The VISES of Garage Journal

[vintage nut]

I never liked the gray... This looks much better


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[OCD]

You don't need a metal bench...

You just need a couple of more layers of 3/4" ply/mdf/???...

And...

Grade 8 bolts 1 1/2" longer...

(By the way, your 5" Machinist vise, isn't --- a Machinists vise, it is a Combination Vise, hence the pipe jaws...See the photo of a 500 Machinist Vise vs 1755 Tradesman vise --- Huge difference!!!)

Yup, 2 layers of 3/4" plywood, glued and screwed together... It has worked great, but the end are warping up...

Sorry about the loose terminology on the vise, it is a pipe/bench combo...

 

[G-ManBart]

Great comparison

The article and pics were really great!! Thank you for putting that together!!

Thanks guys!

 

[Pucman1]

That is the style base I need for the 450 I am working on!

JP

I picked up this Wilton 645 Utility vise with 5" wide jaw for $14 yesterday. I was surprised to see the swivel base uses the single 360 degree circular design, apparently this base would go right on a 400, 450, 500 or C1.

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[Sdflcorran]

Here's a lol for you,

Grade 8 bolts in wood, guess it's time for a new steel bench!!

Question - are grade 8 bolts necessary to mount a vise for casual use? I can get my hands on any number of 18-8 stainless bolts for free. I figure I can use fender washers to disperse the load.

 

[Pucman1]

So looks like the base I need is the 101084 but I see others similar but not sure if this will cross over and a different base will work??


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[vintage nut]

Question - are grade 8 bolts necessary to mount a vise for casual use? I can get my hands on any number of 18-8 stainless bolts for free. I figure I can use fender washers to disperse the load.

I have a couple of my vises mounted to wooden benches with hardware store lag bolts.
You'd be hard pressed to break the bolts off before doing damage to the vise in some way.


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[Sdflcorran]

I have a couple of my vises mounted to wooden benches with hardware store lag bolts.
You'd be hard pressed to break the bolts off before doing damage to the vise in some way.

That was my thought too. While 18-8 is only equivalent to Grade 2 steel strength-wise, I figure the wooden workbench would start to break prior to any bolts failing.

Guess this way I'll have two fail safes.

 

[drivesitfar]

SD: you should be ok with those stainless bolts and as you say if they fail you probably saved the vise from breaking off a mounting ear or worse.

ALL: i needed to do some Organizing and moved a few of my vises. a few of these are KEEPERS and most will find homes on GJ member's benches in the near future.

here's some close ups of the Wilton 450 with a Jan. 1977 date stamp and i bet it wasn't on a bench long before i found it with 40 other vises inside a client's barn.

hope you are all having a great weekend.

 

[Carla]

Question - are grade 8 bolts necessary to mount a vise for casual use? I can get my hands on any number of 18-8 stainless bolts for free. I figure I can use fender washers to disperse the load.

'Back in the day' (going, that is, by what one finds, all these years later) it was customary to mount vises to wooden bench tops with 'common', i. e., not grade-marked, bolts, often the old-style square head bolts, or 'carriage bolts', with square nuts.

Even with the far lesser strength of 'common' bolts, as compared to even the 'grade 2' of today, it would not be possible for even the strongest and meanest of men to tear a vise loose from a bench.

So-----grade 8 is 'gross over-kill' for this job, and any stainless bolts will be well more than amply strong.....and they could be polished out, a bit, if you'd like.....'just for pretty', as some of the old-timers would say.... : )

cheers

Carla

 

[wjamyers]

Is this worth the $32 asking price (and an hour round-trip)?. That's assuming everything works right. I'm tempted to go grab it. I'm a shade tree wannabe with a one car garage and 2x4 work bench that I built. I've done exhausts and brakes and axle seals and various silly little jobs, I need to calibrate my torque wrench and want a vice to do it with.

https://washingtondc.craigslist.org/nva/tls/6099507510.html

 

[Provincial]

wjameyers, those Columbians are workhorses for a home shop. They are not built for hammering on or using as a press. Don't use a cheater on the handles. They will last a lifetime if not abused.

