Question on MI building codes, were to look?

[JasonF]

Going to be building a 32x48x12 which I am still in the planning stages of. I was either going to do a pole building or possibly build it on a floating slab with rat wall and a course of block up top. Anyways I called the building inspector yesterday just to find out what the inspection schedule would be and he informs me that MI code says the largest outbuilding that can be put on a slab is 600sqft. This would be ok as it would just mean that I will do a pole building but it raised some questions on my part.
-First I moved to this township I'm in around a year ago and in looking at different homes before moving I spotted many large accessory building on floating slabs. (Verified at the time there were no footings)
-Second, In calling to get some estimates a while back and the contractor I talked to quoted me a building on slab. I asked then about any restrictions and he stated that they had built many gargages on slabs in my area without restriction. The only reason I brought it up then was that I remembered there was a restriction in the previous township I lived, I just thought it was a twp rule though, no MI code.

Does anyone know what others in my Twp. may be doing to get around this code or where I can go to read up on the code regulations myself? I am more curious about this than anything else as I am still in the planning stages.

 

[DekeT]

Tittabawassee Township
Zoning Administration
& Code Enforcement


Mike Faerber
145 S. Second Street
P.O. Box 158
Freeland, MI 48623-0158
t: (989) 695-9512
f: (989) 695-5060

 

[JasonF]

I guess my point was missed as I have already talked with different people from the twp including Mike below who is in charge of Zoning. I was more looking for a link or personal info at the state level that would pertain to this? The township will always give the hard n fast rules but there are always subtext that doesnt get passed on. Example, when I bought my home I was told that I was limited to a 860sqft accessory building, hard n fast rule, no exceptions other than zoning change. On my own time I dug through the local zoning ordinances only to find exceptions listed in an agricultural section of the zoning that pertain to my R-1 zoning. Took that into the Twp office and my building was approved. It may be just me but I like to be armed with all the info I can get when doing a project which is the reason for the post, and thanks again for the google search.

Really dude, can it be that hard.
Tittabawassee Township
Zoning Administration
& Code Enforcement


Mike Faerber
145 S. Second Street
P.O. Box 158
Freeland, MI 48623-0158
t: (989) 695-9512
f: (989) 695-5060

 

[toomany]

I don't have much to add. As I'm in Williams Twp. and am planning on doing a pole building. But you're just around the corner from me, nice to see someone local on here.

 

[DekeT]

I guess my point was missed as I have already talked with different people from the twp including Mike below who is in charge of Zoning. I was more looking for a link or personal info at the state level that would pertain to this? The township will always give the hard n fast rules but there are always subtext that doesnt get passed on. Example, when I bought my home I was told that I was limited to a 860sqft accessory building, hard n fast rule, no exceptions other than zoning change. On my own time I dug through the local zoning ordinances only to find exceptions listed in an agricultural section of the zoning that pertain to my R-1 zoning. Took that into the Twp office and my building was approved. It may be just me but I like to be armed with all the info I can get when doing a project which is the reason for the post, and thanks again for the google search.

No, your point is not missed at all. You are missing the point that state rules cannot help you. You live in a charter township with a zoning ordinance. Your ordinance will reflect whatever rules you MUST follow. Your local zoning ordinance is also online. You said you found an exception in your previous "zoning ordinance", so I believe you answered your own question about where to look and whom to ask.

 

[JasonF]

I don't have much to add. As I'm in Williams Twp. and am planning on doing a pole building. But you're just around the corner from me, nice to see someone local on here.

Good deal, are you building it yourself or hiring it out?
I've built my own in the past but I think I will pay to have this one done, just don't have the drive to do it myself anymore.

 

[sands35]

A floating slab in Michigan is more likely a "Frost Protected Shallow Foundation". i.e., they have insulation under them applied in a specific way.

Either way, you need to read the fine print for the zoning ordinances in your area. It is likely that it will quote different standards of construction for Pole, Footer or FPSF construction. Then you can read on what is required of the different methods.

Google Frost Protected Shallow Foundation and you will see lots of information.

It also matters on who does your work. If your contractor doesn't know what they are doing, don't ask for it or find someone else.

 

[jimkaniki]

I guess my point was missed as I have already talked with different people from the twp including Mike below who is in charge of Zoning. I was more looking for a link or personal info at the state level that would pertain to this? The township will always give the hard n fast rules but there are always subtext that doesnt get passed on. Example, when I bought my home I was told that I was limited to a 860sqft accessory building, hard n fast rule, no exceptions other than zoning change. On my own time I dug through the local zoning ordinances only to find exceptions listed in an agricultural section of the zoning that pertain to my R-1 zoning. Took that into the Twp office and my building was approved. It may be just me but I like to be armed with all the info I can get when doing a project which is the reason for the post, and thanks again for the google search.

