The VISES of Garage Journal

[Bcom]

Is there a way to fix the tiny amount of slop from a worn keyway on a Wilton Bullet slide. Ive got a bullet here and the dynamic jaw can tilt a hair bit side to side. Is there a way to fix this?

 

[drivesitfar]

BMR: i'd love to find one or a few of those little hand vises cause it makes it a lot easier to keep small objects in a grinder without having them fly when you lose your grip. also would help me from grinding the end of my fingers.

BCOM: some of the guys just remove the old keyways and make a new one to fit snug if old one is worn or damaged. i've heard of some other fixes that involve welding if you have that skill set. or maybe you can make a shim?

good luck

 

[Bcom]

Drives ---- I was hoping there was some type of shim that people may have used. I'm not exactly sure how these Wilton keyways are attached to the slide. I'm sure a small tack weld and some grinding would fix it up but really wanted to see if someone has ever made a shim or something for it. Thanks for the response

 

[drivesitfar]

BCOM: i think they posted up a few examples on the Vise Repair 101 thread if you have time to take a look. i think the keyways are just pinned to the dynamic and i think can come off fairly easily, but i've never had the problem or a need to do that.

 

[Bcom]

BCOM: i think they posted up a few examples on the Vise Repair 101 thread if you have time to take a look. i think the keyways are just pinned to the dynamic and i think can come off fairly easily, but i've never had the problem or a need to do that.

Ok thanks drives. I'll take a peek

 

[Rileysan]

My buddy asked me if I knew what year my Craftsman 5180 was made. Up to that point, I had only assumed (due to the "Heritage" logo) that it was from the late 40s through the early 60s. This morning, I set out to figure it out. I have digital copies of Sears Craftsman Mechanic's catalogs from 1949, 1954, 1957, and 1960. I can't find my vise in any of those catalogs.

Does anyone have an idea what years the Reed-made Craftsman vises were made? Does anyone have access to digital catalogs showing them?

Thanks!

Brian

 

[scooternut]

This was from a post by outlaw awhile back. He had it labeled as 1945.
Link to the original, very informative post
https://www.garagejournal.com/forum/showthread.php?t=149519

My buddy asked me if I knew what year my Craftsman 5180 was made. Up to that point, I had only assumed (due to the "Heritage" logo) that it was from the late 40s through the early 60s. This morning, I set out to figure it out. I have digital copies of Sears Craftsman Mechanic's catalogs from 1949, 1954, 1957, and 1960. I can't find my vise in any of those catalogs.

Does anyone have an idea what years the Reed-made Craftsman vises were made? Does anyone have access to digital catalogs showing them?

Thanks!

Brian

 

[KMScott]

Here is a new on me. A customer wanted a set of jaws for his C1, we all know the jaws are 4-1/2 x 1 x 5/8 thick with 5/16; screws centered on standard 2-3/8 C/C. He bought the 3/4 jaws and they did not fit, digging deeper I realized this vise was not altered since the center pin and original jaws were made for the 5/16 screws. This is the first C1 with a 6-47 date stamp I seen and this vise uses the 4-1/2 x 3/4 x 1/2 jaws with the 5/16 screws and 5/16 center pin. This vise shows that Wilton seen a issue with the large screws and changed the 3/4 tall jaws to the 1" tall jaws in later models. Wilton also had a issue with the first gen swivel bolts where the lock-downs were to close to the static side hence using the Acorn nuts. Anyone seen a C1 this old? I'll post this on the Wilton vise date thread later.

Customer lives in Virginia and would let it go to a Wilton collector but not a reseller. Bart or Nick what would this vise be worth? I mentioned $200-300 but being rare does this increase the value even with rough corners. Came from a rock quarry.

 

[trijeff]

Interesting C1. Seems like the "redesign" was just to cut down further into jaw pocket as vs. making the jaw face bigger. This pic is from a 2013 C1, but I have seen the same on newer C series of all numbers ... basically just leaves a (sometime incredibly) thin ribbon of iron between the bottom of regular jaw and top of pipe jaw. No likey.

