Milwaukee 9.0 vs Dewalt Flexvolt
- Thread starter KnurledNut
- Start date
This is why I made the jump from dewalt to milwaukee. They use torque ratings on their drills only they can understand. And all the number/volt fudging marketing ploy really soured their reputation and continues to do so. I've spent 4 grand with milwaukee since the jump.
Keep playing with those fake numbers, Dewalt. You'll never get my business again.
Keep playing with those fake numbers, Dewalt. You'll never get my business again.
TomB19
Well-known member
The DeWalt marketing strategy will play well with those who don't understand power systems, which is the majority of people.
TomB19
Well-known member
I'm a Milwaukee guy and like them very much but, as best I can tell, DeWalt makes some really good stuff. If you let the cheesy marketing put you off, you will be missing out on some excellent tools.
Milwaukee does me just fine. Dewalt dropped the ball by not offering a 20v to 18v converter to their life long customers who spent 1000's on their 18v line up.
They "Just" started to offer it within the last few months. I know many people who made the jump to milwaukee because of this. Even their local rep here said it was a stupid move. 5 years later, And now they come out with it? Too little, too late.
Dewalt isn't the only option. I'll buy Bosch /hilti / other quality brands before dewalt gets my money.
Strouty
Well-known member
When milwaukee first released the V28 tools, I was knee deep in Dewalt. I am so glad that I switched to the V28, I really wish they would add more tools to that line up. The M18 is here for the long haul, I think that milwaukee learned a lesson or two when the people that had V18 tools got pissed during the M18 transition. Lucky for me the V28 to M28 transition was seamless and painless. Dewalt was super dumb to not offer either a buyback incentive or an adapter, but then again, they were also busy trying to sell all those 36 volt tools they made to compete with milwaukee.
OP
KnurledNut
Well-known member
I have to agree. Dewalt waited to long to offer the 18/20 adaptor.
They also shot themselves in the foot losing the A123 contract for the 18v lithium batteries. IMO, those were perhaps the best batteries they ever introduced.
They also shot themselves in the foot losing the A123 contract for the 18v lithium batteries. IMO, those were perhaps the best batteries they ever introduced.
I own the 36 volt set, the only downside to them is the car battery hanging off the back of the tool.
OP
KnurledNut
Well-known member
If they had released an 18v to 120v AC converter like they did for the 24v system, they would have sold a million of them.
Of course, there was probably more profit in batteries.
Of course, there was probably more profit in batteries.
beamrider
Well-known member
You mean they have to call it what it actually is? How refreshing....
Know Wosad
Banned
- Joined
- May 15, 2016
- Messages
- 811
Customers needed this back in 2012. Dewalt didn't realize just how many would jump ship instead of buying into the 20 volt tool system. They really shot themselves in both feet with this gamble.
Now customers are leary to buy into another system they might change on them again. They lost a lot of trust by what they did.
I'm just one guy, but they lost 4000+ bucks from me alone, and I'm small potatoes. I hope dewalt is reading this.
Dewalts 18 to 20 switch was a poorly handled. But they are doing it again because the 20v Max batteries will not work in Flex Volt tools. So if your a Dewalt guy you now need 2 different battery systems. Flex Volt batteries work in the Max stuff but Max does not work in Flex Volt tools or accessories, dont know if that includes Max batteries not charging in a Flex Volt charger.
Thankfully the M12/M18 lines dont seem to be in for any of those issues in the future, which is one of Milwaukees benefit claims.
Thankfully the M12/M18 lines dont seem to be in for any of those issues in the future, which is one of Milwaukees benefit claims.
kctyphoon
Banned
What's funny is I belive Milwaukee's SINGLE 18v 9.0 battery used in their sliding miter saw, still delivers more cuts then Dewalts 120v cordless using TWO battery packs.. If I remeber right, that's even using Dewalt's claimed cuts, which I'm sure requires a solar eclipse on leap day to achieve..
