The VISES of Garage Journal

[CwazyWabbit]

What is SG Iron? Did they use it on the other quick release vices like 22 & 23?

Over the years they have described the material the the Engineers Vices are made of as Pearlitic Malleable Iron, Ductile Iron, Spherodial Graphite Iron (nodular iron). It's a superior type of casting and heat treatment that makes the casting much less brittle as the graphite in the casting is contained as small spheres rather than the flakes that are found in normal grey iron. It is a more expensive process than regular casting and more prone to defects in the casting apparently.

The 22 and 23 are fitters vices and I've not found any references that said they were made of anything other than 'normal' grey cast iron.

The Engineers vices over the years have been 110 through to 114 (112 and 114 still made today), the 34 and 36 (36 still made) and the 84. There are probably a few others.

 

[Fretters]

Wouldn't mind getting another Parkinsons 'Perfect Vise' as they as far as I can tell are the vice everyone else over here copied.

Welcome. Does seem that Parkinson likely was the source of most stuff we're used to seeing in current standard vice design.

They're my favourite too. Have a No.7 same as yourself as my main large vice, a Handy No.3, a No.15 woodwork vice and then one of their old style woodwork vices.

I will clean and repaint my current one, I think it should be a crimson red BS381c 540 but I'm not sure.

I think they may have used something slightly lighter. I always thought around the Crimson/Maroon/Burgundy mark, but the original, untainted paint I catch a whiff of on occasion seem quite a light red in comparison.

EDIT: Just to add this is the vice I'm awaiting delivery of, a Record 36 that looks to have had a hard life .... Hopefully I can get it looking smarter and working properly It's another of Records SG Iron vices so should be worth trying to fix up.

I've seen worse. That should clean up nicely. Should be a nice 6" vice after a bit of time and effort. Put some more photo's of that up when you have chance, if you could? The 3* series is one of the rare Record styles I'm intrigued by. Keep hoping to get a hold of one of those one day, just due to their styling.

What is SG Iron? Did they use it on the other quick release vices like 22 & 23?

Ductile iron. It's more forgiving than cast when it's getting a pounding.

 

[dutchgray]

Somebody say Record 114
View media item 47323Sad thing is I'm not even using it at the moment, its awaiting the building of a new work shop.

 

[CwazyWabbit]

dutchgray you need to put something next to that gorgeous 114 to show everyone the scale of it. I bet your arm gets tired opening that one all the way out with the plain screw ..... Maybe I could help you out and take it off your hands? The plain screw is supposed to be more durable than the quick release.

 

[CwazyWabbit]

Fretters I think you may be right on the colour of the Parkinsons, I shall have to do a little more searching to see if I can find any original paint on mine.

When the 36 arrives I'll get some more pictures up, I've plenty of the roundel blue left from painting the 112 so it'll get a fresh coat of paint once all the welds are removed.

 

[Fretters]

The plain screw is supposed to be more durable than the quick release.

In general or with that specific vice?

I've heard that mentioned as a general comment quite a few times. I've always thought the opposite. I've never seen a notably worn buttress thread as yet. Seen a few knacked standard leadscrews though. The QR buttress thread should theoretically outlast the standard square thread by a long way. The thread sees a lot less wear as the QR mechanism is in play most of the time, and the buttress thread is more suited to the application of force in general.

 

[Fretters]

Fretters I think you may be right on the colour of the Parkinsons, I shall have to do a little more searching to see if I can find any original paint on mine.

If you have a look on Ebay, I seem to vaguely recall seeing one within the last few days which appears to be sporting a rather clean original paint job. I have a photo knocking about of a patch of paint I found on one of mine which had weathered well. I'll dig that out later and post it.

I do much prefer a slightly darker colour, like you were planning on using though. It seems more fitting with the older equipment. Original is nice, but I prefer to stare at a colour which I actually like.

When the 36 arrives I'll get some more pictures up, I've plenty of the roundel blue left from painting the 112 so it'll get a fresh coat of paint once all the welds are removed.

Cheers. Record's don't usually rock my boat, so to speak, but there's something about that 3* series which just takes my fancy no end.

 

[dutchgray]

Yeah I probably should have, 8" jaws, 16" handle, 24" front to back closed, also quite heavy, I can pick it up and carry it around but I don't enjoy it. My No3 gets most use.
I also have a few other small vices, Record 00 through to 3, one of those small clamp on wood working vice and a Woden w00.

 

[CwazyWabbit]

Fretters As I understand it it's a general opinion that plain screws withstand more abuse than a half nut, but you make a very valid point about about the buttress threads strength and the use of qr reducing wear. I too have seen more wear on the standard screws.

