Building House - Air Tools thru Wall

[NSXelrate]

Hey guys,
Been a lurker on this forum, and finally registering.

So I'm building a house, and I want to run a retractable reel for air tools from the ceiling. I have little experience with air tools, so please bear with me.

I'm talking to the builder about running an air hose to the area in the garage where the compressor to live, into and up the wall, over the ceiling, to the center of the garage. The space above is inaccessible because there's a media room. It's now or never.

They are reluctant to do any of this, and want to run a smurf tube for me instead. Also, there's no way they'd take on soldering copper pipe.

1. Do you think I can run an air hose thru a (large) smurf tube? (Smurf tube is tubing normally used for low voltage cable like CAT5. They are run empty, so that you can easily run any future wiring if new types of connections come out.)
2. Install a filter and a drip leg next to the compressor.
3. Should I push them to just run the air hose thru the walls and ceiling instead of smurf tube?
4. Is it okay to run tube instead of copper thru the walls?
5. Anything else I'm missing? Suggestions?

My future garage: 4 car bays (1 tandem), 2 ft extension on the front of the house, 10-11 ft ceilings. I never thought I'd be able to have a 4 car garage.

 

[Stuart in MN]

If they're not willing, could you go in yourself and stub in a copper pipe before they do the drywall?

 

[BoostedOne]

I wouldnt even consider running hose in the wall, even if its in smurf tube.. What happens down the road when the hose deteriorates and bursts? Your EFFED...
Id have them(or someone) run steel piping. By code you are allowed cutouts in joists and studs, you just have to do them right and place them properly. Any plumber should know the codes and techniques. And any plumber should be able to run the pipe.

 

[pattenp]

Is it that you want a clean look so you want the air line buried in the wall and ceiling? Personally I would surface mount using RapidAir FastPipe or Garage-Pak Air systems. Or you could install electrical rigid 1" PVC conduit with large radius sweeps in the wall and ceiling that you can pull air hose through.

 

[gorilla]

I have no idea what smurf tube is but I do know that pvc electrical conduit has large radius elbows that would make pulling an air hose easy if the ID was big enough. If the hose fails just replace it.

 

[ssdave]

Hose would work, and be replaceable if the tubing was large enough and radiused well. But, I'd just have a plumber come in and run the pipe if your general contractor won't do it.

 

[NSXelrate]

So the problem is that they won't allow any external contractors to work on the house.
I theoretically could install the copper myself (but I'd have to learn) at night, and sneak in.

Edit: Hmm, I think PVC would be a better solution. I'll ask about that.

 

[Blue XJ]

Don't run PVC for air lines, there are many threads about this.

 

[gungatim]

I don't understand why the builder wouldn't just add it to his plumbing sub. copper pipe is pretty simple to do, can't imagine they wouldn't just run the bare stubs and cap off for more the a couple hundred bucks.

if you can't do it yourself, rather than make a mistake (leak) first time in a buried wall, do you know anyone that's a handyman/coworker/whatever that would run it for you? I would definitely skip the air hose, whether in a tube or not. you have no idea the quality of the hose and/or fitting crimps and a leak in a confined space--especially a fire--is probably not something worth risking...

if no go on the copper, use rapid air. you can do that yourself pretty easily.

 

[cthulu]

Install one of these outside the drywall, goes up easy so you can do it yourself. I'm just finishing my install and like it a lot.

https://shop.rapidairproducts.com/cgi-bin/commerce.cgi?preadd=action&key=F28075

Also, insulate your garage! You live in Dallas, it gets miserable there in the summer.

 

[Firebrick43]

If your builders subs are not competent enough to plumb, cap off and pressure test a copper airline you need to be blunt with him and tell him you may need a different builder.

Copper is child play for a competent plumber. Insist on L copper instead of M.

 

[Git]

I would go with the smurf tubing - for those of you who don't know what it is, it's this stuff

http://www.homedepot.com/p/Carlon-1-in-x-25-ft-ENT-Coil-Blue-12008-025/202688856

If there was ever a problem down the road (and I doubt there would be) pull out the old hose and replace. Heck - it may come in handy to run something else in.

PS - we have a 'builder' on the forum who says if he catches anyone installing anything on the side and if he finds out about it, he will chop the walls open to remove it!!!!!

 

[Musicinabottle]

I would go with the smurf tubing - for those of you who don't know what it is, it's this stuff

http://www.homedepot.com/p/Carlon-1-in-x-25-ft-ENT-Coil-Blue-12008-025/202688856

If there was ever a problem down the road (and I doubt there would be) pull out the old hose and replace. Heck - it may come in handy to run something else in.

PS - we have a 'builder' on the forum who says if he catches anyone installing anything on the side and if he finds out about it, he will chop the walls open to remove it!!!!!

regular PVC electrical conduit is quite a bit cheaper.

 

[-Brent-]

I ran a RapidAir kit in my ceiling. I pressure tested it and after addressing the leak(s) it held air pressure for 96 hours or so before I finished the ceiling. It was easy! I think I have 3 fitting in the ceiling, that's it.

