Gertsner wood machinist box restoration. 1st wood box restoration. any advice or tips

[drivesitfar]

I bought my first Gertsner wood machinist box. well that isn't a big deal for some and there are many that would like to own one. i know Gertsner has a good video on how to restore a basicly clean box, but this one has a few issues i might be able to live with like the missing oak veneer on the bottom in the back and the lack of the door to lock and since i don't have a key that might not get made either.

i'm also curious as to the age of this box and i haven't found any markings. i'm guessing 1950's maybe because of the leather handle and the metal bottoms on the top 4 drawers, but not certain and any help always appreciated.

so here's what i now own and the challenges i face that i already know of.

1) two small top drawers need re gluing and maybe a couple small nails to hold them on the metal plate on the bottom.
2) front door is busted and missing part of it so a new one will need to be made or can one be purchased reasonably
3) some oak veneer is missing on the bottom in the back
4) mirror missing, but frame seems in tack so will find replacement
5) lock doesn't have a key
6) lock, latches, metal corner holders and hinges need to be shined up and would like to hear your methods
7) sanded and re varnished
8) replace felt or leave and use as is
9) anything else that you can see i forgot??

I'm fairly handy with big wood projects like this Pergola i built out of cedar that i posted a picture of. i also have quite a few tools (doesn't every GJ member eventually have one or two of every one) so if i get enough information i may just make this old girl shine on my own without hiring it out.

or if there is a local guy near me that does this all the time and he or she can PM me with a price and maybe a few good words about his (her) work that could happen too.

 

[drivesitfar]

more pictures of the Gertsner box.

 

[drivesitfar]

more pictures of Gertsner box

 

[beatcad]

gotta change my orig guess after seeing more pix.
that chest is early 40s (right around 1942)

 

[matt stott]

That is a nice looking box, everything seems to be workable!

I have re-finished/ cleaned up two of these boxes and have some thoughts:

replace the felt- it is the cheapest thing to replace and will make the box seem MUCH newer/cleaner/better. You can get the original felt from Gerstner in multiple colors.

You can get the keys from Gerstner as well.

Go easy on the cleaning of the metal- you don't want to remove the plating. Most of the crud can come off with a gentle isopropyl soak or an ultra-sonic bath.

Go easy on cleaning the wood, too. The Gerstner videos are great for this- most of the dirt on these is old oil and grease, so they clean up really easily. I would not try to sand any of the wood, you may sand clear through the veneer.

Most of the glue Gerstner uses is hide glue- meaning a quick spray with some water and some heat gun action can free any joint. The felt comes up REALLY easily with just some water. Just a note, in case you want to re-do any of the drawers- you shouldn't need to cut anything.

Use hide glue for any repairs you make, too- so 100 years from now the next tool junkie can also work on the chest!

Good luck and have fun!

Matt

 

[matt stott]

What mine sort of looks like, today...(with some added dirt). I did not really clean up the metal too much on this one- left the coating of grease on the corners because I liked it.

<a href="http://s4.photobucket.com/user/mstott/media/tools/gerstner_zpsa9c191e6.jpg.html" target="_blank"><img src="http://i4.photobucket.com/albums/y118/mstott/tools/gerstner_zpsa9c191e6.jpg" border="0" alt=" photo gerstner_zpsa9c191e6.jpg"/></a>

 

[woody 73]

If you gave me your local city information in your avatar I could locate a woodcraft store for you (although you can do just the same).

Those guys/gals live for helping people with finishing projects like your Gerstsner tool box, they have just the needed colors and information for you.

Plug in your zip and this will tell you the store in your area on the Northwest:

http://www.woodcraft.com/Stores/Default.aspx

 

[Adam.C]

That is a nice looking box, everything seems to be workable!

I have re-finished/ cleaned up two of these boxes and have some thoughts:

replace the felt- it is the cheapest thing to replace and will make the box seem MUCH newer/cleaner/better. You can get the original felt from Gerstner in multiple colors.

You can get the keys from Gerstner as well.

Go easy on the cleaning of the metal- you don't want to remove the plating. Most of the crud can come off with a gentle isopropyl soak or an ultra-sonic bath.

Go easy on cleaning the wood, too. The Gerstner videos are great for this- most of the dirt on these is old oil and grease, so they clean up really easily. I would not try to sand any of the wood, you may sand clear through the veneer.

