Gable end overhang attachment that won't sag

[biggziff]

I'm just now realizing I should have spec'd my gable trusses shorter to allow for cantilevered overhang supports. Too late now so I'm looking for suggestions on how to mount the overhang, fascia, etc. in a way that won't allow it to sag over time. 12" overhang all around the building. 6/12 pitch roof, gable end walls are 34' long.

Thanks

 

[blair683]

Knotch your gable end trusses to allow for a 2”x4” to lay flat in the knotch. The 2x4s will but against and screw to the first truss in. Do this on 2’ centers. To cut the knotches just mark out where each one will go. Set your circular saw to 1.5” and make a bunch of cuts where the knotch will be and knock it out with a hammer. Many here will tell you to not cut in to your trusses but it won’t hurt a thing and will give you strong gable overhangs. This assuming that your inspector (if you have to worry about one) allows it. When I built my garage I did gable ladders and just lag screwed them to the gable trusses. My overhangs are only 1’ and no way would I go any more than that with the ladders.

 

[biggziff]

Knotch your gable end trusses to allow for a 2”x4” to lay flat in the knotch. The 2x4s will but against and screw to the first truss in. Do this on 2’ centers. To cut the knotches just mark out where each one will go. Set your circular saw to 1.5” and make a bunch of cuts where the knotch will be and knock it out with a hammer. Many here will tell you to not cut in to your trusses but it won’t hurt a thing and will give you strong gable overhangs. This assuming that your inspector (if you have to worry about one) allows it. When I built my garage I did gable ladders and just lag screwed them to the gable trusses. My overhangs are only 1’ and no way would I go any more than that with the ladders.

Since my truss package is stamped Im guessing I'll need to get the OK from the truss company before cutting anything, yes?

Thanks

 

[Kaizen]

I did the same thing. Rookie mistake. One one end I used a ladder made up of 2x4s with supports a foot apart. Each support I used two three inch screws at a slight angle. I attached it to the building with engineered wood screws. Don't know the name. Used normal screws to get it up there attached to the outside of the last truss then used these screwed through truss and inner 2x. Made mine in two pieces and overlapped them with more 2x. Then I screwed the roof sheathing to it instead of nails for more strength. The second gable I changed the ladder middle pieces to every two feet as the first one was way overkill.
Did mine myself and it was scary till I figured it out. I put two 2x4x12s across the top of the ladder and another halfway down. It makes a counterbalance to the weight of the ladder. I put some small pieces of wood on the inside of the truss so I had a stop to hold it. I left the counterbalance 2x on till I got to that row on the roof sheathing. Also added trim to the very top as it's 25 feet up so easier to do on the ground.






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[blair683]

Since my truss package is stamped Im guessing I'll need to get the OK from the truss company before cutting anything, yes?

Thanks

Probably, but I am sure that they are not going to ok cutting into the trusses. I live in a town that you can do whatever you want building wise, as long as you pay taxes on it when you’re done. Every builder around here uses this technique on pole buildings and garages. You never specified how big of an over hang you want. Anything more then a foot is going to sag over the years if you just do a gable ladder. You could probably do gable ladders then run purlins flat across all your trusses then your sheeting on top of that. That way you can run the 2xs across the trusses over you gable ladders for extra support.

 

[captain14]

Some of the old arts and crafts style bungalows near me have a decorative support running from an angle from the ladder section of the roof to the sidewall of the gable end of the house.

 

[blair683]

If you decided to knotch your gable trusses as I stated above. You could knotch them on 4’ centers. Then just scab a 2”x4”’ in between the gable truss and fascia board on 2’ centers to support the sheeting.

 

[Stuart in MN]

For a 12" overhang I don't think you'll have any problems with simply nailing a ladder-shaped structure to the gable wall. That's how my garage was built over 20 years ago and there's no sign of sagging. If it were deeper than 12" you'd need something more substantial.

 

[padroo]

I bolted my one foot ladders to the truss, no problem. I was an experienced laborer and inexperienced builder back then but they never sagged.

 

[RocketScott]

Knotch your gable end trusses to allow for a 2”x4” to lay flat in the knotch. The 2x4s will but against and screw to the first truss in. Do this on 2’ centers. To cut the knotches just mark out where each one will go. Set your circular saw to 1.5” and make a bunch of cuts where the knotch will be and knock it out with a hammer. Many here will tell you to not cut in to your trusses but it won’t hurt a thing and will give you strong gable overhangs. This assuming that your inspector (if you have to worry about one) allows it. When I built my garage I did gable ladders and just lag screwed them to the gable trusses. My overhangs are only 1’ and no way would I go any more than that with the ladders.

That’s how it’s done. You can notch the top cord. Only thing I would add is sheeting on the gable.

Call your truss company just to be sure it’s not some special structural gable.


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[85lolo]

End truss sits on a wall anyway. It won't bother it
I've been doing it that way for 25 years

 

[Kaizen]

Regarding the notching of the truss. I called my inspector and he said hell no unless the truss company has it okay in their documents. Called truss company they said hell no we didn't design it for that. Guessing an experienced builder might get more leeway from an inspector


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[Firebrick43]

That's minimal over hang. If you were doing over 18" you would want outlooks. High Winds tearing them off is more of an issue than sag.

