Snap-on/Cornwell/MAC/Matco can keep their Asian junk!!!

[autoace]

All of us have probably bought some cheap Asian tools from Harbor Freight or Northern tool....etc...to try something out for short money. We pros and tool enthusiats see the Snap-on, Cornwell truck etc. we anticipate the super high quality tools we are about to feast our eyes on.and all of us want to upgrade our less expensive imports to super tool status. Especially if we liked the cheap tool, we want the great ones. Does anybody really want to spend 10 times the money for RELABELED Asian imports; because that is what they are all doing. Snap-on/Cornwell/MAC/Matco can stuff their Taiwan fare where the sun don't shine. If a want a cheap import as a spare, I will buy it from Harbor Freight. I will not replace cheap import with relabeled cheap import, I will use the cheap tool until I can afford a Hazet,Wiha,Witte,etc...Yes German tools are imports, but they are uncompromised quality like we USED to get from the big 4 not cheap knock offs. What will happen 3yrs.plus from now. HEAR COMES THE SNAP-ON OR......TRUCK FULL OF RELABELED HARBOR FREIGHT SPECIALS,then they can keep on motoring. Their original hardline may be top USA fare but all the new stuff is you guessed it, they don't even have the acorns to engrave the origin on the tool, insulting. Even if others don't follow, I'm making a stand, they can keep it.

 

[billymade]

Look for yesterdays USA made used tools to "upgrade" to and find them cheap on ebay, garage sales, the flea and pawn shops! Yes, it is sad to see whats happening to the USA tool industry; your not the only one that is disgusted...

 

[autoace]

yeah,I use that as an option, but the big four are going to fold in to obscurity. With Cornwell first it was their bit sockets, then some ratchets, then pliers, all their ratcheting wrenches, they argue that they are still of good quality, this is true, but I have cheap stuff from Northern tool that is good quality too, and it was peanuts for money. Where do we go for the great stuff now. I have alot of tools so I cannot go get used USA ratcheting wrenches, yes Crafsman guys, Sear ones are USA, but I don't put Sears up with the big four; however, if that is my only USA choice that will have to be it, and wait they won't be USA for much longer. One company should take the hit and stay true to form, then we will come to buy it when they are the last true one standing. They get high on the profit of Asian labor imports, once they get a taste they can't stop, but I have a nice fruit bowl for them

 

[Nealcrenshaw]

You wouldn't happen to be related to Merkava 4 Would you?

 

[Merkava_4]

These days you just gotta be a highly informed consumer; you've got to do your research BEFORE you buy.

The Cornwell driver sockets were never made by them in the first place; they were made by Vermont American. I suspect the older Cornwell screwdrivers were made by an outside vendor too; but I never did find out who. Their new screwdrivers are obviously made by Witte now.

With MAC, it's getting even more tricky; you have to do your research because some of their sockets are being made in Asia and then some are still being made here. Some of their ratchets with the rubber grips are made in Asia and some are made here. Again, you've got to be well informed.

Snap-on has their Blue-Point line pretty much all Asian; so all you have to do is not buy Blue-Point.

 

[krusty the clown]

I suspect the older Cornwell screwdrivers were made by an outside vendor too; but I never did find out who. Their new screwdrivers are obviously made by Witte now.

depends on the screwwdrivers........i have a set from the early 80's that were exactly the same as a set of crescents my dad had. whether crescent made them or just got them from the same mfr i don't know. after that the blue handled ones were scourced from vermont american as well......they were the same as matco except the handle of course.

 

[Merkava_4]

after that the blue handled ones were sourced from vermont american as well......

I suspected they were made by Vermont American, but I wasn't sure. Who made the handle? They're still using the handle from their old screwdrivers for their current ratchet handles. . .

 

[wrenchr]

These days you just gotta be a highly informed consumer; you've got to do your research BEFORE you buy.

The Cornwell driver sockets were never made by them in the first place; they were made by Vermont American. I suspect the older Cornwell screwdrivers were made by an outside vendor too; but I never did find out who. Their new screwdrivers are obviously made by Witte now.

With MAC, it's getting even more tricky; you have to do your research because some of their sockets are being made in Asia and then some are still being made here. Some of their ratchets with the rubber grips are made in Asia and some are made here. Again, you've got to be well informed.

Snap-on has their Blue-Point line pretty much all Asian; so all you have to do is not buy Blue-Point.

I know of their old style stuff is now made with asian handles. I have a 1/4 flex that came with a sticker that said "Made in USA with global parts".