For about the price of a cheap China vise, you get a decent American vise.

 

[Mr_P]

Hey Drives, show us more pics of that Fulton Iron Works. And the one to the left front of it with the through bench mount.

 

[KMScott]

ALL: i needed to do some Organizing and moved a few of my vises. a few of these are KEEPERS and most will find homes on GJ member's benches in the near future.

here's some close ups of the Wilton 450 with a Jan. 1977 date stamp and i bet it wasn't on a bench long before i found it with 40 other vises inside a client's barn.

hope you are all having a great weekend.

Drives did you get these vises at one time? You just show a Wilton but there is much more to share in the back of your vehicle. It is none of our business what you purchased these vises for but I bet it was not cheap.

As for bolting vises down to a steel bench, I would have a machinist flatten the bases on a mill, you can get away with it on a soft wood top but risk breaking a tab off on a steel bench. Maybe nesting a vise in epoxy or something like that. All my restored vises get the bases machined flat. The Holland base was out .035, not terrible but the Parker was out more then .09 on one of the tabs and that is risky. Yes they have made it but why risk it.

 

[Outlawmws]

WJ that is a good "mechanic's vise" and a good workhorse within its limits as Prov mentioned.

Price IMO is at its upper range, but that is really dependent on the local vise supply, and how quickly/badly you need a vise. Certainly a better value than an Asian import.

 

[drivesitfar]

WJ: i've seen more than a few of those little vises on very handy guys and gals workbenches. it's a solid vise, but if you can afford $100-150 cause it will be your main vise i'd keep my eyes open for a 4-5 inch Rock Island, Reed, Athol or Starrett, or several of the other great old vises. i'm not sure if any members live close to you so you could avoid shipping, but if you were close to me i'd probably have something for you cause i'm trying to slim my collection down a bit. hope that helps you.

i just took a quick look at vises (vices) in your area and i'd probably buy this one today and i don't NEED a vise, but it's a great price for a 4.5 inch REED. sure it doesn't have a swivel base, but honestly i rarely use my swivel bases and you can build a stand for it to have 360 degree access. feel free to PM me if you might need help choosing a vise for your bench and just make sure they are not broken or cracked. if you buy a welded one make sure that you get a decent vise cause it might still work, but the value isn't there in most cases.

https://washingtondc.craigslist.org/nva/tls/6089325159.html

 

[drivesitfar]

MR. P: here you go and they are great vises. the Fulton's anvil isn't something i'd beat on, but it does have that LOOK doesn't it?

 

[drivesitfar]

Kevin: i agree you shouldn't really tighten down your vises to a steel bench and your method is great if you have the tools or a friend to help you. Fretters made some copper sleeves that help to keep from breaking off a mounting tab a while back on the vise repair 101 thread, but if you have a minute to re post your last post over on the 101 thread if you haven't already i bet it would help a lot of new members that happen to see that thread and don't have as much time to go back through this one.

ALL: i was just moving a few vises around cause doing some ORGANIZING. i picked up a few new cabinets to hold some of my Stuff and finally had a chance to pull things out of the garage while it wasn't raining to cut my 1.5 inch rubber floor gym mats to size. my addressOgraphs might come in handy and i bet more than a few of us could use one of these that i just bought 3 of a few months ago. sorry they are not for sale, but thought some of you might want to see them cause the drawers are 2 feet deep and this cabinet without the drawers in it weighs about 500 pounds. remember the old metal credit cards our parents and grandparents used to use that were held in the department store's cabinets like these back in the day when you didn't always have to lock your stuff up?

 

[Mr_P]

That Reed is very nice. A while ago I passed on one due to being out of state and having to worry about checking it in on my return flight

 

[wjamyers]

You guys are amazing. Now I have a dilemma. I want that Reed.

Thanks a lot!

 

[bluebolt]

So looks like the base I need is the 101084 but I see others similar but not sure if this will cross over and a different base will work??