Their high torque impact was basically proven to be over rated by 100 ftlbs of torque.. Why they would exaggerate is beyond me. I have both of the brushless 7/16 hex drive high torque impact from the Dewalt and the Fuel line.. They are both solid performers but the Milwaukee just seems better made.
You can count me in with the former Dewalt customers that dropped the brand when their only option of swapping over to lithium batteries for the established 18v platform was almost as expensive as buying a brand new set of lithium tools from Milwaukee.. It will take them a decade at least to ever hope to get those customers back..
Their high torque impact was basically proven to be over rated by 100 ftlbs of torque.. Why they would exaggerate is beyond me. I have both of the brushless 7/16 hex drive high torque impact from the Dewalt and the Fuel line.. They are both solid performers but the Milwaukee just seems better made.
You can count me in with the former Dewalt customers that dropped the brand when their only option of swapping over to lithium batteries for the established 18v platform was almost as expensive as buying a brand new set of lithium tools from Milwaukee.. It will take them a decade at least to ever hope to get those customers back..
Last edited:
Obviously this forum is full of red fanboys. That's never been a secret. I think Milwaukee makes a fine cordless tool so I'm not judging you. Enjoy your tools.
But how are you gonna sit there and try to slam Dewalt for your perception of a marketing gimmick and ignore that Milwaukee is trying to pretend like this new battery is something more special than a big fat 9.0 ah battery. I don't see any engineering feat there either. Just a big *** battery.
Have any of you tried the new flex volt system? It doesn't sound like it. I haven't either but I'm not writing it off as a gimmick yet either. I understand the basic calculations you'll use to try and discredit the 60v concept but I'm willing to bet that Dewalt has some EE's that know a bit more than you. Maybe... Just maybe... They've been able to get more out of 60 (54) volts with their brushless technology.
But how are you gonna sit there and try to slam Dewalt for your perception of a marketing gimmick and ignore that Milwaukee is trying to pretend like this new battery is something more special than a big fat 9.0 ah battery. I don't see any engineering feat there either. Just a big *** battery.
Have any of you tried the new flex volt system? It doesn't sound like it. I haven't either but I'm not writing it off as a gimmick yet either. I understand the basic calculations you'll use to try and discredit the 60v concept but I'm willing to bet that Dewalt has some EE's that know a bit more than you. Maybe... Just maybe... They've been able to get more out of 60 (54) volts with their brushless technology.
beamrider
Well-known member
And scientists never say something is "impossible." They will, however, say that something is "highly improbable." Dewalt lost my vote a long time ago.
Ign
Well-known member
I've said it here so many times but the bolded comment comes up all the time. This never used to be true. 10 years ago it was Dewalt that had the upper hand (by a lot) and there were very few red fan boys on this forum and others. Every carpenter in the US seemingly owned and used DeWalt tools. Now the tables have turned and people complain about that. Maybe - just maybe - Milwaukee gained customers through expanding their product line(s) and making good tools.
As for the 60V "controversy", I don't have any personal experience with it so I don't know.
Point is, I won't reward them for their deceitfulness. They also have a charging station that needs 4 60v or 4 20v batteries to make 1 120v plug in you can power a skill saw with. Can you explain how that works? I don't understand how they do math
Last edited:
Ign
Well-known member
Oh and honestly I'm surprised Milwaukee took this so head-on with LordDiesel's link in post #1. Honestly I'm glad they did, but they've still got an uphill battle trying to get the general public to understand amp hours vs volts and the relationship.
People like bigger numbers and DeWalt has always played on this, which is why - as mentioned - they felt they had to do 36V to compete with V28. But V28 was revolutionary with li-ion and that's another thing the general public struggles to understand - - polysyllabic words about chemistry just aren't as **** as bigger numbers.
I'm off to haul *** in my 351M. It's a V8 so it must be good, right?
