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Lincoln Pro mig 175

1930

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Ive had this welder quite a few years and love it, zero complaints and has held up with no issues in heavy duty shop environment.

I have been looking into getting a spool gun for my big miller welder and that just isnt going to happen so by chance I contacted a member here whom was kind enough to share his experience with a Lincoln SG100 Spool gun on his 175 and according to him it isnt terribly bad.

Reading reviews online and there is alot of comments such as manufacturer prob. could not have possibly made the gun any cheaper but yes it does weld aluminum and not half bad.

Im wondering if anyone could suggest an upgrade to this gun.

Id rather spend a couple of hundred more bucks to get a great gun if that is possible to work with my welder.

Thanks, any reviews of the SG100 are welcome as well.
 
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imagineer

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I was asked to provide pictures and review of the Lincoln SG100 Spool gun, so here goes (you might want to get a cold drink, this is a bit long winded)…

SG100_zpsoqfuioin.jpg

I’ll start with the bottom line; is it worth the ~$200 – yes. It makes MIG welding aluminum significantly easier. The actual welding is not any easier, rather the SG100 takes care of “nearly all” the wire feed problems associated with MIG welding aluminum with a conventional pusher system. I’ll get into the “nearly all” bit in a moment.

SG100%20Label_zpskyali11h.jpg

Next, I want to stress that I’m not a pro-welder. I’m a self taught hobbiest. Chances are, some of the welding techniques I’ve learned/developed over the years (that work for me) aren’t 100% correct. So take this review with a grain of salt. Individual results may vary and if you have more or less success using a SG100 (or any spool gun), please share your experiences as well.

Set up – Either there was not complete information in the Lincoln website, or I simply didn’t pay enough attention, but I was put under the impression that to hook up the SG100 to my Lincoln ProMIG 175, I would need an adapter kit that wasn’t available through Lincoln. Like the good little lemming, I quickly ordered a SP125 kit from Oxarc.com.

http://shop.oxarc.com/lincoln-elect...oolgun-to-sp-100-sp-130-sp-175-model-welders/

(This is not an endorsement or negative critique of their product, only to say it worked). Turns out, the only part needed out of the Oxarc kit, is the female plug receptacle that gets mounted in the front panel of the MIG welder. The rest of the wire, terminals and switch were included with the SG100. It irked me a bit to spend $50 for a simple part. Someday when I have nothing better to do, I’ll peruse the electronic resources I use to find an appropriate plug receptacle for less $$.

SG100%20Plug_zps3bxxm63w.jpg

Budget 2 hours for installation. Some folks will finish the work in far less time with far less profanity . . . I don’t like any of you. The descriptions and graphics in the instructions (in my case) didn’t exactly match the innards of my older ProMIG 175. It was a little scary messing with the wiring inside the welder while not being 100% certain I was doing the correct thing. A little deductive reasoning and circuit chasing proved to me I was doing things right.

A word of caution, before drilling the required holes for the switch and female plug receptacle, take a moment to mock up where these items will be installed and evaluate that you actually have enough wire length to place these items where you are instructed. In my case, the wires for the switch were a bit too short to make things easy. I ended up routing wires outside of the stock insulated wire loom to gain the needed length. It might have not been necessary, but I salvaged a bit of insulating wire loom from a PC power supply to protect the re-routed wires. Conversely, there was ample wire available for the female plug receptacle and I could have positioned it where it looked a little better.

SG100%20Switch_zpsakkv46he.jpg

Use. Again, this is just my experience, but to weld using the SG100, I had to toss out the journal I kept of what setting worked for what aluminum conditions. Using the spool gun required less amps (about 20% less) and slower wire speed. Also the wire speed out of the ProMIG 175 internal drive system is about half of what the SG100 puts out. The wire flat out screams out of the SG100. I ended up welding with my wire speed setting at about 60% of what I was accustomed to.

SG100%20Tip_zpsmuui97kp.jpg

It seems that the electrode tips used on the SG100 have a propensity toward melting. Settle down all you pro-welders out there…I’m sure it’s something I’m doing wrong, but in the 10+ years I’ve been MIG welding aluminum, I’d never actually melted an electrode tip. The electrodes that fit the SG100 are tapered versus a blunt tip like I’d been using for years (and of course, they’re not interchangeable.) Maybe the lack of material makes them more prone to melting. So with that said, expect to turn down the amps and wire speed. It wouldn’t hurt, before you get started, to find and purchase a package of electrode tips. I paid about $8 for a pack of 10. (Also, for what it’s worth, I also drill out the .035” tips using a 1mm drill bit to ensure any inconsistent wire condition won’t cause the wire to stick.)

