versus not saving anyone or anything.
nissan_crawler
Well-known member
You dont follow, as usual.
Why would you even think of relying on 0-rings, when a threaded/sweat-soldered connection is so damn bullet-proof?
And you do know that there are MANY grades of O-rings, right?
Bullet-proof, my ***. I fixed about 10 gas leaks at the house today, and have about another 15 joints to fix in the morning.
I tried plumbing my air compressor with Lowe's fittings, fat ******* chance. I tried pipe dope, pipe tape, pipe tape and pipe dope, waiting 24 hours for pressure, none of it worked. I ended up buying high dollar US fittings to get no leaks.
As far as fire, if it gets hot enough to melt solder or aluminum, or even an o-ring for that matter, there's nothing left at that point, anyway. You can play what-if's, all day long, but **** will happen either way. If it hits temps to melt solder, all my paint cans will blow up, all the aerosol sprays will blow up, the gas cans will melt, the oil jugs will have melted, the acetone/mek/mineral spirits will have gone up, my wood work bench will have gone up, adding air is a moot point by then.
RbrtAWhyt
Well-known member
Hows that? Please explain...
nissan_crawler
Well-known member
Oh, technically it could. So could waking up 2 seconds earlier, or having your room a foot closer to the exit. In reality, it's splitting hairs, IMHO.
Torque1st
MEMBER EMERITUS
Have any of you ever used a bellows on a fire? The air stream makes things burn very fast and very hot. That is why fire and building codes specify iron pipe. The fire has to be really hot to hurt it. It just gives the fire dept and your family some additional time to save things and the differences were well documented in testing. There are good reasons for those codes.
An approved cabinet for storing flammables will help also. They are expensive but I found a 30 gallon unit for $100 at a freight salvage place with only one small scratch and no dents.
Make sure your local fire department knows where you store flammable items like paints, gas, welding gas, solvent based insecticides, etc as well as where your compressor tanks sits.
BTW, those cheapo import threaded fittings ARE a nightmare. Save yourself a headache and buy the good stuff. The stuff at the home box stores can be OK at times but check them. The import stuff has improved greatly over the last 10 years.
An approved cabinet for storing flammables will help also. They are expensive but I found a 30 gallon unit for $100 at a freight salvage place with only one small scratch and no dents.
Make sure your local fire department knows where you store flammable items like paints, gas, welding gas, solvent based insecticides, etc as well as where your compressor tanks sits.
BTW, those cheapo import threaded fittings ARE a nightmare. Save yourself a headache and buy the good stuff. The stuff at the home box stores can be OK at times but check them. The import stuff has improved greatly over the last 10 years.
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IDASHO
Well-known member
Just to make you aware, I am NOT talking about black iron. Did you not read that?
I sure hope you are not running gas in copper.
Either way, it isnt the pipes fault the installer did a half-*** job.
Pipe fittings/joints last a LONG time. I have done propane to natural gas retrofits in homes that have 30+ year old black iron systems in them. More often than not, the system passes a pressure drop test as-is.
So... whats the problem again?
You buy cheap fittings, and Ill assume cheap pre-threaded *******, and you are complaining that they are ****?
No matter really, Ill bet money that it was operator error again. If you were working with steel pipe fittings, Ill bet you simply did not have the fittings tight enough. Pipe threads only seal when TIGHT.
IDASHO
Well-known member
Hardly splitting hairs.
Lets take a specific example, that would apply to 90% of this board.
Say a fire erupts in the garage/shop. Oily rags thrown into a barrel that self-ignite. That fire needs FUEL, the primary one being Oxygen, secondary being that of some sort of combustible material.
A roaring fire runs out of oxygen FAST. You should know this, if you have ever burned wood in an air-tight wood stove.
Get a good fire going, then shut the damper and choke it down.
What happens when you open the door
akdiesel
Well-known member
nissan_crawler
Well-known member
Other than at the end, copper isn't threaded connections (and not even then, sometimes), hence why I thought you were talking pipe.