People like bigger numbers and DeWalt has always played on this, which is why - as mentioned - they felt they had to do 36V to compete with V28. But V28 was revolutionary with li-ion and that's another thing the general public struggles to understand - - polysyllabic words about chemistry just aren't as **** as bigger numbers.
I'm off to haul *** in my 351M. It's a V8 so it must be good, right?
beamrider
Well-known member
Lets be realistic. If someone came out with a cordless circular saw that sported a 120v battery, people would buy it. And of those people, there would be a portion that would have a reaction such as this:
"Gee, that huge battery doesn't last as long as I thought it would, but MAN this saw will cut thru anything! Sure makes my old cordless saw look like a POS!"
To the general public, a larger number is "better" in many cases, and that's what a marketing department counts on.
"Gee, that huge battery doesn't last as long as I thought it would, but MAN this saw will cut thru anything! Sure makes my old cordless saw look like a POS!"
To the general public, a larger number is "better" in many cases, and that's what a marketing department counts on.
JettaGetUpandGo
Well-known member
I sold off all of my Dewalt tools shortly after the "20v" tools were released. They were excellent tools at the time, but the batteries were on their last legs. I certainly wasn't going to pay the outrageous price for new batteries when the system seemed to be in its final days.
The M12/18 lines were pretty new, so I figured they would be around for a while. It was the right decision! Milwaukee will have hell to pay if they release a new battery at this point that isn't compatible with prior M12/18 tools.
BQuicksilver
Well-known member
- Joined
- Aug 25, 2006
- Messages
- 560
Exact same story. Had a ton of DeWalt XRP, felt deserted. I hope Milwaukee is smart enough to have a transition ready when new tech emerges.
cajunfirehawk
Well-known member
Did he really say "De-wilt"...and he says it several times too.... lol
Last edited:
ca90ss
Well-known member
How is DeWalt calling their batteries 60v any different from Milwaukee calling their M12 batteries 12v?
Because everyone calls it 12 volts. Bosch started it. I believe they're all 10.8 volt. It's even called 12 vote in the UK/Europe. I'm surprised dewalt didn't call theirs 15 volt.
ca90ss
Well-known member
The original Bosch tools said 10.8v, they changed to 12v max when everyone else called theirs 12v.
I see. I'm not a bosch guy. But it's a stupid game they play.
Call it what it is and be done with it.
ca90ss
Well-known member
Know Wosad
Banned
- Joined
- May 15, 2016
- Messages
- 811
Sure did.Mil-fuckmee too. Chris is smart enough to call them what they ALL are. ******* overpriced, over-rated junk directed towards people with more money than sense. I gotta go put my 20's on charge
.One charger. 5 batteries.3 am. Yup. Need to order another charger
OP
KnurledNut
Well-known member
If you throw a DMM on a battery, it'll read around 20v and 12v at rest.
Under load that drops to roughly 18 and 10.8.
Under load that drops to roughly 18 and 10.8.
outdoorspace
Banned
- Joined
- Jan 28, 2014
- Messages
- 356
This is why I keep to corded for DeWalt and just avoid the modern TTI **** with Milwaukee's name altogether.
Point is, I won't reward them for their deceitfulness. They also have a charging station that needs 4 60v or 4 20v batteries to make 1 120v plug in you can power a skill saw with. Can you explain how that works? I don't understand how they do math
It's called a power inverter. They're commonly available to deliver 120vac from 12vdc.
Not sure why 72 volts to 120 seems like such a stretch to you...
Did you think they were really just trying to add the battery voltages up?
If you really don't see how that simple electronic feat would work, I don't think your in a place to challenge Dewalt on the subject of power.
I understand how it works. It's pathetic how it will only work with 4 batteries on it. So yes, in this case, its all to do with voltage and adding up batteries.
You can support dewalt all you want. Enjoy the games.
truckdriver
Well-known member
Toolguyd reported that at the Dewalt demonstration that the Milwaukee Sawzall outperformed the 60Vmax Dewalt.