sz0k30
Well-known member
OK? What's the deal with all the little X's and no photos lately?
The VISES of Garage Journal
- Thread starter mjozefow
- Start date
Mark in Indiana
Well-known member
Bcom:
I googled the Athol Machine & Foundry Co. History and found that the company was dissolved in 1965. From the picture, it looks like it's been neglected for a few years. The paint is chipping off on a lot of the areas, the same way that old paint chips off of wood windows. Also, the striped pants and glasses that the girl sitting down is wearing, I'm going to guess that the picture was taken in the mid-late 1960s.
I'd guess that the vise was made of wood, based on the chipping paint and the handle. Also, if it was made of concrete or steel (unless a scrapper got it), it would still be there.
BTW: My wife won't let me build one as a yard ornament. She said that I have too many vises...more than she has purses.
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drivesitfar
Well-known member
ALL: sorry for not checking in or throwing up a smoke signal, but health wise i'm ok. just busy trying to take advantage of 80's and sunshine getting stuff done around the house before 6 months of rain and cold weather come again.
not much to report on the vise front lately maybe cause i'm getting a bit too picky, but i did find a MADE IN ENGLAND Record 6vs with it's box that is in REALLY TOUGH SHAPE.
i posted up a question up over on the Vise Repair 101 thread and was wondering if my quick release parts could be swapped into this like new record 6vs so i could have a like new one on one of my benches. the other one is just in ok shape and i was going to have to take it apart to clean it up anyway so just curious. any thoughts please post over on the 101 thread if you have time.
also picked up this little Palmgren
thanks for all the emails and PM's concerned about my well being and i'll try to make time for at least a few posts from now on instead of just stopping to finish a project or two.
cheers
not much to report on the vise front lately maybe cause i'm getting a bit too picky, but i did find a MADE IN ENGLAND Record 6vs with it's box that is in REALLY TOUGH SHAPE.
i posted up a question up over on the Vise Repair 101 thread and was wondering if my quick release parts could be swapped into this like new record 6vs so i could have a like new one on one of my benches. the other one is just in ok shape and i was going to have to take it apart to clean it up anyway so just curious. any thoughts please post over on the 101 thread if you have time.
also picked up this little Palmgren
thanks for all the emails and PM's concerned about my well being and i'll try to make time for at least a few posts from now on instead of just stopping to finish a project or two.
cheers
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va.grouseman
Well-known member
Welcome back Drive.---Had me worried.
Guapo
Active member
Thanks.
It's a Reed 4CA. I just picked up a second one.
Both NIB. Little bit of surface rust on the handle....
Terry
I've been looking into vises, but I am clueless at pricing them.
What is considered a fair deal on a used Reeds C series? I am located in Sacramento, CA area, BTW.
How about something like this Chas Parker?
https://sfbay.craigslist.org/sby/tls/d/vice/6318050871.html
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Shiftless
Well-known member
One thing I noticed about the big parker is that big weld booger which might indicate a past break on the dynamic jay support shelf.
trijeff
Well-known member
Yeah, and if you're looking for a combo (per your Reed 4C comment), a Parker 956 ain't one of 'em
gman007
Well-known member
ALL: sorry for not checking in or throwing up a smoke signal, but health wise i'm ok. just busy trying to take advantage of 80's and sunshine getting stuff done around the house before 6 months of rain and cold weather come again.
not much to report on the vise front lately maybe cause i'm getting a bit too picky, but i did find a MADE IN ENGLAND Record 6vs with it's box that is in REALLY TOUGH SHAPE.
i posted up a question up over on the Vise Repair 101 thread and was wondering if my quick release parts could be swapped into this like new record 6vs so i could have a like new one on one of my benches. the other one is just in ok shape and i was going to have to take it apart to clean it up anyway so just curious. any thoughts please post over on the 101 thread if you have time.
also picked up this little Palmgren
thanks for all the emails and PM's concerned about my well being and i'll try to make time for at least a few posts from now on instead of just stopping to finish a project or two.
cheers
Drives
Welcome back
, there was definitely a big void at the forum because of your absence.By the way nice finds.
007
Muggzy
Well-known member
I don't mind paying a fair price, I can't even find a decent sized used vise at all.
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Shiftless
Well-known member
I bet there are GJ members close to you that would be happy to sell you one or more of theirs. If you were closer, I'd be happy to deal. Shipping is expensive for the larger vises.