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101084 is for a 600, C2, early C3 and a few others, it is too big for yours. The actual part number is 1010840.

You need a 1010810 inner ring and outer ring 1011980 and the hold downs.

My inner ring is the same 101081 and the outer ring is a 101082. I need to try this on my 500 later and see if it works.

 

[drivesitfar]

WJ: that REED will last you 100 years not that you'll need it that long and you'll NEVER REGRET BUYING IT so beg, borrow, trade or negotiate to own it. if you don't use it as a press (yes they have other tools for that), or an anvil or beat or grind on the vise itself it will be all the vise you'll ever need unless you visit this thread often. good luck

P: yep having an empty suitcase or backpack for these items i'm sure is in my future if I start to travel around the USA again and maybe the world to visit a few members and auctions/sales.

cheers and it is a sweet vise and it's newer version is a REED 1C that isn't a bad looking or user vise either. good luck in your searching and don't forget to ask if someone has a vise to sell cause even if you get 100 looks of WTF you'll find a few. ask me how i know and how i found barns full of them.

 

[excelsisba]

*Didn't find this thread till after I posted in the vintage tool section... sorry for the double post*

First off, I'm new here so hello everyone. I'm a woodworker hobbiest and 3d modeler by trade. Anyhow, I've been on the hunt for a vintage vise that wasn't being asked top dollar. Most I see these days are around $100 or so.

I've read through a lot of the "Everything you need to know about vises" thread already. Man there's a lot of information there!

So I picked up this vintage Columbian Cleveland 3 1/2" vise for $20. Needs a little work and clean up. Can't tell if it's a number 33, 63 or 83 because of the casting makes it tough to tell. Has "patent applied for" on the other side. Needs new jaw faces and one hole on each piece has a broken screw in it. Looks like I'll be drilling and tapping 4 holes? Also the collar and set screw are missing on the spindle. I can't really find any information on any of the Colombian vises that are only double digits and without an alphabet letter at the beginning.
Anyhow, I like old tools and for $20 I thought I might take a chance on it. Maybe paid a little too much for the condition but oh well. Any suggestions on rebuild and age will be more than appreciated!

I thought I took a photo of it before I disassembled it but alas I did not.

 

[vintage nut]

If you're not able to mill the bottom of a vise flat (assuming it's bad enough to worry about, and going on a steel bench) I'd be half tempted to cut one or two gaskets the size and shape of the base. Give a bit of something to crush under the high spots. It wouldn't be quite as good, but it'd definitely help.

That said anything short of a welding table I'd pick wood myself. A heavy rock maple top is surprisingly durable. My most used bench has laminated old growth Douglas fir for the top, and it's held up well to at least a decade of use so far. Maple is best, but expensive.

Cabinet grade plywood (thin layers of birch, vs thick layers of softwood) makes a great surface too. Especially doubled up 3/4-1" with a solid frame under it.

Someday I'd like to do a bench with a two part top. 1" Baltic birch plywood topped with a sheet of 3/4" canvas micarta.

If anything the top material isn't as important as what it's attached to....

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[drivesitfar]

EX: first of all if you've got a vise that has all its parts and isn't cracked or welded i'm pretty certain $20 isn't too much. sadly $100 doesn't buy what it once did and you can barely get a decent MADE IN CHINA vise for that anymore. sounds like you did ok with your purchase and Imgur has issues with GJ's site so might i suggest you clicking on the paperclip just above where you write your posts and attach pictures like i do sort of like you would on an email.

Vintage: good points as per the norm from a very wise young man.

ALL: why do i search for vises everyday? habit, fun, or JUST BECAUSE. anyway this one popped up maybe a bit too far from me that might be interesting to those of you that have the skills and tools to make a non swivel a swiveler (OLDIE don't panic or get upset cause this would make any non swiveler swivel).

this is a Prentiss #52 non swiveler with a machined part and a swivel base off another vise, but not sure which vise the swivel base came off of.

