Kreg Pocket Hole Jig

[theoldwizard1]

2 thumbs up !

Most woodworkers probably have one (or a better equivalent) but anyone who does even occasional work with wood should strongly consider one.

I was working on a small project the other day and needed to **** the end of a 2x4 into the face of another 2x4. It was late so I tried the old pilot hole method. After 3 or 4 I gave up and called it a night.

Later I remembered I had bought a Kreg Pocket Hole Jig for myself as a Christmas present and had never used it ! Next day, I disassembled my mess, drill pocket hole and drove in the special course thread screws (I bought extras at with the it). Now those are some strong joints !

You do need a wide opening locking pliers (I have a cheap HF pair) and if your work piece is small, some way to clamp it. After that, its a breeze !

The only issue I had was driving the screws. The hole were in tight quarters and the 6" Robertson (square) drive bit did not allow me to use my impact driver. My arms are a bit sore after driving 32 screws in by hand.



Anyone know of a cheap source for the equivalent Kreg "washer head" screws ?

 

[ez-duzit]

There must be plenty of uses for one of these jigs but I have always found better ways of creating a wood joint than 2 screws, close together, in end grain. Tenons, dowels, biscuits, splines, slip feathers--this is for cabinet work, not house framing. But I'd be interested to learn if there are any applications where the pocket hole creates a better joint than a properly designed traditional method.

For driving screws in close quarters I highly recommend the old Sioux or Milwaukee (original) close quarters drill (angle head). The newer versions are only ok.

 

[NoahG]

The pocket hole method is for fast assembly. Sure, you could make stronger joints in the ways you mentioned, but when things need to get done, its a go-to. I build scenery for a living and we have found the Kreg jig to be a great way to build prop furniture, window frames, prop cabinets and all sorts of decorative set items. If you glue and screw, the Kreg joints are surprisingly strong. Also, the only power tool required is a drill/driver. I really like the Kreg jig. Its cheap and it works.

As for the screws themselves, check out McFeelys.com. Also perhaps Fastenal. I agree, the Kreg brand screws are a tad expensive, but they're basically just course or fine Robertson drive pan head screws with a self-drilling tip.

 

[Pinz73]

They are very strong and incredibly fast and easy to align. I just picked up a 500 box of the 1 1/4" coarse screws for $18. I didn't think that was bad.

I have the HD block too, for the larger coated outdoor screws. Great.

 

[cheechi]

I remember reading that sometimes (yeah i know) the amazon price for the big bags of screws is pretty good.

Basically any place that sells hardware is going to sell them, and if you can get them in 1000+ qty you're going to get the best deal. whether there's differences in what that best deal is, I can't say.

 

[Tom Hintz]

2 thumbs up !

Most woodworkers probably have one (or a better equivalent) but anyone who does even occasional work with wood should strongly consider one.

I was working on a small project the other day and needed to **** the end of a 2x4 into the face of another 2x4. It was late so I tried the old pilot hole method. After 3 or 4 I gave up and called it a night.

Later I remembered I had bought a Kreg Pocket Hole Jig for myself as a Christmas present and had never used it ! Next day, I disassembled my mess, drill pocket hole and drove in the special course thread screws (I bought extras at with the it). Now those are some strong joints !

You do need a wide opening locking pliers (I have a cheap HF pair) and if your work piece is small, some way to clamp it. After that, its a breeze !

The only issue I had was driving the screws. The hole were in tight quarters and the 6" Robertson (square) drive bit did not allow me to use my impact driver. My arms are a bit sore after driving 32 screws in by hand.



Anyone know of a cheap source for the equivalent Kreg "washer head" screws ?

I was a diss-believer for a long time then got a kit and tried it. I then got way involved and did a bunch of break tests of these joints and was amazed at how well they hold. I'm sure a good mortise and tenon is stronger but barring an act of war or something similar the Kreg joints hold up fine. I have a large oak frame and panel door made with these things that is as square as the day we hung it.

 

[volleyball]

I bought one when I was far from home to replace box fronts of some carpenter built kitchen cabinets. Made a good hidden fastener joint with hand tools.

 

[IndyGarage]

Ever since I got one, I no longer have a use for my old biscuit joiner. Might as well give it away.