Since you have over 100 postings, you could place a wanted ad in the classified section of GJ.
Or put a wanted ad in the tools section of your local C/L
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chrisnazzy
Well-known member
Can anyone give me specs on a Chas Parker 574x.....
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+ 1 on that
RagTopTA
Well-known member
Went to the flea and a G sale today and found a couple little vises. a General Vacuvise thats got a little swivel bace. Really prety neat. And a Tesco 12W that cleaned up nice! Cant find much on it, has Tulsa Okla on one side.
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gman007
Well-known member
chris
There is an old thread at GJ that has a photo and spec for the 574 in the catalog (supposedly from around 1946, 4" jaws and 44 lb)
https://www.garagejournal.com/forum/showthread.php?t=63694&page=2
007
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chrisnazzy
Well-known member
Thanks 007. Everytime anyone posts these old catalog pages in this thread I save them to my recently created "Vise" album on my phone. I seem to have more info on Parkers than any other but none of them had anything about the 574. I wonder what the "x" designates.
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Mark if you had one build, could I come and visit?
Anyway, I'm surprised they didn't put the name Starrett on the side of the big ole vise depending on how old the vise is.
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Guapo
Active member
I'm not looking for a particular vise. I would like to know what is a fair price for vises like that Reed or Parker in good condition. I was using them as examples.
I've been browsing CL and I get a feeling that the listed vises are a bit overpriced, but I would like to get some sense of pricing for when I see a good deal.
Fretters
Well-known member
Good to see you back online DIF.
There are too many variables to consider when buying a used vise and its not just brand. Are the jaws worn out? Is anything broken? Can it be fixed? How much are parts? Are parts even available? What jaw width? How much does it weigh? The only thing that's a definite is to stay with MADE IN THE USA VISES. I can't just give one generalized price because some vises are better than others.
Fretters
Well-known member
There are too many variables to consider when buying a used vise and its not just brand. Are the jaws worn out? Is anything broken? Can it be fixed? How much are parts? Are parts even available? What jaw width? How much does it weigh? The only thing that's a definite is to stay with MADE IN THE USA VISES. I can't just give one generalized price because some vises are better than others.
English vices too.
454ragtop
Well-known member
Thanks 007. Everytime anyone posts these old catalog pages in this thread I save them to my recently created "Vise" album on my phone. I seem to have more info on Parkers than any other but none of them had anything about the 574. I wonder what the "x" designates.
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Pretty sure the "X" designates a steel slide bar, versus the more common cast iron.
gman007
Well-known member
Thanks 007. Everytime anyone posts these old catalog pages in this thread I save them to my recently created "Vise" album on my phone. I seem to have more info on Parkers than any other but none of them had anything about the 574. I wonder what the "x" designates.
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Chris
I also checked FMC's spread sheet (by the way this spread sheet has a wealth of info on huge number of vises) and there is only one entry for 574 (with no X)
Is the 574X that you mention a fixed based vise? I am asking this because there
Is a 574C with swivel base so I am wondering if the X model might designate fixed base version.
Most likely one of the vise experts here will have a more definitive answer for you on the Significance of the X.
007
gman007
Well-known member
Ragtop
It looks like our updates crossed path
. This make sense, so is this also why on the old Parkers vises such as 29x, 39x etc it says "Semi Steel Solid Bar"?Chris
Please see ragtop's reply
007
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I've been helping my neighbors take care of their family members house who recently passed away. He was a hoarder of sorts, but the house always look clean from the outside.
Lately for helping them, they've been letting me have some of his tools for the massively packed basement. They wanted things to go to people that would actually value them and use them. These are a bunch of harbor fright tools, but we've only just begun looking through things.
All of these clamps and vises are NOS in the original boxes with the factory grease and directions. The large Craftsman woodworking vise (391-5195) had never been opened and is in almost perfect condition! And they're all made in Japan.
Lately for helping them, they've been letting me have some of his tools for the massively packed basement. They wanted things to go to people that would actually value them and use them. These are a bunch of harbor fright tools, but we've only just begun looking through things.
All of these clamps and vises are NOS in the original boxes with the factory grease and directions. The large Craftsman woodworking vise (391-5195) had never been opened and is in almost perfect condition! And they're all made in Japan.
