Any Advantage to Stud Walls in a Pole Barn?

[Augus7us]

A friend of mine recommended I go with stud walls in my pole barn when I insulate it. My posts are 6"x4" that are 8' OC. His logic was at 8' the walls would be week in the middle. It make perfect sense but I was wondering if it would be overkill?

I'd rather save the money for tools or something if its just overkill. There are no strong winds or earthquakes here in Ohio so I'm not to worried about natural disasters, but figured I might be missing something.

As an alternative, what I've seen is running horizontal furring strips. Are there better alternatives?

Thanks Guys

-Clint

 

[Whasat]

If you are using batt type insulation, it would be tricky to install withouth some studs in there. Spray foam it wouldn't matter. As far as the stiffness of the wall, my poles are 10' O.C. And I've had no problems. I would think the extra framing might just make insulation easier, you should run cost of framing plus batt against spray foam. It make come out a wash price wise and lots less labor installing the extra/unneeded framing.

 

[Voi]

I would not be comfortable with the idea of having a standard framed wall with bottom plates resting on the slab which can move independently from the columns. People do it but not everyone's climate and soil are alike. I assume since your friend recommended it he knows of people who have done it in your area?

Posters here have toenailed bookshelf girts to their standard girts which makes for a fairly rigid assembly. I think they then use fiberglass batts made for 24" on center framing and just run it horizontally between the bookshelf girts.

You say your columns are 4x6. Are the walls going to be 4" deep or 6" deep?

 

[dmcintosh]

I went with framing in between my posts. This has made my insulation easy to install, and allows me to finish the interior with drywall. In researching insulation, i found information that suggested spray foam against the metal would cause rust issues, so I opted for fiberglass batts.

 

[Augus7us]

If you are using batt type insulation, it would be tricky to install withouth some studs in there. Spray foam it wouldn't matter. As far as the stiffness of the wall, my poles are 10' O.C. And I've had no problems. I would think the extra framing might just make insulation easier, you should run cost of framing plus batt against spray foam. It make come out a wash price wise and lots less labor installing the extra/unneeded framing.

Like the quote below I read that spray foam can cause rust in a metal building. As far as insulation goes, part of the appeal of stud walls was making it easier to install insulation with batts. Frankly I'm not sure how to install insulation if I went with furring, but I've seen it done on here before in the gallary. It looked like they attached it up top somehow and let it hang down. I'm speculating here based on photos, but I'm sure someone knows how.

I would not be comfortable with the idea of having a standard framed wall with bottom plates resting on the slab which can move independently from the columns. People do it but not everyone's climate and soil are alike. I assume since your friend recommended it he knows of people who have done it in your area?

Posters here have toenailed bookshelf girts to their standard girts which makes for a fairly rigid assembly. I think they then use fiberglass batts made for 24" on center framing and just run it horizontally between the bookshelf girts.

You say your columns are 4x6. Are the walls going to be 4" deep or 6" deep?

6" deep. I was going to use 2x4's for the framing, this was recommended by my friend. He owns a construction business but they mostly do interiors, as I found out when trying to get a deal on some lumber through them. His is using the furring but he said if it wasn't done when he bought the place he would have went with stud walls for better support.

As far as the walls being free floating, I figured I would nail them to the posts. It does get cold in the winter and humid in the summer, but I know my friend wouldn't steer me wrong. But I'm open to all advice and recommendations from those more experienced then me, which is probably most.

I went with framing in between my posts. This has made my insulation easy to install, and allows me to finish the interior with drywall. In researching insulation, i found information that suggested spray foam against the metal would cause rust issues, so I opted for fiberglass batts.

I found the same and figured spray foam was probably going to be more money. I've been considering changing from OSB to drywall and that was one of my concerns. Stud walls would be fine but if I had a joint 4' from the post and someone leaned on the wall with drywall over furring, that may be a problem.

-Clint

 

[TonyG109]

You may want to consider dense packed cellulose (as opposed to loose blown in). It's rarely mentioned when the topic of insulation is discussed but has many positive aspects. R value and sound attenuation are excellent. It's also very good at slowing/preventing air movement which is a major cause of heat loss/gain. The biggest downside is, perhaps, labor to install. It's much more involved than simply pushing in some batts but I feel the results are worth the one time pain of installation.

