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Flexmar or HP Spartacote

flyingtpot

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tejas del sur
Interested in info from users of Flexmar and/or HP Spartacote. That includes old or new applications of the products. I'm familiar enough with the various choices that are available for floor chemical covering. Yet, I'm in search of more details on these two product lines. I'm NOT interested in tile for my two current projects!

Thanks
 
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Shea

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From the floors we have seen, both coating companies put out a quality product. The only failures we have been aware of were due to applicator errors and/or poor floor prep.
 
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flyingtpot

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From the floors we have seen, both coating companies put out a quality product. The only failures we have been aware of were due to applicator errors and/or poor floor prep.

Were the floors residential or commercial that you reviewed? Any idea on when they were coated?

Thanks
 

Shea

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We've seen both commercial and residential floors. The residential floors were less than a few year old and looked brand new. I saw one failure that was done with Flexmar product, but the failure had nothing to do with the product. It was bad prep by a new installer who thought acid etching was all that was needed. These coating set up too fast to try and get away with acid etching. You need the consistent profile that grinding creates.

Some of the commercial floors we've seen were over 10 years old and going strong. One was a mechanics shop. It was Flexmar because I remember being very impressed because it only showed minor wear when it was cleaned up.
 
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flyingtpot

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We've seen both commercial and residential floors. The residential floors were less than a few year old and looked brand new. I saw one failure that was done with Flexmar product, but the failure had nothing to do with the product. It was bad prep by a new installer who thought acid etching was all that was needed. These coating set up too fast to try and get away with acid etching. You need the consistent profile that grinding creates.

Some of the commercial floors we've seen were over 10 years old and going strong. One was a mechanics shop. It was Flexmar because I remember being very impressed because it only showed minor wear when it was cleaned up.

Thanks Shea for the detailed reply. Flexmar receives excellent reviews. The owner of Flexmar is a wealth of knowledge on his product and pleasant when discussing it. The issue is the local installer for the material is a total wreck. I'm leaning now towards HP Spartacote. Yes, these coatings set up fast.
 

thegarageguy

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I wouldn't concern myself so much with the product, rather than the Company applying it. A reputable Company will use what they know works, not which has the best marketing machine or fancier packaging. The 2 mentioned will work fine if properly applied. You will not notice any difference in performance between the 2. What you will notice is if it's applied poorly because these fast cure systems have a learning curve.

I get much better results from epoxies and typically reserve polyaspartics as top coats, except for winter time which I use polyaspartic exclusively due to it's cold weather cure.

If time is not a concern, don't blow your money on a fast curing product and stick to a good epoxy for priming and base coating....save it for a coat if you so desire.
 
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Garage Flooring

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I wouldn't concern myself so much with the product, rather than the Company applying it. A reputable Company will use what they know works, not which has the best marketing machine or fancier packaging. The 2 mentioned will work fine if properly applied. You will not notice any difference in performance between the 2. What you will notice is if it's applied poorly because these fast cure systems have a learning curve.

I get much better results from epoxies and typically reserve polyaspartics as top coats, except for winter time which I use polyaspartic exclusively due to it's cold weather cure.

If time is not a concern, don't blow your money on a fast curing product and stick to a good epoxy for priming and base coating....save it for a coat if you so desire.

:bowdown: Well Said!
 
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flyingtpot

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I wouldn't concern myself so much with the product, rather than the Company applying it. A reputable Company will use what they know works, not which has the best marketing machine or fancier packaging. The 2 mentioned will work fine if properly applied. You will not notice any difference in performance between the 2. What you will notice is if it's applied poorly because these fast cure systems have a learning curve.

I get much better results from epoxies and typically reserve polyaspartics as top coats, except for winter time which I use polyaspartic exclusively due to it's cold weather cure.

If time is not a concern, don't blow your money on a fast curing product and stick to a good epoxy for priming and base coating....save it for a coat if you so desire.

My inquiry is in search of information:

That compares the two products as per the quality of the finish.
Compares the quality of the finish over a period of time.
Any unique process properties that will achieve the best results

As an engineer, my preference is to never move forward only based on if the company is considered reputable. I look at the big picture rather than focusing just on one variable. I wouldn't make a decision on choosing epoxy based on a comment of getting 'much better results' with it.

Time is an issue in the application process and therefore is driving my choice of materials. There are also other reasons for the choosing of the two material brands.
 
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mnavillus

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Fly,
I agree with my colleagues in the Forum as to the products you mentioned...either one will perform fine, however I get the feeling that your main concern is a "tight" installation window? yes or no? Are you building a specification for a project?

Don't forget, Surface preparation and the contractor performing the installation is equally as vital as the product selection. Particularly for commercial or industrial applications?

There may be other products that better suit you needs, but I have a few more questions to help me determine my advice.

Can you provide a few more specifics for your 2 current projects? new construction, or repair? is there a vapor barrier on the current slab? Did you test for moisture? what part of the country?

Are these commercial businesses that are operating and you need to squeeze the application after hours and weekends?

what is the use of the facility? residential or commercial? garage? food plant, restaurant, work shop, metal building?