These lines are probably 15-20 years old, I doubt it's an installer issue. One fitting is leaking to where you can smell it when you're close (I had my nose about 5" away from it while working on something), the others I couldn't smell, but the detector shows it. It could easily pass a pressure drop test, but it's still not acceptable to me.
I know how pipe fittings seal, these didn't. when you're heaving on 24" pipe wrenches on 1/2" line and it doesn't seal, they're junk. I got tot he point of stripping a few fittings and finally gave up on them, no operator error. the other fittings went right on, no leaks, first time around. I probably had the system apart 10-15 times witht he other fittings.
Hardly splitting hairs.
Lets take a specific example, that would apply to 90% of this board.
Say a fire erupts in the garage/shop. Oily rags thrown into a barrel that self-ignite. That fire needs FUEL, the primary one being Oxygen, secondary being that of some sort of combustible material.
A roaring fire runs out of oxygen FAST. You should know this, if you have ever burned wood in an air-tight wood stove.
Get a good fire going, then shut the damper and choke it down.
What happens when you open the door
Yeah, except a garage is hardly air-tight, and even if it was, has a lot of air in it. By the time it's used up air, it's burned a hole through to air anyway. Also, how much air would a 60 gallon 150 p.s.i. air compressor add? I doubt it would be that much.
Again, it could make a slight difference, but I have a hard time seeing it being significant. The wood walls in my den are probably as dangerous.
akdiesel
Well-known member
Hardly splitting hairs.
Lets take a specific example, that would apply to 90% of this board.
Say a fire erupts in the garage/shop. Oily rags thrown into a barrel that self-ignite. That fire needs FUEL, the primary one being Oxygen, secondary being that of some sort of combustible material.
A roaring fire runs out of oxygen FAST. You should know this, if you have ever burned wood in an air-tight wood stove.
Get a good fire going, then shut the damper and choke it down.
What happens when you open the door
This is getting a little off of subject, but very important notes to take.
This is correct, but a little correction. The fuel is the rag and chemical and those two make a reaction to create heat the third element in the Tetrahedron.
It takes three things to make a fire. Fuel(wood, gas, plastic, etc), Oxygen(self explanitory), and Heat(spark, fire, hot atmosphear), and now a fourth that takes place is called the chemical chain reaction.
akdiesel
Well-known member
NFPA rules as well as OSHA rules have been writen due to somone being killed.
You could drive with your seat belt off for the rest of your life and nothing happen to you, but it is a chance you are taking.
You could drive with your seat belt off for the rest of your life and nothing happen to you, but it is a chance you are taking.
nissan_crawler
Well-known member
Does OSHA outlaw aluminum piping? I haven't seen it.
akdiesel
Well-known member
I am not sure on aluminum piping but I was responding to copper pipe.
Torque1st
MEMBER EMERITUS
Compressed air distribution lines should be out in free air so that they can perform their function of cooling the air and condensing the moisture in the air.
hidollartoys
Well-known member
66L78, Check to see if the aluminum system is ASME or ASTM tested and to what standards. Compare this to copper and threaded pipe. Remember that there is also welded pipe and pex to through into this discussion. I have seen pvc pipe used but would not recommend it because if there is a pressure failure there could be shrapnal produced which could cause additional injury. What you really want to know: is the piping system suitable for the application and enviroment? Additionally, us must identify the max working pressure of the pipe and if it is air compatable. Some piping systems and corresponding fittings are not.
