Yes, new Starrett. I don't see any COO markings. Starrett seems very clandestine with COO.
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Made in USA but not marked on tool
- Thread starter bw77
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Yes, new Starrett. I don't see any COO markings. Starrett seems very clandestine with COO.
bob15
Well-known member
They used to mark their tools Athol, Mass. New stuff isn't always marked as such now. I have a 0-1" mic that has paperwork saying US made, but the tool doesn't say anything. I actually question much of what they make now, as they are making a lot of stuff in china, and still getting top dollar for it.
bob15
Well-known member
These are newSays right on the dial...
And these starretts are made in china:
http://www.grainger.com/product/2ZUE3?cm_sp=HIO-_-Home-_-VTV70300505&cm_vc=HPPVZ11
These are new
Why do they choose "American made" instead of "USA made"? Much shorter. There is South America and North America.
Look to the left... Athol, Mass. USA
That's their corp. address.
I'm curious if their Chinese tools also say "Athol, Mass" under the Starrett name but without any "made in ___" markings?
With Starrett, it's never real clear what you're getting. (at least that's been my recent experience).
sonvolt
Well-known member
And they want $255.00 Grainger is fing nuts !
That is the address of the company headquarter, not necessary where the tools are made. They have manufacturing plants all over the world.
purplezr2
Well-known member
Believe it or not, not everyone in the world thinks that american made is better.
Bobcat only puts the "made in the USA" stickers on domestic market machines. You can tell an international unit as it doesn't have a made in the USA sticker on the boom. It was said the that the international market didn't see it as a positive thing. Cost extra money to put that sticker on too. I know everyone says it cheap, but think about it this way.
You have to have the following just for the sticker,
1. PN-part number maintenance cost money
2. Print for the sticker itself, and the sticker location(2 prints that need to be maintained and changed)
3. Buyer for the sticker(more time for the buyer that typically does stickers)
4. Inventory(everything takes up space)
5. Floor spaces on the line
6. Cleaner(for before you apply the sticker)
7. Jig for sticker install(cost time/money and they wear out)
8. Operator to install the sticker
9. Trash can for backing.
Not as easy as it looks to just add something during manufacturing.
Bobcat only puts the "made in the USA" stickers on domestic market machines. You can tell an international unit as it doesn't have a made in the USA sticker on the boom. It was said the that the international market didn't see it as a positive thing. Cost extra money to put that sticker on too. I know everyone says it cheap, but think about it this way.
You have to have the following just for the sticker,
1. PN-part number maintenance cost money
2. Print for the sticker itself, and the sticker location(2 prints that need to be maintained and changed)
3. Buyer for the sticker(more time for the buyer that typically does stickers)
4. Inventory(everything takes up space)
5. Floor spaces on the line
6. Cleaner(for before you apply the sticker)
7. Jig for sticker install(cost time/money and they wear out)
8. Operator to install the sticker
9. Trash can for backing.
Not as easy as it looks to just add something during manufacturing.
I always email or call their support line before I buy anything new - I only have US made stuff from Starrett, but you've gotta be wise and pick what you need, not what you want. They'll let you know if you ask.
For example, their regular solid squares aren't US made... but the "master" ones are. They're also ridiculously expensive.
egnorant
Well-known member
This is what I call a rationalization for mediocrity. While market pressures will make some changes necessary, sometimes the line between fat trimming and bleeding it dry is hard for some to notice.
A small change that has a profitable effect lends a little confidence in the next change ...and the next until the changes may show an initial profit but cause a loss in confidence among consumers.
Scrambling to maintain profit margins lead to moves that are bad for the final consumer as the product is outsourced (Sears) or their name is used on various **** products (Snap-On).
Taking "Made in U.S.A." off of tools is a precursor to tools not being made in the U.S.A.
To the darker side you have to examine that a tool or part that is stamped "Made in U.S.A." would be hard to import (not impossible) while some guy slapping stickers or 20 seconds on the computer can put "Made in U.S.A." on the package graphics would be harder to track.
I can imagine so many "hijinks" that can be pulled involving laws, inspections, inventory and shipping confusion, slap on the wrist fines and even outright bribes and some changes such as removing "Made in U.S.A." just makes it easier.
I won't buy "Made in U.S.A." **** tools more than any other **** tool available. But if you dilute that label it is the consumer who gets the short end of the wrench.
Bruce
chadster1
Well-known member
74.83% of statistics posted in internet forums are totally made up.
dleonard1122
Well-known member
Please pardon me for being alittle skeptical but, whenever someone on an Internet forum says they know something for fact, red flags immediately go up.
I don't doubt you have experience in this, but I can't imagine here isn't at least one tool company producing in the USA that isn't stamping their tools.
If it's not stamped on the tool, the packaging says it's Made in USA, and it is NOT Made in USA, then it is a fraudulent claim, which is both illegal (and subject to gov't action) and may be actionable by private parties under the Lanham Act.
I bet...
"American made" is a term not regulated by the FTC so companies can play fast and loose with it if they choose to deceive their customers. Technically, that caliper is probably assembled in the USA w/global components.
