Small rant about brand name tools brand tools

[PavelK313]

Hi everyone. I dont post much on here but always read this forum.
Not sure if i would exactly call this post a rant, perhaps its more of a story with a question in it.

In my tool box I have a mix of USA, German, Japanese and handful of HF tools. I started collecting tools about 11 years ago (I am 27 now) and my first purchase of "quality" tools was large 250 something pieces Craftsman set. I used it a lot for about 5 years and didn't think I needed much more than that when it came to basic mechanic tools. Now a days I enjoy having more refined things and can actually afford them so I started purchasing name brand tools few years ago, such as SO, Matco, Knipex, Wera, Hazet, Wiha, Witte, Kal, etc.

Well, I guess here is where the rant is... when it comes to ratchets, I feel like my old and proven Craftsman ratchets have proven themselves to be more reliable than my Matco, Proto and SO ratchets. Whats even funnier, I abuse my C-man tools and try to be as careful as possible with my truck brand tools cause I paid a lot of money for them.

Am I missing something guys? I currently have 3 broken Matco 3/8" ratchets, 1 3/8" SO, 1 1/2" Proto. lol For a guy like myself who doesn't work at the shop but fixes cars & bikes at home it is extremely inconvenient since I dont get truck service at my home and cant replace my broken tools in timely manner.

At this point I am starting to question if its really worth it to be spending big money on expensive tools...

Rant/Venting is done. haha
Just wanted to tell you my story and see what all of you have to say.

PS: I dont have any complains about any of the other tools from those brands, its just ratchets that dont seem to be able to stand up to my usage.

 

[Danglerb]

how did you break a 1/2 Proto?

Each of us has different requirements, different things we are fussy about or let slide. Suit yourself and have some fun. For me Snapon combo wrenches are worth it. Ratchets I am ok with a lot of cheaper ones like the HF composites, but I don't care for the old Craftsman. I need smaller, smoother, less clunky, more teeth, and good fit to my hand.

 

[3baygarage]

Not sure to what extent you use your ratchets but I always use a breaker bar first when possible to bust things loose. Really they are a ratchet saver. I think there's no quicker way to ruin a ratchet than fighting with something.
As far as the Craftsman being better, if not abused they last but I prefer some other brands.

 

[STEVENC]

I Had one SO 1/2 ratchet dual 80 that I really liked and was forced to sell during tough times. Plus I had it ingrained in my head to buy the 1/4 and 3/8. The dual 80s are very smooth and fit well. I was always worried about dropping it. The old Craftsman Teardrops I don't mind using if I have the room, but in low space I really like my old round head fine tooth Craftsmans.

 

[PavelK313]

how did you break a 1/2 Proto?

Each of us has different requirements, different things we are fussy about or let slide. Suit yourself and have some fun. For me Snapon combo wrenches are worth it. Ratchets I am ok with a lot of cheaper ones like the HF composites, but I don't care for the old Craftsman. I need smaller, smoother, less clunky, more teeth, and good fit to my hand.

I broke my 1/2" Proto when taking a wheel off of my car. I also ALWAYS use Snap-On torque wrench to torque my wheels to 87ft/lbs. I do need some better wrenches though. Looking into Wera Joker line.
I agree that craftsman ratchets are not the finest out there, but from personal experience they can handle abuse.

Not sure to what extent you use your ratchets but I always use a breaker bar first when possible to bust things loose. Really they are a ratchet saver. I think there's no quicker way to ruin a ratchet than fighting with something.
As far as the Craftsman being better, if not abused they last but I prefer some other brands.

Sometimes there is just no room for breaker bar. Funny thing is that I have also broken few breaker bars too! haha But only when trying to remove axle nuts.

 

[wrenchr]

For wheels and axle nuts I'd start looking into an air compressor and an impact as that will work way better for wheel bearing and wheel removal. What will break any brand ratchet quick is the jarring or jumping on it to break something like a lug nut loose. If you are pulling back on one smoothly I do not see you having an issue.

 

[PavelK313]

For wheels and axle nuts I'd start looking into an air compressor and an impact as that will work way better for wheel bearing and wheel removal. What will break any brand ratchet quick is the jarring or jumping on it to break something like a lug nut loose. If you are pulling back on one smoothly I do not see you having an issue.

I never jump on my ratchets and always pull up on it. Sometimes leverage works a lot better than impact gun.
And what you're saying is that a nut torqued to 87lbs is too much for professional grade 1/2" ratchet to handle?