Kayakranger76
Well-known member
- Joined
- May 8, 2016
- Messages
- 51
Shiftless
Well-known member
FlyBy:
That is a noble thing to do and an appropriate way to be thanked for your help. I have done the same for a couple of friends of my wife.
The Craftsman vises from the time they were made at the foundry in Daido, Japan (foundry code BF found on the underside), are highly regarded and IMHO just as good as many of the homeowner or mechanic's vises that were made here. Not equal to the top shelf American machinist grade vises but entirely adequate for most users. That exact model vise was on my bench for more than 20 years and served me quite well until I joined GJ when the red Craftsman was retired. It still does part time work at a floral designer's shop just up the street from me.
Since those vises and clamps are NOS, you might want to list them on eBay where they could bring enough money to make a good down payment on a decent condition top shelf maker USA (or English...thanks Fretters) machinist vise if that is what you are looking for.
Remember though that carpenter vises don't bring the $$ that bench vises do.
That is a noble thing to do and an appropriate way to be thanked for your help. I have done the same for a couple of friends of my wife.
The Craftsman vises from the time they were made at the foundry in Daido, Japan (foundry code BF found on the underside), are highly regarded and IMHO just as good as many of the homeowner or mechanic's vises that were made here. Not equal to the top shelf American machinist grade vises but entirely adequate for most users. That exact model vise was on my bench for more than 20 years and served me quite well until I joined GJ when the red Craftsman was retired. It still does part time work at a floral designer's shop just up the street from me.
Since those vises and clamps are NOS, you might want to list them on eBay where they could bring enough money to make a good down payment on a decent condition top shelf maker USA (or English...thanks Fretters) machinist vise if that is what you are looking for.
Remember though that carpenter vises don't bring the $$ that bench vises do.
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Shiftless
Well-known member
Kayak:
That is something I too probably would have picked up even though it has been badly wounded. Somebody probably dropped it. Not only is the back corner of the slide cracked off but the dynamic jaw support shelf looks to be MIA.
But don't despair... it would look cool with a little clean up work or even a complete repaint if that's what you like and then retired to life on your vise display shelf.
That is something I too probably would have picked up even though it has been badly wounded. Somebody probably dropped it. Not only is the back corner of the slide cracked off but the dynamic jaw support shelf looks to be MIA.
But don't despair... it would look cool with a little clean up work or even a complete repaint if that's what you like and then retired to life on your vise display shelf.
Pricing varies a lot with location and it can vary significantly with just a 100mi difference in location.
Pricing also varies a lot by brand. The average person buying or selling a vise doesn't know anything about who made what, or which brands were good, etc. Generally speaking, aside from collectors or enthusiasts, like the folks here, nobody knows anything but Wilton. They are really the only ones left selling the same basic line from decades ago, where you can look at the current retail price and compare. Their prices have gone up, so the used market has gone up.
There is no reason a Wilton C-1 should sell for almost twice what a Reed 2C does (both 4.5" jaws, pipe jaws and swivel base), but that's how it usually works out. It doesn't matter than the 2C weighs 15lbs more, has an adjustable nut stop and split nut, etc, etc. I can sell a clean C-1 for $350-400 pretty easily, and getting $250 out of a C2 is on the high side. This is largely because Wilton is a known brand, and Reed isn't any longer. The same can be said of vises from Parker, Athol/Starrett, Hollands, Rock Island, Morgan, etc, etc.
The other thing to consider is that you almost have to ignore the prices you see folks post here, for a number of reasons. You have folks scouring the planet looking for vises and they know what to pay, so they don't overpay. On top of that, I know some of the prices posted here are false. I've seen a vise sold by someone I know, and know how much they sold it for, and then seen the price posted in this thread for half of that, or less. I don't know why, but I know it happens. There are also folks from this thread informing sellers that their prices are too low to stop other folks from getting good deals, but that's another matter entirely.
Here's what looks like a great vise at a reasonable price in your area....$300 for a 6" Hollands on a swivel isn't bad at all. I'd try for $250, but wouldn't complain at $300 too much. Consider a 6" Wilton on a swivel would be double that, and it sort of makes my point from above about brand pricing.
https://sacramento.craigslist.org/tls/d/large-industrial-size-vise/6318622313.html
On the flip side, a 4" fixed base Rock Island with a chunk out of the slide for $75....nope, too much. $35-40 maybe as a beater vise.
https://sacramento.craigslist.org/tls/d/heavy-duty-bench-vise/6318622035.html
GETRIDAONE
Well-known member
For some reason the right corner of the slide is broken most of the time. I have two Parkers that are broken in exactly the same place.