Most of the glue Gerstner uses is hide glue- meaning a quick spray with some water and some heat gun action can free any joint. The felt comes up REALLY easily with just some water. Just a note, in case you want to re-do any of the drawers- you shouldn't need to cut anything.

Use hide glue for any repairs you make, too- so 100 years from now the next tool junkie can also work on the chest!

Good luck and have fun!

Matt

Agree with all. +80 on hide glue. Other glues likely won't work anyway. PVA needs high bond pressures and clean bare wood to bond.

Few more suggestions:
To clean wood (all wood in your house) use 10% solution of household ammonia in water. Ammonia is a great degreaser and leaves nothing behind to damage finishes. Wood doesn't need or want oils or waxes. These actually lead to it's destruction.

Agree with hide glue BUT- original Gerstner felt was 100% wool. Now, mostly synthetic. Some believe the wool felt contained natural oil (lanolin?) that helped prevent rust. New synthetics have strong acidic dyes (needed to dye synthetic materials) that may promote rust.

Ditto, the glue you use to hold the felt down can be a factor in rust. I used wall paper paste. You cut the felt with a super sharp razor blade using a ruler as a straight edge, spread the wall paper paste in, then squeegee the felt in place with an old credit card. Works great- you can stretch or shrink the felt by working it with the card.

I would skip the front panel. The original fronts were not that pretty anyway. You'll never get one to match properly. Mine is almost never used. I'd skip it.

 

[Blue Frog]

I picked up a Gerstner a couple of years ago for $200.00 - loaded with tools - sold the tools on d bay for more than $600.00 and kept the chest. I chose to keep mine as original as possible so I went with restoration supplies directly from Gerstner. They're more expensive, but in my case, I considered it worth that extra expense.

I started with the felt and used LOML's rotary cutter, mat, and cutting guide. It's much more precise than other methods. When I took pictures of the tools I sold, I placed them inside the newly-covered drawers - neat appearance helped in the sale of tools in my case.

There's another option for restoration supplies, that being: http://machinistchest.com/site/ They have many supplies but not those that are propriety.

If you want to make it usable and do not want to go for felt, then I would consider 1/16" cork. It's much less expensive and would make a nice interior for the drawers. I'm lining the bottoms of drawers in an old library card chest with 1/8" cork for some of my smaller tools at the present time.

The hardest item for you, as I see it, is the front cover. Matching up the wood grain, mounting hardware, and locking hardware can be a little difficult. I suggest that you try to find a woodworker locally who can do the job for you. If you can't find someone locally, get back in touch with me and I'll help you out, but I'll need the old door to make a new matching door. I do have some old quarter-sawn oak that will closely match what you have.

Good luck on you restoration. If you would like to see specific pictures, please let me know.

Those of us who live in Ohio love to see these old chests restored. After all, two of the best tool chests made, Gerstner and Kennedy, were made in Ohio.

 

[48fordnut]

Not stealing the thread, but my 86 yr old cousin has one that never had a tool in it. I saw it yesterday. It's mint.

 

[beatcad]

as to the front lid.
i also have a machinist chest that is missing one.
i aint done it yet, but my idea is to make a front lid out of clear plexiglass so you can still see the drawers when its shut.
id have to get a hold of a mill or a router to do it i guess.

depending on what yer going to do w/ it the front lid may be slid under the bottom drawer anyhow.

 

[WallynSC]

I'm in for info, I might find one for sale one day.

 

[PFSard]

I picked up a Gerstner a couple of years ago for $200.00 - loaded with tools - sold the tools on d bay for more than $600.00 and kept the chest. I chose to keep mine as original as possible so I went with restoration supplies directly from Gerstner. They're more expensive, but in my case, I considered it worth that extra expense.

Blue Frog >> I don't suppose that you'd have a few pics available. I aspire to be a Gerstner owner one day and am always interested in seeing those that have been restored. >> Thanks Paul

 

[Carla]

gotta change my orig guess after seeing more pix.
that chest is early 40s (right around 1942)

I'd tend to concur, late '30's to early '40's.

The embossed oval logo plate and the trim washers under the drawer pulls (I've seen those little washers referred to as 'finger-nail scratch guards', or some such) would be pre-war features, but the use of Phillips head screws on the ends would seem to say '40's.

As a bit of trivia, from a Gerstner listing in a post-war catalogue.....if it measures 31" OAL, its a model O44 (the 'O' referring to oak, instead of the more common black artificial leather covering), with a list price of $30.00. If its 26" OAL, its a model O43, which was listed at $28.00.

