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What brand/ type exposed plastic junction boxes to use?

jdsac

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Joined
Mar 2, 2011
Messages
565
I have been looking for plastic junction boxes to be used in an attic to replace metal non grounded / bonded ones. Wiring is old style 2 wire romex with no ground.

The only 4x4 boxes I have found are Carlon & they say inside: "for use IN walls"

What would be the proper boxes to get & be safe and legal?

Thank You!
 
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jdsac

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Mar 2, 2011
Messages
565
Not extending the circuits- boxes are necessaryfor repair purposes due to previous "handyman" tapping into the romex in the middle of the run and just twisting & taping joints with no boxes. Metal boxes were installed, but not bonded/ grounded.
I was told in that case plastic would be the safest.
 
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troyks

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Aug 27, 2014
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23
Location
Kansas
Since you've already got metal boxes for the junctions there's no reason to replace them. Plastic boxes aren't any safer than metal, I would just remove the electrical tape and replace that with appropriate wire nuts and call it a day. Millions of homes still have original metal boxes with ungrounded wiring and receptacles, if you upgrade the branch wiring to be grounded then you need to be sure to bond metal boxes.
 

wyliesdiesels

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Aug 14, 2012
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Location
Modesto, CA
Not extending the circuits- boxes are necessaryfor repair purposes due to previous "handyman" tapping into the romex in the middle of the run and just twisting & taping joints with no boxes. Metal boxes were installed, but not bonded/ grounded.
I was told in that case plastic would be the safest.

If its 2 wire NM then its NOT Romex(Romex is a Southwire brand of NM-B wire).

Those newer circuits that were tapped off the 2-wire needs to be removed and reran as a homerun to the panel or nearest 3-wire circuit. This is because code doesnt allow 3-wire circuits to be ran from 2-wire circuits or the extension of 2-wire circuits...

These circuits need to be replaced using new wire with a ground.

Theres nothing wrong with existing 2-wire/ungrounded circuits other than u cant extend them...
 
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bczygan

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Nov 4, 2009
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DETROIT! Arsenal of Scrappers
If its 2 wire NM then its NOT Romex(Romex is a Southwire brand of NM-B wire).

Those newer circuits that were tapped off the 2-wire needs to be removed and reran as a homerun to the panel or nearest 3-wire circuit. This is because code doesnt allow 3-wire circuits to be ran from 2-wire circuits or the extension of 2-wire circuits...



Theres nothing wrong with existing 2-wire/ungrounded circuits other than u cant extend them...

So what is the inherent danger of living with ungrounded circuits.

And more importantly, if they are so dangerous, that you need to make all future circuits 3 wire, why aren't the 2 wire ones required to be replaced.

And I know the answer....economics.

So following this logic. What would be the added danger of adding 2 wire circuits to the ones already there, and using 3 wire to do it?

I know it isn't code. But from a practical standpoint.
 

Jdsmith

Active member
Joined
Nov 24, 2012
Messages
42
Location
Ohio
The electrical code, and the building codes in general, are not laws that are always in effect - they are regulations that a new or remodel project needs to meet at the time it is installed. An installation that is code compliant when installed does not need to modified in the future if the code changes, unless there is a remodeling project that goes through the building code process, then only the parts of the existing installation that interface with the new part are required to be changed. The legal mechanisms used to adopt building codes do not allow for the codes to be applied retroactively. Some people refer to this as grandfathering in the existing installations. This isn't technically true but it's basically the way it works in practice.

If you have a two wire circuit and part of the insulation on the hot wire fails a metal appliance or tool enclosure can be energized and have a 120v potential to ground. Since there is no ground wire this does. It create a short circuit so the breaker doesn't trip and an electric shock is waiting to happen. Connecting all of the metal parts of electric appliances together with ground wires, then connecting the ground wires to the system neutral at exactly one point provides a much greater likelihood of a breaker or fuse operating when a fault occurs, which has significantly reduced the number of people getting electric shocks.

The other subtlety is that this interconnected system of equipment grounds needs to be connected to the system neutral at exactly one point. This may be in the service entrance panel, in the meter base, or if the facility owns the transformer the neutral to ground bond is often made in the transformer. Connecting the neutral to the ground in more than one place is arguably safer than not having the ground connected, but it often results in steady state current on portions of the grounding system, which can also cause electric shocks.


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Jlarson

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Joined
Mar 27, 2015
Messages
738
Location
AZ
Carlon or whatever brand nonmetallic nail on boxes you can get easily and some nylon blank covers.

Some localities will allow 2 wire circuits to be extended if you GFCI them, check with your local amendments or with the AHJ.
 
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