 

[Pucman1]

Ok so I am relatively new to this repair vise thread so my question was how to find the proper base to replace this one! The number I referenced was stamped on the current base around the outer ring. I tried to search for a part number that might fit this current size vise but did not find any manuals or parts breakdowns.
This base looks like a 360 degree rotation with two hold downs! I do not have the missing piece for any kind of repair. I am really trying to get it to just be usable and cleaned up. Also it is missing the dust cover on the end.

JP

QUOTE=bluebolt;6463949]101084 is for a 600, C2, early C3 and a few others, it is too big for yours. The actual part number is 1010840.



You need a 1010810 inner ring and outer ring 1011980 and the hold downs.



My inner ring is the same 101081 and the outer ring is a 101082. I need to try this on my 500 later and see if it works.[/QUOTE]






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[G-ManBart]

Ok so I am relatively new to this repair vise thread so my question was how to find the proper base to replace this one! The number I referenced was stamped on the current base around the outer ring. I tried to search for a part number that might fit this current size vise but did not find any manuals or parts breakdowns.
This base looks like a 360 degree rotation with two hold downs! I do not have the missing piece for any kind of repair. I am really trying to get it to just be usable and cleaned up. Also it is missing the dust cover on the end.

As I mentioned previously, post a picture of the bottom of the swivel base, and measure the diameter of the outer ring machined surface.

There are a number of various combination used on the same vise model, so without a pic we're all just guessing.

A dust cap can be purchased from Kevin at Wiltonviseparts.net, but will require a bit of work to open the vise body up to fit....a few minutes with a die grinder is all it takes. Barring that, get a freeze plug from an auto supply store...won't look great, but will work.

 

[excelsisba]

Drives Got the images in there. Thanks! My biggest issue I think is the broken studs on the jaws where the jaw faces go.

 

[Outlawmws]

Find an appropriate size LEFT HAND twist drill for an easy-out and likely it will spin out. I would hit it with some heat and penetrating oil first though.

 

[Mark in Indiana]

EX: first of all if you've got a vise that has all its parts and isn't cracked or welded i'm pretty certain $20 isn't too much. sadly $100 doesn't buy what it once did and you can barely get a decent MADE IN CHINA vise for that anymore. sounds like you did ok with your purchase and Imgur has issues with GJ's site so might i suggest you clicking on the paperclip just above where you write your posts and attach pictures like i do sort of like you would on an email.

Vintage: good points as per the norm from a very wise young man.

ALL: why do i search for vises everyday? habit, fun, or JUST BECAUSE. anyway this one popped up maybe a bit too far from me that might be interesting to those of you that have the skills and tools to make a non swivel a swiveler (OLDIE don't panic or get upset cause this would make any non swiveler swivel).

this is a Prentiss #52 non swiveler with a machined part and a swivel base off another vise, but not sure which vise the swivel base came off of.

Drives:
I bet most of the guys & gals here look for vises every day.
I would guess that the base used with that Prentiss is from a Parker vise, based on the shape of the feet and the fastener sticking out.
Thanks for posting the pictures. Looks like a great idea for a simple conversion for a fixed base vise. I have a couple of challenged Parker Vises. If they can't be restored, the bases can be reused.

 

[OCD]

Question - are grade 8 bolts necessary to mount a vise for casual use? I can get my hands on any number of 18-8 stainless bolts for free. I figure I can use fender washers to disperse the load.

Wilton did recommend using grade 5 or stronger bolts, I just went all out for giggles...

I think any bolts one has laying around would work fine...

 

[excelsisba]

Find an appropriate size LEFT HAND twist drill for an easy-out and likely it will spin out. I would hit it with some heat and penetrating oil first though.

I'm assuming I should clean the rust off first?

 

[PacificaVette]

I just wanted to report on my progress with the Prentiss vise I picked up a few weeks ago. After disassembly, I had to come up with a solution for the missing crown nut which goes on the handle end of the screw. A set-screw collar looks like it will do the trick. I just have to drill a small hole in the screw for the set-screw.