The corner joints of Gerstner box drawers are a special cut, called an 'Abernathy joint' by some woodworkers.

The do break, and using small pins to re-enforce a glue repair is a good idea. Don't use nails, tho, the correct method is to use very small diameter brass machine screws. Drill just a few thou under the outside diameter of the screw, and, when clamped-up for gluing, drive in the screws, they will thread into the wood easily. When the glue is set up, cut off the screw heads, and file the brass level with the wood.

You can get small pieces of the quarter-sawn oak veneer (called 'tiger oak' by some woodworkers) from specialist supply houses, and carefully cut and patch. The repair won't be perfect, of course, but would be 'close enough', a standard repair practice.

The veneer is indeed thin, but one can sand, ever so gently, with, say, 320, just to 'clean up', then stain and varnish or lacquer, multiple coats, then sand with ultra-fine, and polish with fine pumice, followed by fine rottenstone. I'd use lacquer, myself, as I would suspect, but don't actually 'know', that the original finish would be a spraying lacquer.

I've re-felted a couple of these boxes, and would caution you against getting your felt from Gerstners. The felt they supply these days is a significantly lesser quality than the stuff they used, years ago. I was quite disappointed, actually.

Have a look on ebay, some suppliers of 'pool table felt' offer remnants in a variety of colours.

I must confess to total ignorance of the subject, but I'd suspect that pool table felt might be a very specialised market, with the serious 'big money' players being extremely particular about the quality of the felt on their pool tables......you might look on the internet to see whether there might be some sort of 'Billiards Association' or some such entity, which would publish felt quality specs, or specify acceptable suppliers.

Admittedly, I'm only guessing, but I'd not be surprised to find that there are various quality/price levels of pool table felt, so one may as well try to find rems of the 'best quality' stuff.

cheers

Carla

 

[nine4gmc]

Lots of good info, can't wait to find one myself!

 

[jakemac]

To clean antique furniture quality wood items, an old method used by my grandmother and my great-grandmother, was to use a 50-50 solution of water and white vinegar with a damp (not wet) sponge.

It will cut through grease and wax, so go lightly so you don't strip the original finish off.

You only want to clean off ages of dirt and grime, but don't want to ruin the patina (yeah, I know, I used the "P" word) so the collector's value is preserved.

You can then use a paste wax or linseed oil to polish the wood. Tung Oil is another option.


EDIT : I forgot to mention that you should do this in a well ventilated area because of the fumes, and wear rubber dishwashing gloves so the vinegar doesn't burn your hands. Don't get it in your eyes !

 

[drivesitfar]

All: Just wanted to let you know I thank you for all your information and I'm reading through all the posts and soaking it all in. thanks again for all that has been written so far and please post more as you want to because i'm sure i'll have a lot of questions. i'll have answers to the ones asked of me if I can too like size and such.

thanks GJ

 

[davethorik]

4) mirror missing, but frame seems in tack so will find replacement

I like gerstners, and a few coworkers have them. It makes me grimace to see what happens to them in a shop environment. I have seen one that got lit on fire by chop saw sparks, but it was only cosmetic.

Another guy had a gerstner top and mid on a smaller snappy roller, the mid box took a direct hit from towmotor forks. Luckily it was in front of a wall so the top box just slid back and bumped into the wall... Both times, not the guy who owned the box who did the damage.

That's why I will never have one at work...at home? yes please.

However back to the quote, all the gerstners I've seen have been missing the mirror. I don't know if it is common but every single one I have seen didn't have it. I have never seen a brand new or NOS other than pix online.

Good luck with the resto, they are very nice boxes.

 

[foodgroup]

Thanks everyone, this has been a really interesting thread.

I bought a Gerstner top and middle box from my wife's retired machinist Grandfather to save it from ebay, and have had it in storage for most of 10 years. This thread has inspired me to clean it, reattach the loose felt, and find a good spot for it.

I appreciate the tips on cleaning, hide glue and wallpaper paste.

Here's mine:

 

[softailgarage]

The first toolbox restore I did was my dads Gerstner. Biggest thing I found was try not to damage the veneer. All the metal work I polished with a dremel. Gerstner does have replacement hardware, but its not cheap. The felt you can get from any yarn store a lot cheaper than from Gerstner. I chose to leave some of the original felt just for authentic purposes. If you contact Gerstner, for a fee they will tell you when the box was made.

