Designing socket sets better?

[toolaholic]

Hi all, I purchased the last made in Taiwan kobalt 1/2 drive socket set at my lowes. It was on sake for $47. I got 10% off using my lowes card( 10% off 2 day promo). Anyway, I got me thinking about who designs these sets. I bought it for the universal swivel, six point sockets, and the 3 extensions. I feel the ratchet should be 15" not 10" as supplied. Plus the breaker bar is 12". How bout 12" that telescopes to 18". Or a 18 that goes to 24 like the Cal van I own. I'm selling my dewalt 1/2 drive set to my best friend for $20( I paid 23.88 at Sears). This set is great for my friend cause of thin case. But it has no extensions! WTF! He works at sewer plant. The kobalt: Kobalt 33-Piece Standard (SAE) and Metric Mechanic's Tool Set with Hard Case
http://www.lowes.com/pd_573345-25428-86757_?productId=999909123 the dewalt set: http://m.sears.com/dewalt-25-piece-1-2-inch-full-polish-socket/p-00938295000P. I bought the dewalt set for the six points but liked the kobalt better. But both sets could be so much better if they included the right ratchets and breaker bars.

 

[drink]

Some packaged socket sets can be difficult because it seems like they are always leaving something out that you really need. The ratchet and breaker bar look like they are pretty short. Adding either missing pieces or additional tools to a blow mold case can be difficult unless they added room for expansion.

Years ago I purchased an Allen socket set with mainly 1/4" & 3/8" drive standard depth sockets. The case has a hidden compartment and later I added some rails of 1/4" drive deep sockets to increase the capability of the set. A 1/4" drive ratchet and some 1/4" drive extensions were added also.

 

[MShaw]

I love it when they leave out necessary things. Like the Kobalt 3/8" drive flex sockets. To keep the same quantity of sockets for uniform cost and packaging they left out the 14, 16 and 18 mm sockets. 14 mm is a really popular size. What ***** decides it is ok to leave out frequently used tools?

 

[bfm336]

This is why (as a homeowner who does car work, house work, old machine, etc) I love the SK sets - I've got a 1/4 and 3/8 complete socket sets in SAE and Metric, not missing sizes, for less than $150/each. The cases are GREAT organization as I like to pick them up and take them to where I am doing work, and for those just doing car work can take the lids off and leave in their box nice and organized.

 

[Schurkey]

The fact that those sets always leave out desirable tools is a hint that you shouldn't be wasting time 'n' money on them unless you go in from the beginning with the idea that you're going to have to add-on to the set. Which then usually means the blow-molded ******** goes directly into the trash.

Leaving out vital items means either the set was designed by marketing manipulators, or by someone who has no business dealing with tools. What does that say about the rest of the tool company?

 

[speed bump]

If you want something individually tailored to your needs why are you purchasing it at Lowe's as a set? They are working on the assumption (correctly I might add) that you either won't use those pieces or will come back and buy them individually when you do need them. That allows them to hit a price point and packaging size that they feel will influence the consumer to consume at the highest rate possible.

 

[Rarified27]

There's no question that leaving out certain items is a marketing effort, however my bigger gripe with socket sets are the cases- the blow mold stuff is always obnoxiously large and there's such a lack of efficiency in case design that creates unused/unnecessary space.

When you travel with tools and your job depends on it, having the most complete, but least space-consuming and lightest setup is critical to efficiency.

For example- my favorite sets (see pics) are discontinued ones from NAPA that are in slim cases, have little wasted space and the 1/4" goes up to 15mm which is nice.

Minor wishes- that the 3/8 had a 1" deep, the torx didn't skip T25/T30 and the hex sockets weren't doubled (I use 5/23 and 3/16 constantly and have extra ones I leave in the cases).

Breaker bars in the sets seemed useless since I wouldn't want anything below 18"+ and if I did, it would probably need a cheater.

 

[M6erfan]

This is why (as a homeowner who does car work, house work, old machine, etc) I love the SK sets - I've got a 1/4 and 3/8 complete socket sets in SAE and Metric, not missing sizes, for less than $150/each. The cases are GREAT organization as I like to pick them up and take them to where I am doing work, and for those just doing car work can take the lids off and leave in their box nice and organized.

I'm curious, how old and which model SK sets do you have? I bought a 1/4" SK socket set last year and thought the blow molded case was not that great. The sockets were very loose in their respective holders allowing them to shift quite a bit during transport and the plastic was not very thick allowing the case to bow and flex allowing the contents to scatter further. Also, I don't remember the lid being very easy to remove/replace. I was not impressed with the SK blow molded case at all.