I used some Jasco paint stripper to remove the old paint. It bubbled up in just a few minutes, and it only took me an hour to get it all scraped off and clean.

I have now started on my home-made electrolysis tank to remove the rust. The base is bubbling away in the tank (thank heavens for HD buckets!:thumbs), and it looks like 1-2 hours should get it clean.

I'm still kicking around ideas for paint color. After I stripped off the greenish-gray coat, I found a few traces of red in the logo---not the letters, but the underlaying portion. I'd like to find out what the original color scheme was. I've searched on GJ and Google, but there don't seem to be many Prentiss vises of this vintage. The branding shows "Bristol CT" as the place of manufacture, which seems to indicate that it was produced after Prentiss was taken over by Chas. Parker. I may end up going wild on the color (yellow, to match my car???), but I'm leaning toward keeping it more original.

One more question--I'd like to keep the slide fairly shiny, but still looking like "natural" bare metal. Would boiled linseed oil give that appearance? Or should I just use a paste wax or sealant?

 

[bluebolt]

Pucman, if that base fits your vise you may have a C2, not a 500. Same 5" jaw width. Does your vise have pipe jaws? As GMan says pictures would help!

Ok so I am relatively new to this repair vise thread so my question was how to find the proper base to replace this one! The number I referenced was stamped on the current base around the outer ring. I tried to search for a part number that might fit this current size vise but did not find any manuals or parts breakdowns.
This base looks like a 360 degree rotation with two hold downs! I do not have the missing piece for any kind of repair. I am really trying to get it to just be usable and cleaned up. Also it is missing the dust cover on the end.

JP

QUOTE=bluebolt;6463949]101084 is for a 600, C2, early C3 and a few others, it is too big for yours. The actual part number is 1010840.



You need a 1010810 inner ring and outer ring 1011980 and the hold downs.



My inner ring is the same 101081 and the outer ring is a 101082. I need to try this on my 500 later and see if it works.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk[/QUOTE]

 

[vintage nut]

I tend to just keep the slides of my vises wiped down with light machine oil. Same way I look after drill press tables, mills, lathes, ect

When you're done using it wipe the crud off with a rag, give it a squirt of light oil, and wipe it down again.

Of course vises don't need as frequent attention as machine tools, but figure on doing that at least once a month or so. And remove the screw to clean and re lubricate once or twice a year. I do it every couple months, but mine get used A LOT and live in a quite abrasive environment.

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[drivesitfar]

PV: i'm sure others in different climates and those that have heated garages have different results, but BLO would make a shiny slide duller in my area of the PNW and my unheated garage/shop/storage units. if you get it all shined up and don't mind using Johnson paste wax in the yellow can maybe every month that might be your best choice. i'll let others say what they like and what results they might get and just read and learn like i tend to do a lot.

nice job on the restoration so far and keep up the great work. not sure what to tell you on colors cause i think Prentiss is one of the few that offered different color choices on their vises. i've got black or JAPANNED finish, green, red more like a burgundy wine and some yellowish ones in my collection. not all certain everyone is original paint either, but most of them look that way.

good luck with the rest.

EX: since you $20 vise is missing maybe the most expensive part to replace if you don't have the materials or skills to replace them it might be just an ok deal. if you have the skills to make jaws check out the Vise repair 101 thread and see all the materials some of the members use from wood to tempered steel.

 

[excelsisba]

Drives: Thanks! Doing woodworking mostly I had planned on using hard maple as the jaw faces.

 

[Pucman1]

Does this help?

Pucman, if that base fits your vise you may have a C2, not a 500. Same 5" jaw width. Does your vise have pipe jaws? As GMan says pictures would help!











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[/QUOTE]

 

[bluebolt]

Pucman1, you definitely have the bigger base, mine is only 10" across right there. So that means you DON'T have a 500. Post pictures of the actual vise!

 

[KMScott]

Thanks PghJKB for getting me to look at creating my own decals. It was actually kind of fun. This opens up new possibilities. Will try these out before printing a bunch. Ink is expensive now a days.