Charles Parker 436 Vise Repair

[kirklandkie]

Hey folks, long time browser first time posting here. Seems google often brings me here so I thought it was about time I should make an account. So, onto the bread and butter of this post. This past March I replied to a post to a welding shop closing down on craigslist. I went down there and found this beauty of a vise weighing in at almost 200 lbs. (Also came home with a engelberg 10"x70" 5HP belt sander pictured in the background. But that's another story which I had to sneak into the barn.....)
View media item 70660He was asking 150.00 dollars so needless to say I didn't negotiate I just counted out the cash and paid the man. The Vise had one issue, It would not extend without pulling the jaw out but it would close and squeeze just fine and looked well kept otherwise. I took the vise apart in hopes of repairing it (assumed there would be a broken pin) but found this.
View media item 70661View media item 70662View media item 70663As you can see two of the cast iron lobes which would keep the nut from lifting are broken. This is an issue in itself but it wouldn't seem to have retained the nut (if you continue unscrewing the handle eventually the nut comes out the back of the vise). My question is if anyone has this vise or a similar one and knows how it should be retained? I'm sure I could fabricate a stop for it but I'm hesitant to permanently modify such a nice vintage vise. I'd prefer to repair it to like-original condition. The screw hole visible in the pictures is where the swivel base attaches to the fixed jaw portion of the vise itself. Thanks everyone for reading, I'm glad to be here.

-Kirk

 

[lazer50]

Where can i get parts for a 4x parker? Im not what its called but its a collar approx 2" round on the front of vise,its broke in half and vise wont tighten

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[lazer50]

Maybe not 2" more like 1"

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[kirklandkie]

Hey lazer50, I did a quick google search and turned up this page where it looks like someone is reproducing charles parker collars:
http://www.benchvisejaws.com/chas-parker-collars-and-swivel-handles/
How is your dovetail nut retained in your vise? I'm still trying to figure out how mine should be.

-Kirk

 

[G-ManBart]

Hey Kirk,

Your pictures aren't showing up. Some picture hosting sites won't allow images to be displayed on sites that have a classifieds section like GJ does. You can just upload them directly here, and we'll be able to see what you're trying to fix.

The nut should be retained by a dowel pin that goes vertically into a small hole (around .25") just behind the nut. Often the pin is bent slightly to take up the bit of slack that is often present. Some vises had a more complicated setup with a pin that had a threaded section for a set screw that extended to touch the pin allowing you to precisely take all the slack out (Reed was one) but I'm not sure if Parker ever used that system.

 

[G-ManBart]

Where can i get parts for a 4x parker? Im not what its called but its a collar approx 2" round on the front of vise,its broke in half and vise wont tighten

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Hey Lazer,

As Kirk mentioned, Kevin at www.benchvisejaws.com sells a Parker collar.

Still, even with the collar missing the vise should close just fine. The dowel pin keeps the nut from backing out and the collar keeps the spindle from backing out when you go to open the vise.

It would be better to start a thread for your vise repair since it's got a different problem than what Kirk is trying to fix.

 

[kirklandkie]

Hey Kirk,

Your pictures aren't showing up. Some picture hosting sites won't allow images to be displayed on sites that have a classifieds section like GJ does. You can just upload them directly here, and we'll be able to see what you're trying to fix.

The nut should be retained by a dowel pin that goes vertically into a small hole (around .25") just behind the nut. Often the pin is bent slightly to take up the bit of slack that is often present. Some vises had a more complicated setup with a pin that had a threaded section for a set screw that extended to touch the pin allowing you to precisely take all the slack out (Reed was one) but I'm not sure if Parker ever used that system.

Copy, Thanks G-ManBart. I've uploaded the pictures to GJ and modified my original post, you should be able to see them now. The last picture is the bottom side of the fixed jaw since it is cleaner and therefore more obvious there is no pin holding the dovetail nut in place. I'm tempted to drill a hole for a 1/4" roll pin up from the bottom but want to see if there's a better way.

-Kirk

 

[G-ManBart]

Copy, Thanks G-ManBart. I've uploaded the pictures to GJ and modified my original post, you should be able to see them now. The last picture is the bottom side of the fixed jaw since it is cleaner and therefore more obvious there is no pin holding the dovetail nut in place. I'm tempted to drill a hole for a 1/4" roll pin up from the bottom but want to see if there's a better way.

-Kirk

Okay...got it now. I've seen a number of Parker 88s restored here, and they look pretty much the same, so I'm sure somebody will come along who knows how the nut was retained. It's obvious there was some sort of major impact that damaged the dovetailed part....my guess would be a fall since it's pretty heavy. A pin would work, but it would be interesting to see what the original setup looked like.

 

[KMScott]

This is how I fixed my broken dovetail on my 79 Parker. Using the original stop pin hole I added a dowel pin and built a block set up that captured the nut after machining a step in the nut. I then added two 5/16 threaded holes to clamp the holder block in place. These old vises need a machine shop to repair unless you are good at doing this repair work on a drill press. The grease you are seeing is from a grease channel holes I added to the nut so you can grease the vise without taking it apart.

I might have a custom made collar for your vise. Answer the diameter question on the Parker Collar fitting picture and PM me. Good Luck.

Kevin

 

[scooternut]

Slick work KMScott, impressive repair and save.

 

[Carla]

This is how I fixed my broken dovetail on my 79 Parker. Using the original stop pin hole I added a dowel pin and built a block set up that captured the nut after machining a step in the nut. I then added two 5/16 threaded holes to clamp the holder block in place. These old vises need a machine shop to repair unless you are good at doing this repair work on a drill press. The grease you are seeing is from a grease channel holes I added to the nut so you can grease the vise without taking it apart.

I might have a custom made collar for your vise. Answer the diameter question on the Parker Collar fitting picture and PM me. Good Luck.

Kevin

Well done, Kevin....... : )

cheers

Carla

 

[KMScott]

Well done, Kevin....... : )

cheers

Carla

Thanks Scooter and Carla, I think this repair will work for years except I worry about the nut not floating a little to align the screw to the center of the nut when opening and closing. These vises are made a little loose to forgive the miss alignment in the castings. I might go back and loosen things up a bit after thinking about it.

 

[GETRIDAONE]

Copy, Thanks G-ManBart. I've uploaded the pictures to GJ and modified my original post, you should be able to see them now. The last picture is the bottom side of the fixed jaw since it is cleaner and therefore more obvious there is no pin holding the dovetail nut in place. I'm tempted to drill a hole for a 1/4" roll pin up from the bottom but want to see if there's a better way.

-Kirk

I can see the round impression of the retaining pin in the second and third photos. I think the original nut was damaged and replaced with a shorter length nut. It probably finished breaking the dovetail out and left the short sections of the dovetail at the rear.
It doesn't help with how you want to fix it but there was a pin there only about an inch or so back from where you are looking for it.

 

[454ragtop]

Kirk, here are the pics of the nut in my 436. Looking at your pics, the most troubling thing I see is you seem to have lost the positive stop ledge at the front of the nut mounting area. This stop does most of the work when tightening the vise, as far as keeping the nut in place. I think I'd be tempted to bolt a stop block in front of the nut, and a retainer similar to Kevin's behind it. Then I'd flip the vise over and drill and tap a couple 5/16" flat head socket cap screws into the nut from the bottom, in front of the threaded hole for the swivel center bolt.
Good luck, Jim