SG100%20Open_zpsj8oiavsb.jpg

The wire drive system in the SG100 could stand for some improvement. The pressure roller is not adjustable. It’s basically a sealed roller bearing on a spring plate. Prying the pressure roller away from the drive roller to load new wire (or put the misaligned wire back in the groove, more on this in a bit) is not the easiest chore. When prying the roller out of the way, the little engineer in your head will be convinced you over flexed, and permanently deformed the spring plate. I sacrificed a tiny flat blade screwdriver, bending the end, to make a tool that made this task easier. The pressure roller doesn’t have much support. In fact it appears to be only balanced on the edge of the spring plate.

SG100%20Drive_zps3fmca8j9.jpg

This allows the bearing to pivot, which allows the filler wire to slip out of the drive roller groove and get stuck under the pressure roller bearing. This is made worse by poor quality wire (BTW, it was the spool of .035” 4043 that came with the SG100 kit). I’m working on a solution to the pressure roller dilemma and will share the fix when ready. So the long, profanity laced tirades that used to be commonplace while trying to feed aluminum wire through a 10’ torch cable or unf*cking a birdsnest, were replaced with a new tantrum brought on by the weld wire suddenly stopping, leading to yet another melted electrode tip. Again, find and buy a supply of electrode tips. The kit only came with 5 - .035” tips and I melted 4 inside of 15 minutes while I figuring out this new system.
 
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1930

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I didnt want to quote your entire post with pictures but thanks, great write-up.
I misunderstood, I see now that you have not yet figured a way around the one outlet needed that has to be ordered with the 50 dollar kit.

Can you reccomend a place to buy the extra tips directly, also can you recommend a higher quality wire, you leave me with the impression that the wire that came with the kit might not be ideal and I do not believe in handicapping myself further with shiz wire.

I understand if its too much of your time already but if possible to take brighter pictures of your wiring, I am terrible reading directions but pictures ( ooeeaaa ) work very well for me.

Dosent seem like anyone has tried this set-up personally other than yourself and I cant find any positive or negative comments on the web so for the 2 hun I might just give it a shot.
 

imagineer

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I bought the electrode tips at my local weld supplier. The part # was KP2744-035T. Luckily they had one pack of 10 in stock. I'd recommend buying from this place, https://weldingsupply.com/cgi-bin/einstein.pl?PNUM::1:UNDEF:X:KP2744035T I've bought a bunch of stuff from them over the years and been satisfied with the price/service/delivery. I only bought the pack of 10 locally because I was in a hurry.

Sorry but I'm not pulling the cover off the welder for pictures of the wiring modifications. It's a pain in the azz to get the cover back on and besides, the pictures will not show the new wiring very well as most of it is hidden or snaked behind other parts.

I've never been impressed with Lincoln brand wire, usually purchased at Lowes. The wire frequently has sections that are flatted (not round) and also sections that are not the correct diameter and worse, has the wire crossed over itself so it hangs up. I'm not partial to any particular brand other than to say, I cannot recall wire quality problems using brands other than Lincoln.

FWIW, sberry is correct that if you want shop production level performance, you need a machine designed to MIG aluminum, preferably one with pulse control. For a home based hobbiest hack like me, the add on spool gun was a better choice.
 
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1930

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I bought the electrode tips at my local weld supplier. The part # was KP2744-035T. Luckily they had one pack of 10 in stock. I'd recommend buying from this place, https://weldingsupply.com/cgi-bin/einstein.pl?PNUM::1:UNDEF:X:KP2744035T I've bought a bunch of stuff from them over the years and been satisfied with the price/service/delivery. I only bought the pack of 10 locally because I was in a hurry.

Sorry but I'm not pulling the cover off the welder for pictures of the wiring modifications. It's a pain in the azz to get the cover back on and besides, the pictures will not show the new wiring very well as most of it is hidden or snaked behind other parts.

I've never been impressed with Lincoln brand wire, usually purchased at Lowes. The wire frequently has sections that are flatted (not round) and also sections that are not the correct diameter and worse, has the wire crossed over itself so it hangs up. I'm not partial to any particular brand other than to say, I cannot recall wire quality problems using brands other than Lincoln.