 

[CAT_serviceman927]

My favorite is how MAC and Matco have their pliers which were at one point in time, Channellock rebadges. But if you look now, the USA is no longer on these pliers, yet the price remains the same. I mean it was ridiculous to buy the exact same tool that you could get for half the price at Lowes or any other typical hardware store, but now it is even worse since it isn't even a USA made product anymore nor is it probably as good of quality. Anyone who buys tools to use for a living really does need to research what it is that he is buying.

 

[krusty the clown]

matco and snap on both rebadged diamond pliers until diamond was bought by cooper.they did have chanellock supply them for a while. the current matco pliers are chineese knock offs of channellocks.

 

[Merkava_4]

the current matco pliers are chineese knock offs of channellocks.

All of them?

 

[autoace]

These days you just gotta be a highly informed consumer; you've got to do your research BEFORE you buy.

The Cornwell driver sockets were never made by them in the first place; they were made by Vermont American. I suspect the older Cornwell screwdrivers were made by an outside vendor too; but I never did find out who. Their new screwdrivers are obviously made by Witte now.

With MAC, it's getting even more tricky; you have to do your research because some of their sockets are being made in Asia and then some are still being made here. Some of their ratchets with the rubber grips are made in Asia and some are made here. Again, you've got to be well informed.

Snap-on has their Blue-Point line pretty much all Asian; so all you have to do is not buy Blue-Point.

I used to think only Blue Point was imported, but look at the Snap-on ratcheting wrenches,they are not USA, I'm sure they are slowly sliping in a few others, that's how it starts. We shouldn't have to be so informed, what they are all doing is B.S. this is what they are giving us

 

[krusty the clown]

All of them?

the ones with the B suffix.

 

[krusty the clown]

I used to think only Blue Point was imported, but look at the Snap-on ratcheting wrenches,they are not USA, I'm sure they are slowly sliping in a few others, that's how it starts. We shouldn't have to be so informed, what they are all doing is B.S. this is what they are giving us

afaik the snap on branded ratcheting wrenches are assembled in elizebethtown tn using us made forgings and tiawanese guts. so assembled in usa using us and global components.

 

[autoace]

You wouldn't happen to be related to Merkava 4 Would you?

No, I don't know who Merkava is; however, I have seen his posts and agree with most of them, we both seem to like Permatex lube for the ratchets,although mine says Clevite,same stuff. If I was to bet, his tool boxes and tools are probably waxed and clean,respectively and his air tools are probably well lubed, like mine. My wife says my tools are my mistress, I say we wouldn't have all we got without them. She also asked me WHEN I WOULD BE DONE BUYING TOOLS,I said to death do us part is when.

 

[Merkava_4]

No, I don't know who Merkava is. . .

Just some dude that uses a tank for a username.

 

[krusty the clown]

Just some dude that uses a tank for a username.

and has WWWWAAAAYYYYY to much time on his hands

 

[autoace]

afaik the snap on branded ratcheting wrenches are assembled in elizebethtown tn using us made forgings and tiawanese guts. so assembled in usa using us and global components.

Thanks for that, Snap-on is the least quilty, but the Blue Point line is getting deep, at least S.O. isn't as cloudy as the others, but they have another line to bury it in. My S.O. guy had more Blue Point stuff than S.O., kinda the same thing as the others. Less expensive imports have their place, don't get me wrong I buy some stuff that is Asian for the junkyard crawl box, and to let my friends use)haha, but they don't belong on a tool truck, it's like bringing home an exotic dancer to meet mom. They are just out of place there

 

[Fedwrench]

Just some dude that uses a tank for a username.

And often forgets to take his meds while polishing his tools

 

[krusty the clown]

it's like bringing home an exotic dancer to meet mom.

HEY....i've done that

 

[olds88]

Anyone know why every ratcheting combo wrench is made in Taiwan, or at least the ratchet guts are from Taiwan? Does that country hold the patent? I kind of assumed Danaher owned the patent...... or were they just the first to contract with the Taiwan co. that owns the patent.....???????

 

[Crawlin]

Anyone know why every ratcheting combo wrench is made in Taiwan, or at least the ratchet guts are from Taiwan? Does that country hold the patent? I kind of assumed Danaher owned the patent...... or were they just the first to contract with the Taiwan co. that owns the patent.....???????

I wish someone would answer this too. I have some MACs and they work great buy they are also Taiwan. Luckily I bought mine off Ebay, It would be a shame to pay so much for asian tools, when gearwrenches are so much cheaper.