I think I missed the point of the post in my reply. The 8' span between posts is not an issue. I assume that there are horizontal girts supporting your exterior finish. These, along with the exterior sheathing, provide substantial support. If you feel you need additional strength in the wall, you can always install additional horizontal girts on the interior. These can also be used to support the finish of your choice i.e. drywall, sheathing, etc. which add even more strength to the wall.

I am just finishing up a 30' x 50' x 12' pole building using girts on the inside and I never felt the wall spans between poles needed any additional support. While fiberglass insulation won't add much to the rigidity of the walls, the dense packed cellulose created an absolute rock solid feel. And this is before the interior sheathing is installed!

 

[ckyle29]

I framed my pole barn between the 8" OC posts and ran the studs horizontally. I was working by myself, so there was no way I could build frame walls and lift them into place myself, so working one row at a time was perfect for what I was accomplishing. Plus a pole barn ain't exactly perfectly square between the posts anyway.

I used a pressure treated stud at the bottom, and built up, one stud at a time, nailed to the posts, using 14.5 inch risers in between the horizontal studs. That way the horizontal studs were 16 inches OC and standard 15 inch wide R-19 batt insulation fit snug between the studs. When the wall was finished, it looked like an oversized ladder and I could climb the studs all the way to the ceiling.

I don't have to worry about heaving in my area, so that is not a concern. But wind is, and framing between the studs really strengthened the walls. Plus, I was able to hang cabinets and heavy stuff to a stud.

Some people may ask why not just stick build if you want studs, but I don't need footers and by going this route, I was able to do the work all by myself and spread the cost out as the budget allowed. For me, it was the best option.

 

[rburke65]

I did a "pole barn" foundation and then framed the shop in a standard studded construction.

 

[toolchaser]

I did standard 16" o.c. framing on my pole barn with 10' spacing between poles. If you're working by yourself, you should be able to stand up an 8' stud wall solo. Mine were 12' high x 10', about my limit to lift by myself.

 

[astroracer]

I studded between the posts on my barn after it was built in '85. I set the PT sill plate on the concrete and toe nailed it into the posts. I ran the studs up between the headers and nailed the top of the studs through the header. No load so an upper header for the wall isn't necessary. The sill just floats on the concrete and I have had no issues for 32 years.
Mark

 

[6768rogues]

I framed between my 6x6s with 2x6s so I could use regular rolled insulation and so that my vinyl siding had studs for nailing.

 

[bullnerd]

Check out my build in my sig.

8' wide batts here.

 

[stm317]

What wall material are you planning? Most wall materials will need more support than what you'd have with 8' OC poles. If you ever want to mount anything to the walls, or have outlets, switches, etc between the posts then some type of framing is pretty much required.

My personal plan is similar to your friend's suggestion. 6 inch deep walls framed with 2x4s that have been brought flush with the poles. Plenty of strength for wall sheathing, and mounting most anything.

 

[bullnerd]

I don't get the framing inside a pole building concept.

Why not just frame the whole building?

 

[stm317]

I don't get the framing inside a pole building concept.

Why not just frame the whole building?

For me, it's time and money. Initial building goes up much faster and cheaper with pole barn construction. Mine went from being a not-so-flat lot to having a finished building in 5 or 6 days. That's not happening with stick built. This allows me to store my stuff, and use the building while I finish it on my own as time/money allows. Stick built might end up the same cost, or even a bit cheaper in the long run, but I'd have to have more budget all at once upfront, and It takes longer to become a usable building.

 

[astroracer]

^^^ This^^^
Nailed it... Pun intended. When I built my pole barn in '85 I needed the storage as we were also building a house. We had no where to store furniture and other stuff while the house was being built. The pole barn was quick and cheap and, as stated above, I finished off the inside as I had the time and money.
Mark

 

[Rc_Guy]

I don't get the framing inside a pole building concept.

Why not just frame the whole building?

Time and money.

Our last house I had a 30'X40' polebarn built, I went to work that day looking at a pile of material that was delivered the day before and came home to a polebarn built and the next day the doors were installed.

Not quite as quick with our new house, I think it took two weeks for the polebarn company to put the thing up but they did 2"X6" stud walls between the posts as well as window openings an Tyvek before putting steel on building.

 

[bullnerd]

I agree with all that, mine was the same. Two Amish guys built it in 2 days.

But, why not use the large batts and some 2xs and your done.

Why spend the money on all those studs when the roof is already being supported?