 

[autopts]

Here is a new on me. A customer wanted a set of jaws for his C1, we all know the jaws are 4-1/2 x 1 x 5/8 thick with 5/16; screws centered on standard 2-3/8 C/C. He bought the 3/4 jaws and they did not fit, digging deeper I realized this vise was not altered since the center pin and original jaws were made for the 5/16 screws. This is the first C1 with a 6-47 date stamp I seen and this vise uses the 4-1/2 x 3/4 x 1/2 jaws with the 5/16 screws and 5/16 center pin. This vise shows that Wilton seen a issue with the large screws and changed the 3/4 tall jaws to the 1" tall jaws in later models. Wilton also had a issue with the first gen swivel bolts where the lock-downs were to close to the static side hence using the Acorn nuts. Anyone seen a C1 this old? I'll post this on the Wilton vise date thread later.

Customer lives in Virginia and would let it go to a Wilton collector but not a reseller. Bart or Nick what would this vise be worth? I mentioned $200-300 but being rare does this increase the value even with rough corners. Came from a rock quarry.

That's strange, It could be that C1 originally came with 1" high jaws but due to the long extensive wear on the towers over all these many years 3/4" jaws now are the answer. I have a 1950 Wilton Catalog and Wilton shows that C1 however they only show replacement jaws for their original Machinist's vise, not any combos. Honestly, I wouldn't go near that worn C1 unless I was a hard up collector and the base probably would ne next to impossible to find. Nice add on photo for the Journal though.

 

[KMScott]

Well I just did a ratio and proportion and the threads per my rough calculations are a 1/2" above the shelf. Guys Machinist's/Toolmakers measure in thousands where others measure in 64ths so I might mail a set of 4-1/2 x 1" jaws and see how they fit. Well anyway this is a old vise and would be curious to see how it compares on the date thread. Thanks guys.

 

[Rileysan]

This was from a post by outlaw awhile back. He had it labeled as 1945.
Link to the original, very informative post
https://www.garagejournal.com/forum/showthread.php?t=149519

Great information - thank you!

I'm "flyspecking" here, but it is a curious detail. The 5180 in the ad you posted has the cast-in lettering for "Craftsman" whereas my 5180 has a Craftsman 'Heritage' badge riveted into a recess that was made for it. I can see why they made the change (much easier, therefore cheaper) but I haven't seen a catalog showing the change. I guess it's possible, if not likely Sears left the original illustrations as-is since these were only around for a few years. By 1949, the 518x series disappeared from the catalogs altogether.

Thanks again!

Brian

 

[AngryBeaver]

Been in some training at the cummins Rocky Mountain Facility. Largest Cummins dealership on the west coast.

Every technician has a wilton vise at their work station.

I've counted 37 Wilton bullets in the shop so far. Almost all 450/9450/850 models. A few 5". Oldest one was 9-48'.

Pretty cool.

 

[G-ManBart]

Here is a new on me. A customer wanted a set of jaws for his C1, we all know the jaws are 4-1/2 x 1 x 5/8 thick with 5/16; screws centered on standard 2-3/8 C/C. He bought the 3/4 jaws and they did not fit, digging deeper I realized this vise was not altered since the center pin and original jaws were made for the 5/16 screws. This is the first C1 with a 6-47 date stamp I seen and this vise uses the 4-1/2 x 3/4 x 1/2 jaws with the 5/16 screws and 5/16 center pin. This vise shows that Wilton seen a issue with the large screws and changed the 3/4 tall jaws to the 1" tall jaws in later models. Wilton also had a issue with the first gen swivel bolts where the lock-downs were to close to the static side hence using the Acorn nuts. Anyone seen a C1 this old? I'll post this on the Wilton vise date thread later.

Customer lives in Virginia and would let it go to a Wilton collector but not a reseller. Bart or Nick what would this vise be worth? I mentioned $200-300 but being rare does this increase the value even with rough corners. Came from a rock quarry.