In my opinion, most garages and small shops only require 3 to 6 drops and cost (unless you are really pinching pennies) between the best(most expensive) and the budget(least expensive) is very small. Only if you are going to change the layout frequently or impress you buddies would it be benefical to go the cadillac route. All of the industrial environments that I was responsible for in the past utilized black iron threaded or welded pipe. Proper piping techniques are required no matter what system you choose. You may want to use a conventional piping system for distribution and then go with the aluminum system for the drops. It is true that the "exposed pipe" would 'aid' in the cooling aspect of the compressed air. However this is a very small aspect. Piping in hospitals(breathing air) and other "clean" enviroments is located inside walls/ceilings. If moisture is a problem you should deal with that with a dryer located at the compressor. Otherwise install 'point of use' filter/dryers along with moisture pots. Proper pipe fall should also be adressed.
Hope this helps. You can PM me and I can share other air piping experiences.
In my opinion, most garages and small shops only require 3 to 6 drops and cost (unless you are really pinching pennies) between the best(most expensive) and the budget(least expensive) is very small. Only if you are going to change the layout frequently or impress you buddies would it be benefical to go the cadillac route. All of the industrial environments that I was responsible for in the past utilized black iron threaded or welded pipe. Proper piping techniques are required no matter what system you choose. You may want to use a conventional piping system for distribution and then go with the aluminum system for the drops. It is true that the "exposed pipe" would 'aid' in the cooling aspect of the compressed air. However this is a very small aspect. Piping in hospitals(breathing air) and other "clean" enviroments is located inside walls/ceilings. If moisture is a problem you should deal with that with a dryer located at the compressor. Otherwise install 'point of use' filter/dryers along with moisture pots. Proper pipe fall should also be adressed.
Hope this helps. You can PM me and I can share other air piping experiences.
1320stang
Well-known member
.....uhhh, I shut the valve to my system when it's not in use. Copper will be fine...
Torque1st
MEMBER EMERITUS
PVC is illegal per OSHA and other regulations. All of the PVC manufacturers I have checked have warnings on their websites or catalogs. There is a grade of ABS that is allowed but it must be approved and marked for the use. There are other plastic types but again in a fire they would be dangerous.
The gasses used in hospitals are dry to begin with since most are supplied as liquids. Compressed air lines in a shop should be run in free air. Moisture removal is a large part of the function of the distribution system in a shop which is why pipe fall is important. Of course very large shops with high volume air use may install a mechanical chiller etc but there are few home shops where that would be warranted.
Industrial Concepts
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- Joined
- Nov 25, 2007
- Messages
- 97
Prevost ALR is certified by TSSA-TUV-it conforms to ASME B31.1. I am sure the other three major Aluminum Air Line Mfg. are to the same standards. These are products that are engineered & designed for compressed air. Most of these have a working pressure rating of 188 psi, which means with a burst rating of four times the working pressure it would take 752 psi to blow the pipe apart. That does'nt mean that if the airline is not installed correctly you won't have problems.
Aluminum does melt at a lower temp. than steel, that is why it is not allowed in the manufacture of spray booths.
In case of a fire or a line burst, etc. there are safe guards that you can put between the compressor & the airline tie-in to shut off the air supply. It is never a good idea to leave a compressor on or the ball valve open that would allow air to keep feeding air to a flame. I personally think that if this going into business then A. by code you may be required a fire supression system B. There are probally more things in your shop that will fuel a fire to worry about, or if this going into a home hobbiest shop chances you are not going to have much more pipe tan an air hose, air hoses melt.
tdkkart
Well-known member
Some of the people here need to move forward 100 years or so...........
The factory I'm sitting in right now has literally thousands of feet of copper air line in it. In the 23 years that I've been here I've yet to see a failure in the hard line portion of the air system.
Black iron is simply a PIA and expensive to work with. Threading machine?? Yep, I've got 2 or 3 of those in my shop just waiting for the next time I need one. Tried to buy a decent pipe theading setup lately?? Prepare to spend some big dollars for one that does a better job of threading than the Chinese do.
Ever look inside any new production equipment, CNCs, tractor trailers??? Wanna guess what they use for air lines?? It ain't black iron, and it's all sealed with push-fit O-ring'd connectors. Again, rarely see a failure.
