Opinions on American Standard Accuclean Air Filter System

[kwschumm]

Building a new house and looking for opinions.

With the heat pump we can get a standard electronic air filter or the American Standard Accuclean Air Filtration System. We both have allergies so we'd opt for one of these over a standard media filter.

If the Accuclean is really better than the normal electronic air filter I'd pay the extra $500, but before doing that I'd like to hear some opinions if anyone has experience with that system.

Thanks in advance!

 

[mrpizza]

Get a thing called a Reme Halo. Use a good media filter, like a Trion Air Bear. That combo will work nicely

 

[Milton Shaw]

Another thing to look at is Phenomenal AIR cold plasma generator. It's an ion generator that goes in the HVAC system and fills the house with ions that destroy mold, mildew, bacteria and most odors. The web site to look at them is "topproductinnovations.com and find a local distributor of them. They can be DIY installed but most are installed by HVAC professionals. Johnstone Supply is one of the big distributor of them. In commercial applications they improve the air quality so much that the 20% make up air requirement is waved and can reduce the a/c tonnage requirement by that same 20% giving payback of the units in just a few months. I have two in my house and they have improved the allergies quite a bit and the whole house has no smell from cooking etc.

 

[DC73]

With the heat pump we can get a standard electronic air filter or the American Standard Accuclean Air Filtration System. We both have allergies so we'd opt for one of these over a standard media filter.

I don't have any experience with the Accuclean but it sounds good. I do have allergies and I used an Aprilaire 2210 in my last house. It's a very thick pleated HEPA type filter. It worked very well and kept my house very clean. I only had to change the filter once a year. First chance I get, I will install another in my current house.

Here's a link: https://www.aprilaire.com/whole-house-products/air-purifiers

DC

 

[yeldogt]

The filter is in the system .... to protect the system. That's why most will tell you not to go above a MERV 11 ... or it becomes restrictive for the equipment.

I have never read a study that supported the idea that the HVAC system cleans the air in a house. In many climates the system is not running any hours ... and new VS systems create low velocity.

Return placement has a lot to do with filter replacement frequency -- floor returns pick up stuff that would otherwise be vacuumed.

 

[DC73]

I have never read a study that supported the idea that the HVAC system cleans the air in a house.

I don't need a study. I have real world experience. I lived in one 1950's house with evaporative cooling that we eventually transitioned to central air. The amount of dust in that house went from extreme to nearly nothing.

I also lived in brand new house with central air and a standard filter. We dusted twice a week. After installing the air filtration system I linked above, we only had to dust once every two weeks.

I'm convinced a good quality filter not only protects and keeps the HVAC system clean, but it keeps my lungs clean as well. And for an allergy sufferer, that's better than any study that might suggest otherwise.

DC

 

[bushmechanic]

The filter is in the system .... to protect the system. That's why most will tell you not to go above a MERV 11 ... or it becomes restrictive for the equipment.

I have never read a study that supported the idea that the HVAC system cleans the air in a house. In many climates the system is not running any hours ... and new VS systems create low velocity.

Return placement has a lot to do with filter replacement frequency -- floor returns pick up stuff that would otherwise be vacuumed.

Looks at filter in ceiling above computer...

It's filthy...

Apparently it caught something...

But you said it wouldn't! I want my money back.

There are a lot of studies that haven't been done. This is mostly because it would be a complete waste of time.

 

[LS6 Tommy]

Hey, where did my post go??

Tommy

 

[yeldogt]

Looks at filter in ceiling above computer...

It's filthy...

Apparently it caught something...

But you said it wouldn't! I want my money back.

There are a lot of studies that haven't been done. This is mostly because it would be a complete waste of time.

I'm not saying the filter does not catch dust and dirt -- they do. The question is if they are cleaning the air ... and how much a filter above MERV 11 is actually doing anything.

And the studies have ben done.

w/o continuous circulation most homes don't have air movement -- and most people don't want the fan running day and night ... especially in the winter. Add in oversized equipment -- what are they running on average per hour?

 

[yeldogt]

I don't need a study. I have real world experience. I lived in one 1950's house with evaporative cooling that we eventually transitioned to central air. The amount of dust in that house went from extreme to nearly nothing.

I also lived in brand new house with central air and a standard filter. We dusted twice a week. After installing the air filtration system I linked above, we only had to dust once every two weeks.

I'm convinced a good quality filter not only protects and keeps the HVAC system clean, but it keeps my lungs clean as well. And for an allergy sufferer, that's better than any study that might suggest otherwise.

DC

What was the MERV of the new? ... what was the velocity of the old system vs the new ... how many hours did it run. Where was the dust coming from ?

How big was the filter that it could hold a years worth of dirt?

We had a client who was injured in an industrial accident -- vapors in his lungs. We had to hire clean room engineers .... anyway it was interesting. Most house dust is kicked up -- high MERV filters can reduce CFM enough to change air flow in a house.

 

[bushmechanic]

I'm not saying the filter does not catch dust and dirt -- they do. The question is if they are cleaning the air ... and how much a filter above MERV 11 is actually doing anything.

And the studies have ben done.

w/o continuous circulation most homes don't have air movement -- and most people don't want the fan running day and night ... especially in the winter. Add in oversized equipment -- what are they running on average per hour?