That's an old one, for sure. The oldest C1 I've had was 1951, and looked very much like it, but didn't have the "WE" under the "C1" on the right side. I paid around $90 for the one I found, had to spend almost $100 on a correct 180* swivel base, then added a set of jaws and handle, so I wound up with darned near $400 in it by the time I was done...ouch! I just remembered I had to make an oversized key for it since the keyway was worn. In the end it turned out nice, but it was an expensive, slow build.

Somebody needed to work on their filing technique back at the rock quarry....no need to file the vise!

 

[G-ManBart]

Been in some training at the cummins Rocky Mountain Facility. Largest Cummins dealership on the west coast.

Every technician has a wilton vise at their work station.

I've counted 37 Wilton bullets in the shop so far. Almost all 450/9450/850 models. A few 5". Oldest one was 9-48'.

Pretty cool.

Every time someone calls me up and says they absolutely have to have a 6" bullet I ask if they've seen one in person, and mention that most heavy equipment and fabrication shops have mostly 4.5" bullets, with a few 5" thrown in here and there. I don't know what all these folks are doing with their 150-200lb vises at home!

 

[exmaxima1]

..... This is the first C1 with a 6-47 date stamp I seen Anyone seen a C1 this old?....

Customer lives in Virginia and would let it go to a Wilton collector but not a reseller. Bart or Nick what would this vise be worth? I mentioned $200-300 but being rare does this increase the value even with rough corners. Came from a rock quarry.

My C1 was dated 1945, and FWIW it sold recently for about $350 completely refinished, no issues.

 

[oldldh]

My C1 was dated 1945, and FWIW it sold recently for about $350 completely refinished, no issues.

That wee beastie is five months younger than I am...

But...

I must say, that I'm in much better condition...

Reverend Scott --- Your 1947 model is a veritable early teenager...

 

[Private Lugnutz]

My C1 was dated 1945...

In more ways than one! That is one sweet and rare forged-in "1945" on the swivel base!

On a record-keeping note, unless I am just flat out missing it, I don't see your former vise in the Wilton dating database. There are three (3) vises with an "11-45" stamp in the iteration of the file I have, none of them appear to be this vise, and none of them are attributed to your username. Since we don't really "know" the new owner, I think it should go in under your username. If there are questions, we cna go back to you, and perhaps you can go back to the new owner.

I will work it out with bluebolt.

 

[exmaxima1]

In more ways than one! That is one sweet and rare forged-in "1945" on the swivel base!

On a record-keeping note, unless I am just flat out missing it, I don't see your former vise in the Wilton dating database. There are three (3) vises with an "11-45" stamp in the iteration of the file I have, none of them appear to be this vise, and none of them are attributed to your username. Since we don't really "know" the new owner, I think it should go in under your username. If there are questions, we cna go back to you, and perhaps you can go back to the new owner.
.

I thought I posted it last year, but in any case I no longer own it and I don't know if it went to a GF member. I painted it sage green over BLO. I didn't let a grinder touch it.

 

[454ragtop]

What a shame! 7" Prentiss swivel jaw swivel base beat to death https://phoenix.craigslist.org/wvl/tls/d/vintage-railroad-vise-200/6348448817.html
"Some damage to the end of the slide, doesn't affect operation." Uhm yea, OK........

 

[exmaxima1]

What a shame! 7" Prentiss swivel jaw swivel base beat to death https://phoenix.craigslist.org/wvl/tls/d/vintage-railroad-vise-200/6348448817.html
"Some damage to the end of the slide, doesn't affect operation." Uhm yea, OK........

LOL, I saw that as well. I wonder if it can even open 2 inches! The seller is nuts.....

 

[Outlawmws]

Worth maybe about 10% of what he's asking as parts...

Looks like the slide was slagged off with a torch...

 

[KMScott]

My C1 was dated 1945, and FWIW it sold recently for about $350 completely refinished, no issues.

Jaws are 4-1/2 x 1" I bet. Thanks for the note exmaxima.

Just had a great time with AngryBeaver, he came up from his school in Denver. Do not get many visitors up here in the mountains. Left with a bunch of goodies.