FWIW, sberry is correct that if you want shop production level performance, you need a machine designed to MIG aluminum, preferably one with pulse control. For a home based hobbiest hack like me, the add on spool gun was a better choice.
No prod. level performance needed here either with what im trying to do. Thanks again for info
 

zkling

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So I guess you gave up on your MM200 aluminum capability? :lol_hitti


The problem with those smaller mig machines is they just don't have the duty cycle to do much aluminum welding. Throw a Teflon liner in that gun and get a small spool of 5356, keep the gun as straight as possible. That will at least get your feet wet with aluminum too see if the machine has the power to do what you need.

For example, the 175 is ~125amp at 25% IIRC where as a full size 200amp class mig is more in the 160amp at 60% and your MM200 ~200amp at 60%.

BTW there are TONS of people that have that setup and other brand equivalents. You need to look more generically at the class of machines and guns vs specific model numbers. That "Pro Mig 175" has been a number of things over the years, all essentially the same machine.
 
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sberry

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I have a HH210 and it has replaced my tig. But... the op doesn't need duty. A small unit will do the work most need to do. They work well for utility and maintenance.
 

zkling

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I have a HH210 and it has replaced my tig. But... the op doesn't need duty. A small unit will do the work most need to do. They work well for utility and maintenance.

How do you know? We around in circles in his other thread when he wanted to outfit his MM200, yet never gave an example of what he wanted to weld. Space shuttle most likely. :lol_hitti

BTW those 200amp class 120/240 compact migs are pretty stout with ~160 @ 25% or something like that.
 
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I wasn't talking production but a guy could sell it and buy a Hobart gun ready for very little juice.
For the time being ( and I do not see things changing anytime real soon ) I am thinking of small projects, too be honest the ONLY one that comes to mind at the moment is to weld/stabilize the arms on two brand new just newly bought bumper racks that I purchased that will allow me to store my bumpers safely and conveniently.

I paid alot of money for these http://www.ebay.com/itm/140749836197?_trksid=p2060353.m1438.l2649&ssPageName=STRK:MEBIDX:IT ( I purchased two of them ) only to find out that if they really tried hard they still could not have possibly manufactured them any cheaper. I feel that welding the arms to that upright support though may give me the added security and that Im not going to come into the shop one morning and find a heavy bumper or tailgate smashed on the floor.

To take this to someone and have done will easily cost me in excess of the 200 give or take that this little spool gun costs and so since I VERY rarely have minor projects ( working with welding aluminum ) like the one at hand I thought that I might just give something that costs a whole lot less than an entire aluminum welding outfit might cost a try.

I see that imagineer has welded some really heavy aluminum together with his spool gun and so I figure if it will do as many projects as what he has done with his than maybe this would do me for now.

I hope that I am being less evasive at this point.
 
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1930

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I wasn't talking production but a guy could sell it and buy a Hobart gun ready for very little juice.
If you do not mind could you tell me more, is their an entire Hobart welding outfit avail all set up for aluminum for just a bit more than this spool gun.....is Hobart Harbor freight?

Ive seen the Hobart mig welders in various shops, they are usually sitting in the storeroom collecting dust cause either people did not know how to take care of them or they were just too fragile.
 
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1930

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So I guess you gave up on your MM200 aluminum capability? :lol_hitti


The problem with those smaller mig machines is they just don't have the duty cycle to do much aluminum welding. Throw a Teflon liner in that gun and get a small spool of 5356, keep the gun as straight as possible. That will at least get your feet wet with aluminum too see if the machine has the power to do what you need.

For example, the 175 is ~125amp at 25% IIRC where as a full size 200amp class mig is more in the 160amp at 60% and your MM200 ~200amp at 60%.

BTW there are TONS of people that have that setup and other brand equivalents. You need to look more generically at the class of machines and guns vs specific model numbers. That "Pro Mig 175" has been a number of things over the years, all essentially the same machine.
Yes I gave up on the Miller welding aluminum, makes no sense to pursue from what I gathered.
 
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1930

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How do you know? We around in circles in his other thread when he wanted to outfit his MM200, yet never gave an example of what he wanted to weld. Space shuttle most likely. :lol_hitti

BTW those 200amp class 120/240 compact migs are pretty stout with ~160 @ 25% or something like that.

