Champion R15A or R15B or GD?

[guitar jesus]

Posted this in the wrong forum first, oops

Hey guys, Jeff here. I bought an older pump in fairly decent shape for $100. Crankcase says m-1820, but no other real indentifiers for what it is. I've read possibly a R15A or R15B Champion? Or possibly a Gardner Denver? I'm not sure how to differentiate between the two variations of compressor pump.

Help is appreciated, I wanted to rebuild it and clean it up. Thanks guys.

I'll post pictures later tonight if that helps anybody in identifying this for me.

 

[malibu101]

My R15B has the same casting numbers on the crankcase.
A picture is needed.

 

[metal4130]

The crank case between the R15A and B would be the same I believe. Also you could have an R10A or B. The big difference between the 10 and 15 I believe is the crankshaft

Lastly, the difference between the A and B models are the style of air intake manifold. If this is a round air filter the size of a soda can it is the older model.

 

[guitar jesus]

I'll get some pictures today after work, but man I hope its a R15. 23.4cfm @7.5hp sounds a lot better than 8cfm at 2hp. And my tank is 80 gallons. That will burn out a 2hp motor fairly quick I'd think.

 

[b-body-bob]

The crank case between the R15A and B would be the same I believe. Also you could have an R10A or B. The big difference between the 10 and 15 I believe is the crankshaft

Lastly, the difference between the A and B models are the style of air intake manifold. If this is a round air filter the size of a soda can it is the older model.

B and later all valves are different sizes so it's impossible to put one in the wrong place.

This has everything you need to know about an R10/15 pump - https://www.flamingoshopserv.com/portals/2/news/partsbreakdown/champion r15 breakdown.pdf

 

[guitar jesus]

free image uploader

 

[guitar jesus]

I guess if the only way to tell is by the stroke since I plan on a rebuild, I'll take the head and valves off and look at how long the stroke is.

 

[guitar jesus]

Took the head off:



See the length of the stroke:



Crank is stamped R15-5! Woohoo!



Definitely awesome news. With the look of the head, I'd say ive got a R15A. Nothing wrong with that, they have the same specs air-wise.

 

[b-body-bob]

Does it have a hand-hole to get inside the crankcase without pulling the head? I just remembered that is another difference - the hand-hole was eliminated with the R15B. I want to say it's in the bottom of the crankcase but could be wrong since mine is an R15B.

 

[guitar jesus]

Does it have a hand-hole to get inside the crankcase without pulling the head? I just remembered that is another difference - the hand-hole was eliminated with the R15B. I want to say it's in the bottom of the crankcase but could be wrong since mine is an R15B.

I think I read somewhere that it was jist the R15 that had the hand hole, the R15A didnt have it. I could be wrong. Mine has no hand hole. And the air intake doesnt have the hole on top of the manifold for an air filter, its on the bottom, which would leave me to believe its an R15A. As well as the intercooler pipe is more round at the bottom, if you see an R15B pipe, its more squared at the bottom.

 

[guitar jesus]

Oh yeah, and the low pressure intake valves look like they are the same size, you said the 15B models went with all different sized valves.

 

[b-body-bob]

I see what you mean on the air filter, looking at photos of my pump. The jug is a lot different too, the corners of the finned area are more rounded on mine. The fins on the top of mine run the opposite direction too.

I'm positive about the valves because I ordered the wrong gasket set and they didn't all fit.

 

[guitar jesus]

I see what you mean on the air filter, looking at photos of my pump. The jug is a lot different too, the corners of the finned area are more rounded on mine. The fins on the top of mine run the opposite direction too.

I'm positive about the valves because I ordered the wrong gasket set and they didn't all fit.

Just because I like the look I wonder if I can use the LP intake manifold to mount the air filter on top. I like things being OEM but also like updates

 

[b-body-bob]

A determined man can make about anything work. If it's like mine it's just standard NPT thread. Not sure of the size off the top of my head but when I got it the intake had been rigged so it ran through a wall using some ******* and PVC pipe.

 

[guitar jesus]

Speaking as I cant find a parts breakdown for an A model, if I "needed" a manifold for it, I'd have to go with the newer one. Same with the intercooler tube. Can only find the part number for the R15B

 

[b-body-bob]

Hopefully that's not one of the valves that is a different size for the 15B pump.