 

[JasonCAT]

I broke my 1/2" Proto when taking a wheel off of my car.

I swear I'm the only guy on this forum who actually uses a lug wrench to remove lug nuts.

 

[wrenchr]

I never jump on my ratchets and always pull up on it. Sometimes leverage works a lot better than impact gun.
And what you're saying is that a nut torqued to 87lbs is too much for professional grade 1/2" ratchet to handle?

In theory no, but what were you doing to remove the lug nut? Just pulling back on it should have not broken it. Yanking or jarring as I mentioned will jam the gear up in any ratchet and break it. As far as leverage goes my IR 1/2thunder gun has never broken a sweat at any bolt thrown at it in my garage. I'm a weekend wrench too.

 

[wrenchr]

I broke my 1/2" Proto when taking a wheel off of my car. I also ALWAYS use Snap-On torque wrench to torque my wheels to 87ft/lbs. I do need some better wrenches though. Looking into Wera Joker line.
I agree that craftsman ratchets are not the finest out there, but from personal experience they can handle abuse.



Sometimes there is just no room for breaker bar. Funny thing is that I have also broken few breaker bars too! haha But only when trying to remove axle nuts.

If a ratchet will fit then a breaker bar will sure fit.

 

[bobcatdan]

I don't know how you break a ratchet taking 87 ft lbs lug nuts off. I have to take drive sprocket bolts torqued to over 200 off in the field with my 24" matco flex head ratchet with no problems. I had to use the ratchet because my 1/2" matco breaker bar broke on the first bolt. Some people's kids.

 

[Flivver250]

I very rarely break a tool. The few times I have, it has mostly been my own fault by using the wrong tool. I have had great luck with Snap-On, SK abd Mac ratchets. Through attrition and giving tools away, I only have Snap-On now, and those will take me to the grave. I do have a Wright 3/4 ratchet, but my arm will break before that does. I will not buy Chinese or Japanese hand tools. The majority of my tools are Snap-On I bought between 1978-1980. Almost every tool is still as useable as the day I bought it. My Snap-On boxes are not big or pretty compared to the modern luxury liner tool boxes they make today, but they are filled with great tools. I always felt the box was more ego than utility.

 

[pipsters]

I bought an expensive torque wrench, a Precision Instruments split beam, and it is wildly inaccurate. Set to 20 ft-lbs (range is 10-50) I have gotten measurements as low as 16, that is 40% off!! My el cheapo HF clicker is considerably more accurate and repeatable as well as my Craftsman beam style. I honestly feel like I got ripped off. It's my second one too, first one was rusting out something crazy and they offered to exchange it via warranty.

I hate to say it, but I too have had much better luck with the less expensive stuff. "You get what you pay for" does ring true but not in all cases.

 

[Adam.C]

In restricted spaces, Snap On's dual 80 ratchets remove fasteners faster than lower tooth count ratchets. Their dual paw design more than compensates for the typical lack of strength found in fine tooth ratchets. Tight fit between socket and drive helps you get the tool on the fastener and keeps extensions and sockets attached. Low back drag (my favorite) makes ratchet operation fast and efficient.

But all fine toothed mechanisms can strip readily (compared to coarser toothed ratchets) when the teeth are worn because the contact patches are so small. Similarly, debris inside the heads accelerates wear. Snap on F80 etc have "sealed heads" to reduce foreign debris, but even material lost due to wear can accelerate wear (like a transmission).

The tear drop Craftsman ratchets are the AK-47s of ratchets. You can bury them for a year, then dig them up and use them. Their mechanisms are simple, effective and damage/wear/filth tolerant. But they clearly don't have the performance of Snap On ratchets.

Better performance generally means higher maintainance costs/intervals. I believe that to be the case with Snap-On's dual 80 ratchets. You probably should replace the guts regularly and grease them with the right grease to keep them working as designed. Snap on offers inexpensive (or free) kits. If I were a pro mechanic, I think I would swap mechanisms yearly at least. I bought lightly used ratchets on ebay and rebuilt all of them. Every one was noticeably worn.

If you don't want to do that, Craftsman is an excellent alternative. I did good work with my Craftsman tools for 30 years (part time/weekend).

You shoudn't allow us to convince you one brand is "better" than the next. Its really all about what works for you. I can think of many examples where someone might be better off with a lower cost, "poorer quality", possibly disposable tool. I think you have done a good job highlighting just such an example.

