justin1795
Well-known member
I have my ground rods in and they are wired together. What is the proper way to go into the pannel?
proper way to run earth ground into pannel
- Thread starter justin1795
- Start date
rockwithjason
Well-known member
need more details and maybe some pics
Bondo
Well-known member
Ayuh,.... Through a knock-out, with a clip in it, to the earth bus bar,...
pattenp
Well-known member
The wire needs to be one continuous piece from panel to the rods. You can get the wire to the panel how ever you want as long as it's not in a place that it can get damaged. If running across the ground where a shovel may get it the wire needs to be placed in a sleeve of EMT or copper water pipe. As far as getting it in the house, for an example you can strap it to the side of the meter conduit coming up from the ground and bore a small hole in the house wall and push it inside. You can bore a small hole in the foundation and push it though to under the crawl space and bring it up to the panel.
OP
justin1795
Well-known member
Its a sub panel for my garage. Thanks for the help
Zeke
Well-known member
I believe once the continuous wire is properly clamped to the closest rod you can connect the 2 rods with another ground and set of approved clamps. Here are 2 drawings of different scenarios. Ignore the 'existing' ground wire.
No, I didn't draw those.
alfredeneuman
Well-known member
And if it EMT or Rigid Conduit, you will need to bond it on both ends . If you don't the choking effect that ungrounded ferrous conduit has will greatly reduce the ground wire's effectiveness.
And the NEC requires it
You could always go with Schedule 80PVC
Mustang51js
Well-known member
Don't know your local codes but in nj you can run the thhn right out of ground and into back of panel or into foundation and then into panel. Never have or have seen any house that put the ground rod wire into a pipe or sleeve.
wyliesdiesels
Well-known member
Charles (in GA)
Well-known member
If thinner than #6 solid I seem to recall that it is required to be protected where exposed.
As far as entering the panel, most panels have a tiny knockout, about ¼" in the back corner of the bottom and top of the housing. You take a small punch and knock it out, and run the ground thru it.
Charles
As far as entering the panel, most panels have a tiny knockout, about ¼" in the back corner of the bottom and top of the housing. You take a small punch and knock it out, and run the ground thru it.
Charles
Mustang51js
Well-known member
I use #6 black thhn stranded, no need to have bare wire for whole way,just strip it where it connects to rods. Only time I use bare solid wire is for pools and hot tubs.
wyliesdiesels
Well-known member
Yes thinner than #6 is required to be in conduit. And if the #6 is in an area where it can get damaged then it needs to be in conduit as well!!
Mustang51js
Well-known member
Must be a west coast thing because it's not required here or if it is it's not enforced, I've done 100+ services and seen a lot and none had the ground wire in pipe outside the house, not that it couldn't hurt just not done here
teamextreme
Well-known member
That's why I always just run #4 bare cu, because under that size is required to be protected. The price increase is minimal and you don't have to mess with conduit, and bonding if metal as has been mentioned.
Now that I think of it, I don't recall anything in NEC that specifies solid for this use, but that's what I've always used and seem to recall inspectors always wanted to see. But THHN is probably fine if that's the case. It would have to be green insulation.
Now that I think of it, I don't recall anything in NEC that specifies solid for this use, but that's what I've always used and seem to recall inspectors always wanted to see. But THHN is probably fine if that's the case. It would have to be green insulation.
alfredeneuman
Well-known member
The Code doesn't specify solid or stranded. You'd have a hard time installing solid 2/0 or 3/0 Grounding Electrode Conductor, even if it was available (I think the biggest produced is #2 solid). THWN is commonly used as a GEC.
The GEC doesn't need to be green. No color is required. You could use Black or even Pink if that is what you desire.
The requirement for conduit isn't just a "West Coast" thing. It's required in the NEC where the GEC is subject to physical damage.
pattenp
Well-known member
Will you please state the NEC section that says a metal protective sleeve on the grounding electrode conductor has to be bonded to the electrode conductor.
Speedy Petey
Well-known member
I'm not sure yet where it is in the NEC, but I do agree, yes, it MUST be bonded.
alfredeneuman
Well-known member
250.64 (E)
Enclosures for Grounding Electrode Conductor.
Ferrous (iron/steel) raceways, boxes, and enclosures containing the grounding electrode conductors must be made electrically continuous by bonding each end of the ferrous metal raceway, box, and enclosure to the grounding electrode conductor.