That said the record vice handles are sized so that they bend before the vices break so shouldn't have problems with either, I did read they used to test them by tightening with a length of pipe till the handle bent and then they put a 4ft pipe wrench on to it and tightened till the vice failed. They'd need a lot of risk assessments to be allowed to do that now!

 

[CwazyWabbit]

more pictures please dutchgray

the 3 series records do seem to be quite artistic in their design Fretters they have a certain something.

 

[Fretters]

That said the record vice handles are sized so that they bend before the vices break so shouldn't have problems with either, I did read they used to test them by tightening with a length of pipe till the handle bent and then they put a 4ft pipe wrench on to it and tightened till the vice failed. They'd need a lot of risk assessments to be allowed to do that now!

Aye, I seem to recall hearing that their destruction tests were very thorough too. I bet a penny to a pound that the new Irwin produced stuff doesn't see the same type of testing abuse as the old Sheffield factory used to employ.

 

[alan camby]

Just returned from a 3 hour road trip. Picked up a real nice Wilton C2 with a 1995 date stamp on the slide. Paid $260.
I will get some pictures up later.
Plan to take it apart and repaint.
I think the dynamic jaw has been replaced. the jaw is 1/8" or so wider on both sides compared to the static. The static is ground flush with the side of the vise casting and the dynamic is sticking out on both sides, if that makes since.
I think this will be the only repair. Oh, one of the swivel handles has a slight bend. That should be easy to fix.

Will also build another receiver hitch mount.

 

[zkling]

Louisville Alan?

 

[alan camby]

Just other side of river.
Jeffersonville, IN

 

[alan camby]

C2 and 1755

 

[alan camby]

Oops. Tapatalk sideways picture

 

[CwazyWabbit]

Is it just the picture or is that vise truly massive?

 

[oldldh]

Oops. Tapatalk sideways picture

Fixed it for you....

CwazyWabbit---A Wilton C-2 is a big B@#tard...

 

[CwazyWabbit]

It looks it!

 

[alan camby]

It is pretty big.

I can now confirm the dynamic jaw is new. I will belt sand the new jaw sides to match the static jaw. I don't think vise jaws and hss end mills would get along?

 

[CwazyWabbit]

It's very nice, just been reading about them, they're made of ductile iron like the top of the range Record vices in the UK.

 

[KMScott]

Alan, the 1755 looks like it has a gap in the spindle channel that the horse shoe washer fits in, they make a 1/4 thick washer, that one might be 3/16 thick, might be able to tighten up the backlash. Both vises are very nice. Great find on the C3.

 

[Tritonus]

Question for anyone who knows the answer.

What does that metal cap on the swivel hole look like?
It is that shinny silver metal under the 924.

I don't understand the purpose.

Thanks

 

[drivesitfar]

Tri: your Starrett vise has the tightener for the swivel on the one side and a plug on the other side to keep it from tipping and staying on the swivel i'm guessing.

Alan: nice vise and i for one think the Wilton C2 is their best made vise for almost any business. it's a little overkill for most home garages, but i doubt you'd have anybody say they didn't like it if they had a nice bench to mount it on. since I've posted your awesome bench all over GJ can you take a few pictures of how you make the hitch mount for you C2 and put them over on the vise stand thread in Fabrication section? thanks and great price even though it was a haul to get it.

CW: pretty sure my Wilton C2 weighs 110 pounds and has 5 inch wide jaws so yes its a beast.

Dutch: I agree with your fellow UK vise thread members that more pictures of your old Parkinson would be nice.

 

[alan camby]

Drive,
I put the photo's in my Parker thread when we were discussing the bench in that thread the other day.

Feel free to copy and paste the pictures as you like.
http://garagejournal.com/forum/showthread.php?t=274710&page=2

 

[bluebolt]

Parker 954 I found at the flea market. I didn't buy it but thought I would post some pics. Handle is a little bent, jaws still have some grooving, no visible welds, weld spatter or signs of heavy hammering. Spindle collar looks good. Something looks off about the vise nut, it doesn't touch the retaining pin. Slide looks decent, no cracks or signs of being used as an anvil. Asking price is $110, he will usually deal a bit. He had a 608 8" Columbian several months back that brang over $600.

Located at Greenwood Flea Market just off of Interstate 20 near Greenwood Louisiana by the Texas border. Guy's name is Steve. He has an outside booth (old train cars) in the far corner from the entrance.

 

[jakemac]

Question for anyone who knows the answer.

What does that metal cap on the swivel hole look like?
It is that shinny silver metal under the 924.

