HELP Clothes Washer Install

[scarney1988]

OK, so wife wants to move washer and dryer to 2nd floor. No big deal. There is an adjacent bathroom with access to hot/cold supply and the drain stack. Also an exterior wall for venting of the dryer.

My question: Can I use a TAP saddle to make my connection for the drain? For reference the drain stack is vertical.

I am not opposed to plumbing in a PVC TEE but it would be nice to avoid some of the work haha.

Wondering if some experienced plumbers could offer some advice. I can supply some pictures if that'll help.

Thanks in advance.
Sean

 

[RVDan]

Nobody can stop you.

 

[forAK]

If it's good enough to get buried in the ground, then there shouldn't be a problem in a wall. Fernco's are used all the time in walls and in ground joints.

 

[mires]

Don't use that thing. No self respecting plumber would use one so you shouldn't either. It honestly wouldn't even make the job much easier. There is probably play in the stack above where you're going to cut the tee in. Just solvent weld in a PVC tee and if there isn't enough play, you can use a Fernco coupling on the vent side. Not trying to be a **** but water causes a lot of damage. Especially when it's buried in a wall and you don't know it's happening until it gets really ugly.

 

[cvairwerks]

Putting in a pan or a floor drain for when the washer overflows or leaks?

 

[MFolks]

Replace the original rubber hoses, with SS reinforced type,as when the ones that came with the washer can burst,doing massive water damage.

 

[Mark118]

You can tap in essentially the same way as the rubber saddle by using a PVC fitting cut to the same configuration. Prepare both surfaces (I always sand instead of relying on primer), then graft on the trimmed fitting over the matching opening with PVC cement. If you have the space to work in you're really not saving any work, though, compared to just putting in a proper fitting per Mires' post.

 

[Mark118]

Or you can buy the fitting already fabricated; probably more expensive.

 

[Milton Shaw]

That may be the vent for the entire house not the drain stack. You need to be sure you are not blocking the vent with water or your entire house full of sinks, tubs and toilets will gurgle each time the washer drains.

 

[theoldwizard1]

Putting in a pan or a floor drain for when the washer overflows or leaks?

Anyone who does NOT do that for a second floor laundry is a fool !

 

[LS6 Tommy]

Putting in a pan or a floor drain for when the washer overflows or leaks?

Anyone who does NOT do that for a second floor laundry is a fool !

Not to mention that it's frequently local code when the installation is above a finished space...

Tommy

 

[Sawdustmaker]

Putting in a pan or a floor drain for when the washer overflows or leaks?

Good Idea, but do over do it!! My neighbor has a second floor laundry room. Has a floor pan with a 2 inch drain. When the place was still under construction I told him to go with a 3" or 4" drain (over kill??...not). He told me that his contractor told him that 2" was code and was good enough.....NOT!! You guessed it, a water line broke when they were gone for 4 days, floor pan and 2" drain could not handle the flow, down stairs master bedroom gets flooded as well as their office. Mucho $$$ to fix and home owners ins premium went up.
So go with the bigger drain. Code is minimum.

 

[CTyankee]

Good Idea, but do over do it!! My neighbor has a second floor laundry room. Has a floor pan with a 2 inch drain. When the place was still under construction I told him to go with a 3" or 4" drain (over kill??...not). He told me that his contractor told him that 2" was code and was good enough.....NOT!! You guessed it, a water line broke when they were gone for 4 days, floor pan and 2" drain could not handle the flow, down stairs master bedroom gets flooded as well as their office. Mucho $$$ to fix and home owners ins premium went up.
So go with the bigger drain. Code is minimum.

While I agree with installing a pan, expecting them to be a fail safe measure for any length of time isn't a good idea. Water lines to a washer should be closed after the days usage. Even if leaving the house for the afternoon..never mind 4 days.

 

[rburke65]

Ok....a pole....how many shut off all water to washer after every use?......that's what I thought....

 

[rlitman]

OK, so wife wants to move washer and dryer to 2nd floor. No big deal. There is an adjacent bathroom with access to hot/cold supply and the drain stack. Also an exterior wall for venting of the dryer.

My question: Can I use a TAP saddle to make my connection for the drain? For reference the drain stack is vertical.

I am not opposed to plumbing in a PVC TEE but it would be nice to avoid some of the work haha.

Wondering if some experienced plumbers could offer some advice. I can supply some pictures if that'll help.

Thanks in advance.
Sean

Look at how that tap saddle you linked works. It is not meant for vertical installation.

One thing to be careful of, is that this sort of connection can lead to clogs where hair catches on sharp edges.

If you have a PVC stack, the suggestions above might work. If you have cast iron, I suggest you consult a plumber.

 

[drmarkr]

While I agree with installing a pan, expecting them to be a fail safe measure for any length of time isn't a good idea. Water lines to a washer should be closed after the days usage. Even if leaving the house for the afternoon..never mind 4 days.

Of course...and the dishwasher. And the icemaker. And all of the sink feeds. Oh, and dont forget the toilets. Lol...

 

[Todd.Brock]

We just leave all of our valves closed unless you need to flush. But be sure to turn it off when you are done...

 

[James-W]

While I agree with installing a pan, expecting them to be a fail safe measure for any length of time isn't a good idea. Water lines to a washer should be closed after the days usage. Even if leaving the house for the afternoon..never mind 4 days.

Why would you turn off water valves after each use? If you do turn them on and off all the time, there is a good chance they will start leaking prematurely.

 

[CTyankee]

Of course...and the dishwasher. And the icemaker. And all of the sink feeds. Oh, and dont forget the toilets. Lol...

I guess if all your appliances and fixtures are plumbed with soft walled lines...then yeah....you should turn them off. Thankfully mine aren't.