That's from a previous Edition of the Code.......It still says pretty much the same thing, though, with a lot more text
From the 2011 NEC
Bonding methods in compliance with 250.92(B) for installations at service equipment locations and with 250.92(B)(2) through (B)(4) for other than service equipment locations shall apply at each end and to all intervening ferrous raceways, boxes, and enclosures between the cabinets or equipment and the grounding electrode
Enclosures for Grounding Electrode Conductor.
Ferrous (iron/steel) raceways, boxes, and enclosures containing the grounding electrode conductors must be made electrically continuous by bonding each end of the ferrous metal raceway, box, and enclosure to the grounding electrode conductor.
That's from a previous Edition of the Code.......It still says pretty much the same thing, though, with a lot more text
From the 2011 NEC
Bonding methods in compliance with 250.92(B) for installations at service equipment locations and with 250.92(B)(2) through (B)(4) for other than service equipment locations shall apply at each end and to all intervening ferrous raceways, boxes, and enclosures between the cabinets or equipment and the grounding electrode
Last edited:
Mustang51js
Well-known member
Well it's a good thing none of the inspectors enforce in nj, waste of time and money
alfredeneuman
Well-known member
I personally know 2 NJ Senior Electrical Inspectors that would call it out in a heartbeat.
Last edited:
pattenp
Well-known member
I'm just talking about short sleeve buried outside for protection. I'don't think it's necessary by code to bond. At least not here.
alfredeneuman
Well-known member
Gleaned from the Mike Holt website:
CAUTION: The effectiveness of the grounding electrode can be significantly reduced if a ferromagnetic raceway containing a grounding electrode conductor isn't bonded to the grounding electrode conductor at both ends. This is because a single conductor carrying high-frequency lightning current in a ferrous raceway causes the raceway to act as an inductor, which severely limits (chokes) the current flow through the grounding electrode conductor. ANSI/IEEE 142, Recommended Practice for Grounding of Industrial and Commercial Power Systems (Green Book) states, "An inductive choke can reduce the current flow by 97 percent."
From ECM:
Section 250.64(E) requires ferrous metal enclosures for grounding electrode conductors that are not physically continuous from cabinets or equipment to the grounding electrode, such as sleeves or short lengths of conduit used for physical protection, to be made electrically continuous by bonding each end of the raceway to the contained grounding electrode conductor.
Just use PVC 80 It's nonmagnetic and doesn't need to bonded
CAUTION: The effectiveness of the grounding electrode can be significantly reduced if a ferromagnetic raceway containing a grounding electrode conductor isn't bonded to the grounding electrode conductor at both ends. This is because a single conductor carrying high-frequency lightning current in a ferrous raceway causes the raceway to act as an inductor, which severely limits (chokes) the current flow through the grounding electrode conductor. ANSI/IEEE 142, Recommended Practice for Grounding of Industrial and Commercial Power Systems (Green Book) states, "An inductive choke can reduce the current flow by 97 percent."
From ECM:
Section 250.64(E) requires ferrous metal enclosures for grounding electrode conductors that are not physically continuous from cabinets or equipment to the grounding electrode, such as sleeves or short lengths of conduit used for physical protection, to be made electrically continuous by bonding each end of the raceway to the contained grounding electrode conductor.
Just use PVC 80 It's nonmagnetic and doesn't need to bonded
Last edited:
pattenp
Well-known member
Well I learned something. I have some sleeves l should go back and bond or replace with PVC.
Heatdr
Member
Here is South Jersey they require ground rods and Upher grounds,which is continuous ground through rebar and mesh infloor to the panel
Mustang51js
Well-known member
Yeah but when you come out of the ground and up the outside of the house a foot or two before going into the house,do you sleeve it inside pipe. I have never seen it on a residential house or put one in. In fact I just did a generator where the wire from the ground rods came out of ground and right into transfer switch. No pipe, just need to secure it so it's not loose.
Speedy Petey
Well-known member
I was called on it once, many years ago. I was pretty close with the inspector, and when he explained it to me it made complete sense. He said he had seen the end of a pipe sleeve literally blow apart from a lightning hit, where if it were bonded it would not have.
Mustang51js
Well-known member
We talking two different things, I was talking about not having a pipe at all and just the wire running up the foundation, your talking if you have a pipe and not connecting the ends where I could see that happening like you mentioned
wyliesdiesels
Well-known member
My understanding and what i was taught is #6 can be ran by itself without sleeve or conduit, unless subject to damage. Smaller than #6 always needs to be in sleeve/conduit...2011 book is at the shop so ill have to look when i get back...
Ive seen many GECs sleeved in EMT right upto the rod....
Ive seen many GECs sleeved in EMT right upto the rod....