Compressed air fanning the flames?? I'll bet you've got the pressure relief valve on your tank plumbed outside don't you?? What happens when a fire starts near the compressor, flames heat the tank, the air pressure goes up and the valve pops?? Better plumb that valve outside.........
Have you seen the new crimped copper piping systems?? Guess what it's sealed with??
It ain't pipe doped, it ain't soldered, and it ain't threaded, yet I see it every day and it ain't leaking.
Your family needs to try to save stuff and escape the flames??
#1, saving stuff is what insurance is for, scew it, get the hell out. More people die trying to save stuff than failing to wake up.
#2 Any "working" shop containing anything but minor amounts of flammables should not be attached to the house, period.
Like the fire department is going to keep a list of what's in yout house and where it's located. There's simply now way for them to keep track of everyone's home garage.
And on and on.............
Use what you can afford and what you feel comfortable with installing and using.
The factory I'm sitting in right now has literally thousands of feet of copper air line in it. In the 23 years that I've been here I've yet to see a failure in the hard line portion of the air system.
Black iron is simply a PIA and expensive to work with. Threading machine?? Yep, I've got 2 or 3 of those in my shop just waiting for the next time I need one. Tried to buy a decent pipe theading setup lately?? Prepare to spend some big dollars for one that does a better job of threading than the Chinese do.
Ever look inside any new production equipment, CNCs, tractor trailers??? Wanna guess what they use for air lines?? It ain't black iron, and it's all sealed with push-fit O-ring'd connectors. Again, rarely see a failure.
Compressed air fanning the flames?? I'll bet you've got the pressure relief valve on your tank plumbed outside don't you?? What happens when a fire starts near the compressor, flames heat the tank, the air pressure goes up and the valve pops?? Better plumb that valve outside.........
Have you seen the new crimped copper piping systems?? Guess what it's sealed with??
It ain't pipe doped, it ain't soldered, and it ain't threaded, yet I see it every day and it ain't leaking.
Your family needs to try to save stuff and escape the flames??
#1, saving stuff is what insurance is for, scew it, get the hell out. More people die trying to save stuff than failing to wake up.
#2 Any "working" shop containing anything but minor amounts of flammables should not be attached to the house, period.
Like the fire department is going to keep a list of what's in yout house and where it's located. There's simply now way for them to keep track of everyone's home garage.
And on and on.............
Use what you can afford and what you feel comfortable with installing and using.
hidollartoys
Well-known member
Breathing air in most hospitals is supplied by breathing air compressors located in central mechanical plants. I have personally installed these in hospitals and in medical facilities as well as medical vacuum systems(suction). Oxygen on the other hand "is" piped from a central liquid source.
I have a 20 cfm dryer in my shop that I use for my plasma cutter and all painting. I just expect my impacts, rachets, die grinders, etc to spew water and air thus resulting in increased tool maintenance and failure.
The ability to condense water vapor out of compressed air is a function of several factors and is essentially relative to the ambient air temperature, compressed air temperature, compressed pressure and initial(pre-compression)relative humidity. At pressure and say 75 degrees ambient, no length of pipe will cause a temp drop sufficient to condense the water vapor and knock it out of the stream because as the pressure rises the dew point decreases. Then when the pressurized air is dropped across a regulator the dew point rises and some water is condensed and this is where a filter/seperator or knockout pot comes into play. But there is still water in the air stream. The balance then enters the tool, at regulated pressure and more water is knocked out when the regulated air is reduced to atmospheric pressure as tool exhaust. At each pressure drop there will be a temp drop resulting in condensation. The cooler the ambient air and/or the more volume of air the worst this situation gets. A dryer will reduce the temperature of the compressed air to 45/50 degrees F before it enters the piping system and will condense most all the water out of the air stream. Without a properly sized drying system, some condensation will occure during cooling within the piping system but the piping system itself is not considered a "drying system". It is ideal to dry the air before it enters the piping system because you really never want water in the piping system. In practice it occurs "ONLY" because there never seems to be enough money or foresight to properly dry the air before it enters the piping system. Pipe fall, knock-out pots, filter/dryers, etc are all required because it is extremely difficult to remove all the moisture but by themselves do not constitute a "drying system". These "secondary" stratagies are insurance when used in conjunction with proper post-compression drying. All the dryers that I have worked with were refrigerated dryers.