Why would you turn off water valves after each use? If you do turn them on and off all the time, there is a good chance they will start leaking prematurely.

I didn't say turn them off after each use. I said turn them off after the days usage. So do you leave your outside spigot open with the hose connected all the time so it doesn't fail prematurely? That's what values are designed to do..be opened and closed.

FWIW, most values I've seen fail have more to with non-use than over use.

 

[scarney1988]

A couple things.

I have already ordered a stainless drain pan from Killarney Metals. This will be under the washer and have its own drain line.

Also, The home was constructed in 1904. Supply pipes are copper. Most drain pipe is CI. Some drain pipe is PVC. THE DRAIN PIPE IN QUESTION IS CAST IRON.

I am comfortable supporting the pipe, cutting the CI with a cutoff wheel, and integrating an elbow. Not the end of the world.

The 2nd and 3rd floor bathrooms are plumbed and drained individually. Worst case would result in shutting the 2nd floor bathroom down to get converted to PVC drain stack is something crazy happens. I would still be have a full bath on 3rd floor to use.

Honestly, there is enough space in the wall pocket that I could probably just plumb in a separate PVC pipe that would discharge in the basement sink like it does now. Prolly not to code though hahaha

 

[rlitman]

I don't know of any issues draining a washing machine into a slop sink. By all means, do that. Instead of PVC, you can use continuous polyethylene (the black stuff used for underground sprinklers). It's flexible, and is less likely to clog, since it will have no joints and can be clamped right to your machine's drain hose.

You'll want some sort of a lint trap where the hose enters the slop sink.

 

[tjpavlov]

I guess if all your appliances and fixtures are plumbed with soft walled lines...then yeah....you should turn them off. Thankfully mine aren't.



I didn't say turn them off after each use. I said turn them off after the days usage. So do you leave your outside spigot open with the hose connected all the time so it doesn't fail prematurely? That's what values are designed to do..be opened and closed.

FWIW, most values I've seen fail have more to with non-use than over use.

But a "time out" valve. It's a mechanical timer that will shut off the water after 90 minutes. Works great.

 

[scarney1988]

I don't know of any issues draining a washing machine into a slop sink. By all means, do that. Instead of PVC, you can use continuous polyethylene (the black stuff used for underground sprinklers). It's flexible, and is less likely to clog, since it will have no joints and can be clamped right to your machine's drain hose.

You'll want some sort of a lint trap where the hose enters the slop sink.

Hmm. That is good to know. A little flexibility would help the install if its possible too.

Have an access to panel to my plumbing on the second floor so I gotta vacuum out all the dust and then explore the option of running a pipe down to the basement to terminate in the sink. The more I think about this the more I like it. Really will just come down to space in the wall cavity that carries the mechanicals to the 2nd floor bathroom.

EDIT: And not to contribute to the high jacking of my own thread but I typically leave the valves on at all times (unless leaving for vacation). However I have never had 2nd floor laundry so this may change.

EDIT: Largest poly pipe at local big box store I can find is 1 1/4" which is reduced the 2" recesses wall box kit that I purchased. Will have to investigate further after assessing the feasibility of this option.

 

[Iron-Iceberg]

Just a heads up but the new dryers spin about 10,000 rpm LOL if they are out of level or loaded wrong they will shake your house down and on the second floor it will be really bad.
Just my .02

 

[CTyankee]

EDIT: And not to contribute to the high jacking of my own thread but I typically leave the valves on at all times (unless leaving for vacation). However I have never had 2nd floor laundry so this may change.

Apologies...I'm usually one that gets pissed when threads get thrown off the tracks. :tard:

At least Rlitmans here to keep things on the rails and offer some good advice. I'll keep out my mouth shut from now on. Good luck, I'll be interested in seeing what you end up doing.

 

[Milton Shaw]

Anyway you drain it, make sure the drain line comes up to the top of the washer and has an air break in it to keep the washer from draining all the time.There is no valve on any washer drain I have seen. They will siphon out if the drain does not have an air vent/break in it and continually drain if hose does not loop to the top of the washer. Had one customer years ago that ran his well dry every time he ran his washer. .

 

[scarney1988]

Anyway you drain it, make sure the drain line comes up to the top of the washer and has an air break in it to keep the washer from draining all the time.There is no valve on any washer drain I have seen. They will siphon out if the drain does not have an air vent/break in it and continually drain if hose does not loop to the top of the washer. Had one customer years ago that ran his well dry every time he ran his washer. .

Will do. I have an outlet box purchased and ready for install. It will be installed above the height of the washer (though I originally only thought this was necessary for access to water valves easily haha).

 

[scarney1988]

Apologies...I'm usually one that gets pissed when threads get thrown off the tracks. :tard:

At least Rlitmans here to keep things on the rails and offer some good advice. I'll keep out my mouth shut from now on. Good luck, I'll be interested in seeing what you end up doing.

No biggy. I happen to agree that valves should be closed while the appliance is not in use in ideal scenarios. I do admit that life happens and I may not be perfect with it, but I am going to try to habitually keep them closed.

At the moment the washer is in my unfinished basement - next to the sump pump .

 

[rlitman]

Just a heads up but the new dryers spin about 10,000 rpm LOL if they are out of level or loaded wrong they will shake your house down and on the second floor it will be really bad.
Just my .02

Its the washer spin cycle in front loaders. They're not doing 10k RPM, but many break 1000 RPM, and yes, they can shake quite a bit.

My parents have a Whirlpool Duet set on the second floor. You can certainly feel when it is spinning. One thing I did there, and with my front loaders, is to put a squeeze piece of foam between the washer and the dryer. It lets you place them close together without the vibrations from the washer causing it to bang into the dryer.