I did mention many times in my past thread small projects, generic stuff, no space shuttles. I hope I clarified in the above post an example.
 
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1930

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I have a HH210 and it has replaced my tig. But... the op doesn't need duty. A small unit will do the work most need to do. They work well for utility and maintenance.

I google HH210 and I get this... http://www.northerntool.com/shop/to...&type=search&gclid=CPGau_nXq8oCFYI7aQodIVkCow

Over a thousand dollars, if I were to spend this kind of money on a welding outfit I would just go ahead and spend a little less than another thousand and buy a much bigger machine made for heavier shop use.

I may still do this one day but not today. Thanks though
 

zkling

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I did mention many times in my past thread small projects, generic stuff, no space shuttles. I hope I clarified in the above post an example.

No you didn't, give an example of material thickness and weld length.

Sberry is talking about a HH210 and a spool gun, similar setup, same size, just a bit more power than your 175. Both compact wire feed machines with a spool gun option.

Just start with the teflon liner I suggested above, that will at least get you started to see if mig welding aluminum is for you.

There are 3 ways to feed aluminum wire
*Spool gun - most common for smaller machines to feed a smaller softer wire (less column strength).

*Push pull gun, typically reserved for larger 200+ amp class machines, can be expensive to get into, although not much more than some of the higher end spool guns, especially if you need a controller.

*Direct feed from the machine, which can be done but it is better suited to larger diameter wires and stiffer alloys (greater column strength) as well as minimal gun length. Which can be a catch 22 when people want to run this on small machines that don't have the power to properly run the wire size.


Your options are, from cheapest to most expensive...

Try running direct feed
Get a spool gun for your 175
Find a used spool gun for your 200
Find a used push/pull system for your 200
Get a new spool gun and controller for your 200
Get a new push/pull system for your 200 and possibly a controller
 
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1930

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No you didn't, give an example of material thickness and weld length.

Sberry is talking about a HH210 and a spool gun, similar setup, same size, just a bit more power than your 175. Both compact wire feed machines with a spool gun option.

Just start with the teflon liner I suggested above, that will at least get you started to see if mig welding aluminum is for you.

There are 3 ways to feed aluminum wire
*Spool gun - most common for smaller machines to feed a smaller softer wire (less column strength).

*Push pull gun, typically reserved for larger 200+ amp class machines, can be expensive to get into, although not much more than some of the higher end spool guns, especially if you need a controller.

*Direct feed from the machine, which can be done but it is better suited to larger diameter wires and stiffer alloys (greater column strength) as well as minimal gun length. Which can be a catch 22 when people want to run this on small machines that don't have the power to properly run the wire size.


Your options are, from cheapest to most expensive...

Try running direct feed
Get a spool gun for your 175
Find a used spool gun for your 200
Find a used push/pull system for your 200
Get a new spool gun and controller for your 200
Get a new push/pull system for your 200 and possibly a controller

Good info, I thought a spool gun was considered a push pull gun so I have learned something new.
 

CNGsaves

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If you do not mind could you tell me more, is their an entire Hobart welding outfit avail all set up for aluminum for just a bit more than this spool gun.....is Hobart Harbor freight?

I've seen the Hobart mig welders in various shops, they are usually sitting in the storeroom collecting dust cause either people did not know how to take care of them or they were just too fragile.

You obviously have NOT been out in the sunshine much if you . . . . .
. . . . . think that Hobart is Harbor Freight !!!??!?!##?!! :lol_hitti

Time to do a little research or Googling first and learn what's out there. Hobart is quality welder and very good machine.
 

zkling

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Good info, I thought a spool gun was considered a push pull gun so I have learned something new.

:lol: Yet you still don't give an example of what you want to weld.

We discussed this in your other thread, time for you to do some self study and retain the info.
 

MoonRise

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The problem with those smaller mig machines is they just don't have the duty cycle to do much aluminum welding. Throw a Teflon liner in that gun and get a small spool of 5356, keep the gun as straight as possible. That will at least get your feet wet with aluminum too see if the machine has the power to do what you need.

Ixnay (aka NOPE ) on using 5356 aluminum filler wire with most of the 'small' MIG machines. Where 'small' is the under 200 amp units. The 210-class machines are also usually in this category (as far as aluminum filler wire goes).