Like the new Dewalt's that say "Built in". Again a term probably not regulated by the FTC and used by a company to be deceitful about either content or place of assembly/manufacture. Content in the Dewalt case.
nicksnothereman
Well-known member
What if it's marked on the handle and the handle ink wears off? SOL right?
I think I have stuff like that (cutters, snips, pair of channelock (maybe, not sure if they're stamped under the handle, not interested in removing it to find out honestly)), it doesn't bother me because I don't got no one to impress.
Does proto offer anything made outside the usa?
Is that gearwrench feeler stamped with their logo or just thrown in the package (bulk repackage)?
I asked my Snap-On guy about this recently and he told me they were made using "global components" for a short time. Not sure if this is actually true or not, but none of my dual-80's are stamped "USA". Regardless they're still the best ratchets I own.
Correct me if i'm wrong, but i'm pretty sure i read on this forum that all the dual 80 guts are made in spain.
dadsEH
Well-known member
On a lighter note.... im grocery shopping with the missus and ask for a lb of bacon at the deli counter, there is a sign next to the bacon display....
'Made from local and imported ingredients'....
So I ask the lady behind the counter, " what part of the pig was imported?"
Answer...." huh?"
'Made from local and imported ingredients'....
So I ask the lady behind the counter, " what part of the pig was imported?"
Answer...." huh?"
It was a rumor floating around that had no fact in it. Snap on lists coo on their website for all dual 80 rats as USA. They took the USA stamp off and people lost their minds on here. USA is now on the handle rather than the head as it was probably a cheaper fix to stamp it there then change the complete tooling for the head.
chadster1
Well-known member
You are wrong, consider yourself corrected.
4x4gearhead
Well-known member
Just saw this the other day on some new ratchets on the truck. It's about time...I get that outside the US the world hates us but christ, just stamp it! We have to live with their markings! What do we have to lose?
Leaflessshadetree
Well-known member
GSMotorrad
Well-known member
- Joined
- Mar 8, 2012
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If the COO isn't stamped, I'll forget after a few years, and I usually keep tools forever. I also don't like the cheaper stuff I have that doesn't even have the brand anywhere, like some Harbor Freight and Neiko tools. I'll soon forget who made the tool and then never be able to warranty it.
I've had some Snap-On dykes, where the laser engraving wore off. The tool truck guy almost didn't warranty them, saying he couldn't tell they were Snap-On brand and I should consider myself lucky that he decided to trust me and eventually warrantied them out, but told me to make sure the brandings don't wear off in the future.
I wouldn't want to buy Sterling Silver if it wasn't stamped, "925" or "Sterling" or whatever, and it would be harder to sell. Same goes for gold or other precious metals - that stamp is important to me.
Without the made in USA stamp, I automatically assume the worst, that they're made in China - because it's usually the Chinese made stuff that isn't proud enough to flaunt their COO with a stamp.
It might be an age thing. I'm older and I come from a time when Made In USA stamps meant the best quality, and that's a hard thing to let go of.
I have a Strider knife that doesn't have the USA marking - they removed the USA stamps about the same time that counterfeits were coming out of China. I know my knife is the real thing, but it might make it harder to sell if it ever came to that. I think they started stamping them again now, so mine seems even more like a counterfeit one, to the layman.
I think it can affect the resale value without the stamp, if that's important to you. The stamp also invokes a feeling of pride in my hand whenever I hold a tool. Like they were proud enough to display that mark of excellence.
I like roll stamps. It's like the artist's signature on a work of art. When the tools become antiquated, and someday appear on Antiques Roadshow, I'd think its value would be greater with a prominent COO stamp.
I've had some Snap-On dykes, where the laser engraving wore off. The tool truck guy almost didn't warranty them, saying he couldn't tell they were Snap-On brand and I should consider myself lucky that he decided to trust me and eventually warrantied them out, but told me to make sure the brandings don't wear off in the future.
I wouldn't want to buy Sterling Silver if it wasn't stamped, "925" or "Sterling" or whatever, and it would be harder to sell. Same goes for gold or other precious metals - that stamp is important to me.
Without the made in USA stamp, I automatically assume the worst, that they're made in China - because it's usually the Chinese made stuff that isn't proud enough to flaunt their COO with a stamp.
It might be an age thing. I'm older and I come from a time when Made In USA stamps meant the best quality, and that's a hard thing to let go of.
I have a Strider knife that doesn't have the USA marking - they removed the USA stamps about the same time that counterfeits were coming out of China. I know my knife is the real thing, but it might make it harder to sell if it ever came to that. I think they started stamping them again now, so mine seems even more like a counterfeit one, to the layman.
I think it can affect the resale value without the stamp, if that's important to you. The stamp also invokes a feeling of pride in my hand whenever I hold a tool. Like they were proud enough to display that mark of excellence.
I like roll stamps. It's like the artist's signature on a work of art. When the tools become antiquated, and someday appear on Antiques Roadshow, I'd think its value would be greater with a prominent COO stamp.
Fretters
Well-known member
We don't hate you...