I don't understand the purpose.

Thanks

The plug is there to keep dirt and grit from falling into the base and causing problems for the swivel. The vise was made so that it could be mounted as a static vise, but could have a swivel base added if the owner wanted. Since it only needed one locking bolt (mounted on the other side), the open side hole was given a cap. The third mounting hole on the back is clear of the base, so it didn't need to be plugged.

I'm not sure if the plug is OEM, or if a previous owner put that there. It may be an electrical conduit plug that has been repurposed.

 

[Tritonus]

The plug is there to keep dirt and grit from falling into the base and causing problems for the swivel. The vise was made so that it could be mounted as a static vise, but could have a swivel base added if the owner wanted. Since it only needed one locking bolt (mounted on the other side), the open side hole was given a cap. The third mounting hole on the back is clear of the base, so it didn't need to be plugged.

I'm not sure if the plug is OEM, or if a previous owner put that there. It may be an electrical conduit plug that has been repurposed.

Thanks Jake and Drive

This guy is selling a NOS 925 and it found there as well.
http://www.ebay.com/itm/RARE-NOS-ST...1?pt=BI_Tool_Work_Holding&hash=item27e4aeede9

I guess if you wanted to, you can put the swivel lock on the other side if needed. I'm still interested in what the thing looks like. It is a mystery.

 

[drivesitfar]

Alan: i remember that you showed the parts when making a mount for you smaller 1755, but there weren't any specs as to sizes of the tubing. also had no idea what or where that grey piece went with the screw or how you mounted the tube inside your bench if you did. if you have time to take a few pictures of the C2 and how you cut the plate that would be great or i'll figure it out. thanks

Jake: makes sense with the Starrett. the only Starrett vise I've owned was a non swivel that has been sent to another member's bench a while ago.

Tri: i can say Starrett vises are one of the best made vises and i wish they were still in the vise business. i can't recall when they stopped selling vises and this cold is killing my already old memory.

EDIT: spelled Alen's name with two LL's again. sorry

 

[jakemac]

Thanks Jake and Drive

This guy is selling a NOS 925 and it found there as well.
http://www.ebay.com/itm/RARE-NOS-ST...1?pt=BI_Tool_Work_Holding&hash=item27e4aeede9

I guess if you wanted to, you can put the swivel lock on the other side if needed. I'm still interested in what the thing looks like. It is a mystery.

Well, that's strong evidence that the plug is OEM. Live and learn.

 

[oldldh]

My "Non-swivlin' b@#tard" Starrett 925 doesn't have the shiny cork...

Of course, it has a large bolt going through the hole, too...

And, as I, too, don't swivel...

All is firmly clamped, and facing the correct way...

 

[wrenchguy]

Question for anyone who knows the answer.

What does that metal cap on the swivel hole look like?
It is that shinny silver metal under the 924.

I don't understand the purpose.

Thanks

its 4 left handed operation of the swivel lockdown if so desired. i read it in a factory brochure somewhere online. kinda simple idea really.

 

[taumac]

I got this little guy courtesy of my SS. Its a little German vise made by Richa now part of Bessey as info was provided by my SS.

Have a good one Gerard

 

[xxaler]

Why did you guys do this to me. A Vise addiction is too expensive for an apprentice millwright. God dammit.

 

[Fretters]

Why did you guys do this to me. A Vise addiction is too expensive for an apprentice millwright. God dammit.

Sounds like the slippery descent begins.

 

[oldldh]

Why did you guys do this to me. A Vise addiction is too expensive for an apprentice millwright. God dammit.

Slippery slopes in Ontario are usually frozen...

 

[drivesitfar]

**: Maybe buy smaller ones they are less expensive than the big ones.

Taumac: nice little guy and from across the pond too. sweet.

 

[zkling]

Thanks Jake and Drive

This guy is selling a NOS 925 and it found there as well.
http://www.ebay.com/itm/RARE-NOS-ST...1?pt=BI_Tool_Work_Holding&hash=item27e4aeede9

I guess if you wanted to, you can put the swivel lock on the other side if needed. I'm still interested in what the thing looks like. It is a mystery.

I really like the lines of those Starretts but is it just me or does the screw eye finish seem to be pretty rough?

 

[Outlawmws]

I really like the lines of those Starretts but is it just me or does the screw eye finish seem to be pretty rough?

Well that one on Eprey seems rough, but it also looks like the guy did a **** job cleaning off surface rust.

Mine is as smooth as any other MFG...

 

[Outlawmws]

**: Maybe buy smaller ones they are less expensive than the big ones.

Cool! sell me your next Baby Bullet for cheap!