Sunset_Z28
Well-known member
Don’t ban me for this, but I cleaned up an import vise...
I bought a lot of junk at a sale Friday and in it was a nasty little Fuller vise. It looked to be in pretty decent shape just caked with dirt and surface rust. I sprayed it down, disassembled it and dunked it in an electrolysis bath for a few hours. I thought about painting it but I’ve wasted enough time on a $10 vise lol. Not sure what to do with it now.
I bought a lot of junk at a sale Friday and in it was a nasty little Fuller vise. It looked to be in pretty decent shape just caked with dirt and surface rust. I sprayed it down, disassembled it and dunked it in an electrolysis bath for a few hours. I thought about painting it but I’ve wasted enough time on a $10 vise lol. Not sure what to do with it now.
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mgmlvks
Well-known member
Reminds me of the vise in my uncles feed mill when they had the dairy - dust on every surface - guess that is why they (are supposed to) use explosion proof wiring systems! Anyway - Time Well Spent on the vise.
dimwittedmoose51
Well-known member
With regards to G Man Bart's comments and explanation(much appreciated BTW) I was under the impression that Wilton had been farming out a lot of their vise production to overseas manufacturers. I bought a Wilton 4500 at a farm store new in 2003 and paid like 90 bucks for it, assuming it was US made. To this day there's nowhere on that vise that says whether it was made stateside or overseas. 1998 rings a bell as a date when the manufacturing shift began, but I could be wrong on that. It's been a good vise and the feature that lets you unscrew the dynamic jaw and stic it in the back side of the vise to make a wider clamping space is a real plus. I love the old vises, but as soon as I pick up my 3" bullet vise I had a friend win for me at an auction yesterday, I'll be getting really picky about the next one that goes in the collection. Love it every time something new pops up from GJ vise thread on my email inbox.
DM&FS
DM&FS
mgmlvks
Well-known member
We studied the photo for a sense of dates and we are basically the same. Joanne was pretty definitive on the striped pants from the very early 1970's, and I note one kid with long hair and one with a crew cut which puts me in late-late '60's,
chrisnazzy
Well-known member
Interesting weekend for me! Since purchasing and fixing up my first vise 3 months ago I've been learning alot from all of you in this thread. Unfortunately I have not been able to locally source any more vises. I been looking hard too.....local Craigslist in AZ and in families area in So Cal. Vise searching has also prompted me to sign up for Facebook marketplace groups for the first time as I've always despised FB.
Well Friday night I catch a 17 minute old CL ad for a Wilton baby bullet on a Powerarm Jr (see pic) for $100. I am not particularly interested in Wiltons due to how crazy of money they command but for that kind of deal I call, text and email and the lady called me back a few minutes later. She says I'm first and I said I'll take it. It's an hour drive each way but she says just come out the next day and she'll hold it for me. I even called her back and said "you know I really want to come tonight" and she said it was too late but she reassured me she would hold it for me. She also told me that her son who lives with her also has a few other vises I could look at and I of course expressed my interest in them as well.
Saturday she calls me as I'm getting in my truck to head out. She's acting all distraught and sad and says she's been getting calls all night and morning. She says someone has offered her $250 and she has to take it. Of course I know what they are worth but I'm left virtually speechless. I asked her how she wasn't sick to her stomach about going back on her word but I stop short of telling her off. I think mainly I was thinking about salvaging the ability to see the other vises because I of course had no idea what else she had.
I text her an hour later and asked if she could email me some pictures of the other vises. She sends me 13 pics of an Athol 625, a Chas Parker 574x and a Prentiss 19. The Prentiss has a chunk missing near the logo on the static but the other 2 look awesome. So I call her and talk to her and her son. They tell me $150 for the Athol, $50 for the Parker or $175 for both. They tell me to come out the next day after they get done with a prior engagement in the morning.
Text her this morning asking if I should head out. She texts back 40 minutes later.....'no need, sold both." I'm sure someone will find some way to blame me but ultimately I'm just really taken aback by how someone can sleep at night knowing that there word and integrity mean nothing.
