I think we all saw it coming, but I was at Menards yesterday and saw several styles of Vise Grip brand pliers "Made in China". Some styles were still the "Made in USA with Global Components" type. You can definitely tell a difference in the texture of the steel, but I am not about to buy one and find out if there is a difference in performance. Was bummed to see this...
Vise Grips...Made in China
- Thread starter Mike83
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Uncle Buck
Banned
Good by Vise Grip, it was great knowing you! (I think I might even send the company an Email message saying about the same!)
Titus
Well-known member
Harryepstein.com bought up a bunch of the US made VISE-GRIP products before the outsourcing began. Enjoy: http://www.harryepstein.com/Irwin.html
posaune
Well-known member
A lot of those seem to be US made, but take a close look- the #77SG set and the #323S set both have the "Made in USA with Global Components" stamp...
david71camaro
Member
- Joined
- Aug 12, 2008
- Messages
- 12
Merkava_4
Banned
I've always hated Vise-Grip no matter where they were made.
The Cooper Tools Crescent locking pliers are the ones I miss dearly. I've got a couple pairs, but I wish I would've bought more before they quit making them.
It looks like the Grip-On or Knipex locking pliers might make a fairly decent substitute ... I'd have to try them first though.
The Cooper Tools Crescent locking pliers are the ones I miss dearly. I've got a couple pairs, but I wish I would've bought more before they quit making them.
It looks like the Grip-On or Knipex locking pliers might make a fairly decent substitute ... I'd have to try them first though.
krusty the clown
Member Emeritus
dad would never own a pair of vise-grips............he said there was always a better tool for the job. i have several but i really only use them as clamps. if a socket or wrench doesn't work channellock "nut busters" will
posaune
Well-known member
Crescent Locking Pliers on ebay
I've been watching them on ebay FOREVER, but they've just never been a priority (and I hate to pay more for shipping than for the tool).
speed bump
Well-known member
If can think of tons and tons and tons of times and uses for a vice grip, almost none of which are using them on bolts but I come from more of a pipe trade/mining/welding background than an automotive background.
What really gripes me about chinese vice grips is I would be willing to buy them except they charge twice the price they should for the Chinese ones. Its like Bluepoint has a 4 pc adjustable wrench set for $200 new made in China. I can go to the local farm supply and buy the exact same adjustables for $50 new. BTW I don't see how Vice Grip isn't going to fail when I was looking at the Cummins tools ad and I can buy 3 pc sets of chinese vice grips with roughly the same quality for $6 a set.
What really gripes me about chinese vice grips is I would be willing to buy them except they charge twice the price they should for the Chinese ones. Its like Bluepoint has a 4 pc adjustable wrench set for $200 new made in China. I can go to the local farm supply and buy the exact same adjustables for $50 new. BTW I don't see how Vice Grip isn't going to fail when I was looking at the Cummins tools ad and I can buy 3 pc sets of chinese vice grips with roughly the same quality for $6 a set.
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Merkava_4
Banned
I know this is only halfway related, but this weekend I was at the in-law's place helping out with a few things. Well, I only had my electrical bag and I needed my vice grips bad but had to borrow my BIL's cheap knockoffs. I've never used any cheap ones before so I was shocked at how much the jaws flexed side to side. If they were mine I would have thrown them in the trash. Funny thing though, they got the job done. 
speed bump
Well-known member
I know this is only halfway related, but this weekend I was at the in-law's place helping out with a few things. Well, I only had my electrical bag and I needed my vice grips bad but had to borrow my BIL's cheap knockoffs. I've never used any cheap ones before so I was shocked at how much the jaws flexed side to side. If they were mine I would have thrown them in the trash. Funny thing though, they got the job done.
You would be surprised what gets the job done. I have a Cheap Chinese Vice grip that works pretty well and some Cheap Cummins ones that seem to work okay even if the fit and finish isn't all that great.
Titus
Well-known member
I had a set of cheap Chinese Vice grips that I cursed at frequently. I replaced them with a set of Craftsman Professional vice grips, which are much better, but still get on my nerves from time to time.
Every time I am using one, I tell my self that there has to be a better tool for the job, but I just don't own it yet.
Underdog
Well-known member
I have been buying up all the Vise-grips I can at the flea mkt. Only Peterson brand for me.
Uncle Buck
Banned
I see no reason to buy any ones brand if they are all made in China or across the pond. The fact that they were domestic made was what justified their cost, now that they are not domestic made there is nothing that would motivate me to buy them over any other brand including HF. I am not impressed with their Chinese made tool that wears an old American manufacturers name. F them, I hope they fold up! It is a good thing for me I buy most of my tools used.
That's pretty much what I was thinking too. Used tool buyers are a little bit more insulated to these issues than others. It's just sad to see a good brand get watered down.
I posted in the other thread, but I'll reiterate. I picked up a two pack of locking pliers (Vice-Grips) by Irwin at Home Depot (I work there) and they were made in the US. However, most of the rest of the Irwin tools/sets that we sell there are made in China.
Uncle Buck
Banned
Whole thing just pisses me off. People just cannot stand to leave something that works well alone. I really hope those F ers fold!