I also think people who claim one tool is better should qualify their statement (as I believe I have above). You may find the features I find attractive are of no use to your application.

 

[TJJP77]

For lugs, I exclusively use my old RHFT Craftsman 1/2" drive long-handle flex head that I've had for around 20 years. That old dual-pawl mechanism has the guts to break stuff loose without fear of breaking it. I'd expect the flex joint to break long before the ratchet gave out. Had I known that they would go for crazy money on ebay in new/unused condition I probably would have saved it and gone a different direction...oh well.

 

[Pumpman1968]

YOU. NEED. AIR!

However, if you are tough on ratchets, and it is pretty clear that you are (no offense), go out and buy yourself a 1/2" drive S-K 42470 ratchet. There are PLENTY on ebay used that you can pick up for $20 or less. They are not super flashy, not a real high tooth count (60) and a little short (10 1/2") and bulky........but the damn things work. Get yourself some Super Lube on the mechanism and work that tool. The basic design of those S-K round heads is, I think, the oldest continuously produced on the market and are pretty much bulletproof. New repair kits will still fit the ratchets built way back when. I have some that are at least 70 years old and they are just as strong and smooth as they were back then.

 

[Tsquare]

Craftsman built their reputation on being dependable strong tools - not the prettiest or flashiest - just a good deal for the user. I agree with Adam C. - the AK47 of tools.

 

[jeremy v]

Set to 20 ft-lbs (range is 10-50) I have gotten measurements as low as 16, that is 40% off!!

I know what you mean. I have a torque wrench that is off by 60%. It tests to 32 foot pounds when it is set at 35.

 

[woody 73]

Sometimes the best tools are the ones that everybody passes by without giving a second look. I bought an old rusty tool box with Chinese and American tools, some with rust and others just abused; turns out one of the tools was a k-mart benchtop 3/8 ratchet. That little sucker is still going strong and what a joy in my hands, in a million years I would have never guessed how nice that ratchet was.

 

[retDAC]

Sometimes the best tools are the ones that everybody passes by without giving a second look. I bought an old rusty tool box with Chinese and American tools, some with rust and others just abused; turns out one of the tools was a k-mart benchtop 3/8 ratchet. That little sucker is still going strong and what a joy in my hands, in a million years I would have never guessed how nice that ratchet was.

Am not surprised. Some of the Benchtop stuff (Taiwanese) was pretty good.

 

[retDAC]

I swear I'm the only guy on this forum who actually uses a lug wrench to remove lug nuts.

Am busting your bubble. I use a four ended lug wrench regularly on my cars and trucks.

 

[wornoutoldman]

A broken ratchet indicates the need to use a larger drive size.

Give me 10 minutes. I can break anything.

 

[creativecars]

I think there are many good tools out there beyond what is found on a truck, and there is not much I can't fix without them. Bottom line is I have not needed a truck brand in 20 years.

I do know that you guys do math differently than I do!!

Quote:
Originally Posted by pipsters
Set to 20 ft-lbs (range is 10-50) I have gotten measurements as low as 16, that is 40% off!!

I know what you mean. I have a torque wrench that is off by 60%. It tests to 32 foot pounds when it is set at 35.

 

[michael murder]

I worked at a mine where we almost exclusively used Proto. A lot of guys thought Proto was junk because they seemed to be breaking their tools constantly, a lot of snapped wrenches and split sockets. Of course those guys used their tools like wild animals. I never had a problem with them. Bottom line is even top shelf tools aren't bullet proof under the right conditions and in some cases cheaper tools can certainly take a lot of abuse, maybe even more than the $$$$$ stuff.

 

[JMSVIDEOPRODUCTIONS]

I personally use several different brands myself, however most of my collection is Craftsman....here's a quote from a 30 year truck mechanic that told me one day...."you know why I really like Craftsman stuff over Snap-on and such? When I break one every now and then I don't have to wait for the truck to come by next week...I can go right after work or really just about anytime I want 7 days a week and get me a replacement....I think a Lifetime Warranty is a Lifetime Warranty!"..

you decide LOL!

 

[Steinmetz]

I bought an expensive torque wrench, a Precision Instruments split beam, and it is wildly inaccurate. Set to 20 ft-lbs (range is 10-50) I have gotten measurements as low as 16, that is 40% off!! My el cheapo HF clicker is considerably more accurate and repeatable as well as my Craftsman beam style. I honestly feel like I got ripped off. It's my second one too, first one was rusting out something crazy and they offered to exchange it via warranty.