 

[firebirdparts]

one thing I have done (without cutting the trusses) is take that ladder deal and add some allthread through it to put the squeeze on it. You can countersink holes in the barge rafter to hide the nut and a washer on the all-thread. You can angle your all-thread uphill a little bit to cheat even more.

 

[James-W]

Regarding the notching of the truss. I called my inspector and he said hell no unless the truss company has it okay in their documents. Called truss company they said hell no we didn't design it for that. Guessing an experienced builder might get more leeway from an inspector


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That's pretty much the way it is around here too. Any altering on a truss must be approved and signed off by by the truss company structural engineer or it won't pass inspection.

 

[blair683]

I don’t know how I totally overlooked that you wanted 12”’overhangs. You will be fine with a ladder bolted to your gable truss. I would do a 4” fascia on the gable ends though. I wanted 6” fascias all the way around. But after building the ladders with 2”x6”s I quickly realized that they were way to heavy. So I redid them with 2”x4”s and just had a 6” fascia on the eaves and 4” on the gables.

 

[matt_i]

I screwed on a 12" ladder frame (which is also all screws..no nails to pull out). GRK-RSS screws 3-1/8" to the top chord. Build the bottom fascia connection stout and in my opinion there's little to go wrong.

Also lapping the roof sheathing completely over is your friend. Don't create a hinge point by breaking sheets right at the endframe joint. Cut it at the next truss centerline and stagger.

 

[larry4406]

For a 12" overhang I don't think you'll have any problems with simply nailing a ladder-shaped structure to the gable wall. That's how my garage was built over 20 years ago and there's no sign of sagging. If it were deeper than 12" you'd need something more substantial.

This is how all the new construction homes I build are done. Truss vendor does not drop the end gables for the outlooker framing. Roof sheathing overlaps and not spliced on gable.

Pictures and details here, Post 11
https://www.garagejournal.com/forum/showthread.php?t=300682

 

[biggziff]

I screwed on a 12" ladder frame (which is also all screws..no nails to pull out). GRK-RSS screws 3-1/8" to the top chord. Build the bottom fascia connection stout and in my opinion there's little to go wrong.

Also lapping the roof sheathing completely over is your friend. Don't create a hinge point by breaking sheets right at the endframe joint. Cut it at the next truss centerline and stagger.

This seems to be the general consensus and since it's easier than notching trusses, I think I'll go this route.

Thanks, all!

 

[spudley]

Same here, I've used ladders with a 1' overhang on many projects with no sag. However I would appreciate an engineer explaining how an end "truss" (fully supported by the load carrying wall beneath) is compromised by notching.

 

[biggziff]

Same here, I've used ladders with a 1' overhang on many projects with no sag. However I would appreciate an engineer explaining how an end "truss" (fully supported by the load carrying wall beneath) is compromised by notching.

It probably isn't, but they're not going to tell you it's OK. Just heard from them. Forbidden! lol

 

[Radix2]

As long as you have solid blocking in your ladder and the ladder is supported against the verticle framing of the gable wall, the overhang is carried by tension in the roof sheathing - make sure your sheets go back into the roof as far as possible to maximize the strength.

All of the forces below the roof sheathing are in compression. Fancy screws, allthread, etc. do nothing ( good for holding things until the sheathing though) to add to the situation- you simply need to make sure the sheathing cannot separate at the overhang and the overhang cannot press into the gable wall to prevent it from sagging/rotating down. The next weak point is the connection between the verticle framing and the top cord on the gable truss. Blocking between the gable truss and the next truss is useful to prevent the top cord rolling under.

 

[Falcon67]

This is what I did, no truss involved. No sag after 6 years.

 

[T_R]

I built mine with 12" ladders screwed to the trusses through the sheathing. It's had 4-5 feet of snow up there at times. No sag.

 

[johnnyradiant]

Some of the old arts and crafts style bungalows near me have a decorative support running from an angle from the ladder section of the roof to the sidewall of the gable end of the house.

One of our old rental houses have those and the municipality put the house on their secondary heritage list for just that reason.

 

[James-W]

One of our old rental houses have those and the municipality put the house on their secondary heritage list for just that reason.

What does "secondary heritage list" mean? I am not familiar with that term.

 

[johnnyradiant]

What does "secondary heritage list" mean? I am not familiar with that term.

It means they (the municipality) like it enough to give me grief if I wanna do something to it but can’t out right refuse me tearing it down. It means if I was crazy enough I could push through registering it and then not do anything to it that doesn’t match its circa. It means they use it as an example of its particular heritage features when talking about heritage homes but don’t call it good enough to make their a list. It means it is another tool in their belt to try and stave off developers.


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[James-W]

It means they (the municipality) like it enough to give me grief if I wanna do something to it but can’t out right refuse me tearing it down. It means if I was crazy enough I could push through registering it and then not do anything to it that doesn’t match its circa. It means they use it as an example of its particular heritage features when talking about heritage homes but don’t call it good enough to make their a list. It means it is another tool in their belt to try and stave off developers.


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I am not sure I understand what you are saying. Maybe if you could explain it a little differently I would be able to grasp the concept, but I am not sure about that either.