We just tend to class you akin to that type of relative who turns up once a year and empties your booze cabinet then proceeds to embarrass themselves and everybody else, so you tend to keep them at arms length whenever possible....
On a plus point...Hold on, I'll think of something to say in a bit on that front. Honest.
Any idea where the snap-on/Bahco dual 80 guts are made?
bcradio
Well-known member
No way, no how is this true in any way... but I did get a good chuckle.
I prefer my tools to be made on the moon
chadster1
Well-known member
The Snap-on guts are made here.
https://www.google.com/maps/place/S...ata=!3m1!4b1!4m2!3m1!1s0x0:0xb65a1f627b556d9b
I would assume the Bahco guts are made wherever those ratchets are made
purplezr2
Well-known member
Hmmm, I wasn't made in the US, just an import.....
ArcStyles
Well-known member
All tools have the same thing in common, they are all made on Earth. Some earthly tools are better than others. I happen to like the better earthly tools. If an Earthling happens to make a better tool than another Earthling, I will buy from said Earthing. I get a much larger palette to choose from and am not limited by my prejudices.
How rich the painting that has all the colors for which to choose from...
My "POO" (Planet Of Origin) is Made on Earth, you'll never see a Made on Mars tool in my box!! Fck you Mars and your Martian ways!!
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How rich the painting that has all the colors for which to choose from...
My "POO" (Planet Of Origin) is Made on Earth, you'll never see a Made on Mars tool in my box!! Fck you Mars and your Martian ways!!
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Hmmm....
warmpancakes thinks differently. I know it's an old thread. I guess the guts are USA now?
http://www.garagejournal.com/forum/showthread.php?t=78072&highlight=dual+guts
Actually, they can't be. The law, the regulations, and the case law clearly govern such matters. Saying "built in" is the same as saying "assembled", and if it says assembled, then the bulk of the assembly has to take place in the US of A. Saying "American made" will lead purchasers of the product to believe that it is Made in USA, and it is therefore governed by the same requirements as "Made in USA." Slapping a bunch of flag graphics on your packaging, and marketing under the name "American Tool & Die" does not, however, imply or claim to be Made in USA, which is why we have such unregulated wonders as Chicago Electric and Pittsburgh, neither brand having anything to do with their namesakes except for some Harbor Freight stores in the vicinity.
It isn't merely the terms themselves that are regulated, but more expansively, the CLAIMS, whether expressed or implied.
My "POO" (Planet Of Origin) is Made on Earth, you'll never see a Made on Mars tool in my box!! Fck you Mars and your Martian ways!!
I hope you've got Slim Whitman cranked to 11 while you're hosing down that expired Thoat with a fusilade of Pb
Well, we may only show up on occasion, and empty the booze cabinet, but we tend to bring plenty of beans and bullets to the party, so we ALL can deal with the ruffians and have a good meal. ( Plus, you gotta admit, we DO share when we're emptying your booze cabinet.We don't hate you...
We just tend to class you akin to that type of relative who turns up once a year and empties your booze cabinet then proceeds to embarrass themselves and everybody else, so you tend to keep them at arms length whenever possible....
Hold on, I'll think of something to say in a bit on that front. Honest.
)
Now, what I wonder is this: other than the realm of woodworking tools, are there any good to great English hand tools in production today?
Fretters
Well-known member
( Plus, you gotta admit, we DO share when we're emptying your booze cabinet.
Well, you know what they say. No one likes to drink alone.
I can't think of any offhand.
"Made in USA but not marked on tool". I have an issue with this. I purchased a a Warn brand receiver shackle mount a few years back. I paid more to get the Warn because it said "Made in USA" on the box. When I opened the box it said "Korea" on the shackle mount. I immediately called Warn and was told the box is made in USA, not the contents. F-in scumbags.
"Made in USA but not marked on tool". I have an issue with this. I purchased a a Warn brand receiver shackle mount a few years back. I paid more to get the Warn because it said "Made in USA" on the box. When I opened the box it said "Korea" on the shackle mount. I immediately called Warn and was told the box is made in USA, not the contents. F-in scumbags.
Oh that's BS right there! I would be so damn pissed off. They should not be allowed to get away with that!
SMKS
Well-known member
"Made in USA but not marked on tool". I have an issue with this. I purchased a a Warn brand receiver shackle mount a few years back. I paid more to get the Warn because it said "Made in USA" on the box. When I opened the box it said "Korea" on the shackle mount. I immediately called Warn and was told the box is made in USA, not the contents. F-in scumbags.
EDIT- I just read some reviews saying parts of Warn shackles are imported. Likely the actual explanation is that just a part of it was imported, and they either labeled it "made in the USA" because they considered that not a violation of the "all or virtual all rule," or the company labeled it as "assembled in the USA" or something similar.
Either way, the explanation of the box being made in the USA definitely appears to be a violation.
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If this story is accurate than it pretty clearly is a violation of the "made in the USA" labeling rules from the FTC.
Here are the rules:
http://www.business.ftc.gov/documents/bus03-complying-made-usa-standard
If it's something that happened recently, I would report it. Here's what the page says about reporting violations:
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