Trailer Tongue Angle

[brycez28]

Last weekend I forgot to raise the jack on my 14' tandem axle utility trailer when I hooked to my 4 wheeler....when I went from dirt to concrete, the jack caught and bent and bent the trailer coupler. I am going to order a new trailer coupler, but wanted to double check the A-Frame angle. I found a part number on the coupler and looked it up and it is 50 degrees, but what am I doing wrong with my pivot square to find that angle?

EDIT: BTW, the current coupler is rated at 5000 pounds gross weight. Who would put that on a 7000 pound rated trailer??? I'm going to be replacing it with a 14,000 pound coupler.

 

[bimmer1980]

I haven't used that type of angle measuring devise.....

However, It looks like the "corner" of the angle is towards the left of picture 1. i.e. the bottom of the angle is where your length numbers are and the top of the angle is the pivoting piece. Notice that it is reading about 35 degrees.

Keep in mind that this angle finder would typically be used on rafter, etc.

I also notice that the edge of the yellow part that has a flange on it may not be aligned correctly with the hitch....

You should end up reading about 25 degrees on your angle finder. this would be from the center line of the hitch to either side. 25 degrees plus 25 degrees (of the other side) would make 50 degrees "included" angle of the hitch....

hopefully this helps.....

 

[brycez28]

Thanks! I couldn't find my real angle finder and thought I'd try to improvise with this.

 

[Terra Nova]

This is how I would do it. Just need a tape measure and calculator.

Total angle = 2 x α

 

[kerrynzl]

This is how I would do it. Just need a tape measure and calculator.

Total angle = 2 x α

This is sort of how I would do it.

A 50° coupler is 25° each side of the centreline.

Get a string-line and run it down the centreline of the trailer, then measure a simple 90° triangle [ right angle from the centreline and the front of the deck ]

If the math aint your forte use this link and plug in the relevant info.

http://www.csgnetwork.com/righttricalc.html

 

[brycez28]

Thanks! I did a quick measure eyeing it up and used on online calculator and came up with 26 degrees x 2. Close enough for me!

 

[Big Bad Dad]

I recently jacknifed and ruined my coupler. I bought a replacement from etrailer.com. no problems and the angle matched perfectly. There seems to be s standard angle used in the trailer industry.

 

[kerrynzl]

I recently jacknifed and ruined my coupler. I bought a replacement from etrailer.com. no problems and the angle matched perfectly. There seems to be s standard angle used in the trailer industry.

Correct!
A 50° V Angle which is 25° each side of the centreline.

 

[Rookie2]

maybe you need to find a professional welder to attach your coupler.

 

[toofart]

50* couplers are pretty standard in North America.

 

[2004.5cumminsman]

Get rid of the A frame style and weld on a adjustable one. Very easy to do, and not a whole lot more than a good A frame style

http://www.etrailer.com/Trailer-Coupler/Atwood/AT81906-80308.html

 

[kerrynzl]

Looking at photo #2 through the hole you can see where the tongue was gas cut [too short]
I'd almost be too scared to disturb it.

A14lb hammer over a block of wood could straighten that. Then weld a piece of Angle across the back of the coupler as a rib.
To tap up the front of the hole, rest it on a piece of 2 x 4 wood [endways] and hammer down all around it.

Then spend the money on a foldaway Boat Trailer Jockey Wheel and mount it on the side of the tongue further back.

 

[brycez28]

Looking at photo #2 through the hole you can see where the tongue was gas cut [too short]
I'd almost be too scared to disturb it.

A14lb hammer over a block of wood could straighten that. Then weld a piece of Angle across the back of the coupler as a rib.
To tap up the front of the hole, rest it on a piece of 2 x 4 wood [endways] and hammer down all around it.

Then spend the money on a foldaway Boat Trailer Jockey Wheel and mount it on the side of the tongue further back.

I'm not following what you are saying about tpngue being cut too short?

 

[brycez28]

Get rid of the A frame style and weld on a adjustable one. Very easy to do, and not a whole lot more than a good A frame style

http://www.etrailer.com/Trailer-Coupler/Atwood/AT81906-80308.html

How would this benefit me?

 

[kerrynzl]

I'm not following what you are saying about tpngue being cut too short?

Have a look through the hole on the 3rd photo , you can clearly see the Top flange is cut back short.
The top dent goes downwards where the flange should be underneath.

The rails should go right through closer to the front allowing plenty of cantilever loads on the coupler.

I might be wrong because of what cant be seen in the photos.

here is what I mean [a bolt on example]

The original can still be straightened because the ball part is undamaged

 

[2004.5cumminsman]

How would this benefit me?

Very adjustable in case you have different height tow vehicles, adjust for loads. If u tow a lot, easy coupler change out when damaged.

Some 1/4" plate and 7018 and your in business.

Here is one I just did.

 

[brycez28]

Have a look through the hole on the 3rd photo , you can clearly see the Top flange is cut back short.
The top dent goes downwards where the flange should be underneath.

The rails should go right through closer to the front allowing plenty of cantilever loads on the coupler.

