Robert Hall
Well-known member
Good catch. The cord is 6 guage.
How did you wire your 5 HP air compressor
- Thread starter Ross/Kzoo
- Start date
wyliesdiesels
Well-known member
Still not right as Norcal said above!
What would the correct way to replace the Cord with what ? Thanks
pattenp
Well-known member
Some flex conduit using stranded THHN wire.
LS6 Tommy
Well-known member
Compressor in shed with 10-3 on a 50 amp 220 single phase.
Cord is illegal regardless of wire gauge. You must hard wire stationary equipment.
Tommy
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Aceman
Well-known member
You're misinformed.
Cord is allowed to be used in the "prevention of the transmission of noise and vibration". Taken directly from 400.7(A) of the NEC.
Sized properly and with proper strain reliefs for support there is no issue.
sberry
Banned
I want to comment on this. I really doubt the guy holds a licence, most in maintenance do not andf a good share of them learned hand to mouth. They are notorious for this type of thing. They usually work with 3 ph and even higher voltages and a good share of them havnt spent a day in school over this. They simply size wire the way they see it at work. Grounding is another issue too. Often it isn't correct.I wanted to bump this back up to the top and just say......My electrician wired my compressor wrong!!!! It's wires with #12 wire, and I had no reason to really doubt him as he is certified and wires machinery up at work all of the time.
BUT.....after listening to the replies on here, I dug around in every place I could think of to find the book on my compressor. BTW.....Menards pamphlet holder in the lid of their toolboxes, can hide a manual.And sure enough it calls for No.10 wire. I sort of forgot about it until I was cleaning the garage the other day. So I will be swapping that wire out. And I want to thank everyone for pointing it out. Next time that I have something similar wired that I'm not familiar with, I'll ask here first before I get a local electricians idea on things
As I age a little I have way more respect for licensing. I often ask,,, was the guy holding paper? I am always suspect when they don't until its proven they know. I know lots of guys that do without paper but a lot work with it all the time and don't get it right, on occasion a guy that is papered doesn't but its less likely.
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sberry
Banned
This also shows the good of he internet, we have heard it here,,,, the advice to find a local guy and not believe guys on the net,,,,, way wrong on occasion. The collective knowledge is better, the **** gets washed out and it is often worked on till it becomes more clear and reduces the mis understanding and the half azzed code quotes.
Same with law type things,,, had a guy tell me something was the first thing on the form,,,, not only is it not the first its not even on it. Most people rely on hearsay for this and many havnt actually read it at all.
Same with law type things,,, had a guy tell me something was the first thing on the form,,,, not only is it not the first its not even on it. Most people rely on hearsay for this and many havnt actually read it at all.
LS6 Tommy
Well-known member
Thanks for pointing out my loss of memory. Normally that is accomplished with flex and THHN so it just "looks wrong". His install still violates code as there are no strain reliefs.
Tommy
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Aceman
Well-known member
Well, he is using metal Romex connectors for cord clamps rather than a proper cord grip too. Most folks just don't realize there are proper fittings for what they are trying to do, even if Home Depot doesn't stock them.
These work well, but are more expensive than flex, connectors, and THHN, especially when you have to buy two of them:
https://www.platt.com/platt-electri...-Weave/Leviton/L7504/product.aspx?zpid=387198
Attachments
sberry
Banned
They have them at box stores. There is everything a homebody needs at a box store. But I wouldn't loose sleep about a cable clamp hanging vert.
nadogail
Well-known member
My compressor has a label 5 Hp, 20 Gallon, came from the store with a cord and molded plug, and works just fine, plugged into a 15 amp receptacle fed with 12 gauge through a 20 amp breaker.
As long as it works, I have no intentions of fixing it
As long as it works, I have no intentions of fixing it
I'm not saying they don't exist but I really doubt your compressor is truly 5hp. If it's the 5 hp Craftsman or Campbell Hausfeld they are actually 1.5 and 2 hp, respectively. Both of which could be powered by a cord and plug.
Aceman
Well-known member
You've been on this forum long enough that you should know there is a difference between wiring for appliances and air compressors that come with a cord and molded plug and those that do not. Also, if you think the manufacturer is running a true 5HP motor through a 15 amp cord end, I think you're mistaken.
We are talking about wiring for a REAL 5HP compressor with no factory cord and molded plug. Not the economy grade **** compressors they sell to consumers with overstated HP claims.
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pattenp
Well-known member
Fixed it for ya.But well stated before my change.
Edit in itallic.
Was kind of hard to pick out your edit in italics in the quote that is in italics.
wyliesdiesels
Well-known member
Did u use NM-b(romex) or THWN?
Here is how I wired mine. Everything was piped in EMT conduit and this installation passed inspection last week. Hope this helps!
My 5HP Matco compressor with IR 2430 two stage pump.
Motor Tag: 5.0hp, 21.5amp, 230v
Subpanel
2 Pole 30A Breaker feeding compressor
Four (4) 10awg THHN stranded wires running from breaker to receptacle. Wiring includes two hots (red and black), one neutral (white), and one ground (green)
Receptical and plug for compressor: NEMA 14-30R&P 125v-250v
My 5HP Matco compressor with IR 2430 two stage pump.
Motor Tag: 5.0hp, 21.5amp, 230v
Subpanel
2 Pole 30A Breaker feeding compressor
Four (4) 10awg THHN stranded wires running from breaker to receptacle. Wiring includes two hots (red and black), one neutral (white), and one ground (green)
Receptical and plug for compressor: NEMA 14-30R&P 125v-250v
wyliesdiesels
Well-known member
Here is how I wired mine. Everything was piped in EMT conduit and this installation passed inspection last week. Hope this helps!
My 5HP Matco compressor with IR 2430 two stage pump.
Motor Tag: 5.0hp, 21.5amp, 230v
Subpanel
2 Pole 30A Breaker feeding compressor
Four (4) 10awg THHN stranded wires running from breaker to receptacle. Wiring includes two hots (red and black), one neutral (white), and one ground (green)
Receptical and plug for compressor: NEMA 14-30R&P 125v-250v
Well I bet that plug and outlet isnt rated for 5HP.
Shouldve been hardwired.
And thats the wrong plug for 240v equipment. A 14-30p and r is for 120v/240v equipment such as a dryer. Shouldve used a 6-30p and r IF its rated for 5HP.
Glad to see the inspector did his job!
Is that pressure switch rated for 5HP?
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Well I bet that plug and outlet isnt rated for 5HP.
Shouldve been hardwired.
And thats the wrong plug for 240v equipment. A 14-30p and r is for 120v/240v equipment such as a dryer. Shouldve used a 6-30p and r IF its rated for 5HP.
Glad to see the inspector did his job!
Is that pressure switch rated for 5HP?
Hardwiring the compressor is not going to happen. This is my garage, not a machine shop or other industrial/commercial setting. The cord allows me to be flexible.
Noted on the plug type. That said, I don't believe the receptacle / plug I used is a hazard to the equipment or dangerous in any way. Perhaps I'll change it later on down the road.
The pressure switch came with the compressor, I assume it's properly rated. It shuts the unit down at 175psi, and kicks it back on at 135psi as designed.
No comment on the inspector. His tag = "approved" setup.
lakeroadster
Well-known member
I get a kick out of folks saying "It Passed Inspection" like that means it was done correctly, according to the NEC.
Reading just a few of the horror stories here on the GJ you will quickly find that many inspectors simply either don't know the code, or interpret it incorrectly.
The experienced electrical guys here have nothing to gain, personally, by telling you something doesn't meet code... they're simply quoting chapter and verse from the NEC. They're trying to help.. and often getting beat up in the process.
Reading just a few of the horror stories here on the GJ you will quickly find that many inspectors simply either don't know the code, or interpret it incorrectly.
The experienced electrical guys here have nothing to gain, personally, by telling you something doesn't meet code... they're simply quoting chapter and verse from the NEC. They're trying to help.. and often getting beat up in the process.
pattenp
Well-known member
The panel and circuit to the outlet is all the inspector approved. The inspector has no control over what you plug into that circuit. So the circuit in itself is okay. The plug on the compressor is just not proper as a disconnecting device because it's under rated for the motor HP.
Where can I find plug/outlet ratings for motor HP?
Likely not, I assume. It certainly won't like having 20-something amps running through it. However, they get away without using a mag starter by using a motor with built-in overload protection.
That Matco, which also uses an IR motor, is a consumer level set-up. It should be a decent compressor. A mag starter would be a nice upgrade for it but it's likely left off to keep it the price at a certain point.
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pattenp
Well-known member
Pin and Sleeve plugs and outlets are higher HP rated but they are expensive. That's why hardwiring is suggested.
Here's why the HP rating matters.......
http://forums.mikeholt.com/showthread.php?t=164752
also see...
http://www.hubbell-wiring.com/press/pdfs/H5247.pdf
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Interesting reads, thank you!
So i am looking to buy a Quincy QT-5.
How should it be wired?
I have a 220 plug near the spot i was going to set the compressor that has a 60 amp breaker.
Is it not possible to use a plug given it the sized appropriately? If so, which one?
How should it be wired?
I have a 220 plug near the spot i was going to set the compressor that has a 60 amp breaker.
Is it not possible to use a plug given it the sized appropriately? If so, which one?
pattenp
Well-known member
There are pin and sleeve plugs rated for 5HP but they are not cheap. You need to use a proper HP rated plug or hardwire the compressor to be NEC compliant. I assume you read the posts previous to yours to ask this question.
I did read all the post.
Would be much simpler for me to just use the correct plug as to have an electrician hard wire it.
http://www.elecdirect.com/pin-sleeve-devices/60-amp-pin-and-sleeve-devices
Those things are pricey. Never seen one like that.
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bczygan
Well-known member
Just wanted yo take a moment to thank all you professional and knowledgeable guys.
Your persistence on this forum, where day after day, month after month and year after year, you give sage and useful advice, is amazing.
And it is deeply appreciated!
I have learned so much.
I won't mention how many things I have done wrong electrically, that you have helped me recognize. Now qill I mention how few mistakes I have not rectified.
My electrons don't seem to care what kind of cable or wire I use or how I support it or terminate it. But I do realize the error of my ways does contribute to a less safe installation.
The "It's worked good so far" mantra isn't a good gauge. Improper installations can always bite you in the future.
And I also realize that every part of the rules, were written in property damage, injuries and deaths.
So while I haven't followed them all to a T yet, I really appreciate all of you who cross the T's and dot the I's here on the forum.
Plus, it's just great fun to read threads like this one, where you all jump in and keep adding little tidbits to make installations right to the last detail. I makes me imagine how mine could eventually be. I know I'm not alone in thinking this way.
Bill
Your persistence on this forum, where day after day, month after month and year after year, you give sage and useful advice, is amazing.
And it is deeply appreciated!
I have learned so much.
I won't mention how many things I have done wrong electrically, that you have helped me recognize. Now qill I mention how few mistakes I have not rectified.
My electrons don't seem to care what kind of cable or wire I use or how I support it or terminate it. But I do realize the error of my ways does contribute to a less safe installation.
The "It's worked good so far" mantra isn't a good gauge. Improper installations can always bite you in the future.
And I also realize that every part of the rules, were written in property damage, injuries and deaths.
So while I haven't followed them all to a T yet, I really appreciate all of you who cross the T's and dot the I's here on the forum.
Plus, it's just great fun to read threads like this one, where you all jump in and keep adding little tidbits to make installations right to the last detail. I makes me imagine how mine could eventually be. I know I'm not alone in thinking this way.
Bill
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It's not hard, at all, to hard wire it, especially if the outlet is already nearby. It may even cost less in parts and electrician's labor.
wyliesdiesels
Well-known member
The code compliant method is to hardwire the compressor unless u use expensive pin and sleeve plugs.
Need #10 THHN or #8/2 NM-b. A disconnect is required if farther than 50' and not within sight of thr panel.
wyliesdiesels
Well-known member
unless u have deep pockets, there isnt an affordable way to use a plug and receptacle....
I am going to hard wire this into the main breaker box.
Question is, when you wire it "direct", do you go directly from the main breaker to the unit? Requiring to drill a hole through the wall and just have wire running out to the unit?
Or do you mount an additional disconnect to the wall. But to me this disconnect would not be a direct connection as it is another junction point?
I am just wanting to make sure this gets done correctly.
Question is, when you wire it "direct", do you go directly from the main breaker to the unit? Requiring to drill a hole through the wall and just have wire running out to the unit?
Or do you mount an additional disconnect to the wall. But to me this disconnect would not be a direct connection as it is another junction point?
I am just wanting to make sure this gets done correctly.
PhantomEB
Well-known member
Mines hardware to an outlet on its own 220 breaker then compressor has the same plug as my welder. Also another dedicated outlet similar setup on the other wall so I can use my welder on either side of the garage.
wyliesdiesels
Well-known member
It seems that u and Norcal are in disagreement regarding the usage of cordage for equipment wiring.
Aceman
Well-known member
I cited the code article that allows it, Norcal is more than welcome to try and prove me wrong.
What is your take on it?
Adamoutlaw14
New member
Look im so confused reading all the dang arguing on whats right and whats wrong on here on how to wire up my 5hp Saylor Beall im ready to hardwire to the light pole in front of my house. Im new here only came to get help on wiring my equipment up but the back and forth mental bullcrap on here makes the subject get way off topic and makes you read for two hours im over it. Just you know in 4 pages of reading it still does not really say whats right and whats wrong. A veteran says wire it this way another guy says i did it the way i wanted the heck with it then another guy shows it being done while another guy says its whatever.
Ohh well we will truly never know how to do something thats probably so damn simple but we will never know so hell with it I will wire it to plug it in my neighbors usb outlet screw it
Ohh well we will truly never know how to do something thats probably so damn simple but we will never know so hell with it I will wire it to plug it in my neighbors usb outlet screw it