Found: "Set of 4 complete valve assemblies for Champion Pneumatic Compressors Model R15 & R15A. Valve gaskets are also included with the valves. Note the high pressure inlet and discharge valves for model R15 & R15 have the same outside diameters. Be carefull to assemble the compressor with the inlet and discharge valves in the proper valve pocket."

and
"Set of 4 complete valve assemblies for Champion Pneumatic Compressors Model R15B. Valve gaskets are also included with the valves. Note the high pressure inlet and discharge valves for model R15B have different outside diameters."

So from that it seems the HP valves are the ones that changed.

 

[guitar jesus]

Is the difference in valve size very noticeable to the naked eye or are they subtle enough to need to measure them?

 

[b-body-bob]

On mine it was obvious they're different sizes just by looking at them. I remember it being a relief when I noticed it, because I'd already taken them out and mixed them up.

 

[guitar jesus]

On mine it was obvious they're different sizes just by looking at them. I remember it being a relief when I noticed it, because I'd already taken them out and mixed them up.

Ok I definitely have the A model then. When you got your overhaul kit, what did it come with? Looks like I'll need cylinder gasket, rings (had oil blow by), and new valves. Dont know if I should bother taking off the unloader assembly and put in new gaskets there and mess with the crankshaft.

Also, any good tips to get the flywheel off?

 

[unashamedlaborer]

Ok I definitely have the A model then. When you got your overhaul kit, what did it come with? Looks like I'll need cylinder gasket, rings (had oil blow by), and new valves. Dont know if I should bother taking off the unloader assembly and put in new gaskets there and mess with the crankshaft.



Also, any good tips to get the flywheel off?

If it is a tapered shaft make a knocker nut for it. Find a nut that is right size/thread and weld a 2" piece of bar stock to it. Thread on by hand , couple swift blows with a 2lb sledge and the flywheel will fall off (be loose, not hit your foot) if it's a straight shaft just loosen the pinch bolt and drive a chisel into the crack.

 

[guitar jesus]

If it is a tapered shaft make a knocker nut for it. Find a nut that is right size/thread and weld a 2" piece of bar stock to it. Thread on by hand , couple swift blows with a 2lb sledge and the flywheel will fall off (be loose, not hit your foot) if it's a straight shaft just loosen the pinch bolt and drive a chisel into the crack.

Thats what I did and the metal slightly chipped. Seems a bit brittle so I only used a rubber mallet to smack it

 

[unashamedlaborer]

Thats what I did and the metal slightly chipped. Seems a bit brittle so I only used a rubber mallet to smack it

What metal chipped? That's a little concerning. I have never a rubber mallet do anything for me on flywheels. I think it's the harmonics that knock it loose not the inertia. Really you only have a few thou of crank end play anyway.
The bigger nut in the picture I made for a 7100e15 IR pump that I had to do a shaft seal on, as you can see it took a lot of beating, what's funny is that it was a 23oz ball peen hammer with a lot of bat speed that finally did the trick, it's also a 100+ lb flywheel.

 

[guitar jesus]

What metal chipped? That's a little concerning. I have never a rubber mallet do anything for me on flywheels. I think it's the harmonics that knock it loose not the inertia. Really you only have a few thou of crank end play anyway.
The bigger nut in the picture I made for a 7100e15 IR pump that I had to do a shaft seal on, as you can see it took a lot of beating, what's funny is that it was a 23oz ball peen hammer with a lot of bat speed that finally did the trick, it's also a 100+ lb flywheel.

it was a fairly small piece.just when I put the chisel in the crack, attorney hairline piece came off.but I will go ahead and use the heavier mallet to knock it off. It doesn't have a threaded end on the crank, just a straight shaft with a key slot

 

[unashamedlaborer]

Hold the phone.... If it isn't a tapered shaft you should be able to pull it off without a big hammer as long as you sink that chisel so that it gets the pinch off the shaft.

 

[guitar jesus]

Hold the phone.... If it isn't a tapered shaft you should be able to pull it off without a big hammer as long as you sink that chisel so that it gets the pinch off the shaft.

There is a good bit of rust on the end of the crank, we'll see how it comes off

 

[guitar jesus]

Got it off, removed rods and pistons, time to see if I pull the crank and change ALL gaskets, seals and valves.

 

[b-body-bob]

Remember the gasket between the crankcase and unloader sets your bearing preload. You will have to mic what was there to begin with, then stack up the multiple gaskets in the kit to get that thickness. You'll see what I mean when you get the gasket kit.

FWIW I completely disassembled mine but only ended up cleaning things and replacing gaskets.