I got a Kreg Pro set - which has the jig set up in a clamp with some risers to hold everything off the table. I mounted it on a piece of 3/4 inch plywood and mounted a length of 4x4 on the underside. I clamp it into my Jawhorse and have the perfect setup for doing fast joints.

What I like about the Kreg is that it's accurate and it is self clamping with instant hold. Even with biscuits you have to clamp things down tight for a half hour or so. And if you use glue, the joints are really strong. I've built several plywood shelves in the garage - It takes no time at all. I built a hardwood fireplace surround the other day in about an hour.

 

[Zrexxer]

I remember reading that sometimes (yeah i know) the amazon price for the big bags of screws is pretty good.

Yes, I was about to say Amazon, too. Especially if you're a Prime member. I bought a bunch of different sizes there recently.

 

[Regnar]

But I'd be interested to learn if there are any applications where the pocket hole creates a better joint than a properly designed traditional method.

Maybe not better but almost as good. Here is a test that was done on all the joints you mentioned. http://woodgears.ca/joint_strength/



Things to note from the test is he used Drywall Screws and not Pan Head Washer screws. Another thing to notice is he didn't use any glue with the Pocket hole joinery. No offence but Dowels, Biscuits and M&T are worthless without glue.



No one joint is the answer for everything. With proper engineering of the project and consideration of time and money I think any one of them are just as good as the other.



I use McFeelys.com as well. Not cheap but not as expensive as HD and Lowes.



They also make a 3" driver to get into tight spots. I use a 12v Ridgid bat drill to do most of my driving. I like the clutch so I dont blast the screw through something.

 

[metal1313]

now thats an impressive jig. what kind of clamp is that?

 

[ez-duzit]

Maybe not better but almost as good...

I guess almost as good is good enough for most craftsmen.

 

[theoldwizard1]

My brother in law built a made a custom fit, kitchen hutch for my sister in law (his sister). It was all hardwood. The top was 2-3" strips run through a jointer, edge glued and screwed together with Kreg pocket holes and screws.

The face frames were applied with with Kreg pocket screws. Door rails and stile were assembled with glue and Kreg pocket holes and screws and plugged.

One of biggest mistakes that rookies make is to make a joint screwing into end grain, especially when it is something simple made out of 2by material. Kreg pocket holes are much stronger, but even better would be a couple 1/2" holes through drilled into the end grain while the pieces are clamped together (including clamping with temporary screws). The holes should go at least 2" into the end grain. Use 1/2" hardwood dowel to hold the joint and remove the temporary screws.

 

[Regnar]

now thats an impressive jig. what kind of clamp is that?

Its a 1.75" pneumatic cylinder with a rubber pad on it. My Kreg Jig was the Kreg Jr and I was getting tired of using a clamp to hold the jig in place. I came up with this little guy. It allows you to change height and have a vacuum come out the bottom. Cylinder is activated by a 3 way foot valve. I am in the designing phase of a Diy Kreg Foreman just need to iron out a few things.

 

[cagullett1]

I just ordered a box of 1000 screws from Amazon for $25. I bought a box of 100 to start off with and thought that would last me through a few projects. After building a 4' tall bookshelf for my daughter and using the Kreg jig to pretty much attach everything including shelves, face frame, and top, I went through 90% of the box. 1000 screws will last a while, but will be the primary screw I use for most projects with birch ply and 1x boards.

http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00002240N/ref=ox_sc_act_title_4?ie=UTF8&psc=1&smid=ATVPDKIKX0DER

 

[DenisG]

Maybe not better but almost as good. Here is a test that was done on all the joints you mentioned. http://woodgears.ca/joint_strength/

Things to note from the test is he used Drywall Screws and not Pan Head Washer screws. Another thing to notice is he didn't use any glue with the Pocket hole joinery. No offence but Dowels, Biscuits and M&T are worthless without glue.

<snip>

Matthias Wandel -- I love his projects, he never fails to impress me.

 

[mtnwalton]

The pocket hole method is for fast assembly. Sure, you could make stronger joints in the ways you mentioned, but when things need to get done, its a go-to. I build scenery for a living and we have found the Kreg jig to be a great way to build prop furniture, window frames, prop cabinets and all sorts of decorative set items. If you glue and screw, the Kreg joints are surprisingly strong. Also, the only power tool required is a drill/driver. I really like the Kreg jig. Its cheap and it works.

