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Mass install of rivet nuts

yuanzichen

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Guys,

I am planning on put M4-0.7 rivet nuts into my Wall Control metal pegboards. The purpose is to use bolts instead of screws for Triton Durahooks. Any suggestions on installing at least 100 rivet nuts..?:eyecrazy:

Thanks!
Jason
 
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-Brent-

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I have Thread Setter (plier style) and a 100 would be doable but it would be tiresome and time consuming. Still, if it was a one-time deal of putting a hundred in, I wouldn't bother buying a pneumatic at 3x the cost.
 
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yuanzichen

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I have Thread Setter (plier style) and a 100 would be doable but it would be tiresome and time consuming. Still, if it was a one-time deal of putting a hundred in, I wouldn't bother buying a pneumatic at 3x the cost.

Do those plier style setters require a lot strength to squeeze? I have, installed two M8 rivet nuts for the cargo hooks for my Honda trunk. Used the long bolt with nuts and locking washers kinda method. Wrenched the hell outta my arms to get those crushed. Wonder if impact driver would work.
 

Craptain

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I was also thinking about the pliers style. But how far from the edge do you want to go? Depending on the style of nuts I have also seen them set with a hammer and ball bearing.

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ducksface

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Aluminum and you'll be fine.
Steel and you'll do only fifteen or so before needing a break.
 

rlitman

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A lot of M4 rivnuts require a 0.250" hole. Are the holes in your pegboard 1/4"?

The "one piece" rivnuts that squish like an aluminum pop rivet are not designed to be used in sheet metal (i.e. they do not provide "hole fill"). They do not expand sufficiently at the front, and you may end up with them spinning. You want the two piece style. It starts out as one piece that snaps as soon as you start pulling it. The cone on the back half then forces itself into the front half and causes expansion all the way up to the front. Perfect for sheet metal.

Something like this (CFT2, but I've had luck with ATS2 as well):
https://www.amazon.com/dp/B0134QH7IO/?tag=atomicindus08-20
 

rlitman

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Aluminum and you'll be fine.
Steel and you'll do only fifteen or so before needing a break.

Not quite. With one-piece all steel nutserts, yes, you'll be needing a break quickly, BUT you'll also probably snap your mandrel after a few dozen. They take that much pulling force. I've pulled some M4 stainless nutserts, and it was miserable, even that that small size.

The aluminum ones strip out too easily. Avoid these as much as possible.

Look at my link for the steel ones above. They take around the same force as the aluminum ones, but give you steel threads, and they are far less likely to spin in a sheet metal hole. When pulled, that cone half disappears inside the front half, and the splined part actually expands outwards into the sheet metal (the splines on the one-piece part only start to expand well behind the face, as most of the force in those is compression back-to-front). I pulled about 40 of those in the first hour I was installing them with a simple Marson tool, and that included drilling the holes, and I was certainly no worse for the wear.

And I'll admit, I'm not an expert on this by any means, BUT I learned this much from someone who truly is. I had to repair a hundred or so holes in sheet metal that were tapped for M4 that get used on a regular basis. Drilling and tapping to the next larger size was a problem, because then I'd want to do everything, including the ones not yet stripped out, as I don't want to keep around two sizes of nuts and tools. It would make an annoying repetitive task a REALLY annoying one.

So, I went looking for nutserts and happened upon Bay Fastening. I spoke with a REALLY helpful guy there who seriously schooled me on nutserts, and set me up with the parts I needed, which BTW didn't even add up to their minimum order (they usually sell these by the many thousands, not by the hundreds).
 

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yuanzichen

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A lot of M4 rivnuts require a 0.250" hole. Are the holes in your pegboard 1/4"?

The "one piece" rivnuts that squish like an aluminum pop rivet are not designed to be used in sheet metal (i.e. they do not provide "hole fill"). They do not expand sufficiently at the front, and you may end up with them spinning. You want the two piece style. It starts out as one piece that snaps as soon as you start pulling it. The cone on the back half then forces itself into the front half and causes expansion all the way up to the front. Perfect for sheet metal.

Something like this (CFT2, but I've had luck with ATS2 as well):
https://www.amazon.com/dp/B0134QH7IO/?tag=atomicindus08-20

Great advice! Holes are "EXACTLY" 1/4" because I do not have a mic to be precise, but hey I can read a 1/32" on a tape measure. I bought some knurled smooth body style to begin with, which is the same style I used for the cargo hooks. They directly went through a hole on the sheet metal of the trunk hood from the inside.