I hate to say it, but I too have had much better luck with the less expensive stuff. "You get what you pay for" does ring true but not in all cases.

More like 8%.

 

[cburnscrx]

I swear I'm the only guy on this forum who actually uses a lug wrench to remove lug nuts.

Eh, I had one of those cross lug nut wrenches...bent it. Then again I am a pretty big guy and I was jumping on it (for what its worth, it didn't loosen the lug nut). Got out the ol' 1/2 Titan ratchet, jumped on it a few times...lug nut free. My biggest fear there was missing the ratchet when I jumped on it.

 

[The Gambler]

never broke a snap on ratchet or any ratchet to be honest then again if the bolt is bigger than 3/4 i jump upto 1/2 bigger than a 1 1/4 i jump to 3/4 its al about knowing what a drive size can take.

 

[Sblake927]

I'm an A&P mechanic and anytime I break torque on "higher torque" nuts and bolts I use a breaker bar, then use the ratchet. Less wear and tear on the ratchet weather is Cman, matco or SO.. JMO

 

[CWP1616L]

After using Snap-on ratchets for the last 20 years, I don't see how it's possible to break one; they are extremely strong.

 

[basspro]

I agree with an old SK, Ive used a few myself. I have a 1/2 drive Indestro Super, clone to an SK. Bought it at the flea market, cleaned it up and lubed it with Super Lube, let er' eat everyday. All my impact sockets for the most part are cheaper brands, have been holding up fine so far!

 

[basspro]

I also agree with breaking nuts and bolts loose first with a breaker bar, I use one alot! I use a 15" 1/2 drive alot, short enough for tight spaces and long enough to get on it a bit with a little "tug". Im more picky about breaker bars than anything else, they have to have a knurled handle for me.

 

[Sblake927]

I use a 3/8ths snap on breaker bar regularly. I'm pretty sure it's older than I am (I'm 22) because the chrome has pretty much worn off it. still works great though.

 

[OxJaw]

Set to 20 ft-lbs (range is 10-50) I have gotten measurements as low as 16, that is 40% off!

I know what you mean. I have a torque wrench that is off by 60%. It tests to 32 foot pounds when it is set at 35.

You guys have some crazy math going on there. It's more like 20% and 8.5%

 

[djwyman]

I can side with both sides of the fence here...I have craftsman ratchets that I have used cheater pipes on, beat with sledge hammers, and just down right abused and they still work like a champ. But I now own a snap on dual 80 and it feels like gods gift to ratchets when it comes using it over the craftsman ones I own and it does not feel so sloppy in tight spaces. so I can unbolt stuff easier. But at the same time I would not dare abuse it like I will with my craftsman ones...not because I think it wont take the abuse...but more because I don't want to abuse my awesome ratchet.

 

[CWP1616L]

You're not gonna convince me to go out and buy Craftsman raised panel ratchets; I hate those things.

 

[KEH]

It will involve a lot less stress if, for some of the applications , a 3/4 inch drive breaker bar with a 3/4 to 1/2 drive adapter is used(assuming no 3/4 drive socket is availiable).

KEH

 

[HighPlainsWrencher]

It doesnt make since to buy truck brands in your situation. All of my ratchets are Snap On at work and I dont think they are any stronger than any other USA manufactured ratchets. Their selling point for me is the truck shows up at the same time every week and I can get it repaired with no hassle.

 

[STEVENC]

For lugs, I exclusively use my old RHFT Craftsman 1/2" drive long-handle flex head that I've had for around 20 years. That old dual-pawl mechanism has the guts to break stuff loose without fear of breaking it. I'd expect the flex joint to break long before the ratchet gave out. Had I known that they would go for crazy money on ebay in new/unused condition I probably would have saved it and gone a different direction...oh well.

Be careful with those the pawls click along the notches built into the body.
you break the teeth on the body and the whole ratchet is toast.

On that note here is what suits my needs for ratchets
The bottom picture is the ratcheting mechanism for a Craftsman Digi-Torque wrench that broke. Thats how I remove lugs if I dont want to fire up the compressor.

 

[TurboCup87]

I bought a 60 some piece tool set from Montgomery Ward ( for you youngsters out there, "Monkey Ward" was Sears' main competitor) in 1970 when I was 17 years old. My First tools that I bought for myself. The 3/8" ratchet from that set still receives regular use and still works perfectly. It was US made. Things were made better in the "Old Days."