You do know these things turn on and off by themselves, and can encourage and then periodically maintain air movement, right?

If one unit of air carries five dust motes, and upon passing through a filter said dust motes are no longer present in that unit of air, it is logical to suggest that the referenced dust has been removed from the system.

If cleaning is the removal of undesired material, and dust is undesired, the air has been cleaned. Look, maybe you can't eat buttered toast off it's bathroom floor, but it's been cleaned. There's no way around that fact.

I've heard more nonsense out of HVAC techs over the years than I can sanely fathom.

 

[yeldogt]

You do know these things turn on and off by themselves, and can encourage and then periodically maintain air movement, right?

If one unit of air carries five dust motes, and upon passing through a filter said dust motes are no longer present in that unit of air, it is logical to suggest that the referenced dust has been removed from the system.

If cleaning is the removal of undesired material, and dust is undesired, the air has been cleaned. Look, maybe you can't eat buttered toast off it's bathroom floor, but it's been cleaned. There's no way around that fact.

I've heard more nonsense out of HVAC techs over the years than I can sanely fathom.

And your point is ?

Did I say -- don't have any filter? I discussed a MERV 11 -- the nice HVAC are typically 4" pleated in a separate cabinet.

I'm not going to get into the variables -- if you really want to clean the air you need a dedicated system moving a lot of CFM's. Old style glass filters used to get filthy -- it's not because they were doing a better job of filtering the air.

 

[LS6 Tommy]

My previous (now missing) post basically said that both the Accuclean and a "normal" electronic air fliters put decent amount of ozone into the conditioned space. If you have sensitive allergies, it may be worse than the dust you're looking to remove.

Tommy

 

[kwschumm]

My previous (now missing) post basically said that both the Accuclean and a "normal" electronic air fliters put decent amount of ozone into the conditioned space. If you have sensitive allergies, it may be worse than the dust you're looking to remove.

Tommy

I don't know what is considered a decent amount of ozone but this is from the American Standard website:

Some consumers have expressed concern about the ozone emissions of ionic air cleaners. It’s a valid concern, and one that American Standard Heating & Air Conditioning takes very seriously. Research has shown that plug-in air cleaners emit the highest levels of ozone while whole-home systems like AccuClean deliver almost none. In fact, AccuClean was designed to fall well below the FDA voluntary emissions limit for medical devices. American Standard considers safety and quality to be top priorities. So you can rest assured that the clean air delivered throughout your home by AccuClean is good for you and good for the environment.

 

[bushmechanic]

I don't know what is considered a decent amount of ozone but this is from the American Standard website:

Some consumers have expressed concern about the ozone emissions of ionic air cleaners. It’s a valid concern, and one that American Standard Heating & Air Conditioning takes very seriously. Research has shown that plug-in air cleaners emit the highest levels of ozone while whole-home systems like AccuClean deliver almost none. In fact, AccuClean was designed to fall well below the FDA voluntary emissions limit for medical devices. American Standard considers safety and quality to be top priorities. So you can rest assured that the clean air delivered throughout your home by AccuClean is good for you and good for the environment.

Doesn't take much ozone to irritate lungs or even ruin a tire; all it takes is long-term exposure in the most tiny amounts to promote issues. A medical device generating ozone is not likely to be a long-term experience. To which such devices do they refer, I wonder?

Ozone is powerful stuff.

You'd have to measure the output to see if they've actually done what they say, or if they've got Chinese **** in there that's not meeting their "American Standard".

A drill motor alone is enough to eat things up over time.

 

[LS6 Tommy]

I don't know what is considered a decent amount of ozone but this is from the American Standard website:

Some consumers have expressed concern about the ozone emissions of ionic air cleaners. It’s a valid concern, and one that American Standard Heating & Air Conditioning takes very seriously. Research has shown that plug-in air cleaners emit the highest levels of ozone while whole-home systems like AccuClean deliver almost none. In fact, AccuClean was designed to fall well below the FDA voluntary emissions limit for medical devices. American Standard considers safety and quality to be top priorities. So you can rest assured that the clean air delivered throughout your home by AccuClean is good for you and good for the environment.

I'm not up on the specs for the Accuclean unit, but it is electrostatic and the old 100% electrostatic units were pretty bad...

Tommy

 

[kwschumm]

I'm not up on the specs for the Accuclean unit, but it is electrostatic and the old 100% electrostatic units were pretty bad...

Tommy

I sent them an email asking for a number, saying "almost none" is not a number. Health people say that ozone should not be higher than 0.07 ppm, and 0.07 ppm is "almost none".

The problem with giving a number is that it probably depends on how dirty the air is. If there's a coronal discharge for each particle trapped, and there are no particles, there should be no ozone. If the air is really dirty then there will be lots of coronal discharges and far more ozone. There must be some sort of standardized test for this.

 

[LS6 Tommy]

The biggest problem with them (at least the old ones) is the cells warp and they arc. There's a BIG ozone supply.

Tommy

 

[sms1974]

Run from the Accuclean filter as fast as you can!!!

these are the worst electronic filters, hard to clean expensive to repair. we installed them when they were first introduced and i think 90% of them have failed and I've ate the replacement cost. It's hard to beat a SpaceGuard either a standard media or the electronic media.