If all they are going to make is Chinese **** it is time for them to quit cause they cannot beat HF at that game!
If all they are going to make is Chinese **** it is time for them to quit cause they cannot beat HF at that game!
Stuey
Well-known member
I won't buy an VG anymore - EVER, if even by principle. In fact, I don't think I'll ever buy another non-explicitly-USA made Irwin tool ever again either.
Irwin tools aren't bad, but I have just had terrible experiences with their non-USA products. Drill bits that dull in seconds and snap randomly, bits that dull quickly, VG with very poor tolerances, etc.
From now on, it'll only Grip-On locking pliers for me. Should those disappoint, I have no idea what I'd purchase.
Irwin tools aren't bad, but I have just had terrible experiences with their non-USA products. Drill bits that dull in seconds and snap randomly, bits that dull quickly, VG with very poor tolerances, etc.
From now on, it'll only Grip-On locking pliers for me. Should those disappoint, I have no idea what I'd purchase.
See, you kind of agree with me, after all. Already made in Asia,ok American names becoming Asian(this has always been what really ticks me off), and I think that hurts us.
Uncle Buck
Banned
Elroy would like to point out an observation he recently made concerning vise grips. If you look at the new labels it states something to the effect that they are made domestically with both foreign and domestically sourced parts.
Well look at the pressure screw. At the end by the knurl. The newer ones have a hex socket holes broached into the end of the screw for an Allen wrench. A metric Allen wrench none the less.
Elroy would venture to say that these are some of the foreign sourced parts. The older stock will not have these hex broaches holes in the end of the screw.
Did Elroy say screw em??
Yep, Phuckem and the ocean going liner that carried them screws over here.
Well look at the pressure screw. At the end by the knurl. The newer ones have a hex socket holes broached into the end of the screw for an Allen wrench. A metric Allen wrench none the less.
Elroy would venture to say that these are some of the foreign sourced parts. The older stock will not have these hex broaches holes in the end of the screw.
Did Elroy say screw em??
Yep, Phuckem and the ocean going liner that carried them screws over here.
Vinko
Well-known member
My gripe exactly. And not just with tools. When these companies move offshore, they often retain the price of what the item would cost in the USA don't they?
eschoendorff
Well-known member
eschoendorff
Well-known member
Sounds good to me. I am now really glad that I bough all my Vise-Grips when I did.
Stuey
Well-known member
Grr! Every single one of my Vice-Grips were purchased with "Made in USA" package labeling. I made many efforts to avoid those with "with Global Components" wording. Well, I took a look, and you're right, some of my V-G pliers have those hex sockets!
I have noticed that some had "Made in USA" on the bottom handle, and some do not, and was aware that some accepted hex keys, but I don't have many doubles and of those styles that I do, the duplicates are often stored in different places. I cannot believe that I couldn't put two and two together!
The other day, I recommended stripping down VG's soft grip handles to check for a "Made in USA" label, but your method is MUCH easier.
For the most part, it seems that perhaps "Made in USA with Global Component" tools were still at the very least assembled here.
For what it's worth, I put some pics of the differences Elroy mentioned via ToolGuyd.
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Uncle Buck
Banned
I am surprised most guys didn't notice the allen wrench hole in the end of the pressure screw, that is a dead give away.
After thinking about this thread the other day I decided I should buy my boy 4pair of VG pliers, 2 regular curved jaw type, the 9" and the little 4" size and the equivelent sizes in the needle nose type, which was all I ever bought new for myself.
I set out today to begin my search for these four pliers. I lucked out and found the large sizes of both the curved, and needle nose pliers at one of the local industrial suppliers. I will now start looking for the small sizes of each.
I already have several of these and a few others in my box, but I thought it would be nice to have the set of 4new in the boxes set aside to give to my boy years from now when he will be old enough to appreciate what I am giving him, he is only 6yrs old now. I figured he will deserve to have a decent set of new ones to wear out for himself.
Was that a great idea, or what?
Merkava_4
Banned
I wish I could get other guys on the board to shop at their local industrial supplier. All Stuey ever goes to is Sears and Amazon.
I wish I could get other guys on the board to shop at their local industrial supplier. All Stuey ever goes to is Sears and Amazon.
Define "local industrial supplier", I don't think I have one of those. Do you mean, non-box store hardware stores? or Grainger/MSC online?
If you want domestic VG's now is the time. Elroy saw several in the local Grainger today. They were all mixed up about 50/50. The longer they are built over seas the worse they're going to get. JE'sHO
Same thing goes for USA made Nicholson Files. These are now being made in Mexico and Honduras. Some USA made stock is still available but is being depleted FAST
Same thing goes for USA made Nicholson Files. These are now being made in Mexico and Honduras. Some USA made stock is still available but is being depleted FAST
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Stuey
Well-known member
I also order a lot from McMaster, Enco, and MSC. I really don't understand what you want sometimes. What does it matter if the outcome of me with new tools is the same eitherway? I order from Amazon and Sears b/c of the lower prices. In some cases, Sears's catalog includes tools that I couldn't find at any other US distributor.I wish I could get other guys on the board to shop at their local industrial supplier. All Stuey ever goes to is Sears and Amazon.