I have a 20 cfm dryer in my shop that I use for my plasma cutter and all painting. I just expect my impacts, rachets, die grinders, etc to spew water and air thus resulting in increased tool maintenance and failure.
The ability to condense water vapor out of compressed air is a function of several factors and is essentially relative to the ambient air temperature, compressed air temperature, compressed pressure and initial(pre-compression)relative humidity. At pressure and say 75 degrees ambient, no length of pipe will cause a temp drop sufficient to condense the water vapor and knock it out of the stream because as the pressure rises the dew point decreases. Then when the pressurized air is dropped across a regulator the dew point rises and some water is condensed and this is where a filter/seperator or knockout pot comes into play. But there is still water in the air stream. The balance then enters the tool, at regulated pressure and more water is knocked out when the regulated air is reduced to atmospheric pressure as tool exhaust. At each pressure drop there will be a temp drop resulting in condensation. The cooler the ambient air and/or the more volume of air the worst this situation gets. A dryer will reduce the temperature of the compressed air to 45/50 degrees F before it enters the piping system and will condense most all the water out of the air stream. Without a properly sized drying system, some condensation will occure during cooling within the piping system but the piping system itself is not considered a "drying system". It is ideal to dry the air before it enters the piping system because you really never want water in the piping system. In practice it occurs "ONLY" because there never seems to be enough money or foresight to properly dry the air before it enters the piping system. Pipe fall, knock-out pots, filter/dryers, etc are all required because it is extremely difficult to remove all the moisture but by themselves do not constitute a "drying system". These "secondary" stratagies are insurance when used in conjunction with proper post-compression drying. All the dryers that I have worked with were refrigerated dryers.
RbrtAWhyt
Well-known member
IDASHO
Well-known member
As stated already, multiple times, copper lines work great.
Just because you have a hard time with black iron, doesnt mean it is hard to work with. A good machine and sharp dies go a LONG way.
And no, I dont have my own machine. Whenever I need one, I rent one. I typical rent for a day cost me less than $50 It has never, and will never, make sense to buy one. Sounds to me like you have already made that mistake "2 or 3" times.
So you have seen failures? On NEW equipment?
My thoughts exactly.
I have seen it. I have used it. I sell it at work.
But I dont trust it.
Trust takes time. Give those fittings 10+ years. If they are still holding fast, Ill CONSIDER them.
Again, I see no reason to use O-ring fittings based upon this logic:
It creates one more possible point of failure.
Sweat soldered/threaded joints WORK. I see no reason to change, other than installation convenience, which the O-ring setup targets.
#1, Sorry, but I dont think ANYONE mentioned a concern for saving "stuff".
#2, Ill beta majority of this board will disagree with you on that one
And on and on.............
Ill drink to that.
BigChevy80
Well-known member
I agree. Over time the o-rings will dry out and start leaking. If you solder a fitting correctly it won't leak... EVER.
Bottom line: people are lazy and don't want to learn how to solder. At least that's the only reason I can think that people would want to use those stupid o-ring fittings.
akdiesel
Well-known member
It is your choice to use what you want for any purpose including electrical. What happens in an incedent due to the result of your choice or aiding in your choice will have to be delt with your conscience and maybe the insurance. More than likely it will be fine, but we are simply giving our ideas, experiences, and rules to aid in others decisions.
When I build somthing I build it to outlast my life time (overengineered in some cases).
When I build somthing I build it to outlast my life time (overengineered in some cases).
Torque1st
MEMBER EMERITUS
I mentioned saving stuff... But by the fire department, not going back inside a burning building.