I don't know why you say he missed the point. The office he identified can probably steer you to a copy of the applicable code or to another office who can tell you where to find a copy of the code. I would not expect a zoning ordinance to cover your structural issue. Where I live, that sort of thing is covered in the building code, but the idea is the same. Find the people in charge of the code in your area and ask them where this stuff is written down. If your state and local codes are like ours, it will be difficult to figure it out on your own.

 

[ShadowRuleZ]

I'd try the local library

 

[toomany]

Good deal, are you building it yourself or hiring it out?
I've built my own in the past but I think I will pay to have this one done, just don't have the drive to do it myself anymore.

Plan is to build it myself. Will be a few years before I start though. Waiting till I have the house paid off, about 3 years hopefully.

Maybe a call to the local building inspector. He'd probably be the one to ask, as he will have to sign off on it eventually.

 

[brownbagg]

the size of the building is not building code. building code are 'how a building is built" the size will be zoning code, and that is all city township.

 

[DekeT]

I don't know why you say he missed the point.

Every question he asks or link for information he needs is on the web site I pointed to and/or through the name I provided. I would say that is missing the point by a wide margin.

 

[Architorture]

looks like MI has adopted the international building code which restricts the use of free standing buildings using a "shallow foundation" without frost protection... that is where the 600 sf number is coming from...also an eave height greater than 10ft would also violate the same exception which allows for construction without frost protection

R403.1.4 Minimum depth.
All exterior footings shall be placed at least 12 inches (305 mm) below the undisturbed ground surface. Where applicable, the depth of footings shall also conform to Sections R403.1.4.1 through R403.1.4.2.

R403.1.4.1 Frost protection.
Except where otherwise protected from frost, foundation walls, piers and other permanent supports of buildings and structures shall be protected from frost by one or more of the following methods:

1. Extended below the frost line specified in Table R301.2.(1);

2. Constructing in accordance with Section R403.3;

3. Constructing in accordance with ASCE 32; or

4. Erected on solid rock.

Exceptions:

1. Protection of freestanding accessory structures with an area of 600 square feet (56 m2) or less, of light-frame construction, with an eave height of 10 feet (3048 mm) or less shall not be required.

2. Protection of freestanding accessory structures with an area of 400 square feet (37 m2) or less, of other than light-frame construction, with an eave height of 10 feet (3048 mm) or less shall not be required.

3. Decks not supported by a dwelling need not be provided with footings that extend below the frost line.

Footings shall not bear on frozen soil unless the frozen condition is permanent.

 

[jimkaniki]

the size of the building is not building code. building code are 'how a building is built" the size will be zoning code, and that is all city township.

The county doesn't appear to have a problem with the size of his building. The dispute concerns the manner in which he proposes to build it. The building code has different requirements for buildings over a certain size.

Architorture, it appears, has figured it out.

 

[bsg]

Like someone mentioned earlier, the township is the one who will dictate what you can or cannot build not the state.
The township may have adopted the codes but will have their own set of rules.
When I was looking for our new home I checked out the township ordinances before I bought to make sure I could build my barn, again each township is different on what they allow.
Where I'm at now I can build buildings up to 20 percent property coverage, no other restrictions other than setbacks.

I would not piss off the people at the township, they can make it very difficult for you or they could make it a walk in the park.

Good luck on your project.

Kevin

 

[Architorture]

also note that if it is a "frost protected shallow foundation" as suggested earlier that it also means the structure will be heated during the winter to maintain the minimum temperature required by code to utilize such a foundation design

 

[where2]

I learned with the first building inspector I encountered: Do it however the AHJ wants it done today. Later in life, I learned: Don't let your permit lapse. Last project, I learned: Make sure the inspector who came by today signs your permit on your in-progress inspection today, because he might get fired or change jobs before your next in-progress inspection! (mine changed jobs)

I learned that pointing at things that are grandfathered in as justification for avoiding what the AHJ wants to see is useless. There's a 2' section of my garage wall with Simpson-Strongtie brackets and engineered for 150mph winds, because the termites ate a portion of the header beam and two of the uprights. Couldn't rebuild it like it was, had to have it re-engineered to modern code, then rebuild it per the engineers plans to make the AHJ happy.

 

[Architorture]

your simpson connection example is surprising...usually the code allows for the repair of a structure in the manner in which it was constructed if it has a minimal impact on the structure....you could build that 2' section of your garage entirely out of simpson connections and it won't make a lick of difference to the rest of the structure when that 150mph wind comes through.

 

[JasonF]

What I was looking for was the kind of info Architorture has provided, thank you. By me saying the point was missed was that I had already made contact with the township multiple times already and was looking for information beyond what I had been given.
I also agree with BSG in the fact that I don't need to build by garage on a slab so to keep pestering the township with questions about this could possibly have a negetive impact on my future barn build. By posing the question here I open it to people who have built on slabs or work day in and out with state code.
Thanks all for the replies.

 

[Justanoldguy]

I am so pleased I live in a very small country.
We have one building code that covers the whole country.
With some small exceptions, there are no variations from it nationwide.

Good luck with the build.