 

[SouthernSawed]

Hope you guys are still around on this. I have a few questions.. if not I will make a new topic.

Besides insulation advantages. Would framing the pole barn out make it more sturdy and fight against any possibility of 6x6 rot and structure issues?

I have a 40x50 x 10 lean to length of the 50. It’s osb/tyveks like a house on the outside and then covered with hardi. Pretty neat beast I think so .

But before I do to much on the inside (like dress up the walls, customs cabinets).
I wonder if I should stud out the inside to help with structure as well as dressing up the walls.

Any thoughts? Thank you guys - Kyle Woodrome

 

[SouthernSawed]

^^^ This^^^
Nailed it... Pun intended. When I built my pole barn in '85 I needed the storage as we were also building a house. We had no where to store furniture and other stuff while the house was being built. The pole barn was quick and cheap and, as stated above, I finished off the inside as I had the time and money.
Mark

Does it not add more support so if the 6x6 rot or whatever ?

 

[Augus7us]

I'm still here and sadly I'm still working on this. Geez can't believe I asked this two years ago now.

I ended up doing stud walls in between my posts, but not for structural support. The fact that the outside of your shop is done in OSB is going to add some structural support vs the girts and metal panels mine has.

I can't help you on the rot. If you are worried about that you might want to look into installing the posts on piers. I've seen it discussed on here but mine are just sunk into my slab. Why do you think your poles will rot?

As far as the walls go, I've learned a bit since I posted this. From my reading you pretty much have three options: Build stud walls with batts, use bookshelf girts and batts or use interior girts and insulation curtains. I think Bullnerd used these in his shop and has some photos in his build thread. I've seen Morton use them in photos on here as well.

 

[larry_g]

Does it not add more support so if the 6x6 rot or whatever ?

It can provide support provided you have a foundation under the wall. Just having a wall sit on the flat work can break off the edge of the concrete. So the answer to you is, It depends....

lg
no neat sig line

 

[SouthernSawed]

It can provide support provided you have a foundation under the wall. Just having a wall sit on the flat work can break off the edge of the concrete. So the answer to you is, It depends....



lg

no neat sig line

Ah okay. So if I had planned and had a beam poured deeper on the perimeters. Makes sense. Thank you for the input


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[astroracer]

And... If you are concerned about a PT post rotting out 40 or 50 years down the road do a conventional build with a foundation and stud walls. Just be aware the cost will go up over a post and girt build.
Mark

 

[SouthernSawed]

And... If you are concerned about a PT post rotting out 40 or 50 years down the road do a conventional build with a foundation and stud walls. Just be aware the cost will go up over a post and girt build.
Mark

Thanks mark. Yes I’ve already built the pole barn. I hope it last 40-50 years without post issues as I will be dead and gone or close.. well not doing hobby work ha.

The price for what I wanted size wise in a stick built ,around this area, would cost sooo much. Not many contractors build garages for a good price to the consumer when they can build a house. I could literally build this pole barn 2-3 times for a stick built cost .

Appreciate yalls feedback .


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[AndyMB]

Okay, I’m Johnny Come-Lately to this party. I have a 30’ x 40’ x 12’ pole barn with a 10’ lean-to “porch” along the 40’ front. I’m looking to wall up my shop in order to hang cabinets, French cleats, d/c piping, task lights, etc., and to also allow me to up the insulation a bit. The current insulation consists of something that looks like silver-backed bubble wrap, so I thought I’d add some batt insulation in walls with studs 24” OC. I’m looking to use either OSB or plywood to ease hanging things up, so no drywall.

I’m trying to decide whether to build up toward the top of the 6”x6” posts for 10’ or 12’ walls or stick with an 8’ height to use single sheets of ply?
Also, a neighbor mentioned framing the walls with 2”x6”, but I think 2”x4” will be fine since the structure is stable and these walls are not load bearing for anything other than what I hang on them. Not being load bearing is also the reason I figured I’d space studs on 24”, rather than 16”.

I'm a hobbyist woodworker, not a carpenter, so I’d greatly appreciate any advice, thoughts, or suggestions any of you have to offer up.

 

[astroracer]

Your plan will work just fine. Put down a PT sill board and build your wall flush to the posts. Sheet right over the posts. How your header is tied into the posts may have some bearing on how you do this. If it is attached to the inside of the post with no mortise you can do it like that without issue. Put your receptacles 4' off the floor as well.
Mark