All materials have advantages and disadvantages. Personally I would be able to build my air system with any one of them, but I don't.
I believe in Murphy after having much experience with him over the years. The night I would have a fire would be the one I forgot to close down the air system.
Copper can be used in some places if it is type K or L with brazed joints with joint filler metals with melting temperatures between 1 ,000 °F and 1 ,600 °F. Soldered joints should not be used. Most of the copper systems I have seen were soldered like ordinary water pipe and made from thin copper from Home Depot etc.
I do however use copper with soldered joints for my water system and have not had any problems soldering except one nightmare wet system joint repair years ago that was in a very difficult location.
I would not use any other plastic type products or aluminum with plastic joints for fire reasons. The plastic would fail at much lower temperatures than even copper soldered lines.
I certainly don't use PVC. PVC is just all around dangerous fire or no fire.
I personally don't like black iron pipe for the rust issues. But it is code in many places. and we have no choice if inspection is involved.
I do use galvanized pipe for my air system. It is easy for me to use and I don't have leak problems. I have painted it black to keep the inspectors that want it differentiated from water pipe happy.
I do not have the need for an expensive mechanical dryer. So in most small systems the air lines do condense moisture.
I understand that some people may not be able to make up a threaded joint without leaks to save their life. They may be able to braze tho.
The local fire department does keep track of where my flammable items are. I notify them and keep those locations updated to protect the lives of fire fighters and other emergency personal. They prefer to have that information and do keep it on file. Relaying that info to firefighters as they travel to the scene. It may save a life occasionally and it may help minimize property damage sometimes. They feel it is worthwhile in my community and so do I.
All materials have advantages and disadvantages. Personally I would be able to build my air system with any one of them, but I don't.
I believe in Murphy after having much experience with him over the years. The night I would have a fire would be the one I forgot to close down the air system.
Copper can be used in some places if it is type K or L with brazed joints with joint filler metals with melting temperatures between 1 ,000 °F and 1 ,600 °F. Soldered joints should not be used. Most of the copper systems I have seen were soldered like ordinary water pipe and made from thin copper from Home Depot etc.
I do however use copper with soldered joints for my water system and have not had any problems soldering except one nightmare wet system joint repair years ago that was in a very difficult location.
I would not use any other plastic type products or aluminum with plastic joints for fire reasons. The plastic would fail at much lower temperatures than even copper soldered lines.
I certainly don't use PVC. PVC is just all around dangerous fire or no fire.
I personally don't like black iron pipe for the rust issues. But it is code in many places. and we have no choice if inspection is involved.
I do use galvanized pipe for my air system. It is easy for me to use and I don't have leak problems. I have painted it black to keep the inspectors that want it differentiated from water pipe happy.
I do not have the need for an expensive mechanical dryer. So in most small systems the air lines do condense moisture.
I understand that some people may not be able to make up a threaded joint without leaks to save their life. They may be able to braze tho.
The local fire department does keep track of where my flammable items are. I notify them and keep those locations updated to protect the lives of fire fighters and other emergency personal. They prefer to have that information and do keep it on file. Relaying that info to firefighters as they travel to the scene. It may save a life occasionally and it may help minimize property damage sometimes. They feel it is worthwhile in my community and so do I.
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kool55
Well-known member
I ran 3/4 black iron pipe in my shop addition at work in 97. Took 2+ weeks for the install and tie in to the old system my dad put in back in the 60`s. No leaks , no rust. All threaded by hand too. In my new shop at home I think I will use Infinity aluminum tubing.The costs for the tubing are close to bip but the fittings are much more expensive. By the way, 3/4 size pipe is ok for a80 ft. long shop working on bulldozers etc. with 3 plus mechanics so I think it would work in a hobby garage. Also, what is the big deal about o-rings ?I have hydraulic systems with 5800 psi at 30 degrees. working every day.Just my 2 cents.