That said, I'm with the OP on this, it seems most tool companies don't put a ton of thought into the sets or the ergonomics of the cases they're in...

 

[B_Bimmer]

I'm curious, how old and which model SK sets do you have? I bought a 1/4" SK socket set last year and thought the blow molded case was not that great. The sockets were very loose in their respective holders allowing them to shift quite a bit during transport and the plastic was not very thick allowing the case to bow and flex allowing the contents to scatter further. Also, I don't remember the lid being very easy to remove/replace. I was not impressed with the SK blow molded case at all.

That said, I'm with the OP on this, it seems most tool companies don't put a ton of thought into the sets or the ergonomics of the cases they're in...

All that you say is true, although it's not as big a deal to most people as you make it sound. If they made stuff fit tight people would complain they couldn't easily get the pieces out. If they made the plastic super thick and rigid people would complain it's heavy. If they made the lid too easy to remove and replace it would fall off. I believe they are just about a perfect happy medium, packing as much value into a small area as possible. They are one of the best, most reasonably priced sets out there today.

 

[four.cycle]

^ these two statements above pretty much sum it up:

The manufacturer does the best they can to provide a "set" at a competitive price, and all kinds of compromises are made in the process.
There is no "perfect" socket set other than the one you build yourself.

I've yet to see any "socket set" that was owned by somebody who actually used the tools that wasn't added to: more sockets, more extensions, a few wobblies, etc.

The blow-mold cases are all fine and well, but with very few exceptions don't allow the owner to add more pieces.
Only solution is to find a well-built steel box, toss the molded plastic liner, and add to it what you want.

 

[geartow]

Thanks OP I have been wanting that set from lowes now that it is on sale I will pull the trigger.

 

[Gmonkee]

If you already know your needs build up a set to that specific list.

Your perfect set will have at least five details wrong for everyone else so why try to mass market the perfect set for one man at one point in time?

I built up all mine from the best parts and then made tins to hold them. If it's wrong it's my fault and I can correct it.

And most will say my kit has the wrong brand sockets, the W+ extensions **** and it's not a flex ratchet..... So what, it's mine and has served me for years.

 

[toolaholic]

Thanks OP I have been wanting that set from lowes now that it is on sale I will pull the trigger.

get a Taiwan set. The China sets are filtering in.

 

[MShaw]

As I found out, the missing sizes are not made by Kobalt. I bought the sae and metric flex sockets for my son to carry in his car. I had to go to Sears to get a 14 mm flex socket to make the set more useful.

 

[Bigblue&Goldie]

Hi all, I purchased the last made in Taiwan kobalt 1/2 drive socket set at my lowes. It was on sake for $47. I got 10% off using my lowes card( 10% off 2 day promo). Anyway, I got me thinking about who designs these sets.

Read your first 2 sentences. You are gloating about how cheap the set was. If you want a quality, comprehensive set you should focus less on price and more on quality and features.

 

[ChevyEFI]

This is why (as a homeowner who does car work, house work, old machine, etc) I love the SK sets - I've got a 1/4 and 3/8 complete socket sets in SAE and Metric, not missing sizes, for less than $150/each. The cases are GREAT organization as I like to pick them up and take them to where I am doing work, and for those just doing car work can take the lids off and leave in their box nice and organized.

I agree with this in its entirety.

I'm curious, how old and which model SK sets do you have? I bought a 1/4" SK socket set last year and thought the blow molded case was not that great. The sockets were very loose in their respective holders allowing them to shift quite a bit during transport and the plastic was not very thick allowing the case to bow and flex allowing the contents to scatter further. Also, I don't remember the lid being very easy to remove/replace. I was not impressed with the SK blow molded case at all.

That said, I'm with the OP on this, it seems most tool companies don't put a ton of thought into the sets or the ergonomics of the cases they're in...

I've had my 1/4 and 3/8 sets over 15 years each. Transport involves having the lid closed, which prevents all but violent of action from allowing sockets to move around.

The lid is secure, but can be removed if bent properly.

What impresses you about cases? individual socket retention via raised ridges? I don't want to deal with that when I'm stationary and grabbing different sizes.

 

[bfm336]

As someone above said - if I take the SK sets and move them around 1-5 sockets might "pop out" of where they rest, but it is a tradeoff. Happy overall, and I keep a few craftsman black (USA made) plastic cases for extra stuff.