 

[mdbeck1]

Thanks everyone, this has been a really interesting thread.

I bought a Gerstner top and middle box from my wife's retired machinist Grandfather to save it from ebay, and have had it in storage for most of 10 years. This thread has inspired me to clean it, reattach the loose felt, and find a good spot for it.

I appreciate the tips on cleaning, hide glue and wallpaper paste.

Here's mine:

Nice looking chest. I have it's cousin in the bedroom. I put my "man stuff" in it. Things like pocket knives, decent ink pens, tie tacks, ....

It actually belonged to my wife's grandfather. ....and before him her great uncle.

 

[drivesitfar]

All: i'm still working on digesting all the great posts you all have given this thread and will add my comments and questions as i can. it was a long hot day moving stuff around my storage unit and shop.

if you all want to post pictures of your Gerts either in the original post or in a new one that would be great. especially ones that are close to mine. of course any Gertsner box picture(s) and as many as possible are welcome.

did they only make metal bottoms maybe pre WWII or when did they go to all wood?

thank you all

 

[WWIIjeep]

did they only make metal bottoms maybe pre WWII or when did they go to all wood?

AFAIK, they always used metal bottoms and still do.

My '90s-vintage Gerstner O52 has metal bottoms in all the drawers and so does my '50s-vintage Gerstner.

I think the import Gerstner International boxes have plywood drawer bottoms.

I'd recommend getting whatever parts you need from Gerstner, but you can also try here:

http://machinistchest.com/site/

 

[thundermug]

I'm one of those that would like to own a Gerstner. My grandpa had three that used to belong to his father. He sold them in a garage sale in the 90s.

 

[beatcad]

AFAIK, they always used metal bottoms and still do.

they used galvanized sheet steel bottoms up until sometime in the 90s.
now the drawer bottoms are masonite.

 

[Davefr]

If you contact Gerstner, for a fee they will tell you when the box was made.

Just remove the bottom drawers and look at the inside bottom. It was common for the Gerstner workers to personally sign and date the boxes they made.

(ex: mine signed and dated from 1946)

 

[ttpete]

I like gerstners, and a few coworkers have them. It makes me grimace to see what happens to them in a shop environment. I have seen one that got lit on fire by chop saw sparks, but it was only cosmetic.

Another guy had a gerstner top and mid on a smaller snappy roller, the mid box took a direct hit from towmotor forks. Luckily it was in front of a wall so the top box just slid back and bumped into the wall... Both times, not the guy who owned the box who did the damage.

That's why I will never have one at work...at home? yes please.

However back to the quote, all the gerstners I've seen have been missing the mirror. I don't know if it is common but every single one I have seen didn't have it. I have never seen a brand new or NOS other than pix online.

Good luck with the resto, they are very nice boxes.

The mirror was there for one reason, and that was to enable the owner to see a chip that got into the eye and remove it. You used a small wooden stick with a loop of horse hair on the end to flick the chip out.

I have a relatively new set of boxes, a tall top box and a riser, both in oak.

 

[bluebolt]

Lots of good info, can't wait to find one myself!

There is one here with your name on it LOL. I will definitely be going through Baton Rouge around Thursday August 8 on the way to New Orleans.

 

[WWIIjeep]

However back to the quote, all the gerstners I've seen have been missing the mirror. I don't know if it is common but every single one I have seen didn't have it. I have never seen a brand new or NOS other than pix online.

On the other hand, I can't remember ever seeing a Gerstner in person that didn't have a mirror, only pictures of mirror-less ones online.

Here's my '90s vintage O52. The only large Gerstner chest I bought new:

 

[nine4gmc]

There is one here with your name on it LOL. I will definitely be going through Baton Rouge around Thursday August 8 on the way to New Orleans.

see you then!

 

[beatcad]

if you all want to post pictures of your Gerts either in the original post or in a new one that would be great. especially ones that are close to mine. of course any Gertsner box picture(s) and as many as possible are welcome.

there were at least 2 threads just for Gerstner chests years before I joined(believe me I searched) but they never cought on I guess.
I always posted mine in the vintage toolbox thread.

if someone resurrects an old one or starts a new one i'll join in and have to add 1 more thread to my subscribe list

 

[drivesitfar]

All: i'm taking notes and gathering all the information so i can decide how to go about restoring my old Gertsner. of course it is more of a rainy day project so might be a while before i start and it's 80 ish and dry so some of my rainy day projects are put on hold while i build a fence, paint my exterior of my house and a few other things on the list.