I might be wrong because of what cant be seen in the photos.

here is what I mean [a bolt on example]

The original can still be straightened because the ball part is undamaged

I see what you are saying. I took a crappy picture in the dark of the underside and drew in red where the frame should have been left uncut.

I think I will cut a solid piece of 1/4" plate to weld back in where the frame should have been left to begin with and connect the two frame rails together in the front and also put on a new coupler (that has a higher weight rating).

 

[brycez28]

Very adjustable in case you have different height tow vehicles, adjust for loads. If u tow a lot, easy coupler change out when damaged.

Some 1/4" plate and 7018 and your in business.

Here is one I just did.

That looks nice! I have an adjustable trailer hitch ball mount for my truck.

http://www.sharptruck.com/pv/5621/Curt-Channel-Style-Adjustable-Trailer-Hitch-Ball-Mount/45900

 

[2004.5cumminsman]

I used to run adjustable drop hitches, but after a lot of miles they get loose, no matter what the brand. Also, I can stand the slop I in them.

With these on my 6 trailers I run just a solid Reese hitch with a 30k ball and don't worry. Also I got rid of the stupid adapters and have the 2 1/2" solid stinger. Works well for me, just throwing ideas out!

 

[kerrynzl]

I see what you are saying. I took a crappy picture in the dark of the underside and drew in red where the frame should have been left uncut.

I think I will cut a solid piece of 1/4" plate to weld back in where the frame should have been left to begin with and connect the two frame rails together in the front and also put on a new coupler (that has a higher weight rating).

Once the old coupler is off, get 2 pieces of 3" x 1" rectangle tubing and weld a strongback on each side underneath [with a bit of overlap rearward]

That will still clear the tongue jack and not interfere with the fitment of the new coupler.

I still cant understand why you all use tongue jacks in the USA instead of a Jockey wheel that folds up .

 

[mikegt4]

Last weekend I forgot to raise the jack on my 14' tandem axle utility trailer when I hooked to my 4 wheeler....when I went from dirt to concrete, the jack caught and bent and bent the trailer coupler. I am going to order a new trailer coupler, but wanted to double check the A-Frame angle. I found a part number on the coupler and looked it up and it is 50 degrees, but what am I doing wrong with my pivot square to find that angle?

EDIT: BTW, the current coupler is rated at 5000 pounds gross weight. Who would put that on a 7000 pound rated trailer??? I'm going to be replacing it with a 14,000 pound coupler.

As has been stated 50* is the std. A frame angle in the US.

You wouldn't believe how many 7K trailers come with 5K couplers! Many builders and trailer salesmen seem to think that the axle rating alone determines the trailer rating. When I was shopping for a 7K trailer half of those I looked at had 5K couplers. It seems that a 2" ball is what everyone wants to use. 7K rated 2" couplers and balls can be found but they are not common, it is a lot easier to just go 2-5/16" and be done with it.

 

[brycez28]

Once the old coupler is off, get 2 pieces of 3" x 1" rectangle tubing and weld a strongback on each side underneath [with a bit of overlap rearward]

That will still clear the tongue jack and not interfere with the fitment of the new coupler.

I still cant understand why you all use tongue jacks in the USA instead of a Jockey wheel that folds up .

My trailer tongue isn't really long enough to use a jockey wheel

Once the old coupler is off, get 2 pieces of 3" x 1" rectangle tubing and weld a strongback on each side underneath [with a bit of overlap rearward]

That will still clear the tongue jack and not interfere with the fitment of the new coupler.

I still cant understand why you all use tongue jacks in the USA instead of a Jockey wheel that folds up .

My trailer tongue isn't really long enough to use a jockey wheel.

 

[koditten]

Wheeled tongue jacks don't work to good for tandem axle trailers here in the states.

 

[SM Racing]

Damn, that is a sweet 2.5RS. Where do you carry all the spare parts when you go to the track?

 

[kerrynzl]

Damn, that is a sweet 2.5RS. Where do you carry all the spare parts when you go to the track?

Normally in the Back of a Pick up truck.
This car's home is only 30km's [20 miles] from the nearest track.

Over here [NZ] motor racing is a car guy's version of playing golf.
We do it for fun.
If the car has a major mechanical, just load it on the trailer and enjoy the rest of the day as a spectator.

Enclosed trailers are a pain in the ***! You need a huge tow vehicle and a team of hanger on freeloaders just to load and unload all the ****.

There is a huge swing away from Enclosed trailers back to Flat decks over here.

 

[toofart]

There is a huge swing away from Enclosed trailers back to Flat decks over here.

That's exactly why I built my flat deck open trailer. I have a 20' enclosed which is a pain in the *** for everything. It's nice for snowmobiles in the winter since they don't get all dirty from the road grime, but for racing in the summer I'm done.

 

[Nor'Easter]

Once the old coupler is off, get 2 pieces of 3" x 1" rectangle tubing and weld a strongback on each side underneath [with a bit of overlap rearward]

That will still clear the tongue jack and not interfere with the fitment of the new coupler.