Also, why bother with places like Grainger that give me a hard time about not purchasing with official account numbers. I tried placing an order with them with a CC and they gave me such trouble about not using my employer's official account number.
I checked my local Fastenal out - they had a paltry selection, and what they had was expensive. I used to buy aluminum sheeting locally, until I saw how much more expensive and limited in selection they were compared to online shops.
Computer parts are the same. I used to patronize local computer parts shops, but their selection is almost non-existent, their prices are higher, and their sales staff almost brainless.
Once my finances permit, I'll send a large order towards Harry Epstein to try out a few new random brands.
Also, Merkava, Amazon is absorbing distributors like you wouldn't believe. Online Metal's Amazon store has the same prices as their standalone shop, but in some cases with several dollars cheaper shipping. Amazon also apparently absorbed Small Parts Inc. On Small Parts' website, they have some vague wording about being a subsidary of Amazon.
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Merkava_4
Banned
I just want you to walk into one of your local industrial suppliers ... and I don't mean Fastenal or Grainger because they don't fall under my definition of LOCAL industrial suppliers because they're bureaucratic chain gangs. Usually an industrial supplier will be a fixed base operator and will be called (someone's "last name) Industrial."
That's why I wanted you to narrow down your location so that I could run a yellow page search of industrial suppliers in your area ... but instead I ran into a wall of National Security Agency secrecy.
Uncle Buck
Banned
In my town I would consider anything like Grainger that has a store I can go in and order at a counter, or they have a showroom to be an industrial supplier. In my case today I visited a store named White Star Machinery, and another named Salisbury Supply. Both of these stores cater mainly to contractors and construction companies much more so than a Grainger or MSC would. But both do carry a good amount of goods that would be of interest to folks working on vehicles as well. Both stores have wall boards with Proto tools, OTC pullers, and mainly name brand quality hand tools.
Don't ever underestimate the goodies you can find in stores like this. The only thing you generally do not find in most stores like I have described are bargains. If you are looking for bargains you had best look elsewhere!
Stuey
Well-known member
If it makes you feel better, back when I was in high school, I used to head over to Canal St. and check out the industrial plastic supplies shops. When I went back there two years after I graduated, they all closed down.I just want you to walk into one of your local industrial suppliers ... and I don't mean Fastenal or Grainger because they don't fall under my definition of LOCAL industrial suppliers because they're bureaucratic chain gangs. Usually an industrial supplier will be a fixed base operator and will be called (someone's "last name) Industrial."
That's why I wanted you to narrow down your location so that I could run a yellow page search of industrial suppliers in your area ... but instead I ran into a wall of National Security Agency secrecy.
Heck, I don't even head into Airgas, and there's one not too far from me. I suppose it's the way of my generation. There are no moms and pops near me, or else things might be different. When I was a kid, I remember my father having to hustle to the plumbing supply store to pick up a random washer or similar part. They closed at 3, and nobody else had the part. These days, if I need to replace a washer, o-ring, or grommet, I pull out some calipers, order it online, and BAM it's to my door sooner than I could head out to the nearest shop.
Back to the point... made in China vise-grips...
Merkava_4
Banned
Stuey
Well-known member
Yea, I know, but if I'm going to go out of my way to find a local store, I usually prefer them to be filled with knowledgable & friendly folk.I wasn't referring to mom and pop shops.
An associate at the last privately owned electronics' supply shop I've been to asked me if I wanted to purchase anything else besides the "capacitators" that I brought to the counter.
I just don't see what I'm missing out on by shopping for personal use industrial supplies online.
Merkava_4
Banned
Shocker
Well-known member
So Merkava, can you explain what you mean by local shop? If I shop at Grainger, Fastenal etc, that is not local due to it being a chain. But mom and pop shops don't count either.
What is your criteria? I am just wondering. It seems like you are just trolling right now, but it would be cool to understand what you are trying to tell us.
What is your criteria? I am just wondering. It seems like you are just trolling right now, but it would be cool to understand what you are trying to tell us.
Merkava_4
Banned
Well, you'll start off with a 5000 square foot building or so. Then you'll add a customer entrance where the customer walks into a small show room of about 1200 square feet displaying a select assortment of products they have for you to pick up and examine closely.
Then you'll add a front counter. Behind that front counter will be some guys sitting behind desks that have their first name routered into a block of wood mounted on the front of the desk. Surrounding each desk will be couple of book cases lined up with catalogs in thick binders for the guys to have quick reference to. They'll each have their own telephone on the desk.
Behind those guys will be a hallway leading off to a large closed off office where the main boss will be with a great big padded swivel chair. In the rooms across the adjacent hallway will be the bookkeeper's office I suppose.
To the right of the front counter will be some double doors leading off into the warehouse where you will find row upon row of shelving with cardboard trays containing all kinds of sweet industrial tools and tooling parts for machinery.
Off to the right will be two large roll up doors where guys on fork lifts will be going in and out with pallets of good stuff from the smaller adjacent 3000 square foot building; which is the receiving area.