Oldie, you ain't that old are ya. Hows your jaws, I can make ya a set of new metal chompers.

 

[bluebolt]

Here is a new on me. A customer wanted a set of jaws for his C1, we all know the jaws are 4-1/2 x 1 x 5/8 thick with 5/16; screws centered on standard 2-3/8 C/C. He bought the 3/4 jaws and they did not fit, digging deeper I realized this vise was not altered since the center pin and original jaws were made for the 5/16 screws. This is the first C1 with a 6-47 date stamp I seen and this vise uses the 4-1/2 x 3/4 x 1/2 jaws with the 5/16 screws and 5/16 center pin. This vise shows that Wilton seen a issue with the large screws and changed the 3/4 tall jaws to the 1" tall jaws in later models. Wilton also had a issue with the first gen swivel bolts where the lock-downs were to close to the static side hence using the Acorn nuts. Anyone seen a C1 this old? I'll post this on the Wilton vise date thread later.

Customer lives in Virginia and would let it go to a Wilton collector but not a reseller. Bart or Nick what would this vise be worth? I mentioned $200-300 but being rare does this increase the value even with rough corners. Came from a rock quarry.

Kevin I just looked at my early C1 (no date at all so I assumed it was made prior to 1945 for war effort use) and it has 1" tall jaws. It just says C1, no 1945 like the one you posted. 180 degree swivel base..

 

[jrobb316]

Every time someone calls me up and says they absolutely have to have a 6" bullet I ask if they've seen one in person, and mention that most heavy equipment and fabrication shops have mostly 4.5" bullets, with a few 5" thrown in here and there. I don't know what all these folks are doing with their 150-200lb vises at home!

I get a laugh out of this too when I post a vise for sale and everyone wants a 6 or 8 incher. But I guess the answer to your question would be whatever they want to do, same reason I have one or two

 

[bluebolt]

Every time someone calls me up and says they absolutely have to have a 6" bullet I ask if they've seen one in person, and mention that most heavy equipment and fabrication shops have mostly 4.5" bullets, with a few 5" thrown in here and there. I don't know what all these folks are doing with their 150-200lb vises at home!

LOL my favorite vise I own is my Reed 6" jaw 206 and usually the first vise I go to. And no, I am not 7 feet tall, just 5' 7". I just like the feel of that vise.

 

[zoomieport]

Hello all,

I needed to take some pictures for KMScott, so he could work his magic...
Here are 3 Parkers (and a Hollands that is painted to the table, LOL!). There is a 21X, 22X, 23X. I noticed the 21X wasn't on the vise registry, so I am sharing some pics.

If anyone has a 24X, 25X or 26X for sale or trade, please let me know!

Thank you, Take care!

ZOOM

 

[Mr. Bill]

I was hoping someone might be able to ID this vintage vise. It weighs about 85 pounds and the jaws are around 5 inches and it opens to what seemed like almost a foot. The only markings on it are ERIE No. 50. Someone in the vintage tool section believed it was made by Erie Tool Works. Maybe, but I can't find a similar one or any information to confirm that. I am not so sure it wasn't made by someone else. Did early Holland vises not have many markings? I saw on the vise spreadsheet that Holland made a model 50 and it weighed 100 pounds and had 5 1/8 inch jaws. Anybody have a picture of this one? Mine is missing the swivel base, so would weigh a bit less. I live in Erie and am just interested in this piece of local history that I bought to abuse after breaking my Chinese piece of ****. Any help would be appreciated.

 

[drivesitfar]

Mr. B: interesting vise. my guess it might have been a PROTOTYPE from either one of HOLLAND'S or REED'S or the Erie vise company's factory cause i've never seen one. not saying i've seen them all, but I can't recall seeing one like yours.

welcome to GJ and good to have another Vise guy join our group.

BART & ALL: why use a 4 inch vise if you own a 6 incher and the room and space to use it? of course there are a few smaller ones in use and my BABY BULLET might be my favorite.