Now here is the silver lining! Yesterday afternoon after realizing I wasn't going out of town to buy a baby bullet one of our tire techs invites me over to a house he just bought and they are trying to clean out. He says there are a bunch of odds and ends tools in the garage and 2 vises. When I get there last night I found and promptly purchase for $40 this amazing Rock Island 853 double swiveler. 4 1/2" jaws, about 80 lbs and in near perfect condition. This thing is huge. I can't wait to get started on the teardown and refurb and it's definitely helping to ease the pain a bit on the other deal.
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PS.....sorry for the long post. Hope I didn't bore everyone to death.
Well Friday night I catch a 17 minute old CL ad for a Wilton baby bullet on a Powerarm Jr (see pic) for $100. I am not particularly interested in Wiltons due to how crazy of money they command but for that kind of deal I call, text and email and the lady called me back a few minutes later. She says I'm first and I said I'll take it. It's an hour drive each way but she says just come out the next day and she'll hold it for me. I even called her back and said "you know I really want to come tonight" and she said it was too late but she reassured me she would hold it for me. She also told me that her son who lives with her also has a few other vises I could look at and I of course expressed my interest in them as well.
Saturday she calls me as I'm getting in my truck to head out. She's acting all distraught and sad and says she's been getting calls all night and morning. She says someone has offered her $250 and she has to take it. Of course I know what they are worth but I'm left virtually speechless. I asked her how she wasn't sick to her stomach about going back on her word but I stop short of telling her off. I think mainly I was thinking about salvaging the ability to see the other vises because I of course had no idea what else she had.
I text her an hour later and asked if she could email me some pictures of the other vises. She sends me 13 pics of an Athol 625, a Chas Parker 574x and a Prentiss 19. The Prentiss has a chunk missing near the logo on the static but the other 2 look awesome. So I call her and talk to her and her son. They tell me $150 for the Athol, $50 for the Parker or $175 for both. They tell me to come out the next day after they get done with a prior engagement in the morning.
Text her this morning asking if I should head out. She texts back 40 minutes later.....'no need, sold both." I'm sure someone will find some way to blame me but ultimately I'm just really taken aback by how someone can sleep at night knowing that there word and integrity mean nothing.
Now here is the silver lining! Yesterday afternoon after realizing I wasn't going out of town to buy a baby bullet one of our tire techs invites me over to a house he just bought and they are trying to clean out. He says there are a bunch of odds and ends tools in the garage and 2 vises. When I get there last night I found and promptly purchase for $40 this amazing Rock Island 853 double swiveler. 4 1/2" jaws, about 80 lbs and in near perfect condition. This thing is huge. I can't wait to get started on the teardown and refurb and it's definitely helping to ease the pain a bit on the other deal.
Sent from my SM-G930P using Tapatalk
PS.....sorry for the long post. Hope I didn't bore everyone to death.
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va.grouseman
Well-known member
Chrisnazzy, when it comes to cash, never expect anyone to keep their word.---And if they do, you just witnessed an anomaly and become the benefactor of virtue that very few have and few will ever see.---Not much has changed since the California and Alaskan gold rushes.---Many were lied to, many died, and many were murdered chasing those little gold rocks.---Today it's green paper but the mindset is still the same.
Super nice 593.---Bobby Bare would say, ("That makes you the winner").
Super nice 593.---Bobby Bare would say, ("That makes you the winner").
Here's some more pictures of the Rock Island 574 I picked up Friday. I am not familiar with the Rock Island numbering system and thought "This is pretty heavy for a 4" vise" Then I set it next to my Wilton C1 and realized it was actually 4 1/2" wide jaws LOL.
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Wilton has moved some production overseas, but the Machinist, Combination and Tradesman models are all made in the U.S. and marked as such.
I've had stuff like that happen many times, and it's just part of dealing with Craigslist.
It's also further proof that many people ****...no other way to describe it.
Unfortunately, there are also quite a few, mostly silent, forum members who will tank a deal someone else is working on, start a bidding war on a Craigslist ad they didn't see first, etc, etc. If a large, rare vise popped up right now for a really low price, and somebody posted it here, a bidding war would happen, and that vise would very likely silently go into some hoarders collection not to be seen until they die....that's just the way it is.