 

[Fedwrench]

Anyone know why every ratcheting combo wrench is made in Taiwan, or at least the ratchet guts are from Taiwan? Does that country hold the patent? I kind of assumed Danaher owned the patent...... or were they just the first to contract with the Taiwan co. that owns the patent.....???????

Those are excellent questions and perhaps the Gearwrench rep or someone else will enlighten us.
What I don't understand is there are Craftsman, Matco, Snap on (not blue point), and Armstrong Fine tooth ratcheting wrenches that all have USA marked on them and heavier than the Gearwrench versions so, someone in the US must be making them here?

 

[autoace]

I was looking for non-import ratcheting wrenches today. Snap-on,Matco,MAC, and Cornwell are all Taiwan. I ordered a up to date Hazet catalog to see if there was a German alternative. I know they are imports too,but if the USA ones are not available, the German tools like Wiha and Hazet are high quality bullet proof tools, far as I can tell. Craftsman has USA ones; which is a Danaher division. It looks like Craftsman may be my only choice for USA made

 

[billymade]

autoace, you can down load the Hazet Katalog as a .pdf file or bits/pieces of it:
http://www.hazet.de/en/products/illustrated-list-2008.html
http://www.hazet.de/fileadmin/media/aktionen/sww2008engl.pdf
http://www.hazet.de/fileadmin/media/aktionen/sww0809engl.pdf

The section of Katalog dedicated to wrenches is here:
http://www.hazet.de/uploads/tx_d3mlinkedsources/kap03_e_01.pdf#page=2&view=Fit (look on page 57; I'm assuming they are german...)

 

[Vinko]

Not as knowledgeable as some of you guys, but I recently bought USA-made Vise-grips from S/O truck (50% off), and will probably get the BP's for myself.

But I know enough to pick up a tool and see how it's made, finished, etc. That tells me something, though maybe not as much as a mechanic who will put it through it's paces. We do however, use certain tools quite a bit in my shop (tin snips, snap ring pliers, hammers, wrenches for adjustments to large German Amada saw, we are constantly using impact guns and torque wrenches and 3/8 hex bit sockets), etc.

But anyway, I've begun to see, as others have pointed out here, the time factor is important. I like the SO guy. My dad was a customer of his, he treats me well, I buy a few things from him. We hang out, have a smoke, shoot the ****. He lives in my neighborhood. If I need a certain tool, and BP will do the trick, then why not. I want to give him my business.

 

[Merkava_4]

I was looking for non-import ratcheting wrenches today. Snap-on,Matco,MAC, and Cornwell are all Taiwan.

The Snap-on wrenches are suppose to be made in USA with Taiwanese ratchet mechanisms; what happened?

 

[eschoendorff]

So Matco is selling Asian copies of Channellcok pliers, eh??? DAMN I am glad that I bought a lot of my stuff a while ago.

Don't get me wrong.... so of the Asian tools are really quite good. But don't think that I am going to pay made-in-USA prices for them. Sheesh.

 

[autoace]

The Snap-on wrenches are suppose to be made in USA with Taiwanese ratchet mechanisms; what happened?

As far as I'm concerned, assembled in USA with Taiwan gear mechanisms, is like telling your wife, you were in a hot tub, with six hot,**** Asian women, but, since you didn't "do anything" you were not REALLY unfaithful. Think that would fly???

 

[xlr8jsc]

Although it is true that the trucks will have Asian tools on board, that is driven by the demand of the customer (even if most customers won't admit it). The constant pressure for lower prices makes it necessary to stock those off-shore products. The USA made tools are also stocked for those that prefer the best quality and have no problem paying for USA labor, etc.. So now we have more choices and that is a good thing!! Either way you go you still get the advantage of lifetime warranty, and payment programs, delivered right to your shop.

 

[xlr8jsc]

Matco Pro-Swing ratcheting wrenches are made in Texas, USA!

 

[autoace]

Although it is true that the trucks will have Asian tools on board, that is driven by the demand of the customer (even if most customers won't admit it). The constant pressure for lower prices makes it necessary to stock those off-shore products. The USA made tools are also stocked for those that prefer the best quality and have no problem paying for USA labor, etc.. So now we have more choices and that is a good thing!! Either way you go you still get the advantage of lifetime warranty, and payment programs, delivered right to your shop.

Everyone is entitled to have an opinion. If I want a cheaper tool I'll goto Harbor Freight or......Masking those tools as Supreme Pro at alot more money is like putting a Mercedes-Benz emblem on a Kia. They haved their place, just not on the Pro circuit.P.S. Matco pro swings are USA/Asian mutts like the Snap-on's, no offense,but you are probably alot younger than me. It's **** like this that puts this country on it's knees.