The 250-class machines can usually run whatever filler wire you want. :bounce: Within reason. Even the 250-class don't really have enough snot to run some 1/16" solid steel ER70S-6 wire in spray mode with C10. Nor some 3/32" Lincoln Ultracore 70C FCAW-G wire (which, with enough machine, can be put down to the tune of over 20 lbs of weld bead per hour!). Just saying. :bowdown:

OK, back to aluminum electrodes and 'small' GMAW machines.

The issue with the 'small' machines and 5356 aluminum filler as opposed to the RTFM 'recommended' 4043 aluminum filler is that most of the 'small' machines do NOT have the proper voltage output AND amperage output at that voltage in order to successfully use the 5356 filler.

There is about a 10-20% voltage-amperage difference between 4043 filler and 5356 filler.

example: for 150 amps welding current, some 0.035 4043 filler would have a WFS of about 450 ipm while some 0.035 5356 for the same 150 amps would need about 500 ipm WFS. That's not too bad at first glance, but at the higher end (voltage or amperage/WFS), the 'small' machines run out of snot/capability rather quickly (the voltage-amperage output curves drop off rather rapidly).

Don't know if this tech advice article is still available on the Lincoln website or not, but this was in regards to a tech question from a few years back about using the 'small' Lincoln MIG machines (SP135 and SP175 machines, both "T" tapped voltage output and 'Plus' continuously variable output voltage versions) to weld aluminum. I will quote just one section regarding filler wire :

Filler Wire

All of these welders are best used only with .035” 4043 alloy aluminum wire. Do not use 5356 wire or wires of .030” diameter. They will not work well.

I 100% agree with your statement about duty cycle being an important consideration, especially with aluminum and the 'small' MIG machine. :beer:

The Lincoln SP175 or ProMig175 machines are decent/nice machines within their limits.

But if you really want/need to be welding some aluminum, get a different machine. Sell the PM175 and put the money towards something else. IMHO.

Maybe like a Lincoln PowerMig210MP. 120V or 240V input, DC only output (no AC output) and the machine can run GMAW for steel or stainless steel or aluminum, is spool-gun ready/capable (the 100SG model) , can also run DC SMAW (aka stick) or DC (so no aluminum) GTAW (aka TIG) all from the same machine. This machine IS listed as capable of running 4043 or 5356 aluminum filler (through the 100SG spool-gun).
 
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MoonRise

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I think someone go *** wrong about the wire size though, the 175-200 class seem to like 030 better.

For steel filler, absolutely.

For aluminum filler, most of those 'small' machines call for using 0.035 4043 wire.

The PM211MP does list 0.035 4043 OR 5356 wire using the 100SG in the parameter chart.

Trying to feed 0.030 'soft' aluminum wire is not easy.
 

zkling

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Ixnay (aka NOPE ) on using 5356 aluminum filler wire with most of the 'small' MIG machines. Where 'small' is the under 200 amp units. The 210-class machines are also usually in this category (as far as aluminum filler wire goes).

I and many others can tell you first hand that 5356 will run just fine on the "smaller" machines*. You have to watch some of those Lincoln articles as they will contradict themselves if not taken within the context of the intended audience. IE hobby welder vs production environment will give different recommendations based on the feasibility of the intended audience.

*within the limitations of the machine itself.

Quite honestly I don't think the OP knows what he wants or needs. Gives no example or specific of joints to be welded, etc. Sure if everyone could afford a pulsed push pull machine, great, however many cannot, nor do not need.
 
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1930

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You obviously have NOT been out in the sunshine much if you . . . . .
. . . . . think that Hobart is Harbor Freight !!!??!?!##?!! :lol_hitti

Time to do a little research or Googling first and learn what's out there. Hobart is quality welder and very good machine.

I said harbor freight but I meant Home Depot, not much of a difference in my opinion but just my opinion.

Lowes sells the welder I mentioned initially and its one hell of a welder in my opinion so I guess there are still some quality stuff found at the big box stores.

As mentioned Ive seen alot of Hobarts sitting in corners unusable but again maybe they were just plain flat out abused.
 

sberry

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I got both. A Linc and Hob. They are both good, never ran alum thru the Linc but it's a super steel unit. I have SPT with a 5 speed and it's right on the money, they made it a long time. The Hobart is so close that it takes a critical expert to evaluate it
 

sberry

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Anyone that lets the Hobart gather dust doesnt know what they are doing. All the current models are very good. Last loser was a 180, its long gone. The IM230 would be on my short list today as well as a HH210 MVP with a spooly.
 
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