What are your install windows? 2 days? 1 day? 4 days?

What is your expectation of service life?

This data will help me understand your current projects and assist in determining product type and etc?


Thanks,
 
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flyingtpot

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As previously stated the window of time to get this done is relatively short. Both floors will be completed in one day (Saturday). The move in will be on a Monday.

I've chosen a contractor that uses the HP Spartacote system. He has a higher end Werkmaster prep machine. He stopped by to review the site. As it turns out, he coated the neighbors recent (two years back) new detached garage floor.

I have two floors for now that will be processed. They are located outside of San Antonio, TX. One is a new detached build. The size is approximately 13'x19'. The pad was poured in 2005. It was pressure washed (water only) in early January. The build started in February. The contractor stated he is not concerned with moisture.

The second floor is an attached garage. The size is approximately 14'x20'. No vehicle or water has been on it since last year. It is a 2005 pour. It was originally coated with Rustoleum epoxy in 2005.

I expect a strong 10 year floor life with the HPS system using both bays as vehicle storage only. By strong, I don't expect peeling and flaking.
 

mnavillus

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sounds like your dotting your I's and crossing your T's. I've attached a few basics about epoxy floors and polyasparics to help you further understand your options? SEE PRO AND CON SHEET LISTED BELOW:

Assuming his diamonds are in good shape,the Werkmester prep machine should make short work of the existing Rustoleum products. That's a good thing!

Glad to hear you guys discussed moisture transfer, if he used the same products on your neighbors and it's performing than you should be in good shape!

Let me know should you have questions?

good luck!

Epoxy Coatings vs. Polyaspartic Coatings

Ever since the construction of the first concrete floor, humanity has searched for a way to protect and beautify the surface. Epoxy coatings have been around for some time and have been popular protectors of concrete floors Fairly new to the party, polyurea polyaspartic coatings have quickly become the darlings of those who want a fast dry time. Let’s examine each of these contenders and see how they stack up against each other.

Epoxy Coatings

Epoxies are resin polymers composed of epoxide units, which are cyclic three-atom ether rings containing an oxygen atom and two carbon side-groups. The triangular units are electronically strained and are therefore quite reactive. Normally, epoxy resin is formed by reacting bisphenol A and epichlorohydrin, but variants popular for concrete floor applications include novolac and aliphatic epoxy resins. A typical application consists of an epoxy primer, a color base coat and two layers of polyurethane. 100% broadcast flake will eliminate yellowing concerns

Pros:
Not expensive
Creates a hard, beautiful finish
You have many finish options, including color and mix-ins
Highly durable
Resistant to chemicals
Good adhesion — won’t lift
Long pot life, allowing application with a manual gun
Cons:
Less flexible and less resistant to abrasion
Can be somewhat difficult to apply in hot or cold conditions
Has a long drying time
Has potentially hazardous vapors, although new formulations address this
May not be colorfast — subject to fading or yellowing from UV exposure, though many formulations include UV protection
Cannot be applied when temperature below freezing

Polyaspartic Coatings

First introduced in the 1990’s, polyaspartic coatings derive from aliphatic polyisocyanate reacting with polyaspartic ester, a diamine. The compound is known as an aliphatic polyurea, which is quite different from conventional polyureas and in many ways superior. By tailoring the relative amount of the ester, scientists can craft a variety of coatings with different characteristics. For garage floor applications, the ester is the main component, resulting in low emissions and quick drying. When applied to grey concrete floors, polyaspartic coatings produce a glossy, almost watery tone that customers can color. In some applications, decorative chips are broadcast on the still-wet topcoat.

Pros:
Easier application in a wide variety of weather and temperature conditions
Hard, smooth finish that is stain- and scratch-resistant, good for high-traffic areas
Clear and non-sticky when dry
Fast drying times, cures to full strength in 1/2 to 1 hour
Colors and decorative chips available
Colorfast, even when applied to slightly damp concrete
Low VOCs and odor
Low viscosity gives its good wetting ability on concrete, but requires reduced percentage of solids
High, controllable film build-up
Less likely to bubble from outgassing
Cons:
Relatively new product, professional application recommended
Short pot life requires use of automatic application guns
Two to three times more expensive to purchase and apply
Must avoid high moisture vapor emission rate conditions when applying
Might have to thin the first coat for better adhesion
Doesn’t stand up as well to battery acids
Very slippery when wet, so a top aggregate such as chips recommended
 
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flyingtpot

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Thanks for the pros and cons list. I'm familiar with the polyaspartic list. My main concern is that rain is scheduled for the next five days or so here in the south TX area and the schedule is still on for the application this Saturday.
 
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flyingtpot

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tejas del sur
Have you tried contacting the mfg of the product you intend to use?


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For clarity...
I've reviewed the issue of applying the material with moisture, in this case rain, with the material supplier. Moisture and the material can be a concern when the floor is exposed to it. The concern the applicator and I discussed earlier today is the issue of working safely with 220V equipment lines outside in south TX flood weather. Also, the detached garage application is not so easy to do with the door opens if it rained like it did earlier today.
 
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