 

[Sam'sAutoParts]

I love it when they leave out necessary things. Like the Kobalt 3/8" drive flex sockets. To keep the same quantity of sockets for uniform cost and packaging they left out the 14, 16 and 18 mm sockets. 14 mm is a really popular size. What ***** decides it is ok to leave out frequently used tools?

Kobalt wrench set i bought last year skipped 14mm 16mm & 1/2"?!?!? It also skipped 13/16 which is not surprising.

 

[toolaholic]

Read your first 2 sentences. You are gloating about how cheap the set was. If you want a quality, comprehensive set you should focus less on price and more on quality and features.

I basically wanted the six point sockets. The extensions and universal was a bonus. I have a proto 15 inch long ratchet, craftsman premium ratchet, Armstrong locking fkex head and a kobalt roto in half drive. Plus a proto sliding 12" breaker, craftsman 15" breaker , 18" proto breaker, and gearwrench 24" breaker. So I'll use the sockets and extensions from set and grab what breaker/ ratchet I need out of the 1/2 drive drawer. I just wish some of the sets would make more sense.

 

[pauls_workshop]

On the big green SK sets, I found putting on top of the sockets just a thin blanket of plastic bubble wrap keeps them all in place just fine when moving it around. Just pull it off when you use them, put it back when done and snap the lid shut. Nothing moves. I love the giant SK sets and want MORE!! Very handy having so much in one place. - Paul

 

[ChevyEFI]

On the big green SK sets, I found putting on top of the sockets just a thin blanket of plastic bubble wrap keeps them all in place just fine when moving it around. Just pull it off when you use them, put it back when done and snap the lid shut. Nothing moves.

I do that with folded shop rags in a plastic case of taps / dies. Works well and serves double duty.

 

[Philbert]

I would just like a Metric tool kit. If I wanted SAE I'd buy it. I have a whole drawer in my tool box with SAE. I throw all my dated tools in there (like my flex oil can spout). The only time I use SAE is when I work on my house, I haven't used my SAE on my vehicals in almost twenty years.


P.S.
It seems like every prepackaged tool kit has SAE tools in it. I'd like to get a decent tool kit for my vehicals that are all Metric. T.Y.

 

[jt777]

Im not a fan of 1/2 drive socket sets going down to 8 or 10 mm.when i put together a set of snap on impacts at work I'm starting at 15mm or maybe 14mm. Even that a professional 3/8 impact gun can take apart anything under 15mm. Heck i use mine with 19mm all the time. A 1/2 impact on 10 or 12mm bolt heads is retarded in my opinion

 

[bwringer]

I would just like a Metric tool kit. If I wanted SAE I'd buy it. I have a whole drawer in my tool box with SAE. I throw all my dated tools in there (like my flex oil can spout). The only time I use SAE is when I work on my house, I haven't used my SAE on my vehicals in almost twenty years.


P.S.
It seems like every prepackaged tool kit has SAE tools in it. I'd like to get a decent tool kit for my vehicals that are all Metric. T.Y.

Same here. Every time I find what looks like a nice deal on a set, it includes a bunch of inch **** that's completely useless to me. Aarrgh.

I'm not so much in the market for complete sets any more for myself, but recently I wanted to get my niece a decent but reasonably inexpensive starter set of tools in a nice case for her birthday so she can start handling some of her own car work. Every set I found skipped essential metric sizes but included a bunch of useless inch junk.


Last time I bought a set of metric sockets (Taiwan-made Kobalt at Lowes -- very, very nice), I had to fill in three or four missing sizes. Fortunately, they had the missing sizes in the exact same style socket in stock.

What REALLY bugs me is when you encounter a set with skipped sizes and no way at all to fill in the blanks with matching sockets. Harbor Freight, for example, has some Taiwan-made socket sets that are otherwise very nice but skip sizes you can't get.

And there's probably some goober in HF HQ with a pocket protector and squeaky-clean fingernails who just can't figure out why they aren't selling.

 

[PelicanPines]

What REALLY bugs me is when you encounter a set with skipped sizes and no way at all to fill in the blanks with matching sockets. Harbor Freight, for example, has some Taiwan-made socket sets that are otherwise very nice but skip sizes you can't get. And there's probably someone with a pocket protector and squeaky-clean fingernails who just can't figure out why they aren't selling. .

Just got a set of thin wall impact from KT-Pro. VERY NICE set but omg... I use 16 and 18mm all the time and they are both skips in this set and I can't find them ONLINE to match. Granted I got the set for super cheap but still. Beautiful metal case... and they skipped something like 5 sizes.