ALL: i guess we are not only showing vises we've become the EBAY and vise appraisers. For what it's worth i sold a pristine Wilton C1 restored by Balane maybe 4 years ago for $450 and on Craigslist. the one with the missing jaws is similar in style, but pretty beat up. i bet some of those GRABBER GREEN Wiltons weren't selling for peanuts either, but to say a beat up Wilton is comparable is comparing apples to oranges in my opinion. if you gents spiffing up these vises and selling them paid yourself by the hour i bet you'd be getting less than minimum wage in most cases. i know it's more a labor of love so spiff them up if you have the skills and find new homes that appreciate them as a tool and not something to beat on or use as an all in one tool.

 

[mgmlvks]

Morgan 3-1/2S Arrived at Lunch.

Unexpected winnings from an on-line environment showed up today. CLEAN, good Jaw Inserts, beautiful as-shown. No idea what to do with it at this point (as a typical newbie and seems to be par for the course here) I am running out of room and rational excuses for placing vises around the house! Does not seem to be in "The Spreadsheet" - so will post that info later.

---------------------------

Later -
3.5" jaws
5" opening
40lb 12 oz
has spaces for pipe jaws but no pipe jaws
and some pics
Mike
--------------------------

-----------------------------------
New Pics for the record!

 

[AngryBeaver]

Every time someone calls me up and says they absolutely have to have a 6" bullet I ask if they've seen one in person, and mention that most heavy equipment and fabrication shops have mostly 4.5" bullets, with a few 5" thrown in here and there. I don't know what all these folks are doing with their 150-200lb vises at home!

I agree 100%. Even with talking to you before I had met you or seen a 4" or 450 in person.

All I know is the few Chinese vises I've had in the 6" range weren't big enough for the work we do or the work I do out of my fab shop.

The 450 I bought is more than 98% of people will ever need.

Just had a great time with AngryBeaver, he came up from his school in Denver. Do not get many visitors up here in the mountains. Left with a bunch of goodies.

I appreciate the hospitality. It was awesome to meet ya and see the shop. I guess I never realized how many different parts you made. I appreciate some
Of the machining tips for a home gamer like myself. Always nice to meet quality folks willing to help newer people out.

Thanks again

Next time we'll have to check out the elk.

 

[mt6]

My Prentiss No 23

Got this vise off of E bay last week. It was described as a possible railroad vise and had poor pictures, I got it for the starting bid of $50. Had to drive 50 miles up to Larimie, WY to retrieve it. The back of the slide has an 8 inch long crack in it. I clamped it together and arc brazed the last inch of it with X-Ergon rod (very little info on the web about arc brazing). The pin for the swivel jaw was missing so I ground one down from a one inch grade 5 bolt, I used a 2 degree taper. The jaws are 7 inches wide and it weighs 200 lbs on my scale. The back of the swivel jaw was apparently used as an anvil, can just make out the PRE of PREntiss and the NO is there but the 23 is barely visible. The swivel base is in good shape too so I'm very happy.

 

[Bcom]

My C1 was dated 1945, and FWIW it sold recently for about $350 completely refinished, no issues.

How does the date work on this vise anyway? Being that the bullet is that old, I thought they were stamping them 5 years from build date back then but that would make the vise a 1940 which cannot be. Can anyone explain?

 

[Bcom]

Re: My Prentiss No 23

Got this vise off of E bay last week. It was described as a possible railroad vise and had poor pictures, I got it for the starting bid of $50. Had to drive 50 miles up to Larimie, WY to retrieve it. The back of the slide has an 8 inch long crack in it. I clamped it together and arc brazed the last inch of it with X-Ergon rod (very little info on the web about arc brazing). The pin for the swivel jaw was missing so I ground one down from a one inch grade 5 bolt, I used a 2 degree taper. The jaws are 7 inches wide and it weighs 200 lbs on my scale. The back of the swivel jaw was apparently used as an anvil, can just make out the PRE of PREntiss and the NO is there but the 23 is barely visible. The swivel base is in good shape too so I'm very happy.

Kevin had mentioned a 7" Prentiss swivel jaw the other day on a conversation. What do you think Kev? Is this the same model we were speaking of?