 

[autoace]

Matco Pro-Swing ratcheting wrenches are made in Texas, USA!

Made here with what components, see last post

 

[phi2039]

As someone who is very familiar with the Danaher (Matco, Armstrong, Allen, KD, GearWrench, Craftsman) products, I can tell you the following: every component in the Matco Pro-Swing, Armstrong, and Craftsman Ratcheting wrenches is made in the USA in the same plant in Dallas, TX (the forgings are actually done in Springdale, AR). I have seen this personally, from billet to finished tool.

Also, I can tell you that the difference between a GearWrench ratcheting wrench and another imported copy is that the GearWrench product is made in a company-owned facility, and is required to meet the same strict specifications as its US-Made counterparts. Most other 'me-too' brands are contracting the manufacture of their import products to outside manufacturers, and they maintain little control over the QC process or the raw materials. GearWrench was introduced to the world in 1998 (by Danaher), and remains the highest-quality, most-innovative choice in ratcheting wrenches.

Danaher has made a point to ensure that all tools manufactured by the company and marked as 'Made in USA' are truly built, from forge to finish, in the USA. This will continue to be the case in the future.

I hope this helps to clear up the issue.

 

[afazz]

That's quite a first post!

I have both Craftsman and Gearwrench ratcheting combo wrenches, and the Craftsman ones (stamped USA) are definitely better! They ratchet smoother, have less play, slightly smaller diameter around the box... just a better tool overall.

I also agree with the above comments about company-owned southeast Asian manufacturing vs. completely outsourced southeast Asian manufacturing. Just because it's made in southeast Asia doesn't mean it's junk, there are a LOT of other factors contributing to quality. The soil the machines are sitting on and the race of the guy pressing the "cycle start" button aren't the root cause of the crappiness!

 

[billymade]

phi2039, care to expound on your knowledge of these companies and manufacturing processes? I'm not asking you to violate a Non Disclosure Agreement but we probably have allot of questions to ask you if you know allot about Danaher manufacturing info. One thing is the current lowering of quality and Q/C issues with Danaher based Craftsman tools... what is going on? Can you shed any light into this situation?

 

[xroad]

As far as I'm concerned, assembled in USA with Taiwan gear mechanisms, is like telling your wife, you were in a hot tub, with six hot,**** Asian women, but, since you didn't "do anything" you were not REALLY unfaithful. Think that would fly???

Eh ..... Please tell me more detail about this scenario ... big tub, small tub, tall women, short women, etc. I need to know all that ...

 

[RbrtAWhyt]

Post pics of the hot tub and nekkid women, please...

 

[garfunkle24]

As someone who is very familiar with the Danaher (Matco, Armstrong, Allen, KD, GearWrench, Craftsman) products, I can tell you the following: every component in the Matco Pro-Swing, Armstrong, and Craftsman Ratcheting wrenches is made in the USA in the same plant in Dallas, TX (the forgings are actually done in Springdale, AR). I have seen this personally, from billet to finished tool.

Also, I can tell you that the difference between a GearWrench ratcheting wrench and another imported copy is that the GearWrench product is made in a company-owned facility, and is required to meet the same strict specifications as its US-Made counterparts. Most other 'me-too' brands are contracting the manufacture of their import products to outside manufacturers, and they maintain little control over the QC process or the raw materials. GearWrench was introduced to the world in 1998 (by Danaher), and remains the highest-quality, most-innovative choice in ratcheting wrenches.

Danaher has made a point to ensure that all tools manufactured by the company and marked as 'Made in USA' are truly built, from forge to finish, in the USA. This will continue to be the case in the future.

I hope this helps to clear up the issue.

I have researched the topic of ratchet wrench mechanism origin and your post contradicts the information I got from a high up Danaher employee.

I was told that there has never been a single 72 tooth ratchet wrench mechanism made in North America. I was told that the only U.S.A made mechanisms were the course tooth ones for the laminated wrenches.

From the information I got, Craftsman, Armstrong and Snap-On combo ratchet wrenches are all U.S.A forgings with Taiwanese guts.

As I said, this was second-hand information, so I cannot vouch for it's validity.

Did you actually see the production of the ratchet mechanism? Again, I'm certainly not going to say you're wrong based on what I was told, but I'd sure be interested to know.

 

[autoace]

Eh ..... Please tell me more detail about this scenario ... big tub, small tub, tall women, short women, etc. I need to know all that ...

They were all carpenters dreams, and I'm a mechanic, that helped me not REALLY do anything. does that help????