As for the screws themselves, check out McFeelys.com. Also perhaps Fastenal. I agree, the Kreg brand screws are a tad expensive, but they're basically just course or fine Robertson drive pan head screws with a self-drilling tip.

+1 ; I moved from air nailers and screws on sets a few years ago. For building flats or almost anything in the scene shop it's a first choice.

 

[mattygee]

I have made the conversion to pocket hole joinery also... so nice being able to forgo those 6 foot clamps and cure time... though the method does leave a large entry wound that has to be considered in the design of whatever you're building.

 

[diebog]

These are really awesome tools! I have just the small kit which I use from time to time in the granite counter top business and let me tell you this come in handy allot! Say you need to glue and screw two pieces of plywood together, or reinforce some hack cabinet guys work, this little kit has payed for itself a bunch of times.

Only draw back is how much the screws cost. Given I don't burn through allot, but they seem to pretty quick. I like the idea of buying in bulk at 1,000ct. I use allot of 3" and 1 3/4" star T25 head screws as well. Does anyone know of a place that sells bulk screws?

 

[bareass172]

I also bought my screws on Amazon, they were the cheapest at the time. As far as function, I suppose some would argue all day about the "proper" way and strength. I think that all types of joinery have their place. I still do a lot of traditional stuff when building, but what I've taken to using the Kreg for is building quick throw-together stuff that I don't need to last forever (like the set design guys above) or I use them as a sort of clamp to hold things until glue sets. I built my workbench top out of several pieces of 2x joined together on edge. Top was 11 feet long or so, so I used biscuits for alignment so I could slap glue in the joint, get the boards lined up and clamped and then I ran pocket screws along the board to hold them together. Then I could undo the clamps and move on to the next board, rinse/repeat until the entire top was together. Works for me...

 

[Beenman]

How affordable are these Kreg jigs in the States? Over here they are priced so freakin' high I can't see how the average DIY'er can afford to use them.

 

[NUTTSGT]

How affordable are these Kreg jigs in the States? Over here they are priced so freakin' high I can't see how the average DIY'er can afford to use them.

I paid about $140 for my kit at Menards, it was the Kreg K4 Master kit. I also picked up some extra screws when I bought it too.


I bought a cheap pair of knock off locking pliers to test a copy of the Kreg pliers. They do work as I have used both pair at the same time.

 

[Beenman]

I paid about $140 for my kit at Menards, it was the Kreg K4 Master kit. I also picked up some extra screws when I bought it too.


I bought a cheap pair of knock off locking pliers to test a copy of the Kreg pliers. They do work as I have used both pair at the same time.


[/URL]

I'll check our pricing again this weekend, but I recall the master system being well over $200 equivalent here, and the locking pliers are over $60 each.

 

[cagullett1]

I'll check our pricing again this weekend, but I recall the master system being well over $200 equivalent here, and the locking pliers are over $60 each.

Wow! I paid $20 for the locking pliers and $30 for the R3. I kept contemplating getting the Master system but decided it could be a pain if I'm wanting to put pocket holes in large boards. I figure it's easier to take the jig to a large piece, rather than trying to fit a large piece into the jig on my workbench (which isn't huge).

 

[Beenman]

Wow! I paid $20 for the locking pliers and $30 for the R3. I kept contemplating getting the Master system but decided it could be a pain if I'm wanting to put pocket holes in large boards. I figure it's easier to take the jig to a large piece, rather than trying to fit a large piece into the jig on my workbench (which isn't huge).

We have stupid *** import duties on most goods imported to this country.

 

[Kevin54]

How affordable are these Kreg jigs in the States? Over here they are priced so freakin' high I can't see how the average DIY'er can afford to use them.

Here you go http://www.kregtool.com/default.html They are affordable and have varying prices for various jigs. And Kreg keeps coming out with other fantastic items other than just the drill jigs. You'll have to look through the site and check it out.

Also, and for ones that may not know, you can send in ideas to Kreg for a tool that they may not be making yet. If they use your idea, I don't know what you get, but it is the chance to get a tool into production from your idea that others can find useful too.

And don't forget to sign up for their newsletter. It will tell you of new tools coming out, and also ideas from other members on the site. They have one section of projects ranging from A-Z and then some.

 

[theoldwizard1]

I bought a Kreg R3 Jr kit and a couple of boxes of extra screws from Amazon for about $55.