I too have a reel in the middle of my shop but you cannot see it because it's in the attic.

 

[ptgarcia]

PS - we have a 'builder' on the forum who says if he catches anyone installing anything on the side and if he finds out about it, he will chop the walls open to remove it!!!!!

I deal with builders every day and they all do this. If its not on the plans, they yank it down. If you want it, add it to the plans.

 

[Git]

regular PVC electrical conduit is quite a bit cheaper.

Smurf tubing, it is very flexible - you don't use any elbows or anything

 

[Git]

I deal with builders every day and they all do this. If its not on the plans, they yank it down. If you want it, add it to the plans.

This is exactly why people 'do things on the side'... The builder is too stupid or doesn't want to deal with it, like in the OP's situation

Fawk your plans, don't sell me the house then. (And like I said in the other post, if I installed something 'on the side' because the builder couldn't/wouldn't do it, that in no way would affect the construction/quality of the house and the builder ripped it out - I would back out of the deal

 

[ptgarcia]

This is exactly why people 'do things on the side'... The builder is too stupid or doesn't want to deal with it, like in the OP's situation

Fawk your plans, don't sell me the house then. (And like I said in the other post, if I installed something 'on the side' because the builder couldn't/wouldn't do it, that in no way would affect the construction/quality of the house and the builder ripped it out - I would back out of the deal

The builder may in fact be stupid, and I know he doesn't want to deal with it, but it's the builder's *** on the line if the home buyer sneaks something by that causes a problem.

 

[Git]

...but it's the builder's *** on the line if the home buyer sneaks something by that causes a problem.

That right there is the key. On another new house we bought, I prewired for a Nutone Intercom system (yes, this was back in the early 90's when people still bought intercoms) Were talking some low voltage wire to each room, hidden behind the drywall

Builder found out about it - right before closing, and threw a fit. I told him I wasn't going to buy the house... He then pulled his head out of his *** and realized that he/they were not the almighty kings that they thought they were and we came to a reasonable agreement that IF a problem developed and it could be directly attributed to the work that I did, it would not be covered by their warranty...

Seriously, of all the fawked up **** I have seen in new homes under construction, the last thing I would be worried about is the new homeowner screwing something up, I would be more concerned with what the subs were doing to cut corners

 

[NSXelrate]

We'll see what they say. I've asked them about copper, smurf tube, and the rapid air stuff.

If it were something I were comfortable with, like low voltage, I may be more inclined to sneak in to do it.

Thanks for the help guys. This forum is great.

 

[Playwme]

Builders run to a plan and a schedule. Sneaking things in and making changes along the way upset that. That's why variations cost so much. It's not just the extra cost of that little item, there can be other flow on effects too.
Also, they don't know the true capabilities of the homeowner or his mates. Better to be safe than sorry. If you want that capability then make it clear before the contract is signed or even before he quotes.

If you pay enough money you can get what you want, but you can't have your cake and eat it too.

 

[FRANKIEWHIPIT]

Talk to the plumber on site, have him take care of it! if it's going to be buried I would use black pipe

 

[ItsNemo]

Run it on the surface after with standoffs...let's you change things and make repairs down the road. Most things are better pre-ran (electrical, network, low voltage, etc) but with air it's better to be accessible.

 

[Notgrownup]

Rapidair system is the bomb...look into it, I have the small tube type that is flexible in my garage walls, mind you I haven't tested it yet but it was easy to install.

 

[Radix2]

We'll see what they say. I've asked them about copper, smurf tube, and the rapid air stuff.

If it were something I were comfortable with, like low voltage, I may be more inclined to sneak in to do it.

Thanks for the help guys. This forum is great.

Instead of running a copper "air" line, have them run a copper "water" line from the compressor area to your reel area...


have it disconnected at both ends for future use or have them connect it to the water system if they absolutely must (don't see why) and it is not too far . you can refit it at your leisure...

and maybe run a line for a water hose reel too while you are at it...

 

[ford33]

I would not bury the air line in the wall or ceiling. Mount the air line outside of the drywall and paint it. All things break and eventually you will need to service that line and will not have access to it.

Also, will they properly pitch the airline so water runs to a drain valve. Water will collect in the line and you will need a way to remove it.

 

[NSXelrate]

Met with the builder supervisor and they are looking into running copper in the walls. Thanks all!

 

[johnnyradiant]

Just remember it is their house and ......

Tell them you want an airline piped in and they can either sour the relationship or they can charge an extra, or they can tell you they have a schedule to keep for their contract to work but you are welcome to bring in your own sub, when it won't interfere with their work.

 

[Heavy Metal Doctor]

I deal with builders every day and they all do this. If its not on the plans, they yank it down. If you want it, add it to the plans.

They don't ALL do it.
The contractor I just hired pre-approved me doing my own voice/data/entertainment system wiring before drywall. The electrical sub told him it's fine - owner can put it exactly where he wants it AFTER the electrical inspection, and I don't have to deal with it.