I would try your link if things go bad...
 

rlitman

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...I bought some knurled smooth body style to begin with...

I attached the images of the 2-piece ones in an edit to my previous post, only after you posted this.

Look at the holding ability of those knurled ones. I'm betting the're rated for thicknesses only over 2.5mm. ;)

I've been down that path. And you'll see how un-fun they are to pull too. I used those to repair a stripped out hole on my Jeep (where the thickness was appropriate).

Worst thing, is if they spin, you'll have a devil of a time drilling them out.

At least the 1/4" hole makes installation easier without having to drill.
 
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6PTsocket

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Great advice! Holes are "EXACTLY" 1/4" because I do not have a mic to be precise, but hey I can read a 1/32" on a tape measure. I bought some knurled smooth body style to begin with, which is the same style I used for the cargo hooks. They directly went through a hole on the sheet metal of the trunk hood from the inside.

I would try your link if things go bad...
I assume you have a set of drill bits. Use the backs of the bits. Much better than a tape measure.

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yuanzichen

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I attached the images of the 2-piece ones in an edit to my previous post, only after you posted this.

Look at the holding ability of those knurled ones. I'm betting the're rated for thicknesses only over 2.5mm. ;)

I've been down that path. And you'll see how un-fun they are to pull too. I used those to repair a stripped out hole on my Jeep (where the thickness was appropriate).

Worst thing, is if they spin, you'll have a devil of a time drilling them out.

At least the 1/4" hole makes installation easier without having to drill.

Looks like the one you showed on the picture has a really short thread length. Do you know what it is off the top of your head?

The other thing kind of concerning is that the flange size on your link looks really close to the shaft diameter. I bought one with 9 mm flange to cover the hole. Maybe not a problem when you know the hole is the perfect size.

Grip thickness is actually 0.5mm to 2mm which is 26 ga. up to 14 ga. Think it would be fine, especially when they are not going to be abused. Will update when I got my hands on them. Thanks again.
 
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rlitman

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Looks like the one you showed on the picture has a really short thread length. Do you know what it is off the top of your head?

The other thing kind of concerning is that the flange size on your link looks really close to the shaft diameter. I bought one with 9 mm flange to cover the hole. Maybe not a problem when you know the hole is the perfect size.

Grip thickness is actually 0.5mm to 2mm which is 26 ga. up to 14 ga. Think it would be fine, especially when they are not going to be abused. Will update when I got my hands on them. Thanks again.

Not off the top of my head, but I just checked one. There are five full turns of thread engagement. More than that is pointless anyway.

Yes, mine have the smallest size flange that fits a hole without a countersink. You can get the same thing with a wide flange too, but I don't have the part number handy. Remember though that the flange isn't providing much added strength.

Sounds like you went with something similar to the CAL series here on page 6:
http://www.sherex.com/pdf/C-RN Low Resolution.pdf
 

6PTsocket

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Between the manual setters and the multi hundred dollar hydraulic setters there seem to be some that run off an electric drill. There is one you tube video of a guy quickly installing a whole grid of them in a sheet of metal held in a vise. There seem to be a lot of them on ebay, etc. I think they are all Chinese imports but they might be good for your job. The one I saw priced was $158. I think they are on Ali Express , too. Might be worth checking out. You can get a lot of pull on a screw without a lot of effort. It is an automated version of the nut and bolt installer.

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racingtadpole

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I modified a hydraulic Greenlee style hydraulic punch to do them at work. Very easy to do, just drill and tap a bolt of suitable thread to fit your punch head with the thread size of your rivnut. Works best with the all in one style punches, still works with the porta-power style heads on a hose but its a bit awkward trying to keep it flat and level with one hand while pumping it up with the other.
I do M6 stainless inserts into stainless sheet fairly regularly at work, quite manageable by hand, but if you have to a lot of them it gets tiring. My rivnut tool is a Marson.

The key thing with rivnuts is get your hole size right or they will spin. On a non critical application like that if they do, put the head down on the anvil of your vice and give the back side a couple of sharp blows with a hammer. If that doesn't work, Loctite is your friend.
 

6PTsocket

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Look for a Huck 150/ FSI D100 rivet gun. Hydraulic actuated, hand powered. It will save your hands!
I had an early version of that gun before Huck bought the company that made it. I had nothing but grief with it. Huck does not consider it part ot their regular line and does not service it. Instead, there is one guy that has all the parts and service. You have to mail it to him If anything goes wrong. It was a great gun when it worked which was not often. Maybe the later ones are better.

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