If you can get free shipping from Amazon, their prices for quantity 250 and 1000 are pretty good. Without free shipping go to eBay.

You had better think twice about using stainless steel screws ! $$$

 

[Regnar]

I bought a cheap pair of knock off locking pliers to test a copy of the Kreg pliers. They do work as I have used both pair at the same time.

I like it. Rather than a washer I will try welding on some 3/8 bolts.

 

[bareass172]

I see them pop up on Craigslist from time to time. I was patient and waited and I got the master set for $45 this way. Opened it up and it was still in the plastic and had never been used. I've seen them a few times before and after at ~$50.

 

[NoahG]

One source for screws.

http://www.mcfeelys.com/sub_category.aspx?id=45423

 

[Chasbec]

I love my Kreg system. It's become one of my favorite tools. It's great for down and dirty shop fixtures or any joinery as long as you can hide the holes. If you use the screws and glue, it makes a very secure bond and no clamps are needed!

 

[aka Larry]

I have the R3 and used it to build the face frames on the doors on the cabinet I made for the shop. It worked great in that application but that wasn't two members at 90 degrees to each other either. I see Amazon has the clamp but I'd want to get two for longer pieces and they are kinda pricey at $25 each IMO.

What are the opinions on the Kreg right angle clamp? Worth it or not?

 

[cagullett1]

I have the R3 and used it to build the face frames on the doors on the cabinet I made for the shop. It worked great in that application but that wasn't two members at 90 degrees to each other either. I see Amazon has the clamp but I'd want to get two for longer pieces and they are kinda pricey at $25 each IMO.

What are the opinions on the Kreg right angle clamp? Worth it or not?

I'm not sure I would like the jig if I didn't have one of these clamps. I'm waiting for the price to drop a few bucks and I will be buying atleast 1 more.

 

[GirlnAgarage]

I also give a thumbs up to the Kreg pocket jig. Some of us aren't/don't/won't intend or pretend to be master wood craftsman with all the master wood craftsman tools or floor space or bench space to setup a full workshop to install some boards flush. Kreg does an appropriate job for the project when you're not "all in" for woodworking.

I purchased the Pocket Hole Jig System for $99 at Lowes. Works fine for the random projects. Grabbed an extra 6" Robertson bit and the 3" for those tighter spots. Used the impact driver to set the screws.

First one was the shop stand for my DP. Only 16 holes but pretty handy. Without the method I'd have had to put the stretchers on the outside of the frame, would have changed the whole look. To hold the workpieces secure while driving the screws I clamped the pieces to the workbench. Worked fine. I thin the 90* pocket hole clamp looks handy though.

I keep intending to repair a busted kitchen chair. But ehh, it earned it's keep being 10yrs old.

 

[Kevin54]

This has to be a GJ first. 34 replies and not one person pitching a ***** about a product. If that doesn't tell you that a Kreg system must be pretty damn good, nothing will

 

[crucible]

I got a master set for a Christmas gift from my wife; I tried it out for a support beam on the farmhouse-style bed I'm building and it worked well. I've got a farmhouse-style dining table on the honey-do list next and that's where it will get serious use with multiple iterations on most every board save for the legs.

I really don't see why one would use more complicated means of joinery unless they simply want to.

 

[Zeke]

This has to be a GJ first. 34 replies and not one person pitching a ***** about a product. If that doesn't tell you that a Kreg system must be pretty damn good, nothing will

Hah! Kevin, look at post #2. didn't even make it out of the starting gate.

 

[cagullett1]

I got a master set for a Christmas gift from my wife; I tried it out for a support beam on the farmhouse-style bed I'm building and it worked well. I've got a farmhouse-style dining table on the honey-do list next and that's where it will get serious use with multiple iterations on most every board save for the legs.

I really don't see why one would use more complicated means of joinery unless they simply want to.

Pics of the bed?

 

[Kevin54]

Hah! Kevin, look at post #2. didn't even make it out of the starting gate.

I missed that one for sure.

BTW Zeke.....It's hard to recognize you now since you got your pony tail cut off and don't have your had on. You clean up pretty nice.

 

[Zeke]

I missed that one for sure.

BTW Zeke.....It's hard to recognize you now since you got your pony tail cut off and don't have your had on. You clean up pretty nice.

Ah, but I've got the beak.