I still cant understand why you all use tongue jacks in the USA instead of a Jockey wheel that folds up .

Pretty useless trying to roll a trailer around that has 8-10,000 pounds on the deck, if it's on dirt there isn't a chance.

 

[kerrynzl]

Pretty useless trying to roll a trailer around that has 8-10,000 pounds on the deck, if it's on dirt there isn't a chance.

Why would you try doing that with a jockey wheel when you couldn't do it with a Tongue jack

Then again I forgot some people try to do stupid ****!

In the 30 years of owning car transporter trailers I have never try manually manoeuvring a trailer with a car loaded on it.

The main advantage of a jockey wheel is it folds away for ground clearance [and to save tailgate damage]

Some people are hopeless at backing up to a trailer [usually made worse with the arm swinging instructions of useless helpers]

A jockey wheel makes it easier to pull to trailer up to the hitch.

 

[Nor'Easter]

Why would you try doing that with a jockey wheel when you couldn't do it with a Tongue jack

Then again I forgot some people try to do stupid ****!

In the 30 years of owning car transporter trailers I have never try manually manoeuvring a trailer with a car loaded on it.

The main advantage of a jockey wheel is it folds away for ground clearance [and to save tailgate damage]

Some people are hopeless at backing up to a trailer [usually made worse with the arm swinging instructions of useless helpers]

A jockey wheel makes it easier to pull to trailer up to the hitch.

The point is that the trailer will always be too heavy to roll. Our trailers weigh 4,000 pounds empty. I've never seen a wheeled jack that can handle that much weight (loaded trailer). Remember it's a lot more than what the tongue weight is... The jacks have hand cranks and manual extensions to reduce crank time.

I have no problem backing up to a trailer alone...don't need someone to hold my hand.

If wheeled jacks are the future then why don't they come standard on every trailer built?

 

[kerrynzl]

Our trailers weigh 4,000 pounds empty.

That explains the need for a crewcab duellie
Why so heavy? [that is so old skool thinking ]

I can build trailers that weigh 4000lbs including the 69 Camaro loaded on it.


Some of these engineering monstrosities will develop stress cracks from their own weight.

I'm not questioning your backing abilities, for entertainment go down to a boat ramp on a Saturday morning and watch. [you'll understand that comment]

 

[Nor'Easter]

If the heaviest thing I trailered regularly was a Camaro I don't know what I would do with myself!

Our trailers are always loaded 8-10,000 pounds, plus the trailer weight puts us close to, or right at, the 14,000gvw of the trailer.

If we had a gooseneck there would be many opportunities to pull 14,000 in material alone, plus the 6,000 pounds a normal gooseneck weighs. I have a feeling trailer weight laws vary from US to NZ? Oil field guys regularly carry 20,000+ on the trailer alone. A gooseneck capable of carrying that will be anywhere from 8-10,000 pounds depending on length. Most are 40'. The more you freight the more you make...

I enjoy watching people (try) to back up.

 

[SM Racing]

That explains the need for a crewcab duellie
Why so heavy? [that is so old skool thinking ]

I can build trailers that weigh 4000lbs including the 69 Camaro loaded on it.


Some of these engineering monstrosities will develop stress cracks from their own weight.

I'm not questioning your backing abilities, for entertainment go down to a boat ramp on a Saturday morning and watch. [you'll understand that comment]

Enclosed trailers are heavy. You can't get around the material needed to make a 30+ft enclosed trailer work and last.

 

[csp]

My 7k capacity car hauler has a fold away jack (with a jockey wheel). The 10k equipment trailer and 14k gooseneck have dropleg jacks. The small enclosed snowmobile trailer has a foldaway and the big one (Vnose) has a tongue jack.

Not every trailer in the US has a tongue jack that prevents you from dropping the tailgate with the trailer attached.

 

[kerrynzl]

Enclosed trailers are heavy. You can't get around the material needed to make a 30+ft enclosed trailer work and last.

You can build an enclosed trailer that is lightweight by using the skins as a stressed member.
The rear door frame needs the most engineering.

The problem with lightweight enclosed trailers occurs when towing them empty.
[ Not a problem in NZ though, we're all good yachties ]

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Our trailer laws for lightweight trailers are [these are Gross Vehicle Weight and can be used with a Car drivers license]

Under 2000kg [4400 lbs] no brakes needed & 1 x safety chain

2000-2500kg [ to 5500 lbs] must have brakes , can be surge hydraulic/mechanical or electric & 2 x safety chains and rated coupler.

2500-3500kg [to 7700 lbs] must have driver controlled brakes [activated off the brake pedal] a separate mechanical handbrake, break-away, + load rated tyres, coupler ,axles etc

Over 3500kg is classified as a Heavy Trailer requiring a truck license and strict build regulations

Our biggest headache is the 2500mm [98.5"] width , by the time you deduct 230mm [9'] each side for the fenders, this only allows 2040mm [80.5"] for the deck.

Too narrow for an old Impala or Galaxie