so far i really appreciate all the help and am collecting my information so i can ask intelligent questions. and i will have plenty of questions believe me.

one thing i thought about is i picked up this Craftsman or Union wood box that is very similar in condition and maybe age too so should i "practice" on this one before i start on my Gertsner?

here is the fence i'm hoping to build in case any of the wood workers or fence builders have any comments or helpful ideas to share. i picked up all the rough cut cedar at a local Cedar Mill last year and it should be dry and hopefully still fairly straight. by the way the guy in the picture is there for size and he's 6'3" which makes my fence to build about 8 foot tall. I thought I might be able to be seen better than a dollar bill for a size comparison.

thanks again for all your help and please continue with all your old or new wood machinist box comments and especially pictures.

 

[softailgarage]

Looks like a good box to practice on and thats a nice fence.

 

[bulletpruf]

Nice looking chest. I have it's cousin in the bedroom. I put my "man stuff" in it. Things like pocket knives, decent ink pens, tie tacks, ....

It actually belonged to my wife's grandfather. ....and before him her great uncle.

BINGO! Now I have to get one of these; think it would be a great place to keep man stuff.

Thanks!

Scott

 

[Adam.C]

I think Gerstners are cool. I would have no hesitation buying one. But for all the work of restoration, you can just build one. They aren't that difficult to build. And the joints aren't that nice. Pretty agricultural. Nor is the wood fantastic. I made mine out of solid mahogany. But you could use anything. I don't actually keep my woodworking tools in it. I designed mine to hold my machinist tools.

View media item 41744
Here is a close up of the joints I used.

View media item 41743
Drawer fronts are solid mahogany, sides are hard maple, bottoms birch plywood.

If you are handy with woodworking, you can build one pretty easily.

 

[foodgroup]

I think Gerstners are cool. I would have no hesitation buying one. But for all the work of restoration, you can just build one. They aren't that difficult to build. And the joints aren't that nice. Pretty agricultural. Nor is the wood fantastic. I made mine out of solid mahogany. But you could use anything. I don't actually keep my woodworking tools in it. I designed mine to hold my machinist tools.

View media item 41744
Here is a close up of the joints I used.

View media item 41743
Drawer fronts are solid mahogany, sides are hard maple, bottoms birch plywood.

If you are handy with woodworking, you can build one pretty easily.

Hi Adam, your comment and Carla's about the drawer joints caught my eye.

I looked it up in Tage Frid's Joinery book. He calls it a "Half-Blind Tongue and Rabbit" and also warns about its weakness.

It is obsolete, but I guess that's the best locking half-blind joint they could make with only a table saw.

I'm new to woodworking and learned half-blind dovetails right off the bat, so this is an interesting history lesson. Thank you both for the info.

 

[Adam.C]

The dovetails are probably overkill. But since I don't have a table saw, they were actually easier for me to produce a good quality drawer. You could easily screw the drawers together. I'm sure there are other methods one could use.

Sometimes I regret building this since it means I will probably never own a Gerstner. I have thought that if I could build this, I could probably build a wooden version of a Snap On roll cab. Then I think..naaah. I think I'd regret that. Now that I think of it, this chest was a lot of work. And the brass hardware was pretty expensive.

 

[Blue Frog]

This is not about a Gerstner restoration, but about a 50's or 60's model 054 that I picked up in mid-March. It was from the estate of a 96-yr-old master machinist who was abundantly blessed with OCD. The box is in exceptionally fine condition - kraft paper was placed over the felt protect it, and every tool was wiped clean before returning it to the box.

The PO stocked his working box with only the top named tools - every tool had a place - the box was packed as full as possible - it took two men to carry it to my car.

Here's the good part. I've already sold the center drills, Starrett parallels, Lufkin squares, milling tools, and the drawer full of machinist steel - all for $800.00. So, the box is paid for, with a profit already of $200.00, and I have a lot of tools to sell yet, possibly another $400-$500. Twas a wise investment - I have an excellent Gerstner 054 and will have a profit of about $600 - $700.

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Blue Frog

 

[nine4gmc]

damn.

 

[kentenn]

I sometimes use GoJo hand cleaner (NON-Pumice) with a lightly abrasive Scotchbrite pad to clean old chests. I've restored quite a few of these and am happy to share what I've learned. Just shoot me a message and let me know what you are trying to do.

Here are a few of my restorations: