So are PB Swiss hex keys that good?

[Aqua-Andy]

I'm about to pull the trigger on a set of PB Swiss wrenches. https://www.amazon.com/dp/B00RFDPXES/?tag=atomicindus08-20

Are they really that good. I'm using Bondhus now but am looking for something better. I work on manufacturing equipment that uses a lot of socket head fasteners and I'm finding the Bondhus just are not cutting it unless the fastener is in pristine condition. I just can't wrap my head around almost $50 for a set of allen wrenches. I also saw these that look interesting. https://www.amazon.com/dp/B009ODV0OE/?tag=atomicindus08-20

I started looking and these are the ones I'm using now. https://www.amazon.com/dp/B007WPD3S2/?tag=atomicindus08-20. I'm not sure what is so great about them to justify the price but they say Bondhus on them and they are anodized blue.

 

[Farmall 1066]

Been wondering myself!

 

[Infinia]

I would look into what fasteners you use most and buy the individual sizes. I believe the higher end bits are rated for more "uses" per bit, whether it makes sense going PB Swiss or replacing mid range bits more often is up to you and your tax accountant. ( please 1st find out what the cause not 'pristine' cap screws) IMO the most sense would be replacing the cheap fasteners as you come across them & send the customer the bill.

 

[1cargarage]

Took a minute, but I found it. Here is an article I found ~6 months ago that compares some of the more common hex key manufacturers' tools.

http://www.bikeradar.com/us/mtb/gear/article/dont-buy-the-cheapest-tools-44468/

It's written by and targeted toward the bicycle mechanic (am/pro), who make their "living" with their 4, 5, and 6 mm hex keys. Bike mechanics literally use them all day long often on aluminum, titanium, steel, and nylon fasteners. Bikes that pass through a shop are often ancient and have been molested by untrained hacks using cheap mis sized tools. Bike mechanics have a lot to say about hex keys. In my experience, ~90% of them prefer the Bondhus.

That isn't to say that your (OP) experience with them isn't valid. God knows I have come unglued when a "superior" brand tool has disappointed me.

I was in a similar situation (wondering about the PB Swiss hex keys) as OP, and in the end I have been very happy with my extra long chrome keys:

They are the best that I have used. Full disclosure: I have not used PB Swiss hex keys, but I have a set of their torx keys, which are head and shoulders above anything I have used. Nothing comes close to the PB Swiss torx keys IMHO.

Sorry I don't have personal experience to lend in the way of Bondhus vs PB Swiss in an apples to apples kind of way, but hopefully that article is helpful.

Happy hunting

 

[FMC1959]

I have a couple of Bondhaus sets for about 30 years, moderate use and have never let me down.

I have some PB stuff but not the hex keys. What I have has been top notch, no complaints.

There have been a couple of threads that have talked about the PB hex sets and overall very favorable. I remember in particular some European mechanics swearing by them and having owned them for very long time. Do some searches for hex keys in general, you should find some PB comments

 

[Aqua-Andy]

I would look into what fasteners you use most and buy the individual sizes. I believe the higher end bits are rated for more "uses" per bit, whether it makes sense going PB Swiss or replacing mid range bits more often is up to you and your tax accountant. ( please 1st find out what the cause not 'pristine' cap screws) IMO the most sense would be replacing the cheap fasteners as you come across them & send the customer the bill.

The PB Swiss set I linked to are the sizes I use all the time. The cause of the less than pristine screws I would guess would be all the other people that are using cheap hex drivers. Replacing the screws is not a problem, it's just getting them out that's the problem, and then the trip to the stockroom. I misplaced my good 4mm bit socket, so while I was at HomeDepot and picked up one of their husky branded sockets, what a piece of ****. Almost every screw I try to remove with the Husky socket wants to round off. I have measured the end of the hex on the Husky and a German made T handle wrench and the hex measures the same size right down to the .0001", I don't know what the differences are but however minute make a huge difference.

 

[T45]

Sorry I don't have personal experience to lend in the way of Bondhus vs PB Swiss in an apples to apples kind of way, but hopefully that article is helpful.

The euros (PB and also Beta) are in a league above bondhus.

(I have used all of them).

Just get the PB swiss and forget it.

The best usa hex tools are Apex/Zephyr, or Snap On.

 

[dutchgray]

In short, yes, are PB worth the money, that depends, other options are also good and cheaper. I have never used a Bondhus hex key, they are not so cheap when they get to the UK (but still cheaper than PB), i do have one T handle in an inch size I needed and that has been fine. Also have hex key sets from Facom, Stahlwille, Wiha and Eight and some others as singles.

 

[Infinia]

I notice you like the ball ended tools IMO That end tends to wreck stuff if not careful.
I reckon the harder the tool bit is can lead to further destroying a bad fit, so not sure what to say, perhaps a using the straight side or even custom fit ala star torx bit depending on how bad is bad. Ive used lots of Xcelite ball hex drivers (pre APEX) in a production/ repair environment and had zero issues on micro sized bunged-up set screws. so go ahead try Euro but I wouldnt expect "leagues better" or miracles. YMMV

 

[jrockford]

I am failing to see what the PB Swiss keys will do that the Bondhus keys won't do if you're running into fasteners that are junk. Whoever touched them before you must have cut corners and used something that was close, but not exact. (Metric on English or vice versa.)

 

[Infinia]

. Whoever touched them before you must have cut corners and used something that close, but not exact. (Metric on English or vice versa.)

yup find & fix the problem 1st! fancy tools aren't miracle solvers. Bring up the problem to management you cant solve everything on your own dime.

 

[Dingleburry]

I have the long non ball, without the colored handles. Love them. Only other ones ive really used are the wiha from germany. Had a really tough fastener was using the wiha on, hex key was flexing ALOT, thought it would of had some plastic deformation, was supprised to see it was only elastic deformation, cause i bent it so much. Anyways took the part back to the shop to try my pb swiss, it bent only about half as much and that all too satisifying CRACK. Both sets are very good and still look brand new to this day. The pb is about 3 years old, wiha about a year. But id say the pb swiss is much better.

 

[PureLeaf]

I have Stahlwille, Gedore, and Bondhus. They look different, but they all do the same job. Do any feel better than another? Hard to say... they all work.

For 50 bucks, I'd give it a shot, and at worst, you can call it a learning experience and never buy PB swiss hex keys again. At best, you find a great new tool and can be happy you bought it!

 

[bixxjs]

I regularly use a set of Allen USA made hex keys both metric and SAE and can highly recommend them.I also work in engineering where I use hex keys all the way upto 22mm.

 

[T45]

This set up to 8mm is only 40 euro ($33ish ex vat), will be about $41 shipped to USA. Might be worth a look :

https://www.werk10.com/Hex-Keys-//PB-212-LH-5-8-10::147.html

 

[cja245]

I highly recommend trying the Wiha chrome hex wrenches (without magic ring). I use them professionally in an industrial setting. I'm amazed at how strong they are. A couple years now used multiple times daily and they are in perfect shape. Also the geared case they come in is awesome.

 

[ncfh]

I haven't been particularly impressed with PB Swiss, at all really.

Yeah sure, the Swiss grip handles are nice. But so are a lot of other brand's handles.

We've trialed them in production, and found them not to stand out in any particular way. Except in price.

Wiha hard chrome hex tools on the other hand, are stand outs.

We found that the tool faces stayed dimensionally accurate and crisp for considerably longer than other brands, including PB Swiss.

If you are doing anything repetitive, ditch the keys and get a set of hex drivers or T-handles.

And unless you absolutely need it, ball end hex drivers ****.

We have found that, in unconfined tasks, a really long T-handle is exceeding fast.

Initially the operator can use the shaft like a spinner, and then the T-handle allows for more torque than a screwdriver handle.

The smaller section, long shafts will twist up when a lot of torque is applied, but in the case of the Wihas, they always spring back unscathed.

Conveniently, the torque applied with a T-handle is just below where many common hand assembly fasteners are typically torqued anyway. Then it's one quick pop with a torque limiting tool, and on to the next.

Can you tell I love T-handles?

 

[Stuey]

I've been having problems with new Bondhus hex wrenches - first with a set of stubby ball hex stubbies, and then with a set of the GoldGuard that I bought.

Only on some fasteners.

My PB Swiss have never let me down. It took me a while to order my first set, but I ordered another during the Black Friday/Cyber Monday sale.

 

[Aqua-Andy]

I like t handles also but use these https://www.mcmaster.com/#t-handle-allen-wrenches/=1687eyn. The shaft has no flex so when the fastener does release you don't get the shock like from the thin shaft wrenches. There are times when you just can't fit a t handle so that's why I'm searching for the hex keys. Maybe I'll just stick with the bondhus and purchase a new set. The link does not go to the correct ones but they are the "deep reach with replaceable tips".

 

[ttpete]

I regularly use a set of Allen USA made hex keys both metric and SAE and can highly recommend them.I also work in engineering where I use hex keys all the way upto 22mm.

Unbrako marked keys are also among the very best. Unbrako also makes super quality Allen cap screws.

 

[ncfh]

Unbrako marked keys are also among the very best. Unbrako also makes super quality Allen cap screws.

Now that you remind me, I'm noticing a distinct drop in the quality of fasteners lately.

Noticed it about two years ago, but it's picked up last quarter, massive amount of stainless metric fastener rejections.

Nuts that won't thread/one direction, cap heads broached wrong/not at all most commonly.

We've been calling it "the Fastenal effect."

 

[ttpete]

Unbrako? Made in INDIA? hahahahahah You must be delusional.

Give me Holo-Krome fasteners and german or japanese hex stuff

Wasn't aware of that, been retired since 2001. Things change.

 

[1cargarage]

The euros (PB and also Beta) are in a league above bondhus... The best usa hex tools are Apex/Zephyr, or Snap On.

Snap On? A couple years ago I would have agreed with you. As I have acquired more and more hex keys (L-style, Ball-end, T-handle, T-handle ball-end, etc), I have found my Snap On stuff to be average. No better, no worse. The newest Snap On hex keys and (bit socket) bits are rebranded Bondhus. I don't know what my older stuff is. The biggest complaint I have with the older SO stuff I have is that the ends are sheared, not machined flat then chamfered like the Bondhus keys, which makes for less than full purchase/engagement on some fasteners. If you deal with any non steel fasteners, this generally leads to a headache. Their Torx keys are especially ordinary (ie not outstanding).

In terms of the Beta T-handles, I know they're very popular and users that I have met LOVE them for their fit/finish, ergonomics, and the speed at which they work. I have been wanting to get my hands on some, but haven't been able to justify the $ with over 10 sets of various brands' hex keys on hand.

 

[1cargarage]

I work on manufacturing equipment that uses a lot of socket head fasteners and I'm finding the Bondhus just are not cutting it unless the fastener is in pristine condition.

Have you considered switching over to T-handles and/or bit sockets + speeders/ratchets? I don't know if you work in a shop or are constantly moving from site to site, thus packing and unpacking your tools constantly.

Are the fasteners you work on generally easy to access or typically difficult to reach? This would govern whether or not to consider standard style or ball end.

Either way, you know basically what you're after. In terms of the $50 cost, I wouldn't sweat that, especially if you make your living working with them all day long. $50 ought to be an easy decision.

 

[KnurledNut]

1cargarage,
Snap-on hex keys are actually Eklind, not Bondhus.
Also, their HD torx bit sockets have a reputation of being VERY high quality.

 

[jrockford]

Wasn't aware of that, been retired since 2001. Things change.

They most certainly do.

All of my Unbrako stuff is US made.

 

[MushCreek]

I have a set of Wera that are called 'hex plus', if I recall. They are slightly hollow instead of true flats on the hex. I use them all day, everyday, usually with a pipe on them for leverage, and they still look like new.

 

[dutchgray]

They most certainly do.

All of my Unbrako stuff is US made.

All of mine is British, another good brand ruined.

 

[T45]

Unbrako was acquired by the Deepak Fasteners Group in 2008 and has since grown multi-fold with new warehouse facilities in Birmigham (UK), Los Angeles (USA) and Brisbane (Australia). Further a $100 million has been made in the new state-of-the-art manufacturing plant in Bhopal. www.deepakfasteners.com

Interesting.

 

[kythri]

1cargarage,
Snap-on hex keys are actually Eklind, not Bondhus.
Also, their HD torx bit sockets have a reputation of being VERY high quality.

Actually, it appears to be a mix. Some are Bondhus, some are Eklind.

 

[KnurledNut]

Let me atone. I was wrong.

 

[derosa]

I love my bondhus T handles, got into them when I made my living fixing bicycles. I actually hurt my wrist a couple times where the tool would wind up before the fastener would finally let go with a cracking noise, had 2 Allens that stayed twisted before that which turned me off. Did learn to go with an L wrench when the bolt was too tight but I've also permanently twisted Allen brand L wrenches. Nothing like trying to remove aluminum fastners from Ti bikes when the last person forgot copper anti-seize. Biggest issue was always a mild steel bolt rusting into steel or aluminum frames or 30+ year old stem bolts that didn't want to move. Bondus almost never let me down unless the bolt was just too far gone to get a grip, even then it seemed to give the best odds.

 

[Grant Gunderson]

I love my PB hex set, they really are very very good. I also have a set of the wera stainless hex keys and for working on stainless and ti fasteners they are exceptionally good in fact as good as the PB Swiss set.

The PB Swiss hex sockets are in a league of there own. No other hex or tore socket set comes close.

 

[manwithtools]

I love my bondhus T handles, got into them when I made my living fixing bicycles. I actually hurt my wrist a couple times where the tool would wind up before the fastener would finally let go with a cracking noise, had 2 Allens that stayed twisted before that which turned me off. Did learn to go with an L wrench when the bolt was too tight but I've also permanently twisted Allen brand L wrenches. Nothing like trying to remove aluminum fastners from Ti bikes when the last person forgot copper anti-seize. Biggest issue was always a mild steel bolt rusting into steel or aluminum frames or 30+ year old stem bolts that didn't want to move. Bondus almost never let me down unless the bolt was just too far gone to get a grip, even then it seemed to give the best odds.

Bondhus used to make a nice product, seeing some recent threads on GJ relating to their current quality, I would not put them at the top of my list.

 

[cashishift]

i wish wera made SAE kits like their metric

 

[kythri]

i wish wera made SAE kits like their metric

They do!

It's a different holder than the metric set, but:

https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B01H88FP24/?tag=atomicindus08-20

 

[cashishift]

They do!

It's a different holder than the metric set, but:

https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B01H88FP24/?tag=atomicindus08-20

I want the same holder

 

[Superbec]

I bet the PBswiss are amazing just like all their tools but those WERA L keys are exceptional, I got almost 2 years of use and they are like new .

I can get them for 24$ , I wouldn't pay 2x for the PBsw. they can't possibly be 2x better

 

[kythri]

I want the same holder

Unless you can convince Wera to send you a spare, you're likely SOL.

 

[jhnlngn]

PB Swiss is 20% off at Count on Tools right now.