 

[KMScott]

Yep a Prentiss 23, as noted in FMC's spreadsheet it weights over 200lbs.
https://www.garagejournal.com/forum/showpost.php?p=2224960&postcount=3961

I designed a swivel base for my 7" Prentiss and after designing I starting taking it apart and noticed the slider was busted and rewelded. Stopped right there. Even designed a handle lock down. Well anyway, this vise is free to anyone that wants it but ya gotta come up and pick it up. No shipping

Going fishing to WY with 6 Grand Kids so have a great weekend guys. Color me gone.

 

[BMR24]

Yep a Prentiss 23, as noted in FMC's spreadsheet it weights over 200lbs.
https://www.garagejournal.com/forum/showpost.php?p=2224960&postcount=3961

I designed a swivel base for my 7" Prentiss and after designing I starting taking it apart and noticed the slider was busted and rewelded. Stopped right there. Even designed a handle lock down. Well anyway, this vise is free to anyone that wants it but ya gotta come up and pick it up. No shipping

Going fishing to WY with 6 Grand Kids so have a great weekend guys. Color me gone.

Dibs on that prentiss.
And best of luck on the fishing trip!

 

[bluebolt]

How does the date work on this vise anyway? Being that the bullet is that old, I thought they were stamping them 5 years from build date back then but that would make the vise a 1940 which cannot be. Can anyone explain?

After a lot of digging by various folks on here it appears that only the ones that have GUAR EXP on the slide as well as the date were released for sale 5 years prior to the date. Very early 1941-1944 vises were for the war effort and had no stamp plus they only had a one year warranty in the beginning. There's a long post about in the Vintage Tools section.

 

[bluebolt]

Jaws are 4-1/2 x 1" I bet. Thanks for the note exmaxima.

Just had a great time with AngryBeaver, he came up from his school in Denver. Do not get many visitors up here in the mountains. Left with a bunch of goodies.

Oldie, you ain't that old are ya. Hows your jaws, I can make ya a set of new metal chompers.

Dang it I was hoping to make a trip to your place before the cold weather comes in and bring you a bunch of vises to work on! Didn't have the time or the money.

 

[bluebolt]

I was hoping someone might be able to ID this vintage vise. It weighs about 85 pounds and the jaws are around 5 inches and it opens to what seemed like almost a foot. The only markings on it are ERIE No. 50. Someone in the vintage tool section believed it was made by Erie Tool Works. Maybe, but I can't find a similar one or any information to confirm that. I am not so sure it wasn't made by someone else. Did early Holland vises not have many markings? I saw on the vise spreadsheet that Holland made a model 50 and it weighed 100 pounds and had 5 1/8 inch jaws. Anybody have a picture of this one? Mine is missing the swivel base, so would weigh a bit less. I live in Erie and am just interested in this piece of local history that I bought to abuse after breaking my Chinese piece of ****. Any help would be appreciated.

Hey Mr. Bill I have been thinking about it and I think that is a late 1950's - early 1960's Erie Tool Works vise. It looks a lot like a Hollands 25 which is a swivel base vise with 5" wide jaws. Around 1957 Erie Tool Works bought out Hollands and that may be Erie simply taking the Hollands molds and changing them slightly before they stopped making vises.

 

[mt6]

Yep a Prentiss 23, as noted in FMC's spreadsheet it weights over 200lbs.
https://www.garagejournal.com/forum/showpost.php?p=2224960&postcount=3961

I designed a swivel base for my 7" Prentiss and after designing I starting taking it apart and noticed the slider was busted and rewelded. Stopped right there. Even designed a handle lock down. Well anyway, this vise is free to anyone that wants it but ya gotta come up and pick it up. No shipping

Going fishing to WY with 6 Grand Kids so have a great weekend guys. Color me gone.

I see your 23 has the printing on the side. Mine is on the top behind the swivel jaw with the sides being blank. The printing suffered a lot more abuse in that location. Does that make mine older or newer? My base has only 3 ears for bolting it down.